411 posts in this topic

You'd be right. Definitely interested in the games though. Can you explain the gun thing?

Do you mean the Forerunner rifles and shotguns? Of course, they're separable, repairable, and builds on its own. The shotgun is called the "Scattershot" and the rifle is unknown, honestly.

Yeah it makes it more challenging because other players who have been playing the game longer/more have an advantage over you (other than their experience). That makes for really bad competitive play.. I could be beaten by someone who would ordinarily be worse than me just because he has more unlocked abilities.

That's what makes you better. :D

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You'd be right. Definitely interested in the games though. Can you explain the gun thing?

That "inconsistency" is nothing new and has "consistently" happened in all Halo games.

Do you mean the Forerunner rifles and shotguns? Of course, they're separable, repairable, and builds on its own. The shotgun is called the "Scattershot" and the rifle is unknown, honestly.

No he was pointing out that the cut scene shows masterchief carrying an AR whereas when the gameplay starts he is using a BR.

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Yeah it makes it more challenging because other players who have been playing the game longer/more have an advantage over you (other than their experience). That makes for really bad competitive play.. I could be beaten by someone who would ordinarily be worse than me just because he has more unlocked abilities.

I agree and that is one reason I can never get onto CoD because if you start even a few hours late, you feel like others have been playing for years and have all the best goodies the game can offer. I like Halo because everyone starts on an even ground.

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That "inconsistency" is nothing new and has "consistently" happened in all Halo games.

No he was pointing out that the cut scene shows masterchief carrying an AR whereas when the gameplay starts he is using a BR.

Ahh okay. :)

To me, they're good upgrades, in a game where armor is supposed to be upgraded. I mean, This is a sci-fi game you know. You can't live with the same lifestyle every new game. You might as well get a Campaign DLC. :p

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Unm grave mind can control any sentient being. It's controller a forerunner ai before ( the books are considered canon FYI) so that's not specific to cortana.

Also on the topic of forerunner tech, there tech as described by the books can be more organic or cold machine like

It is also those books which mention Cortana lost a significant amount of her lifespan from the Halo array (although it could be an agreed upon conclusion by the Halo community). Either way the fact of the matter is Cortana had a bout with rampancy twice already (one in Halo 3 and one in FIrst Strike during her issue with the AI's on the Covenant ship which may have also harmed her greatly).

In regards to your second sentence, if those descriptions came from Cole Protocol or Cryptum I don't really excuse it since these books were made with heavily altered canon in mind.

I can't help but see a few things wrong (in my opinion) with your post Emn1ty.

Let me make it clear; I was hugely disappointed with Reach. I was a big fan of Halo 3, played on the Halo 1 competitive circuit for a long time and was expecting something very different. Frankly, it just didn't live up to the hype in a whole bunch of ways. So with Halo 4, I'm naturally a little nervous. I got burned pretty bad by bungie because of their "swan song". However, with Halo 4, the more I see of it, the more I become comforted and optimistic.

Don't get me wrong, I actually really enjoyed Reach. The campaign was pretty good and the mechanics solid. The issues I had with it are a) it completely disregards the events of The Fall of Reach, First Strike and Ghosts of Onyx novels and b) Armor Abilities. Outside of that, the game was fine.

This is one of the moments were investing yourself in the canon a little more would help. 343 have specifically stated that they are going to incorporate the other stories that have been told (books, animation) into the games. The books have detailed the Forerunner tech in a lot more detail and, as I believe was already mentioned in this thread, they developed ways to mimick humanoid species. For christ sake, they catalogued pretty much every species in the known universe, so they'll have gathered a lot of data on that sort of thing. In terms of the Covenant alliance; again, in the books if you read Glasslands, etc, only on section of the Covenant followed the Arbiter (I believe the Separatists) in his alliance with the humans. A substantial amount deemed them heretics and what nothing more than to kill humanity (Loyalists). The elites are a proud race and the Loyalists feel cheated and dishonored by an alliance with humanity. It strong suspect it will be a splinter cell group like this that they're fighting. Besides, also in Glasslands, humans are actively attempting (albeit deniably and covertly) to antagonise conflict with the Covenant. It's been 5 years since the end of Halo 3, and it was a tenuous alliance anyway, mainly due to the mutual threat of the flood and a hatred of the Prophets. We'll see how things are, but like I said, I strongly suspect it'll be some form of Loyalists, not the Arbie's crew.

I read the books up to Onyx, I tried stomaching Contact Harvest and couldn't get through it (particularly because its entire premise contradicts First Strike). If this "human mimickry" is in Cryptum, I have not read it. Particularly because there is a large split in the community over whether or not they want to accept it as canon. In fact, I know many of the original Halo lore fanatics and most of them have turned their back on the canon. Cryptum has been the most glaring issue since Reach.

In regards to Glasslands. Why would 343 then mention a "breaking" of the Human-Covenant alliance?

You have absolutely no idea where the storyline is going to go at this point. We've seen a 6 minute segment from one mission. I agree, parallels can be drawn; but I have no problem with that. It's the start of a new trilogy and it's echoing the great things that made the first Halo the best Halo to date. There will be many, many differences in the storyline. But, to each his own.

Them having trampled over existing canon demonstrates they don't really care. They have practically thrown away three of the original books in terms of not only events but continuity. Knowing where it is going is irrelevent, and stating ignorance as a reason not to be skeptical is just naive.

What was wrong with Contact Harvest? (Genuinely interested, not attacking. I enjoyed the book. Was there some kind of linear error?)

The first encountered Covenant were Jackals. Second Grunts. Third was Hunters, then Elites and lastly (not until First Strike) were Brutes. Contact Harvest basically destroys that timeline, and they didn't even try to make things fit properly. I enjoyed everything about Johnson, but that was really it.

Totally agree on Reach. However I disagree on your second point. Moving back to the play-style of Halo 2 and 3 (speed, jump height, weapons) is a very good decision from so many points of view. They've already fixed an awful lot in my opinion. The implementation of sprint is now right, rather than crappy and a choice that made you lose any other options in terms of armor abilities, a system which was deeply flawed. Load outs have undergone a natural progression. Finally I can spawn with a skill weapon (BR/Assault Carbine/DMR). Hopefully rank will mean something again, but still waiting on that. Time invested is not something you should earn a prominent badge for. I'm personally really excited about the playstyle changes.

Two was not good because of its weapons. It was good because of its maps. Halo 2 had the best maps in the series. Armor abilities shouldn't even be present, and neither should sprinting. Randomly spawning weapons also destroys a core aspect of Halo. Then we have the canonical weirdness of Spartan IV's (which, in order to exist had to have been in training during at least Halo 3). There are also a ton of reasons why the UNSC probably wouldn't even pursue another Spartan project.

Actually, as far as I know, the original Forerunners are either dead or there's a few who still monitor the standpoint of their planet alone. They created AI's such as 343 and others to take care and build the rings along with the ark for them which has been going on for millions of years. It's obvious that they're too advance for us to even suggest the fact that they're not capable of manipulating anything. Word has it (if I remember the stories correctly) all lifeforms were originally destroyed once, and had to be replicated, by the forerunners. And for that sake, the forerunners, I believe, perished for that reason due to the amount of powers.

They are not manipulators of the organic. That falls to the Precursors (at least the way I would see it). None of their technology in the first 3 games, nor in the core books or even Ghosts of Onyx demonstrated organic qualities. In fact, much of their tech tries to circumvent what being organic means (slipspace stasis pods, for example). Forerunners aren't much different than humans, they just have more energy at their disposal.

About the rebuilding of life, the Forerunners merely had DNA samples of all life in the galaxy and then cultured them. They cannot rebuild genetic code. What they did was Noah's Ark, essentially. And canonically they were responsible for the wiping of life (via the Halo array).

I believe that planet Chief and the Infinity's on is the home world of the Forerunners.

He is on a Dyson Sphere, something the Forerunners had many of. There was one in Halo Wars as well.

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You might as well get a Campaign DLC. :p

If done right it would be amazing, though the only example of campaign DLC for a shooter game, that I can think of is Operation Racoon City. Though the Spec Ops DLC is fun but the game as a whole felt like it was only half done.

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Ahh okay. :)

To me, they're good upgrades, in a game where armor is supposed to be upgraded. I mean, This is a sci-fi game you know. You can't live with the same lifestyle every new game. You might as well get a Campaign DLC. :p

They should just offer more upgrades that don't affect gameplay, such as different coloured spartan lasers, different armour, different skins for weapons, different HUD skins, etc.

At the very least I hope they provide as many options as Bungie did for customising what is available in various gametypes, for example, being able to turn off sprint, armour abilities etc. That way MLG will probably block the upgrades altogether :)

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I read the books up to Onyx, I tried stomaching Contact Harvest and couldn't get through it (particularly because its entire premise contradicts First Strike). If this "human mimickry" is in Cryptum, I have not read it. Particularly because there is a large split in the community over whether or not they want to accept it as canon. In fact, I know many of the original Halo lore fanatics and most of them have turned their back on the canon. Cryptum has been the most glaring issue since Reach.

Fans don't decide what's canon ;)

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Fans don't decide what's canon ;)

But what is a fan to do when they take the battle of Reach which was only a single day and make a game that extends it to WEEKS. Not to mention putting the Pillar of Autumn in a place it wasn't, Spartan III's in a place they couldn't be (from companies where all members died in previous missions) and on top of that giving Spartan III's MJONLIR armor, of which only Spartan II's had (seeing as it was Halsey's armor). Oh, and Halsey had no solid knowledge of Spartan III's at the time of Reach. She actually only knew of another project of some sort. Basically, the entire storyline of the Reach game makes the book's plot irrelevant. Events that happened in the book no longer make sense with the new timeline. When I say trampled, I mean utterly decimated the original canon. So much so one of the popular theories is that the Reach game is a cinematic retelling by the UNSC of the Reach battle which tries to paint a more heroic picture. Yes, a popular theory is that Halo: Reach is merely propaganda.

So, am I supposed to just accept my favorite Halo book as being pointless? Am I supposed to just accept the fact that prior to Reach's release, Bungie stated "it fits perfectly with the novel" when it clearly does not? I may not decide what is canon, but that doesn't give the establishers of said canon the right to completely destroy the history of the universe on a whim. I saw this coming when I heard the premise of Contact Harvest, discussions of Glasslands, Cryptum and even Cole Protocol have affirmed this and Reach made it obvious. Halo 4 will be no better in terms of canon, and from the demonstration at E3 that has been confirmed.

I'll still buy it, play it and probably enjoy it. But that will not be from a lore standpoint. Halo lore died the moment I saw a Spartan with a skull etched into his visor.

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In a Game universe, games always take canon precedence over extended universe books. Retconned.

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In a Game universe, games always take canon precedence over extended universe books. Retconned.

Yes, I'm aware of this hierarchy. Still doesn't change the fact that they disregarded the first released Halo canon. The book that officially established the Halo universe. There is a difference between retcons and just being ignorant. I don't mind them retconning the series, I do mind them claiming to have made a game that follows established canon and it not being so.

Anyways, this is off topic. Like I said, I'll probably buy and enjoy this game because it looks great and the enemies look very fun. I also would jump at a chance to learn more about the Forerunners even if I feel that some great potential was lost with the setting chosen for the game. Bringing back marines and Covenant may be a bad decision. A forgotten, advanced world crawling with alien constructs and a wealth of knowledge (along with a possibly rampant Cortana) would have made a great story in and of itself.

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I always felt like the books were great stories but didn't matter. After all they make it clear that John was not the last one and that others were alive, but the games never referenced them. Now I have not read all the later books(just first three) but are they still alive?

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I always felt like the books were great stories but didn't matter. After all they make it clear that John was not the last one and that others were alive, but the games never referenced them. Now I have not read all the later books(just first three) but are they still alive?

That makes sense though, the reason Halo CE says you are the last of your kind is because from MC's point of view, and even from the Fall of Reach book that was the case. The last thing you see of the rest of the Spartans is Reach being glassed by the Covenant. it is not until MC returns to Reach post Halo CE that he finds the other Spartans. Halo 1, 2, 3 and ODST all play well with the books. Even Ghosts of Onyx meshed really well with the core three.

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That makes sense though, the reason Halo CE says you are the last of your kind is because from MC's point of view, and even from the Fall of Reach book that was the case. The last thing you see of the rest of the Spartans is Reach being glassed by the Covenant. it is not until MC returns to Reach post Halo CE that he finds the other Spartans. Halo 1, 2, 3 and ODST all play well with the books. Even Ghosts of Onyx meshed really well with the core three.

That explains for 1, but hell he finds Kelly(?) in the wreckage after 1 and meets up with the others before 2. They clearly wanted all the attention on MC himself and I hope 343 uses this new trilogy to introduce the others.

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People shouldn't be surprised if things change from one game and the books, I mean, anyone who's followed US comics for a bit should be used to this retcon business. I think if changes are minor ones (making it from one day into a week long battle) isn't that big IMO) then it shouldn't be an issue.

Anyways, I think the 343i people will probably stick closer to any books than Bungie would have going forward.

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It would be hard to make a Reach game for only one day anyway.

Yes, I'm aware of this hierarchy. Still doesn't change the fact that they disregarded the first released Halo canon. The book that officially established the Halo universe. There is a difference between retcons and just being ignorant. I don't mind them retconning the series, I do mind them claiming to have made a game that follows established canon and it not being so

Well... That would be Halo, the game :)

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Well... That would be Halo, the game :)

Halo: Fall of Reach (Novel) - October 30, 2001

Halo: Combat Evolved (Game) - November 15, 2001

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Theres a few claims that the Fal of Reach novel was supposed to be released after the game hit... Kinda like the third book in the forerunner trilogy as it will reveal some in-game spoilers. (The AI is already known though >.> ) hopefully will see one of the mega size halos from the forerunner civil war.

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Don't know about you guys, but Halo 4 made me want to replay the original, again (for probably over 50th time all the way through with my brother) though now we get achievements!

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Theres a few claims that the Fal of Reach novel was supposed to be released after the game hit... Kinda like the third book in the forerunner trilogy as it will reveal some in-game spoilers. (The AI is already known tho

ugh >.> ) hopefully will see one of the mega size halos from the forerunner civil war.

I actually like how they've released all parts of canon from the Halo trilogy (aka games+novels) in chronological order. It wasn't till Contact Harvest they broke that chain. Although won't say that the book was bad merely because they decided to make books that talked about prior to the events of Reach. I don't know what changed but someone somewhere stopped caring.

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New Halo TV ad airing at half-time in the England/France match. Mostly E3 trailer stuff, but also new live action footage of Master Chief

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:/

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I've never really been a Halo fan to be honest, but I have to say when I saw the Halo 4 trailer at E3 I was impressed. I played Halo 3 and Halo Reach and enjoyed those, but I'm really intrigued by the story of Cortana in Halo 4.

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New Halo TV ad airing at half-time in the England/France match. Mostly E3 trailer stuff, but also new live action footage of Master Chief

Video

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This week's Halo bulletin includes details on achievements and samples of the OST.

Spoilers in achievements, be warned.

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