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Zune HD is nothing short of amazing on how well Microsoft has put together a solid, if not superior, alternative to the iPod Touch.

^ Please explain how that is, if its not out yet. Also they pulled there so called "international launch". Besides that, the Touch has been out 2 generations. 3 "technically, but I count 2.5. Anyway, The touch has had solid apps and games day 1.

Please explain how you got to the "solid, if not superior, alternative" if you haven't seen any apps / games on it yet. Also, with it being new, how long before apps and games will be out that are QUALITY and don't freeze / crash the zune like the current games do since they aren't checked and whatever user installs them is basically taking a risk, because if it dies, and they have to send it to microsoft, there screwed.

Before you say anything, my friends 80gig died from installing a game many people did, but had bugs with, sometimes. Him, fine for a week and BOOM crash. So he did a reset and zune was back, didn't play until 2 days after boom again. Ok gave up deleted the game, 5 days later, boom error 5 zune is completely dead.

Exactly, before anyone says a "specific" product is a "solid, if not superior" product to something thats been out on the market for awhile think again.

Now if the Zune comes out and has AMAZING APPS and GAMES within the first month that don't cause ANY problems like crashing, just bugs(of course everything has them) then ok. If not, then its to be expected.

Im not defending apple, I just hate people declaring a product better then another product without experience or giving it time in the market.

^ Fair enough. At the same time, you can't really declare that from past experience on how your friend's zune crashed or exploded, Zune HD will be the same. New product comes with a clean slate. I agree that it takes time and real product feedback after the official launch. But, keep in mind that I am making the statement on the basis of hardware and feature set. Does the Touch have built-in HD radio? Does it have full 720p HD quality? Well, Apple had the chance last Tuesday to add the radio feature they gave to the Nano and also up the screen quality from 480p, but they didn't. So yeah, I am not making any outlandish claims here. All I am saying is the Zune HD has very good potential to trounce the Touch and sales will show for it. Just wait for the reviews to start rolling in later next week.

^ No, but i was implying there introduction of games last year for the zunes didnt turn out too good. So hopefully theres a different way they are doing it this year for the Zune HD.

Also, Who will use HD Radio when you have an MP3 Player. Ive always wondered whats the point of radio(seeing how it barely works on any mp3 player, and some use the headphones as antennas). Really please explain what a radio or HD Radio would do on an mp3 player.

Also, Your right, they could of made it 720p but, if you already have the video on your computer(seeing how there has to be a way to get it onto the touch/zune) why would you even bother putting it on your zune/touch. Then buying a Dock / Cable which would be anywhere from $30-50 and the dock would keep the zune charged / plugged into the tv, where as the cable would be cheaper but would plug it into the tv, and you would have to carry your charge cable plus a usb-to-ac adapter just to keep it charged.

And this goes for any mp3 player. I find it useless for video out, when theres really no point. Burn a dvd, its easier. I personally cant see myself every connecting my mp3 player to my tv to watch video ever. I can stream/burn/etc.

^ The main reason why games didn't take off when they offered a year ago was because the hardware itself was lacking. Very few people would even consider, let alone actually buy, the Zune as an mp3 player. Therefore, there was little incentive for devs to make games for it.

This time around, the Zune HD has some serious guts with the Tegra chipset, HD video, and XBox integration. What is not mentioned in the article is the App Store. A couple weeks ago, a ZuneHD with an "App store" demo was spotted and some people speculated as far as to say MS will pay Apple app store devs to make some of their apps compatible on the Zune. The App Store and Xbox integration really gives two methods for MS to push games through if they go that route.

If they pay apple app store devs to make their apps compatible there admitting that apple has done it right and they need "there" help.

If they do anything to associate with apple, then all APPLE fanboys will TEAR UP Microsoft and I personally will laugh because microsoft f'ed up.

There international launch was a good idea. The OLED Screen AMAZING Idea, everything else was a big fail because the browser, yeah eh no. Anyone with any computer experience does not use IE and using IE on Zune will fail epically. Also, copying basically the Touch besides the OLED screen wasn't smart either. There "were" other ways they could of done it. Honestly I was gonna pick up a HD for my GF, shes been a big zune fan, but now even she said "em if im gonna get the HD might as well get the touch, more support, its bigger, its been out on the market longer". All of what she said, ive never made her choose, so I was surprised when she said that.

I use IE. Have never had a problem with IE7 and later and have had no reason to change to any other browser. I hated safari and imo its much worse then IE so as long as the HD didn't use safari thats a big plus for me. Also MS has the XNA thing. I think they will make it as easy as possible for devs who use that on XBL to port to the zune HD. Also why not pay apple store devs to port to the zune? Im sure MS, Nintendo, and Sony have all laid down money to end a console exclusive. Nothing wrong with it.

Sikh after seeing your anti zune crusade i expect everyone to take anything you say about the Zune with an grain of salt
just because of your friends(NOT YOURS) zune broke, oh **** one product broke out of thousands get the ****in press

There never was going to be an international launch. Here's how The Guardian reported the Zune HD announcement back in May: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/games...une-marketplace

FTA: "However, no Zune portable music players will be launched outside of the US - at least not yet."

the Zune Hd is a totally new product so there going to test the waters in the US(i doubt it will fail) first before attempting to go other places
http://www.anythingbutipod.com/archives/20...s-exclusive.php

Perhaps but my post was aimed at Singh who is claiming that an international launch was abandoned.

i wasn't aiming that at you

No worries

So, where's my 3D games?

lol, here's the one that's out now. It's an independent app, so you need XNA to play.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsWyeTTn7Gg

Can't wait for PGR:FE to drop later this month...

sometime this month i heard