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Triliaeris
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Men (or women) who decide to get on bended knee: Be warned. You could find yourself on both knees, facing a judge instead of a justice of the peace.

That’s what happened in Florida this week, when a woman was awarded $150,000 after suing her former fiancé for calling off their wedding.

For RoseMary Shell, the jilted bride-to-be who left a high-paying job in Pensacola to live with her prospective partner in Gainesville, there was a “wow” in lieu of a vow.

“[I was] a little bit [surprised], but I was thrilled,” Shell told TODAY’s Meredith Vieira on Friday. “But I felt like justice was really done.”

For Wayne Gibbs, the ex-fiancé, a case of cold feet came at a price.

“Mr. Gibbs feels that the verdict did not accurately reflect the evidence and will appeal,” Hammond Law, Gibbs’ attorney, told TODAY in a statement. “In addition, there are significant legal questions to address, including, but not limited to, whether or not breach of promise to marry is a viable action under Georgia law in 2008.”

From bliss to diss
It was 2001 when Shell and Gibbs, who were each divorced with grown children, met through mutual friends and began dating.

According to Shell, the couple had intended to get married when her youngest son went off to college in 2005. When that didn’t happen, she broke up with Gibbs and moved to Pensacola, where she landed a human resources job that paid $81,000 with benefits. Trying to carry on with her life, she started to date someone new.

But in October 2006, Gibbs asked her to move back to Gainesville — and he proposed with a 2-carat diamond ring. Shell said yes. A wedding date of Dec. 2 was set.

About a month after Shell moved back in with Gibbs, however, Gibbs expressed second thoughts in a note he left in their bathroom: He wanted to postpone the wedding.

Gibbs and Shell stayed together a few more months before officially parting in March 2007. Shell chose to take legal action and sued three months later.

“Primarily because he made a promise to me and I relied on that promise and gave up a lot of things because of that promise,” Shell explained.

“And I suffered significantly for it,” she added. “I just felt like people shouldn’t be allowed to do people that way.”

During the three-day trial, Shell testified that she had given up a good salary with benefits to move back with Gibbs. In her current job, in the accounting department at North Georgia College and State University, Shell is making $31,000 a year.

Gibbs testified that he took Shell on several skiing trips during their renewed partnership, made house payments for her, and gave her $30,000 to pay off some of her credit-card debt. He claimed he got cold feet after learning she had even more debt.

Shell disputed that Gibbs was unaware of her overall debt of $42,000. “It’s simply not true,” Shell told Vieira. “We discussed my debts before I left Florida. We discussed my debts when I came back from Florida. He had a list. He knew exactly what I owed. That’s all just kind of a smokescreen.”

A precedent?
After hearing the case, a Hall County jury awarded Shell $150,000 on Wednesday.

Lydia Sartain, Shell’s attorney, said her only reservations about taking on the case were over the “conservative” nature of area residents who might make up the jury.

“We really debated quite extensively whether to bring the case,” Sartain said. “But we just felt so strongly that in this case he had told her to quit her job and she relied on his promise. He came to her in Florida and moved her back into his house, took steps above and beyond the usual ‘Will you marry me, let’s plan a wedding’ and then somebody backs out.”

“Really, we believe now that he never intended to follow through on the promise to marry,” Sartain added.

Sartain also told Vieira that she hopes the case sets a precedent that an engagement can be a binding contract: “When you give your word to do something and you cause people to rely on it to their detriment, then you may be held accountable for any damages that you cause.”

As for her engagement ring, which she displayed to Vieira and TODAY viewers, Shell said she does not know the value — but she will try to sell it.

“It means nothing now,” she said.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25846393/

Odd that she got so much and still has her engagement ring. If he paid for it he should have gotten it back.
Budious
Women are such leeches. Any reason to get money from a man. Figures this would happen in my state. Note to self, use more sarcasm than usual when I do propose.
Triliaeris
Wow, such a generalized comment about women isn't very nice. Sorry if you've had a bad experience or something, but not everyone agrees with this.

She should have just moved on. It'll probably be overturned later.
Deletedforeverhaha
Ah, isn't it beautiful? Suing the person you want to love because he doubts the relationship... I have to back the woman since she put everything on her fiance and was betrayed.

The man is the reason why people keep saying that chivalry is dead.
Mystic
That is wrong in so many ways. Instead of going through with the wedding and costing thousands (for both sides) he decides to call it off, but still hasn't to pay more than the cost of an actual wedding. Sounds like he should have just divorced her, might have been cheaper. tongue.gif
majortom1981
You guys do know that he was also cheating on her right? He told her to quit her job and move in and goes to marry her then only leaves her a note and cheats on her?

On the news here in NY it was also stated that he cheated on her.

You cant right away blame the woman in this.

Also what is the amountshe sued for. If She only sued for $150,000 it sounds like she only sued for a year or two salary.
zeta_immersion
same **** happened to a girl-friend of mine .. she literally got dumped on the stps of the church when she(the bride at that point in time) found out (right there) that he slept with his secretary at work for about 2 months and to top it off ... he aparently loved her (the secretary) ....

mind you these stupid things (portrayed in the moves are funny) but in real life, this girl is not really messed up per say ... but she lost it completelly ... now ... she talks to me but is nore of a veggie if you know what i mean .....
Triliaeris
Break-ups are not easy, especially when you've built your life around that person, but I don't believe suing them before a marriage is right.

After due to cheating is a whole other story
Mystic
Quote - (majortom1981 @ Jul 25 2008, 10:46) *
You guys do know that he was also cheating on her right? He told her to quit her job and move in and goes to marry her then only leaves her a note and cheats on her?

On the news here in NY it was also stated that he cheated on her.

You cant right away blame the woman in this.

Also what is the amountshe sued for. If She only sued for $150,000 it sounds like she only sued for a year or two salary.

Only? Wow, so can I ask what your job is, if you are saying only? Even with all the wedding preparations, there is no way they spent that much.

She had a decision whether or not to move back to Florida, blaming him for what happened after seems a bit far fetched. If she cared that much about her new job she would have pushed harder to keep it. She made a wrong decision leaving that job and was kicking herself for it. What else would you do when you are down and out....sue somebody. rolleyes.gif
ahhell
"Hell has no fury like a woman scorned."
Tikimotel
Think before you act.
This should stimulate more thinking...(I hope.)

However a 150.000$ wedding? What are you a Hollywood wannabe? Thinking more is better?
An article in the local papers here, stated that most brides are stressed out during the wedding, over complicate things and totally forget what a wedding is really all about.
torrentthief
I'm sorry but they were not married, therefore she shouldnt be entitled to a single penny. A verbal promise is not enough, courts need written evidence. I hate it when courts let jury's decide over things like this, the case should never have gone to court, no law was broken, the courts cant just create laws, thats for the government to do.

Money grabbing *****. Cheating is obviously bad but its still no excuse suing someone who hasn't done anything illegal, she's just as bad as him.

Also i dont agree that in a divorce someone should get half their money, they should get their own money back and their own expenditure taken from it. Like with heather mills mccartney, she should have only got the money for the interviews and things that SHE earnt money from, she shouldnt get £20m of paul mccartney's money. <snipped>
majortom1981
So what you guys are saying is that a guy can propose to a woman tell her to quit her job and move in with him . and the guy breaks it off and nothing will happen even though she had a high paying job ? Remember it also came out that he had no intentions of marrying her.

I think she got the right amount $150,000 sound to me about a year or two salary. This article doesnt give all the details like the Salary of her old job , If they had any deposits for the wedding in. Things like that. Dont right away bash the woman when we have next to no info to go on besides this horribly written article.

Fred Derf
He sounds like a user. Good for her on standing up for herself.

The money was not for the cost of the wedding. The money is because he convinced her, under a promise of marriage, to quit her job and move to his state. Without this settlement she would have been screwed.
Persephone
I think this is ridiculous. An engagement is not meant to be a binding contract, that is what the wedding is for. I don't consider it a "promise" either, just an agreement of your intention to marry.

I'm sorry he screwed her over but you don't make huge life changes because someone agreed to marry you. You wait until that person has actually shown they are really committed - which doesn't look the case from their previous history. She's old enough to know that "I love you" or "I'll marry you" are the oldest lines in the book when a guy wants to "get his leg over".


Quote - (Budious @ Jul 25 2008, 16:31) *
Women are such leeches. Any reason to get money from a man. Figures this would happen in my state. Note to self, use more sarcasm than usual when I do propose.


No.. some women, and there are equal amounts of greedy men who would do the same. Personally I prefer the self respect gained by earning and spending my own money and I find people like this woman quite disgusting.
torrentthief
Quote - (Fred Derf @ Jul 25 2008, 17:07) *
The money was not for the cost of the wedding. The money is because he convinced her, under a promise of marriage, to quit her job and move to his state. Without this settlement she would have been screwed.


It was her own choice though, if they had written an agreement and both signed it then fine, otherwise thats just ludicrous, there is no such law. The woman wasn't forced to leave her job, she did that of her own free will. If the relationship screwed up she knew the risks of that happening like with all couples, therefore he should'nt be liable at all.
Persephone
Quote - (Fred Derf @ Jul 25 2008, 17:07) *
He sounds like a user. Good for her on standing up for herself.

The money was not for the cost of the wedding. The money is because he convinced her, under a promise of marriage, to quit her job and move to his state. Without this settlement she would have been screwed.


I agree he's an ass, but you only get used if you let someone use you. He had already broken a previous promise to marry her, she should have been more cautious.
Deletedforeverhaha
Quote - (zeta_immersion @ Jul 25 2008, 15:47) *
same **** happened to a girl-friend of mine .. she literally got dumped on the stps of the church when she(the bride at that point in time) found out (right there) that he slept with his secretary at work for about 2 months and to top it off ... he aparently loved her (the secretary) ....

mind you these stupid things (portrayed in the moves are funny) but in real life, this girl is not really messed up per say ... but she lost it completelly ... now ... she talks to me but is nore of a veggie if you know what i mean .....


For some reason, that made me laugh because of how stupid the situation is... Amazing.
Mathachew
Silly silly woman... this is why you get married before shacking up, but maybe I'm just too old fashioned (nah, I'm not old fashioned)
Fred Derf
Quote - (Persephone @ Jul 25 2008, 12:11) *
I agree he's an ass, but you only get used if you let someone use you. He had already broken a previous promise to marry her, she should have been more cautious.

I'm not sure that the law should recognize that some verbal contracts are worth more than others.
Triliaeris
Quote - (masked unknown @ Jul 25 2008, 11:11) *
For some reason, that made me laugh because of how stupid the situation is... Amazing.

Nah, I think you can live together before getting married with no problems. Flish and I did and had an agreement as to who gets what. We both know who will get what furniture and money and so on.

I think with the right people it can work out, I just think these two were totally the wrong people.

I don't think engagements should be used as verbal contracts and I don't think under breaking it, there should be penalties like this.

.Cipher
Quote - (majortom1981 @ Jul 25 2008, 11:46) *
You guys do know that he was also cheating on her right? He told her to quit her job and move in and goes to marry her then only leaves her a note and cheats on her?

On the news here in NY it was also stated that he cheated on her.

You cant right away blame the woman in this.

Also what is the amountshe sued for. If She only sued for $150,000 it sounds like she only sued for a year or two salary.


I don't know where you heard that he had cheated on her, but they never mentioned it when they were interviewed on the Today show. you would think the lawyer and the golddigger would have talked about it then. And really to me, when I saw a picture of this woman, the first thing I thought of was that she should be old enough to know better. It was an off-and-on relationship to begin with, so it turning off again should have been a surprise.
Vykranth
Quote - (Fred Derf @ Jul 25 2008, 18:13) *
I'm not sure that the law should recognize that some verbal contracts are worth more than others.


I doubt that verbal contracts have any legal/binding values. You have to have a physical signed paper
to have a proof before a judge.
torrentthief
also if this case doesnt get a retrial i reckon loads of women will sue men for proposing then changing their mind and suing for emotional distress, "i couldn't bare going to work because i was so upset, they then fired me for not going to work for 3 weeks, so i'm suing him for him causing me emotional distress and losing my job". People break up all the time and get engaged and break-up, this is a natural thing, you shouldn't be able to sue over such a thing.

I BET you this WILL happen if this case doesnt get a re-trial and overturned.

Quote - (Vykranth @ Jul 25 2008, 17:21) *
I doubt that verbal contracts have any legal/binding values. You have to have a physical signed paper
to have a proof before a judge.


EXACTLY, the judge shouldn't have let this go to court, there needs to be written evidence of such an agreement, a verbal agreement with no audio recording or written evidence of it happening should not be allowed to go to court.
Triliaeris
Quote - (torrentthief @ Jul 25 2008, 11:24) *
also if this case doesnt get a retrial i reckon loads of women will sue men for proposing then changing their mind and suing for emotional distress, "i couldn't bare going to work because i was so upset, they then fired me for not going to work for 3 weeks, so i'm suing him for him causing me emotional distress and losing my job". People break up all the time and get engaged and break-up, this is a natural thing, you shouldn't be able to sue over such a thing.

I BET you this WILL happen if this case doesnt get a re-trial and overturned.

I do hope that it is overturned. It sets a bad precedent for anyone in a relationship.
Budious
Quote - (Vykranth @ Jul 25 2008, 12:21) *
I doubt that verbal contracts have any legal/binding values. You have to have a physical signed paper
to have a proof before a judge.


No, in the US, there are many case precedents which say if party A promises some action that party B commits some action in preparation for party A fulfilling their offer, then they can be held liable for withdrawing an offer early.

A common case example cites a boat seller, who offers a price to a prospective buyer to be good for 3 days, the buyer makes a preparation to receive the boat by building a dock, but in the meantime, the seller sales to a higher bidder. This constitutes a breach of offer and can be liable in these circumstances. Of course, interpreting to apply to a engagement for marriage may be a bit of a stretch.
Persephone
Quote - (Fred Derf @ Jul 25 2008, 17:13) *
I'm not sure that the law should recognize that some verbal contracts are worth more than others.

Are verbal contracts fairly well accepted in some situations then? To me, it seems to be asking for trouble and complications.. (it's not something I know anything about).

Quote - (Triliaeris @ Jul 25 2008, 17:16) *
Nah, I think you can live together before getting married with no problems. Flish and I did and had an agreement as to who gets what. We both know who will get what furniture and money and so on.

I think with the right people it can work out, I just think these two were totally the wrong people.

I don't think engagements should be used as verbal contracts and I don't think under breaking it, there should be penalties like this.


Yeah I've lived with my boyfried for a few years and we plan to marry in the next year or two. We are technically engaged now but haven't got a ring yet.. so I guess I have a biased view.

We actually don't *want* to be any more committed than we are yet, that's why we're not already married. But you know, if it all goes pear shaped, I'm not going to sue him because, I don't know, I could have gone and married someone else by now or gone to a different uni.. the idea is preposterous to me. You take risks in life, sometimes you fail, you have to learn to get over it and make better choices next time.
S7un7
Bottom Line.....No one forced the woman to quit her job and move somewhere else. She did that on her own.

The judge is a moron because now people in the same situation are going to sue thinking they can get revenge on the other person.
Vykranth
Quote - (Budious @ Jul 25 2008, 18:26) *
No, in the US, there are many case precedents which say if party A promises some action that party B commits some action in preparation for party A fulfilling their offer, then they can be held liable for withdrawing an offer early.

A common case example cites a boat seller, who offers a price to a prospective buyer to be good for 3 days, the buyer makes a preparation to receive the boat by building a dock, but in the meantime, the seller sales to a higher bidder. This constitutes a breach of offer and can be liable in these circumstances. Of course, interpreting to apply to a engagement for marriage may be a bit of a stretch.


I did not know that. That is kind of surprising for me: I always thought that people in the US liked formalized, signed, iron-clad binding agreements.

Quote - (Triliaeris @ Jul 25 2008, 18:26) *
I do hope that it is overturned. It sets a bad precedent for anyone in a relationship.


Yup. I am looking forward to the day I am getting sued for emotional distress because I am 10 minutes late for my date ... tongue.gif
dreamz
i don't see how she can sue him because of a broken promise. in terms of the law, what did he do wrong? if a woman promises to be with her boyfriend forever, and then breaks up with him, can he sue her?

as for her sacrifices, those are irrelevant. she didn't have to give up her job, etc. they could have made some sort of arrangement. besides, not everything will go your way. that's not a justification for a lawsuit.
torrentthief
i completely agree with your dreamz! No law was broken therefore it shouldn't have even got to court. What is the suing culture coming to!
b0m8er
so what's next - are we going to sue our wife/husband for cheating on us? are we going to sue each other for lying? That's just ridiculous!
_X_
Quote - (majortom1981 @ Jul 25 2008, 17:06) *
So what you guys are saying is that a guy can propose to a woman tell her to quit her job and move in with him . and the guy breaks it off and nothing will happen even though she had a high paying job ?


Pretty much. Why should the courts with bothered with these 2 peoples problem. More fool her if she left her job for this guy. He asked her back in October and proposed. Barely any time based before a wedding date was set and now she whinges about it?
Not at all saying what he did was right either by the way.
dreamz
^that's how i see it. if i quit my job to move in with a girl and then she breaks up with me, can i run to the courts and ask for compensation? i don't think i should be able to do that. i knew the risks going in. what do i do then? i just absorb the cost (which is what i should have prepared for in this event, anyway), move out, and find a new job. i can't sue just because things didn't work out.
Budious
You're definitely not in the norm though, most Americans don't share that sense of personal responsibility. It's much easier to seek compensation from the gov't or other party than admit your own bad judgment.
gigapixels
I don't believe this was the right decision. It was ultimately her choice to leave her job and return with him, and therefore he is not the one responsible for her current predicament.
Triliaeris
It's not like he had proved he was seriously interested and the relationship was a stable one, they'd been in an on-off again relationship...those are never good.
gigapixels
Exactly. That's why it was down to her judgment and hers alone.

A promise is not a contract and therefore no legal action can come from breaking one. It is one's own decision to trust another's promise, and if he/she doesn't follow through with it, all one can do is simply not trust him/her anymore.
DrunkenMaster
Quote - (S7un7 @ Jul 25 2008, 12:28) *
The judge is a moron because now people in the same situation are going to sue thinking they can get revenge on the other person.


I agree. Its too bad judges hold so much power that its impossible to have them disciplined or fired. We expect them to have good decision making ability, but this is ridiculous. It was her decision to go back. I could see him maybe moving the costs of her move, but he already down paid all her debts.

Though human emotion involved, if I went to buy a $50,000 car and returned it within a month (say its possible), the dealer can't sue me for $100,000 if its in good order. He'd sue basically for price of car and price he would have earned if the car sold to someone else. She's basically arguing she would have been better financially if she stayed. Certainly not emotionally - shes a nut case.
Fred Derf
Verbal contracts are just as binding as written contracts. They just might be a bit harder to prove. In a case like this, it shouldn't be too hard to get witnesses to testify that they had agreed to marry and he had used terminology like "my fiancee" when referring to the plaintiff.
nomis_nehc
I actually have no sympathy for the guy. The girl left her job, basically picked up her life to start something new. Sure it was of her choice, but a choice facilitated by his action.

So good for her. I wish I could make my ex pay for all the promises she screwed me over with.
Ayepecks
Quote - (Fred Derf @ Jul 25 2008, 17:07) *
He sounds like a user. Good for her on standing up for herself.

The money was not for the cost of the wedding. The money is because he convinced her, under a promise of marriage, to quit her job and move to his state. Without this settlement she would have been screwed.

How does he sound like a user?

This woman had massive debt and he paid $30,000 worth of it! He helped make payments on her house... how on earth is that a user? I think every person has the right to back out of a engagement when you learn your significant other has over $42,000 in debt or you simply don't feel like marrying that person because it doesn't work out.

She made the choice to quit her job. Did he convince her with the marriage proposal? Sure, but she made the choice knowing full well it may no work out. This is all just asinine, IMO.
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