Hi all, just went to the Apple website, just noticed that they have updated the XServe oh and also I have noticed a price drop on the Cinema Displays, so now they are what, only $200 more than the Dell LCD. More info http://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=249879

The people who usually visit this forum would have noticed that topic.

You still think these displays are overpriced? $200 is well worth the apple brand and the aluminium casing and the built in USB/Firewire Port

yeah apples products are nice but they are overpriced

yeah apple products are super-sweet... but you have to pay for that status. (paying is part of the status)

its like buying an aston martin. uber cool but why not get a ferrari.

Surely you are not comparing dell to a ferrari!

/k

No I think he is comparing a Dell to an Aston Martin!

actually he is comparing dell to a ferrari


apple = more expensive than dell
aston marten = more expensive than ferrari

I'm definitely getting a Cinema Display (20") now. The price was the only thing holding me back, but with $300 shaved off, it's now a steal.

I still think its a bit pricey IMO. Even though I do get an extra 100 bucks off with the edu discount $900 is still to much. If I do get a display for my iBook it will be the Apple display though. I say its too much now because I don't have close too $900. I'm just going to get Tiger for 70 bucks.

Yeah but you're still paying more and getting less. That's the problem with Apple.

If you're going to sell a lower-end product, you need a lower-end price.

ive got a 20" Cinema Apple screen and OMG.... i love it

cost me £999 tho

How is the Cinema display a low end product?

shoot the guy LOL!!!!

mac low end, stop the drugs man they no good for u, that windows is such a virus man!! lol

Huh?

Apple's Cinema Displays are just rebranded LG screens. They're not really top-of-the-line panels, based on their specifications. I'm not saying they're bad, but they shouldn't have a top-of-the-line price tag for what you get.

$200 will get you Apple aesthetics, but a less capable screen. I don't really see that as being worth it. Perhaps you do.

Apple's computers have a similar problem. Just look at the iMac's price. You can get a far more modern computer from other manufacturers for less.

Whoa, if you're throwing a cool grand at a $20'' display, why not throw it at a plasma? Nevermind $3000 for $30 inches...that's crazy.

I don't think the USB/Firewire ports are worth that much.

Because a plasma won't get you the same resolution that these have. Plasma displays with reasonable prices are usually "EDTV" capable. But even the HDTV panels don't come close to the progressive-scan resolution of these kinds of monitors. Not to mention pixel response times, contrast ratios, and abilities to produce a true black.

doh! Thats what I mean!

The Dell is a better Spec Monitor.

Do you want a shiny Aluminion Housing for your Monitor or a Decent Spec Screen?

So the Apple display's aren't even decent? I very much doubt that mate...

I never said that.

I check the link in The Author of this posts first post.

The Dell Monitor has a better Contrast Ratio & Brightness.

Yes, The APPLE PANEL looks better. The Screen itself is not as good spec.

Heh, what's to say Dell won't cut down the price of the 2005FPW? Besides, you can get one for far less than $799 with coupon codes and/or weekly discounts. Nothing of the sort for Apple Displays.

Not to mention the fact that the quality of the 2005FPW display (the actual screen, not the casing) still beats the ACD hands down. Whether you're paying $500 more or $200 more for the ACD doesn't change the fact that you're still paying more for less.

So to answer the question in the original post: yes, still overpriced, no doubt.

If you ask me, yes they are over priced.
But more importantly, they simply dont look as good as a 22" CRT

By looking at a thread here on Neowin it seems like a very large percentage of people who got the Dell screen have backlight problems of some sort, and the tech support has been outsourced.

I am aware that the 23" Cinema Displays did have some problems with a pink hue when they were released, but most were fixed by calibrating them and if not getting a replacement was an easy process. There were also some isolated ghosting issues and those people got a replacement.

AFAIK there haven't been any reported widespread problems with the 20" Cinema Displays. Maybe its the same LG panel, but something must be different since all those people got Dell screens with severe backlight problems. I haven't heard of an Apple Cinema Display user complaining about an uneven backlight.

Why do some people think Apple stuff is "worth" hundreds of dollars more to be pretty? It makes no sense to me. If you want to get ripped off go ahead.

Here's some news. The Apple brand is not worth paying for. If you think so, I'd like to know why. Apple is really good at one thing. Manipulating people.

Yer if you replaced Overpriced with Quality Style and Uniqueness.

Quality can be debateable. They aren't that bad or anything but Apple has had their share of flaws.

Style is pretty much opinion. And they have had blunders there too. Not many people considered the original iMac stylish. Which brings us to unique.

Apple tends to shine here.... But so does Marilyn Manson, Dennis Rodman, and well you get the idea. I personally don't want a Marilyn Manson computer. jk.

That was an interesting analogy, but on tha note, I'd have to agree that neither do I!

I love my cinema and at that price it sure would have had me purchaseing one a whole lot sooner. But for what it was worth, it was well worth the wait.

saying it's only $200 more makes no sense here. the dell monitors are only in the $700-$800 price range to begin with. so $200 more than that is actually quite a lot. I could see if we were comparing things that were $2000 and $2200 then the difference would be small. But we're talking products here that the difference is 1/4 the total price.

Can I assume you wear $20 sneakers and hand me down clothes then?

People pay for aesthetic qualities in most things. Is it worth it in this case? Could be, the Cinema displays look a lot nicer than the Dells, which look like they're straight out of the office.

Actually i would argue that Apple's machines are honestly priced, not overpriced, with strong evidence of this being IBM giving up its PC side because of lack of profits it just shows that the PC makers have been put under so much pressure from consumers and corps that they have now underpriced themselves so much that they have forced themselves into a situation where the wallmart type margins are just not even worth bothering about. Apple just refuses to use loss leaders or support crap margins and as such for the last few years they have remained healthy.

IBM will not be the last to drop its PC division, many will soon follow through closure and merger, in fact i predict that in around 5 years time the western PC sales market will have consolidated to only a handful of well know brands. The only areas with any chance of selling PC's in this style will be in the Pacific Rim with China leading the way this is not only due to the incredible demand in place but also due to the lower labour costs and most of all PC manufacturing under their sphere of influence. Companies such as Dell will survive because they can maintain low margins with the contracts that they have, HP and such others have other areas in which they can subsidise PC sales, the only others likely to survive are those that are considered to be niche such as specialised products from the likes of Alienware and CAD and scientific specific sellers.

As for the common thread arguements...

The Dell vs Apple LCD example is quite common in these threads and while i realise that the 20" from Dell is a better product at a lower price i would also say that the monitor is being sold as a loss leader being subsidised by other areas in the company, i don't really care though because i have 2 of the Apple 23" screens and as far as i am aware i made a good decision.

Another example of an assumed overcharging from Apple is the iPod, now unless anyone can provide me a clear breakdown of the component prices, development costs, marketing costs and support costs showing that Apple is making these things with an above average margin i will concede but after checking the Best Buy website i saw that the iPod was $30 cheaper than a similar offering from iRiver the next most popular brand of MP3 players, so like the system price myth i will just put this down to the usual 8 year old's thing to say to make him sound intelligent.

And im not even going to mention the differences between Mac and PC as regards to technical specifics, OS capabilities, or even expense such as R & D an area where many PC manufacturers don't have alot of due to the unified nature of a PC.

Bottom Line: Unless you actually think about what your posting before you post you will look very silly indeed, another person who has actually bothered to look into PC vs Mac cost debates the issue in this link

Edit: Seems Apple has finally decided to sort out prices of systems they ship overseas http://www.macosxrumors.com/articles/2005/...urope-by-10%25/

Thats totally different. I don't know about you but I don't wear my monitor.

Aesthetics have their place, but I don't believe for the most part that the Apple stuff is worth paying "extra". It all depends if you bite on to their markting.


I don't believe IBM dropped the PC side because they were suffering as much as they wanted to focus on other aspects that are more profitable. I beoieve they were doing quite well with their notebooks.

I can definately see the market coming togethor more though. I mean it already has.

What it will come down to is who can lower costs to make stuff. Apple is smart though, with their manipulative marketing. They have successfully fabricated their niche market. I think about the only company that is seen as a "niche" with equal or better alternatives.

I believe the reason for Apple's higher prices is due soley to the fact that they sell less so they have to sell at higher margins.

Well, a monitor is a piece of furniture for some people. Do you have crappy, worn chairs with stains all over them?

You get my point. Some people like the way things look, and to them it's worth more money.

As for the Mac, i would say for what i use my machines for i get more for my buck, the OS in my opinion is far superior to Windows and alot more finished and refined than Linux and lets not forget that when talking about portables Apple does really well on price, and if you go to the high end workstation scale Mac's are often cheaper than the PC side, go even higher to server and storage systems and you will see that Apple are blowing the competition away on value. As for the budget system until it seems January 11th Apple have said to analysts that they just don't want to make a budget machine because of the low margins.

As for the IBM not making ends meat from PC's see here -> http://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=266137

Well I suppose, but then the Dell for instance isn't exactly an old piece of furniture. Its very understated and that mite fit well with some people. Anyway I see where your coming from.

Umm didn't catch that. Might not mite. Woops.

I agree, in this case it probably isn't worth the difference. My only problem with the Dell is it looks office stock, where as the Apple ones actually look like they belong in a house.

But what do I know, my case/monitor/and keyboard are all different colors, and the case glows blue.

Well I've had bad customer service from Dell over a product, so hell with it, I am willing to pay the extra $$$ to get a product which looks better and from a company which I haven't recieved any bad products from!

Beige monitor, Black keyboard and blue case.

if you've been jaded by dell than I can understand that too. They are supposed to be very good about getting you a good monitor though. Even if it takes 3 times.

windows?
we're talking hardware- not operating systems.
"stop the drugs man they no good for u"

Marketing? Do they advertise the Cinema Displays on TV or something?



I completely agree. When I was shopping for a Display I only considered the Cinema Display because I am having a desk custom built around the monitor, so that it can be seen from all angles and the visible cabling is minimal. The Dell wouldn't have worked for this.

Of course the cinema disiplays are still overpriced. Howevers I think it was a good move on Apple's part to lower the prices like they have done - maybe a few more users will buy some. Though I think that Apple should let people purchase the cinema displays for even less money if they purchase a Power Mac G5 along with it. That might get some more people to get some....

Not that I know of. But Apple has managed to establish themselves as a company that claims to be for the "discerning" consumer. This includes pretty much everything they sell. This is probably due more to people like you. When I said marketing I am talking about the whole Apple stigma that people tend to get caught up in.

It is a nice display and the lower price does make it more attractive. When you throw in a education discount it ends up being like what? 900? I'm still not sure if its worth the extra to me. I'd have toi see some in person next to other options.

^^^^ Rofl, for some reason the idea of advertising a screen while watching a screen (TV) is kinda amusing to me. !







lol

Yeah just imagine if they were showing the ad on the display in the ad. Wrap your mind around that.

Well in that case, the amount of "visible" screens within a screen would go on infinitely, creating an illusion of mirrors that reflect... each other... or something. Yeah.

Apple screen still overpriced (20") and still a poorer screen

12ms Dell, vs. 16ms Apple. and Dell is brighter too

so now you're only paying 200 for Aluminum, but you're still getting the lower spec screen.

Yeah...imagine paying 200 bucks for a couple garbage bags of melted down Pepsi cans. jk.

btw.. just saw where samsung has a 21" wide OLED at CES. Now that is a sweet display. 5000:1.

http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000270025865/

Are you guys kidding? WHo the hell seriously can see a 4ms difference in their screen? How many of the dell supports have gone to an apple store and actually used a computer hooked up to one of the displays. I've yet to see a screen match the picture on the 30inch cinema, and if its because i can't see 4ms or a 1000th of a difference in contrast well i guess its just my loss than. Seriously the people bringing numbers into this game is like comparing 1.2ghz to 1.25ghz, whoppee.....

too bad you dont know anything

Alot of people with trained eyes will notice the 5ms delay difference on the Monitors, And if you are spending that much money it should be the DAMN best.

Well, in this case, you won't notice the difference because the Dell is a 16ms panel. The same 16ms LG panel as is in the Apple.

The only real differences between the two are: the extra inputs on the Dell (a bonus for me); the 2xUSB & 2xFirewire hub of the Apple vs the 4xUSB hub in the Dell; the styling of the case/stand; and, of course, the price.

When the price cuts were announced, I seriously considered returning my Dell and ordering the Apple 20". The only thing stopping me was those extra inputs: being able to switch between my Mac and PC easily, and being able to use my VCR for the first time in over a year

Suffice it to say, I'll be keeping a hold of my Dell for a long time yet.


Roll on OLED