#Michael Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 I know this will spark some flaming but hopefully have an adult conversation ( :rolleyes: ). I have spent the better part of three days now listening to technology websites, bloggers, and media outlets crying about the disappointment that is the iPhone 4S. Well, here is my two cents. Since the original iPhone was released in 2007, Apple's product cycle was releasing a new phone in June. Well, this year it didn't happen. Since June there has been rumor, speculation, and conjecture that there would be two phones, a lower end one based on the iPhone 4 and a re-designed one that would be called the iPhone 5. We all now that didn't happen. Let's take a look at Apple's product release cycle for the iPhone: 2007: Original iPhone 2008: iPhone 3G 2009: iPhone 3GS ***Hello, a complete re-design the year before with a incremental upgrade this year*** 2010: iPhone 4 2011: iPhone 4S ***A complete re-design the year before with a incremental upgrade this year*** So if we continue to follow Apple's product cycle then we will see a complete re-design next year. The iPhone 4S is a great phone with all new components inside. But why are people considering this to be a letdown? Well, let's take a deeper look: 1. Industry analysts that speculated and put out reports of a supposed re-design 2. Rumors that started to run out of control that were based on those reports 3. Technology websites, bloggers, and media outlets that reported these rumors, speculation, and out right conjecture as news. Just my two cents. *edited for some content errors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleNeutrino Veteran Posted October 6, 2011 Veteran Share Posted October 6, 2011 (edited) I mostly agree with you. This is where my thoughts differ. Their main competitor is putting out phones that are still more powerful than the Current iPhones, and there are phones on the horrizon that are much more powerful than the iPhone 4s. for most consumers to be willing to spend the money on an upgrade phone they want it to be substantially different whereas the iPhone 4s has a new camera and a better processor and not much else. I am not saying it is a bad phone just not that big of an update to justify the cost. for a new iPhone user its a great product. Just with all the 4G phones running around these days they expected more I agree wholy that people are let down from the rumors not from the actual product. also why did you mess with the font it is almost impossible to read that way. leave it default. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#Michael Posted October 6, 2011 Author Share Posted October 6, 2011 I mostly agree with you. This is where my thoughts differ. Their main competitor is putting out phones that are still more powerful than the Current iPhones, and there are phones on the horrizon that are much more powerful than the iPhone 4s. for most consumers to be willing to spend the money on an upgrade phone they want it to be substantially different whereas the iPhone 4s has a new camera and a better processor and not much else. I am not saying it is a bad phone just not that big of an update to justify the cost. for a new iPhone user its a great product. Just with all the 4G phones running around these days they expected more I agree wholy that people are let down from the rumors not from the actual product. also why did you mess with the font it is almost impossible to read that way. leave it default. I pulled this from my FB post so it may have been why the font looks off but actually on my computer screen it looks okay (oh well). But in terms of raw power of a smartphone....why is it needed at this point? If the os is optimized to run the the hardware designed for it then why do you need something faster? I am looking at the HTC Titan (WP7.5) when it hits ATT in a month or so. It is a 1.5 ghz phone but only a single core cpu. But if WP7.5 is optimized to run great on it...who cares? Why does Android need to run on a dual core Tegra2 chip at 1.5 ghz at this point? Does it really take the raw speed to make it run great? I ask because I just don't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLegendOfMart Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 The phone IS substantially different. Dual Core CPU and GPU which if the iPad 2 is anything to go buy is significantly faster than the iPhone 4 CPU/GPU. Comes with new antenna design, GSM and CDMA, 8mp camera with 1080p Video capture. You cant really improve on the screen, not everyone wants to carry around a massive 4"+ screen phone, ok so its not AMOLED but imo the IPS screen is superior. The only thing thats not different is the chassis. the 4S is essentially the iPhone 5. I said in another thread that i dont see why people are so dissappointed that its not the 'iPhone 5', Apple never said that there would be an iPhone 5, all these idiotic unprofessional news blogs, tech analysts and journalists started circulating rumours that it would be the iPhone 5 and that it would have a bigger screen. So all the 'industry' hacks who run little blog websites start the rumours and its somehow Apples fault??????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleNeutrino Veteran Posted October 6, 2011 Veteran Share Posted October 6, 2011 Why does Android need to run on a dual core Tegra2 chip at 1.5 ghz at this point? Does it really take the raw speed to make it run great? I ask because I just don't understand. The operating system requires very little power at all, the only reason for such a powerful device is for games and such to run on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#Michael Posted October 6, 2011 Author Share Posted October 6, 2011 The phone IS substantially different. Dual Core CPU and GPU which if the iPad 2 is anything to go buy is significantly faster than the iPhone 4 CPU/GPU. Comes with new antenna design, GSM and CDMA, 8mp camera with 1080p Video capture. You cant really improve on the screen, not everyone wants to carry around a massive 4"+ screen phone, ok so its not AMOLED but imo the IPS screen is superior. The only thing thats not different is the chassis. the 4S is essentially the iPhone 5. Exactly...and without hitting people over the head with a bat that is what I have been trying to say. In my opinion this is a great phone in a great form factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoDEAN Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 4S would be a winner if a) offered 4G and b) offered better battery life. If Apple could have doubled what the Iphone4 had in the new iphone, it would be a must buy. Sadly, it's currently a pass and wait for Iphone 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
threetonesun Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 4S would be a winner if a) offered 4G and b) offered better battery life. If Apple could have doubled what the Iphone4 had in the new iphone, it would be a must buy. Sadly, it's currently a pass and wait for Iphone 5. a) It basically does. b) Obviously that's not going to happen for a while. Clearly the 4S isn't aimed at 4 owners, and this is a solid upgrade for someone with an iPhone, or with a 3G/GS. More disappointing was the final iCloud announcement. A huge data center in North Carolina, and the service isn't much more than what's already available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#Michael Posted October 6, 2011 Author Share Posted October 6, 2011 4S would be a winner if a) offered 4G and b) offered better battery life. If Apple could have doubled what the Iphone4 had in the new iphone, it would be a must buy. Sadly, it's currently a pass and wait for Iphone 5. I admit that not including 4G is an interesting omission but battery life seems pretty good: http://www.apple.com/iphone/specs.html a) It basically does. b) Obviously that's not going to happen for a while. Clearly the 4S isn't aimed at 4 owners, and this is a solid upgrade for someone with an iPhone, or with a 3G/GS. More disappointing was the final iCloud announcement. A huge data center in North Carolina, and the service isn't much more than what's already available. iCloud is an interesting product and I hope that it works better in the long run the mobile me ever did. Siri is very cool and I am looking forward to trying it. I am still not convinced that either product is using the data center in NC....did Apple confirm that that is what the data center is being used for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLegendOfMart Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 Apple HAS doubled what the iPhone 4 had, the reason there is no 4G is because the current generation of LTE chips are really power hungry and Apple would struggle integrating the LTE chip into the current iPhone design, there is a new chip coming out that will be die shrunk to 28nm but they are having problems with moving to 28nm process/low yields and the chips wont be out till 2012 which is why the iPhone 5 is delayed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melfster Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 I mostly agree with you. This is where my thoughts differ. Their main competitor is putting out phones that are still more powerful than the Current iPhones, and there are phones on the horrizon that are much more powerful than the iPhone 4s. for most consumers to be willing to spend the money on an upgrade phone they want it to be substantially different whereas the iPhone 4s has a new camera and a better processor and not much else. I am not saying it is a bad phone just not that big of an update to justify the cost. for a new iPhone user its a great product. Just with all the 4G phones running around these days they expected more I agree wholy that people are let down from the rumors not from the actual product. also why did you mess with the font it is almost impossible to read that way. leave it default. I don't know why everyone is obsessed with getting the fastest processor in a phone. It doesn't really matter to much in phone. The most important thing is the functionality, screen, and then battery life. The reasons why infinity blade and other unreal 3 games are on iphone and not android. Android is still a mess. Because apple just makes one phone its a lot easier for developers to target it. Android does have its strengths but It also has lot weaknesses. The brilliance of ios the ecosystem. For instance i have printer thats air print compatible so I can just print directly to the printer. I have car that gets the cover art from my ios device and puts it on the dashboard of my car ( I know its useless but its a nice touch it works with other usb devices but the cover art is not displayed.) Ther air video and music which I don't use that much. (I usually use foobar and control it with the apple remote program). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger H. Veteran Posted October 6, 2011 Veteran Share Posted October 6, 2011 Moved to iPhone/iOS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliott Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 Their main competitor is putting out phones that are still more powerful than the Current iPhones, and there are phones on the horrizon that are much more powerful than the iPhone 4s. for most consumers to be willing to spend the money on an upgrade phone they want it to be substantially different whereas the iPhone 4s has a new camera and a better processor and not much else. I am not saying it is a bad phone just not that big of an update to justify the cost. for a new iPhone user its a great product. Just with all the 4G phones running around these days they expected more We'll see how the two SoCs actually stack up against each other soon, but so far the A5 in the iPad 2 has shown itself to be extremely capable. The graphics performance alone is more than double what the SGS2 manages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadrack Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I admit that not including 4G is an interesting omission but battery life seems pretty good: http://www.apple.com/iphone/specs.html iCloud is an interesting product and I hope that it works better in the long run the mobile me ever did. Siri is very cool and I am looking forward to trying it. I am still not convinced that either product is using the data center in NC....did Apple confirm that that is what the data center is being used for? From what I've seen so far with iCloud some things I like and other things I don't like. It seems like Apple is really pushing for a paradigm shift in data storage that I'm frankly just not ready for because the shift doesn't seem to offer any improvements over your basic file systems that have existed for years. I'm a very project oriented person. But iCloud (from what I've seen of it) wants me to be application oriented which is what I don't particularly like about it. A project that I am working on may have documents, spreadsheets, photos, etc and i prefer keeping those files organized under a project header rather than spread out and stapled to individual applications. Maybe meta tagging and searching will come and save the day. I'm sure everyone in tech is day dreaming about how to kill the file system (at least from the user perspective) but unless they offer something that is just as usable I'm going to have a hard time with it. It appears that one of my favorite features from MobileMe, iDisk, days are numbered. As for the topic... I thought that the iPhone 4S wasn't a let down at all. Even though Apple may have a case redesign in the works, the current case form factor isn't at all dated. I mean it is only a year old! It makes sense to hold off on a case redesign. The only thing that I felt was lacking in the iPhone 4S was 4G LTE. The new HSPA antenna does 12+mbps, which is really really fast...but I wonder if it really outperforms the iPhone 4's 3G in practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneKnee Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I know this will spark some flaming but hopefully have an adult conversation ( :rolleyes: ). I have spent the better part of three days now listening to technology websites, bloggers, and media outlets crying about the disappointment that is the iPhone 4S. Well, here is my two cents. Since the original iPhone was released in 2007, Apple's product cycle was releasing a new phone in June. Well, this year it didn't happen. Since June there has been rumor, speculation, and conjecture that there would be two phones, a lower end one based on the iPhone 4 and a re-designed one that would be called the iPhone 5. We all now that didn't happen. Let's take a look at Apple's product release cycle for the iPhone: 2007: Original iPhone 2008: iPhone 3G 2009: iPhone 3GS ***Hello, a complete re-design the year before with a incremental upgrade this year*** 2010: iPhone 4 2011: iPhone 4S ***A complete re-design the year before with a incremental upgrade this year*** So if we continue to follow Apple's product cycle then we will see a complete re-design next year. The iPhone 4S is a great phone with all new components inside. But why are people considering this to be a letdown? Well, let's take a deeper look: 1. Industry analysts that speculated and put out reports of a supposed re-design 2. Rumors that started to run out of control that were based on those reports 3. Technology websites, bloggers, and media outlets that reported these rumors, speculation, and out right conjecture as news. Just my two cents. *edited for some content errors The iPhone 3G was only a small upgrade to the iPhone 2G. The iPhone 3G should of come out first because there is no excuse why Apple couldn't of had a 3G chip in it in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomZ Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 The iPhone 3G was only a small upgrade to the iPhone 2G. The iPhone 3G should of come out first because there is no excuse why Apple couldn't of had a 3G chip in it in the first place. A combination of cost cutting and the fact they'd probably been developing based on that phone and a 2G chipset for several years (the UI was such a paradigm shift at the time and so polished it must have been years in development). They just wanted to finally get the product out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stetson Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 4S would be a winner if a) offered 4G and b) offered better battery life. If Apple could have doubled what the Iphone4 had in the new iphone, it would be a must buy. Sadly, it's currently a pass and wait for Iphone 5. Except at the moment a) and b) are a bit mutually exclusive. More power efficient LTE chips based on the 28nm process are slated for 2012. Expect an LTE iPhone 5 sometime soon after those are available in large quantities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vice Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 I would have liked to see a new design as I just like seeing great new product designs. But I think the iPhone 4S is still a pretty solid phone from an external appearance and physical design perspective. I'll be getting mine when it launches. I guess the thing that counts most to me is the software and for me iOS delivers on that and the physical hardware running it doesn't really matter as long as it has the power necessary. That new 8 Mega Pixel camera looks yummy though can't wait to try it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToneKnee Posted October 7, 2011 Share Posted October 7, 2011 A combination of cost cutting and the fact they'd probably been developing based on that phone and a 2G chipset for several years (the UI was such a paradigm shift at the time and so polished it must have been years in development). They just wanted to finally get the product out That's a terrible excuse. Having 3G wouldn't of cost them that much. Apple are just baby feeding customers features with every release. For christ sake, it didn't even get video recording features until over 2 years later with a faster iPhone 3Gs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neufuse Veteran Posted October 7, 2011 Veteran Share Posted October 7, 2011 The iPhone 3G was only a small upgrade to the iPhone 2G. The iPhone 3G should of come out first because there is no excuse why Apple couldn't of had a 3G chip in it in the first place. I didn't think there was a "2G" it just went iPhone, then iPhone 3G (version 2) then iPhone 3GS (iPhone 3) or where you taking about the network revisions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arewhyfour Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 So I'm confused, people in this article are saying (a) that there's no need in a faster processor on the phone and (b) the software should be optimized for the speed anyway so it shouldn't matter. Are you people also sitting on a 486 crying about having to upgrade your computer? Increased speed, RAM, and GPU allow developers more capabilities. The guys at Epic already said that Infinity Blade II can't run like it does on any other version of the iPhone. Also, anyone who thinks the iPhone 4S wasn't as "big" of an upgrade from the 3GS to the 4 wasn't paying attention to anything but the design of the phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger H. Veteran Posted October 10, 2011 Veteran Share Posted October 10, 2011 I guess at what point is it "fast enough" - how fast is the PSP CPU or those kinda systems. The PSP is kinda single use so it's not exactly the same but the only reason to have a 1Ghz+ CPU in a phone is for gaming. You certainly don't need it for Facebook or Weather apps, definitely not for phone calls and most definitely not for texting. So if games were more optimized per say would we need a 2ghz phone that only sucks down battery faster because it can't ramp down as low as say a 600mhz CPU ramping down to 50Mhz or something on idle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arewhyfour Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 I guess at what point is it "fast enough" - how fast is the PSP CPU or those kinda systems. The PSP is kinda single use so it's not exactly the same but the only reason to have a 1Ghz+ CPU in a phone is for gaming. You certainly don't need it for Facebook or Weather apps, definitely not for phone calls and most definitely not for texting. So if games were more optimized per say would we need a 2ghz phone that only sucks down battery faster because it can't ramp down as low as say a 600mhz CPU ramping down to 50Mhz or something on idle? Well you're saying that like you know what's going on behind the scenes or services are running on the device. For every 1 phone call you make how many background tasks are running just for the operating system alone? Or how many background tasks are running as a result to you playing music, keeping sites in memory, etc... The battery is fine, we're not losing any major battery life with this new phone, but things have to increase. You can only "optimize" a game for so much. Have you ever been a developer for anything? If you were you would know how idiotic your statement sounds (not to call you an idiot). Something I don't get is why people are jumping on Apple about this, when they aren't even the fastest phone on the market. But if you're satisfied for the just the basic surfing the web, texting, and phone calls there are plenty of feature phones out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Miller Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 No, they just included stuff in the 4s that they didn't want to include in the 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger H. Veteran Posted October 10, 2011 Veteran Share Posted October 10, 2011 Well you're saying that like you know what's going on behind the scenes or services are running on the device. For every 1 phone call you make how many background tasks are running just for the operating system alone? Or how many background tasks are running as a result to you playing music, keeping sites in memory, etc... The battery is fine, we're not losing any major battery life with this new phone, but things have to increase. You can only "optimize" a game for so much. Have you ever been a developer for anything? If you were you would know how idiotic your statement sounds (not to call you an idiot). Something I don't get is why people are jumping on Apple about this, when they aren't even the fastest phone on the market. But if you're satisfied for the just the basic surfing the web, texting, and phone calls there are plenty of feature phones out there. I am not against progress - hell if someone told me I had to go back to my Sony Ericsson T68i i'd say screw you! I loved that little phone when i got it however! That then the T610/6 - it was just awesome. I surely as hell love my SGS2 right now and glad I can do all the things that I can do on it. I guess we'll eventually reach the point where the PC is now however. CPUs in general have stopped getting faster via clock speed but just optimized to do same calculation or more of them faster. So maybe i'm not a developer but I know you can always optimize. You can find the best method to do something based on your given knowledge and then someone or something comes along and makes it 10x more efficient by a simple change. Put it this way, if the iPhone 3Gs can run iOS5 good, not great - there's almost no need for much faster anything. Surely if you could upgrade the RAM in the 3GS it would run iOS5 better. Siri can probably run on the iPhone 3G with modifications - it's not like we weren't using dictation on Pentium 3 600mhz CPUs back in the days. The dictation software in that case wasn't that good, and that's not cuz of the CPU per say but just understanding and coding in the programs became more robust and as a result used more resources but if they knew what they know now back they would have found a way to make it work. My point is to say simply this. Apple is a hardware company and they've got to sell stuff. No matter how small or large the changes are, they've got to make some otherwise they don't sell. It doesn't matter if they change the color and sell or change the CPU to A6, they've got to change something so that people want the new one, they just need to create reason why someone would want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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