33 replies to this topic

[contextfree]

Curious since I've still seen people recommend using the Win-C keyboard shortcut, which makes absolutely no sense to me. Personally, I find just using my trackpad for the charms like Settings to feel very easy and smooth. The corner is the easiest spot on the screen to hit (after the pixel under your mouse pointer) and then rather than stopping and waiting, I use momentum to continue moving up in one continuous "swing around the corner" motion. I can see using keyboard shortcuts for individual charms (especially Win-Q) but Win-C is completely pointless because

1) It brings up the charms as a whole, you still have to use arrow keys to get to the individual charm you want
2) Then (except for Search where you can just type) you still have to select something IN the sidebar that comes up, so you still have to move the mouse pointer to the right side anyway (or use arrow keys which is even more cumbersome)

Just using the mouse / trackpad is much easier ...

So to all those who still don't like it, I'm wondering

1) Do you think of clicking on a charm as TWO motions (move to the corner, then stop, then move up to the charm you want) or as ONE continuous "swing around the corner" motion? The latter works much much better IMO

2) Do you like it any better in the Release Preview? (I think it's a bit better as the animations are faster, though still slower than I'd like).

[andrewbares]

What I find really annoying is that you have to right click the web page to switch tabs or type in a URL. pretty ridiculous.

Oh and my mom pointed out, "There's no clock!" The only way you can see what time it is is by opening the charms. They definitely need to add the time to the home screen...

[contextfree]

andrewbares, on 16 June 2012 - 03:35, said:

What I find really annoying is that you have to right click the web page to switch tabs or type in a URL. pretty ridiculous.

Oh and my mom pointed out, "There's no clock!" The only way you can see what time it is is by opening the charms. They definitely need to add the time to the home screen...

How would adding it to the start screen be any better? I can see the advantage of having a taskbar/status bar/etc. on the screen at all the time that would show the clock, but with it on the start screen you'd still have to go to a separate screen to see it, which is no faster or less intrusive than bringing up the charms.

I think the tabs/URL thing is a matter of browsing patterns. Metro style IE is not optimized for heavy tab switching, if you don't switch tabs much and want to be immersed in the page its approach works well, if you're switching back and forth all the time it gets very cumbersome, but you can still use the desktop browser, or another desktop browser and you'll probably be able to use other Metro style browsers that will better suit your needs. Personally I'm 100% on the desktop browser on a laptop and even on a tablet I'm about 50/50 desktop vs. Metro style depending on what I'm doing.

[subcld]

No i get used to it it becomes something regular to do on win8

[Dashel]

Yes, the hotcorners still need a lot of work when it comes to the traps and behavior. At least that is fixable by release.

I still dont know why they don't go back to the Pre-Mango tab behavior, it was much easier. The problem with Metro is that it is supposed to be the successor, so it needs to nail down these problems quickly. They can't just throw up their hands and say use the desktop or a competitor. I don't see how you can call for the death of the desktop yet are so disinterested in getting those bits into Metro. That a pretty nonchalant approach to such a fundamental feature as tab switching.

[contextfree]

Dashel, on 16 June 2012 - 04:15, said:

Yes, the hotcorners still need a lot of work when it comes to the traps and behavior.

What is the difficulty you are having with them? Are you taking the "one continuous motion" approach?

Quote

The problem with Metro is that it is supposed to be the successor, so it needs to nail down these problems quickly. They can't just throw up their hands and say use the desktop or a competitor. I don't see how you can call for the death of the desktop yet are so disinterested in getting those bits into Metro.

Who is calling for the death of the desktop? I don't regard "Metro" as a replacement for the desktop, just an additional model. Much like websites and web applications have not replaced desktop applications (though people have been predicting that for a long time), but only supplemented them. Some people do everything on the web and barely use any local program but a web browser, some people still prefer to use local mail clients etc., most people use a combination.

[bjoswald]

It's not hard to do, it's just annoying and unnecessary.

[+sanke1]

Yes, I still find charms bar clumsy/difficult/stressful. Instead of idiotic swinging of mouse around, they could have simply added a charms bar button on taskbar in place of show desktop button.

[Velox]

I actually rarely use the mouse to open the charms bar, then again I'm rarely in the Metro UI. I've just about got down remembering all the new shortcuts for everything though, so that makes it a lot easier.

But when I was using the mouse to open the charms bar, it REALLY sucks on a multi monitor setup lol.

[+chAos972]

Charms were annoying until I remember I could move the cursor to the corner to access the start menu. Then it was much less painful.

[contextfree]

sanke1, on 16 June 2012 - 05:08, said:

Yes, I still find charms bar clumsy/difficult/stressful. Instead of idiotic swinging of mouse around, they could have simply added a charms bar button on taskbar in place of show desktop button.

But this would still require you to select the individual charm itself, so would be no easier than the current setup. In fact it would require an extra click (if I understand you correctly). And of course it would only work on the desktop.

[Mohitster]

I find it rather a hassle....it's always easier to click on a button or something which you know where it resides rather than a making a gesture (using a mouse) at a certain position on screen.....

[bogas04]

Take my screen estate and get start menu back!

[rfirth]

Mohitster, on 16 June 2012 - 05:43, said:

I find it rather a hassle....it's always easier to click on a button or something which you know where it resides rather than a making a gesture (using a mouse) at a certain position on screen.....

It's never easier to hit a button on the screen than it is to hit a hot corner - which is essentially a button with infinite width. The only problem is that it's hidden - and therefore pretty undiscoverable. But once you know it's there, it's easy. This describes most of the 'usability issues' in Windows 8. It's a learning curve, but not necessarily a usability problem. Unfortunately, people get impatient easily.

It's not really a gesture (in my opinion) - it's just you moving the mouse to a certain part of the screen. The movement of the mouse up afterwards is necessary anyway because you need to move to the position of the charm button to click it anyway. It definitely feels like a gesture, but that's only because they have streamlined it a little.

[theyarecomingforyou]

I've used Windows 8 for several months - started with the Developer Preview, currently running the Release Preview - and I still find the charms bar to be awkward and poorly suited to a desktop environment. It's very annoying that you have to use it in order to shut down or restart your computer; the keyboard shortcuts aren't a good alternative, nor will most users be aware of them. The hot-corners in general are clumsy, though the start corner itself is easy to adapt to.

I like Windows 8 overall but very much dislike the charms bar and the implementation of Metro (though the concept is fine). There is no reason that the taskbar shouldn't remain visible at all times, except for apps that run in fullscreen (like games). If that were the case then you wouldn't need the charms bar, nor the Metro task switcher - the hot-corners wouldn't be needed at all. And the taskbar is already suited to touch since Microsoft switched over to the larger icons in Windows 7. Microsoft has tried too hard to distance itself from the desktop that it has impacted usability.