i want to know that what are the advantages of buying apple mac book over sony vaio's which give windows vista pre-installed.
I want to know why should i consider a macbook over other laptops....?

If you're looking to use Windows Vista then why are you considering spending so much on a Macbook?

No really, what are you looking to use on a Macbook?

i am an engineering student and want to buy a laptop for my studies..
my friends suggested me to by mac..
thats why i was just asking..

There is no "The MacBook is better because xxxxxxxx" explanation. Ultimately comes down to which one you prefer and which OS you prefer to use - Leopard or Vista! Go and try both and decide which you feel does the things that you want best!

i have used vista but didnt performed upto my expectations..
even xp and linux distros were good than vista..
one more question that what if i want to install linux with mac os?
willl i be able to that for my study purposes.. and what about warranty after i install linux...?

You can install linux on your mac without too much trouble. It won't affect your warranty at all.

What model of vaio are you looking at? I have been playing with a macbook and vaio sz for a while. The build quality is much better on the mac than the sony in my experience, things feel flimsy of the vaio and have broken off but the mac is untouched. The keyboard on the mac is also (for me at least) nicer to type on. The battery life on the macbook is also better but at the disadvantage of size/weight. The vaio does feel nice and light to carry around.

But like Chicane said, go and try them out, you'll know pretty quickly which is the one for you

I'd be brave enough to say that if you thought Vista was a let down but you like some distro's of Linux, you'll probably like MacOS X.

I'm an old Linux user (started back in the mid to late 90's) and whilst I admire it hugely and how far it has come, i've never really got on with it on my primary desktop simply for driver incompatibility and (on the whole) immature software. MacOS X is the ideal environment for me - pretty, with excellent hardware support and built on a UNIX core which means I can drop to a shell at any point and use commands i'm used to such as editors, network diagnostic tools (ping, etc etc), ssh/sftp client and so forth.

As I say - try em both out and see what grabs you

You should buy a MacBook because of Mac OS. You really have to give it a try before you can say anything, I absolutely love OS X, and can't wait to purchase my MacBook!

Yeah, buying a Macbook to ditch OS X and use Vista is a little dumb IMO.
Maybe Macbooks can show great performance (except graphically) but use OS X if you're willing to buy a Mac.

I'm an engineering student going on my 4th year soon. A Windows laptop is going to avoid a lot of pain in the future as your classes will require certain software that just won't work on a Mac unless you go out of your way. For engineering purposes a windows laptop is going to be your only option. I recommend a Dell as support is great and fast, in case you ever need it you will be happy. My Dell laptop is still functional for engineering purposes and now that I have moved off-campus I bought a desktop, which in the future you may do as well. At that point you can get a Mac

^^^ A Mac can easily be a "Windows laptop".

I know several engineering students here (georgia tech) with Macs. We use a lot of Matlab--which is available on all three platforms.

Get the Vaio.

for studies and laptop use, the macbook is easy and user friendly... Its great for the it just works side of things. I say that but lots of people i know try to use a macbook and they go back to a windows machine... I also know lots of friends says OMG so much easier on a mac.

It comes down to personal preference, and mine for a laptop is definitely Mac OS.

If you are an engineering student, you will probably be using AutoCad a lot which is not compatible with Mac.
So you could either buy a windows laptop or a mac and run windows on the side for your engineering apps.

we dont just use matlab...

as an engineering student, i've found that majority of cad software is either available on windows or unix. if you want to get a mac, you need to fork over a premium depending on what mac you get plus an additional $100-200 for windows to use with boot camp. engineering programs like CAD will require a good amount of resources, so using virtualization wouldn't be the best idea.

theres no real advantages of a macbook over a decent windows laptop other than os... and that just becomes a matter of preference.

+1, for the amount of software available for Windows

If you get a laptop, get an HP. My dad just recently bought a Dell Inspiron 1525 and had to exchange it because something went wrong. The battery died and wouldn't recharge or something. Read many horror stories about Dell laptops for some reason. Go with HP.

Since when is a Macbook a premium? Especially with the included student deal going on with an iPod touch? Vista OEM is $100.

But you are right that cad is resource intensive and that a discrete video card is something you'd want which the Macbook doesn't offer.

well i consider something like the black macbook and the macbook pro a premium. the black macbook has an igp and costs $1500-1600 and if you want dedicated graphics you have to fork over $2000.

i cannot picture myself spending over $1500 on a laptop, let alone one that has an igp...

Yeah but if his just gonna use windows anyways, seem silly to get a mac THAN use windows when he can get a more bang-for-the-buck PC and use windows.

Get the Vaio, as an engineering student, getting a Mac will cause some headache mainly because of the lack of software.

That Mac will run Windows so there isn't lack of software.

Blackbook is a rip--we all know that. I'd never fancy paying just for a paintjob.

MBPs are a bit overpriced, but nothing out of the ordinary for what it offers to be honest. It's a very nice machine when you consider the entire package and design.

If you're an engineering student, check to see what software packages you'll need to be using. Many of them could be Windows only, and Parallels is a terrible option for some of the more processor intensive or 3D CAD apps, and I don't think anyone here can honestly say that they enjoy dual booting...

I mean, I've certainly used my fair share of Windows only stuff in various engineering classes: Xilinx's IDE for FPGA work, Any of Microchip's PIC compilers, AutoCAD, LASI, SolidWorks, various little apps a prof has thrown together for some lab, some silly toolsuite we used in a Physics lab for a DAQ, etc.


Also, If you have or can get a desktop too, I'd recommend a convertible tablet PC instead of a laptop. They're incredible for classes, and HP has the tx2500z, which is very nicely priced, especially as you can generally find a coupon for several hundred dollars off, bringing even it down to like $1200 even fully spec'd out.


Edit: Ok. Xilinx's ISE isn't Windows only. It can run on Linux, too. But not OSX.

If the required SW is only available for Windows, then there's really no point in a MB - most of the working time would be spent in Windows, and a Windows laptop can be had for less, and offer more features.

I don't know if I would go with a VAIO though either, Sony is about as expensive as Apple, but YMMV. My dad has one, and it's been reliable for him, he's had it for a couple years, and no problems. I like the new Dell Studio line, they look nice, and have good/money performance ratios.

Which certainly couldn't keep me in the Windows camp . . .

That whole software availability thing is no longer a real advantage. There's a whole lot of junk out there, and it's growing by the minute.

But if we're talking some sort of specialized, windows-only, industry-specific software, i.,e. ACE, DRS, etc., then you'll need Windows. And you can install Windows on a Mac, no problem and just run that, wipe off OS X completely.

My brother has a MacBook - and all the software he needs is available on Mac, the only stuff that isn't available are titles you would never want to run on a laptop (be it Mac or PC); so he uses the quad core workstations with gigabytes of memory in the engineering computer labs.

As for a Sony Vaio; don't wast your money - get a Lenovo or one of the new Dell Studio laptops. Sony laptops are over priced, their BIOS's are as buggy as hell, and their machines are from top to bottom riddled with mountains of crapware.

Of all the things, Sony *face palm*

about 2 months ago my parents went for a trip in the USA. I told em to get me a blackbook, my brother got himself a Vaio SZ, and wer'e still arguing which is better. The thing is, it's down to OS. nothing else. Hardware is the same, except for the GPU, which is better on the Vaio.

True, but not only the operating system, but how the whole thing works together. There is no use having the worlds fastest computer when the operating system is crap and poorly integrated with the hardware to the point that unreliable and painful to use.

I'm not sure where you're going to school, but something to consider is where you'll be doing a lot of your work. For example, I'll be an engineering student at the University of Illinois in the fall and I just bought a macbook pro. Whenever I need to use graphically intense engineering software, I'll be using the engineering labs. Depending on where you go to school and the facilities that they make available to their students, you could certainly go with the macbook for your personal surfing, email, and simple office stuff and use the computer labs for your engineering work. Also remember, the university (depending on size) is unlikely to give you free copies of the software you have to use because they just don't have enough licenses. If you decide not to use computer labs, you may end up spending lots of money just buying programs for your classes.

Crapware is a moot point since most everyone I know does a clean install, anyway.

Well *mate* you're shyte out of luck in the case of Sony because you get crappy 'restore DVDs'.

IIRC Dell are one of the few who actually give you a proper Windows Vista DVD.

Which models are you looking at, we don't even know with Macbook or Sony he's looking at. You also have to buy according to price and performance. Also what programs would you be using in specific?

One thing about OS X is it's quite limited in software.

Limited based on WHOSE criteria?

Windows has alot of programmes - and alot of them are crap.

I knew someone was going to say that. lol

I won't get into your Mac vs. PC argument though.

Everyone knows there are 10 times the software on Windows.

Macs are great too, I hope to get one in the next year or so

You never addressed the fact that it has 10 times as much software - and much of it completely crap. When you take out all the crap shareware and freeware garbage that exists, there is no more software available on Windows than there is on Mac.

Somehow I doubt this.

Very few programs don't have OS X counterparts, and if you consider you can use Parallels Desktop for Mac to run Windows inside of OS X seamlessly, there is no limit to the software you can operate on your Mac.

Like what? Quicken? who the hell uses quicken these days; 90% of NZ and Australian businesses use MYOB which is available for Mac.

Well, it might depend on a person's field though.

Before Apple switched to intel, OSX was basically a non-factor. When I did my BSc in electrical engineering, all I used were Windows and Solaris, Macs had absolutely no use to me. Back then, I would have to use AutoCAD from time to time, and now I use Visual Studio quite a bit, as well as Access. I can run Matlab and R on my Mac, but I can run them on Linux and Windows too, and well if I'm at one machine that can run everything, natively, it's usually difficult trying to justify looking for alternatives or running off to a Mac, just so I can say so.

On the other hand, there are apps on OSX, that either don't exist, or more difficult to use on Windows, and in that case, it makes more sense to use a Mac.

In the end, you have to use the tool that gets the job done, regardless of OS.

True, but at the end of the day - what you're using it for, is a very niche situation. I'm sure these lazy companies will eventually start supporting Mac. Right now all the engineering lecturers at the university I go to use Macbooks.

So its not the operating system...but it is the operating system? If the hardware is the same then the only difference is software, there is no "magic" inbetween that some people think macbooks have, they're just another laptop.

The magic is that Apple know what the hell they're righting their software to support - it isn't a random stab in the dark as to whether something works properly. They know that in 2007 they released a MacBook with a xyz specifications, they know that in 2008, the release a MacBook Pro with zyx specifications - therefore, they know what hardware bugs might exist within the cpu, within the supporting hardware - and how to work around them. They know what hardware comes with it by default or what possible variations exist if a custom order.

It reduces the scope of possible issues that could arise.

Engineering software can be very processor intensive. Also, would you like working on a 13.3" screen as opposed to a 15.4?

I would try to look at the higher end notebooks, such as the MacBook Pro (for a Mac) and other PC's that are equivalent in specs.

But really, it all depends on what you like.

Bugs within the cpu? What the hell

Missed the front page news?
http://www.neowin.net/news/main/08/07/14/r...for-intel-chips

Welcome to the world of CPU Erratas, and microcode patching which are delivered through BIOS/firmware updates.

http://www.intel.com/design/mobile/specupdt/314079.htm

AMD has their own erratas and microcode updates as well.

Some of the bugs are minor, like the TLB issue which was more a matter of needing to update the documentation. Others require updates.



For something processor intensive, he is wasting his time with a notebook. Just use the university computers; heck, Canterbury University is hardly rich but they have quad core, multi gigabyte 20+ inch monitors for their engineering workstations. I'm sure the one he's going to will have computers even better.

Btw, you will be writing ALOT of reports. My brother has just finished a 10,000 - 65 page report.

Then again, in New Zealand they compress a course which normally is done in 5 years, down to 3 years. So you should be happy you're over there and not here

That's actually what he/she meant The OS has to support the hardware, like drivers. You also need to test it on the hardware to make sure it works as it should and doesn't cause any problems that can cause the system to become (nearly) useless. The software needs to fit the hardware and when you're making your own hardware and software it's much easier to do so. Sony, Dell, etc. depend on Microsoft to some extend which makes things a bit harder. It's just some more overhead.

Software is not much of an issue with today's operating systems. They have an equal amount of software in grand total. The differences are in the niche software like CAD or networking or security software. Windows has a lot of software for CAD but not that much for networking & security when compared to Mac. Linux has an equal amount of software for networking & security as OS X (as most UNIX/UNIX-like systems have) but when you need to do some photo/video editing a Mac is a much better idea (more software with a lot more features). As said by many others, the amount of software for any OS really depends on what you're looking for/at. That's why you'll always have to make a list what software you'll be needing and base your OS decision on that.

I'd buy the Vaio if you're going for Windows, and since you're an engineering student, you're going to use Windows.