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Family Pictures Taken With Santa, Machine Guns

santa machine guns pictures

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#61 Original Poster

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 11:48

The gun is a SIG, the cartridge the .40 S&W developded for the FBI after the Florida 1980's shootout where they lost 5 agents due to their 9mm's and .38's being inadequate in stopping power. .40's are now used by most law enforcement agencies in the US, the FBI, Border Patrol, ICE, Coast Guard etc.

The round shown is a 135 grain Federal HST developed for the Dept. of Homeland Security for use in the HK P2000sk (sk = sc = subcompact) they use for deep cover. In spite of the parentage of this law enforcement combat round you can buy them in WalMart - $23 for a box of 50. Federal full metal jackets are $25 for a box of 100 here.

The HST's big advantage is its rapid expansion to .68" or as much as .84", creating a 1,700+ lb-ft pressure wave that can cause tissue damage far from the wound, including deep concussions or strokes in the brain, or broken bones from a flesh wound to an extremity. They're also good at penetrating glass and sheet metal.

The black gadget is an UpLULA magazine speed-loader.


mmmmm :o when i move to america im going to have a large amount of guns including rifles, shotguns and hand guns... whats the laws on owning assault rifles and sub machine guns over there? I am seriously planning a whole room dedicated to covert equipment but im very limited over here ! and whats the pricing handgun wise over there?


#62 Nihilus

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 13:26

Actually, per the Heller decision self defense is a co-equal right to all others.

I would also remind you that much of the US in-country ground and air assets are in the hands of the National Guard - citizen-soldiers under the command of the state Governors. In the event of major shenanigans in DC their loyalty cannot be 100% guaranteed.

Remember what happened in Moscow when the Politburo ordered an attack on the revolutionary leaders: it was ignored - they wouldn't fire on civilians.

True, but could it ever reach that point in America, whatever state the government descended to? Surveillance technology in a modern society is such that any organised resistance would be trivial to detect and disband, and on top of that you can push people surprisingly far before they would ever disrupt their daily routine enough for them to do something about it. Let alone for them to take on one of the world's greatest super powers.

Such movements are not impossible, nor are they completely outside the realms of reason, but to a properly organised government they are certainly approaching it. And I know this is a purely hypothetical, and somewhat ludicrous, situation but if the government were to become so corrupt as to require overthrowing do you believe they would be incapable of hiding this fact? Or skewing public opinion in their favor?

Anyway, I guess my main point is that the national guard's loyalty may well not be a concern when they are told they are fighting terrorists for the good of their country.

#63 Vice

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 13:29

Actually, I have never killed a human, but, I have killed deer and wild hogs, for food, and I use the hide for random things, (carpet mostly, have made a blanket as well.)
Great tool for hunting IMO, but I'm taking it you guys are vegan or something? Whatever you may be, a gun may have been designed for killing, but it's uses differ depending on the hands it is in. Just like a flash drive, knife, lighter, rope, box cutter, vehicle.... anything is potentially dangerous. As someone posted earlier, inanimate objects aren't the problem.... Bet you can guess what is though. Next time, don't post such an asinine comment without using your mind first.


Seriously you don't need to go out hunting for food that is what a supermarket is for. Join the 21st century.

Guns are for killing that is all they are designed for.

#64 vetDirtyLarry

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 13:41

Seriously you don't need to go out hunting for food that is what a supermarket is for. Join the 21st century.

Guns are for killing that is all they are designed for.

Cmon, a gun is tool just like those other objects shown! If you cannot open a door, shoot the lock off! Need a can of food opened? Shoot that ****! Need to hammer a nail in the wall! Shoot it (just make sure you have good aim). See, a gun was designed for many other purposes other than ending life (both human and animal). Why can't you see that?

And yes, I am being incredibly sarcastic. Anyone who believes that guns exist for any other reason other than to kill are for whatever reason just not facing reality. That is their sole purpose, that is why they exist. When used properly and correctly, they end a life. Whether it is hunting an animal, or protecting yourself from a criminal, the money shot is a kill. Sure, you can have fun shooting at targets, etc., so they have a secondary purpose, but do not kid oneself, they are meant to end life.

#65 Konstanov

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 13:53

Seriously you don't need to go out hunting for food that is what a supermarket is for. Join the 21st century.

Guns are for killing that is all they are designed for.


Actually here in Texas the wild hog population is so dangerous they have been known to attack and kill people on their property. They breed at an alarming rate and without hunting and professionals keeping their population in check much of Texas' human and crop population would be in danger.

In a similar argument, swords were designed for killing, that is the only purpose they serve but does anyone berate Blizzard Entertainment for handing out swords to their employees for their 5, 10, 15, and 20 year anniversaries with the company? Of course they don't, at least not on the widespread condemnation if a company did the same with artisan firearms, even though both items have the same propensity to cause death if used correctly. Hell, I can give a sword to anyone and they could instantly start stabbing people through the chest with enough upper body strength but if I gave a firearm to someone then more times than not without any guidance or training they would miss their target.

Firearms are not simply for killing, they have become a sport that requires the same training and dedication as any other sport. Target shooting, competition shooting, and hunting are why the majority of people own a firearm in America. I don't understand how Britons can instantly condemn firearms when most of them alive today have never even seen one in person, much less been properly trained in safety, function, and operation of a firearm. They only know firearms can be used to kill people therefore firearms must be bad.

Nothing, anyone says on an internet debate is going to change any minds. The same people are going to be close minded about any sporting uses a firearm could hold and someone who enjoys the sporting uses of firearms are never going to admit they are all bad. I have used firearms for both of these purposes, I have used them to kill people in combat and I own several currently for target shooting, as the intense amount of concentration and focus required to hit a target over 1000 meters away is very calming and helps relieve a great deal of stress in my life.

On the subject of this photo, is it wrong for these people to take their Christmas photo while holding firearms? I don't see any reason it is, however I do personally view it as unnecessary.

#66 eveready

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 03:40

And yes, I am being incredibly sarcastic. Anyone who believes that guns exist for any other reason other than to kill are for whatever reason just not facing reality. That is their sole purpose, that is why they exist. When used properly and correctly, they end a life. Whether it is hunting an animal, or protecting yourself from a criminal, the money shot is a kill. Sure, you can have fun shooting at targets, etc., so they have a secondary purpose, but do not kid oneself, they are meant to end life.


That's why the state of NJ likes to keep the guns owned by two groups: the criminals and the police. :yes:

#67 CyberOptic

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 03:50

Why is stuff like this even allowed to be posted here? All it ever does is start flame wars....

#68 DocM

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 04:23

....whats the laws on owning assault rifles and sub machine guns over there?


If the barrel is over 16", it has an overall length of 26 inches and it's a semi-automatic it's treated no different than any hunting rifle. SKS, AK, HK - whatever. Machine guns require first that State law permits them. If so you to fill out paper with the BATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms), go through background checks and pay a $200 tax on each weapon. The same procedure applies to "Destructive Devices" - hand grenades, grenade launchers, missiles with a charge of more than 1/4 oz., bazooka's, bombs, artillery etc.

....whats the pricing handgun wise over there?


Just talking new here. For a low end Hi-Point pistol $130 - $200 street. Very basic, not fancy & maybe a bit ugly blow-back pistols up to .45 ACP, but if you drop it from the ISS and send them the melted chunk of metal they'll replace it. Seriously. High end the sky's the limit, but a SIG P250 2-Sum can be had for about $550. This polymer double action auto can be converted from a subcompact to full size in 2 minutes flat using a single serial number. A SIG P226 MK25, a commercial clone of the pistol used by the US Navy SEALs, streets at about $900. Basically, you can get a lot of pistol for under a kilobuck.

#69 Perfect72

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 06:40

Cmon, a gun is tool just like those other objects shown! If you cannot open a door, shoot the lock off! Need a can of food opened? Shoot that ****! Need to hammer a nail in the wall! Shoot it (just make sure you have good aim). See, a gun was designed for many other purposes other than ending life (both human and animal). Why can't you see that?

And yes, I am being incredibly sarcastic. Anyone who believes that guns exist for any other reason other than to kill are for whatever reason just not facing reality. That is their sole purpose, that is why they exist. When used properly and correctly, they end a life. Whether it is hunting an animal, or protecting yourself from a criminal, the money shot is a kill. Sure, you can have fun shooting at targets, etc., so they have a secondary purpose, but do not kid oneself, they are meant to end life.


I don't completely disagree. But my sole purpose for owning my guns, is for entertainment, a hobby. Just like video games, football, etc. Honestly I never thought I'd go hunting, until a friend took me. I've been twice, it was a rush, but it isn't why I own guns. I don't disagree they were designed for killing, but more often than not, I find the reason my friends own them is just to go to the range and shoot targets or skeet, and with (hopefully) zero intention of ending a life, ever. Which brings me to back to my original point, its the mindset of the wielder, not the weapon of choice. I'm not naive, but I say this: My guns are no different than my gamepad or controller. Entertainment tools, not a weapon, and I hope in my life they never come to be used as such.

#70 eveready

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:04

I hope in my life they never come to be used as such.


Me neither. Only things I enjoy killing are paper and watermelons. :laugh:

#71 Bad Booster

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:42

I pity that poor child, growing up surrounded by gun-toting rednecks...


Now that's racial profiling sir. For all we know it could be a picture of Europeans, Australians etc if the pic wasn't labelled.

#72 eveready

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:58

Now that's racial profiling sir. For all we know it could be a picture of Europeans, Australians etc if the pic wasn't labelled.


It's acceptable since he's anti-gun.

#73 HighwayGlider

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:13

Where's the fuss? Its just a pic FFS.

#74 Original Poster

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 10:48

If the barrel is over 16", it has an overall length of 26 inches and it's a semi-automatic it's treated no different than any hunting rifle. SKS, AK, HK - whatever. Machine guns require first that State law permits them. If so you to fill out paper with the BATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms), go through background checks and pay a $200 tax on each weapon. The same procedure applies to "Destructive Devices" - hand grenades, grenade launchers, missiles with a charge of more than 1/4 oz., bazooka's, bombs, artillery etc.



Just talking new here. For a low end Hi-Point pistol $130 - $200 street. Very basic, not fancy & maybe a bit ugly blow-back pistols up to .45 ACP, but if you drop it from the ISS and send them the melted chunk of metal they'll replace it. Seriously. High end the sky's the limit, but a SIG P250 2-Sum can be had for about $550. This polymer double action auto can be converted from a subcompact to full size in 2 minutes flat using a single serial number. A SIG P226 MK25, a commercial clone of the pistol used by the US Navy SEALs, streets at about $900. Basically, you can get a lot of pistol for under a kilobuck.


wow :o over here handguns are illegal and would cost me 800 (1400 bucks) for a glock if i went around the law... but i can get a used shotgun for 50 quid (80ish bucks) and a new one from 300-1200 including semi auto 5 shot tac ... when i browse CA in april might see if i can get a can and have it waiting for me when i get back....my god i want guns :'(

#75 DocM

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 11:25

Here a Glock 23 in .40 S&W would run $500 - $600.

http://www.cheaperth...m/13740-55.html

Order, have it sent to a local dealer, pay the taxes & dealer fee, registration ($10 in Michigan + $5 for the notary) and poof.



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