108 posts in this topic

I was trained in the sciences in a strictly academic orthodox manner.

I hold a bachelor?s of science in zoology with a minor in chemistry and a master?s in biocultural anthropology, both degrees obtained at Oregon State University ? as orthodox a science institution there ever was. I then taught physical anthropology at this same university for seven years.

Paranormal phenomena, including UFOs and alien abductions, were anathema to me. I could not fit them into my naturalistic worldview.

First, my academic background simply would not allow it psychologically. UFOs were hallucinations, mass hysteria or some other conveniently explainable occurrence. Alien abduction experiences were the result of childhood trauma, possibly physical and sexual abuse.

Second, even if I wanted to explore the paranormal, I could not and dare not because of the restrictive intellectual atmosphere of collegiate academia. People lose their jobs for talking ?crazy talk?!

But then something happened in late January 2007 that challenged my worldview and my strict scientific interpretation of the natural universe. My best friend of 30 years saw a UFO. Not a far-off, hazy blinking light or a midnight vision from a half-remembered dream but an actual UFO.

He was close enough to see it in some detail: a black triangle with strobe lights that flew low over his house and emitted a deep droning sound that rattled the windows. His wife and young son had witnessed it first flying over downtown south Salem heading toward the Willamette River. She called him on her cell and told him a UFO was moving in his direction. Several people were stopped on the street corner, watching as the strange triangular object floated slowly by low overhead.

My father told me of a UFO sighting he and his grandfather had in what must have been October or November of 1957. They were watching the skies of Eastern Washington for the Sputnik satellite to pass by. But they didn?t see the tiny point of light that went ?beep? on the radio. Instead, they saw two bright blue objects flying in formation from one side of the horizon to the other at an impossibly fast speed. They were well acquainted with military aircraft and these objects were like nothing they had seen before. Besides, there was no sonic boom.

Then my daughter saw a UFO in the summer of 2009. We were reading a bedtime story when she interrupted me and told me to look out the window. By the time I put the book down and looked, the object was gone. I quickly got her some pens and a writing pad. I noted the date and time and the direction she indicated the object had been moving. Then I had her draw it. I asked her about size in relation to distance, and she declared that it had been big, much too large to be an aircraft.

Besides, her drawing looked nothing like an aircraft. My daughter had never been given to exaggeration or fibs, so I knew she was reporting the truth. Had she imagined it? No, absolutely not.

Now my closest friends, my dad and my daughter had all witnessed UFOs. These were not figments of the imagination. They were physically real objects. How could I not believe them? How would I feel if I had seen a UFO and they didn?t believe me? I would feel betrayed, of course.

Suddenly I had an epiphany. I had crossed over into a new worldview and there was no turning back. This was undeniable believability.

I do not believe in UFOs. I accept their physical existence in natural reality. UFOs are real. We may not know what they are; but whatever they are, they exist in the natural universe. I prefer not to consider them paranormal. They are absolutely normal. The scientific question is, normal what? This question is my passion.

Jordan Hofer of Salem is writing a book for Schiffer Publishing called ?Evolutionary Ufology: A New Synthesis.? He is a research specialist in anthropology with the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON), the largest such investigative entity in the world.

Contact him at refoh.nadroj@gmail.com.

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UFOs are nothing more than government classified aircraft.

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^ Good -- that's just what they want you to believe. :ninja:

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^ Good -- that's just what they want you to believe. :ninja:

Or maybe they want you to believe in aliens

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UFOs are nothing more than government classified aircraft.

Proof?

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Aliens exist, they came here and created us. Proof is all around us we just refuse to believe it.

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Proof?

Just look at all the stealth airplanes that came out of Area 51. They also recently built a new hanger, which is odd because there approx. 23 "empty" ones on the base they could have used instead.

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Proof?

There is more proof of secret military projects then there are of alien crafts.

Aliens exist, they came here and created us. Proof is all around us we just refuse to believe it.

That's such a copout statement, saying there is proof all around us while not offering a single thing is just a joke

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Out of all the trillions and more solar systems in the universe there must be Aliens out there, just makes logical sense.

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Out of all the trillions and more solar systems in the universe there must be Aliens out there, just makes logical sense.

That's not really whats being talked about here

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That's not really whats being talked about here

True but UFO most of the time relates to Aliens. Just my 2 cents

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True but UFO most of the time relates to Aliens. Just my 2 cents

That's part of the problem, people associate UFOs with aliens. UFO simply means unidentified flying object, not alien flying object. So no UFOs don't mostly relate aliens, its the association that some people give to it.

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That's such a copout statement, saying there is proof all around us while not offering a single thing is just a joke

Just read all the ancient scripture, try to remember that they did not have words for what they saw and you will see it all makes sense. Surely they can't all be fantasy stories. And for the people who believe 'God' created us well just apply the same logic to that story too and suddenly it's not so crazy after all.

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Just read all the ancient scripture, try to remember that they did not have words for what they saw and you will see it all makes sense. Surely they can't all be fantasy stories. And for the people who believe 'God' created us well just apply the same logic to that story too and suddenly it's not so crazy after all.

When I try to apply logic to religion... I get hate mail :p

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UFO means Unidentified Flying Object, first of all. There are plenty of those, but I guarantee 95% are military aircraft...probably unmanned tests. Aliens do not exist, except for the ones that are illegally living in my country.

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When I try to apply logic to religion... I get hate mail :p

Lol you just need to remember that they did not have the vocabulary we have today. So things like flying chariots are probably the best way they could describe a spaceship.

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UFO means Unidentified Flying Object, first of all. There are plenty of those, but I guarantee 95% are military aircraft...probably unmanned tests. Aliens do not exist, except for the ones that are illegally living in my country.

^ That's the original meaning of UFO -- it has mutated to include alien craft. Look in most dictionaries.

UFO

? ?[yoo-ef-oh or, sometimes, yoo-foh] Show IPA

noun, plural UFO's, UFOs.

any unexplained moving object observed in the sky, especially one assumed by some observers to be of extraterrestrial origin.

And many things do exist -- just because a particular thing isn't in your back yard, does not mean it exists nowhere. ;)

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Just read all the ancient scripture, try to remember that they did not have words for what they saw and you will see it all makes sense. Surely they can't all be fantasy stories. And for the people who believe 'God' created us well just apply the same logic to that story too and suddenly it's not so crazy after all.

Who's ancient scriptures? Cause there is more then a few out there by different cultures and no they don't all tell the same stories. Just because people back then didn't have words that we would use today, does not equate to aliens being described. Why can't they all be fantasy stories? Who made the rule that they have to be real? Are you implying that Medusa, Pegasus, Thor, regular and ice giants, fire breathing dragons and so on were real? What about the thousands of gods that came before the modern day ones, they must have been real as well then.

You are no different then those of religious faith in a god to believe that aliens spawn human kind. Lack of proof for one is still lack of proof for the other and nuts is still nuts.

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^ That's the original meaning of UFO -- it has mutated to include alien craft. Look in most dictionaries.

UFO

? ?[yoo-ef-oh or, sometimes, yoo-foh] object observed in the sky, especially one assumed by some observers to be of extraterrestrial origin.

And many things do exist -- just because a particular thing isn't in your back yard, does not mean it exists nowhere. ;)

Adding to the definition doesn't change the original definition. Not everyone includes aliens in that and until hard proof is found, it remains in the not real section. And we have been over this in the past Hum, video evidence isn't not considered hard proof.

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Who's ancient scriptures? Cause there is more then a few out there by different cultures and no they don't all tell the same stories. Just because people back then didn't have words that we would use today, does not equate to aliens being described. Why can't they all be fantasy stories? Who made the rule that they have to be real? Are you implying that Medusa, Pegasus, Thor, regular and ice giants, fire breathing dragons and so on were real? What about the thousands of gods that came before the modern day ones, they must have been real as well then.

You are no different then those of religious faith in a god to believe that aliens spawn human kind. Lack of proof for one is still lack of proof for the other and nuts is still nuts.

I'm not going to prove anything to you because I don't care what you think and I don't have time for this. Keep living your close-minded life if that makes you happy.

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I'm not going to prove anything to you because I don't care what you think and I don't have time for this. Keep living your close-minded life if that makes you happy.

No you're not going to prove anything because you can't. If proof existed this wouldn't be a debate. Again you make the claim while offering zero proof to back up that claim, the burden of proof is on you, no body else.

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Lol you just need to remember that they did not have the vocabulary we have today. So things like flying chariots are probably the best way they could describe a spaceship.

I completely understand what you are getting at. I always thought the Creator of Independence Day implied that. In the christian bible, it says that when god came down from the heavens, the skys were set on fire and ablaze, with roaring thunder, on a big golden chariot. If you watch ID4 ( the one with Will Smith ), it gives a very awesome visualization of that description.

I'm Atheist, but If there is any type of "god", it is just an alien creature that created us. In my belief.

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I completely understand what you are getting at. I always thought the Creator of Independence Day implied that. In the christian bible, it says that when god came down from the heavens, the skys were set on fire and ablaze, with roaring thunder, on a big golden chariot. If you watch ID4 ( the one with Will Smith ), it gives a very awesome visualization of that description.

I'm Atheist, but If there is any type of "god", it is just an alien creature that created us. In my belief.

And in all fairness nature can also provide almost the exact same effects. A big storm or even a volcano can provide very similar visualization to that as you just mentioned. As for the flying chariots, the more simple explanation would be that of a meteor or comet.

Another thing to remember is that back then, the avg person had the education level of maybe a 3rd grader. Their understanding of the world back then was based on ignorance for the most part. They thought the world was flat and the center of the universe and something as simple as a magnet would defy all logic for the most part. So for someone back then, what we understand as a meteor shower, an earthquake or any other strange event was considered other worldly and didn't have a place in their society as something simple and natural.

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It looks to me like a leaked image of the next flavor of Doritos, complete with edible led's on the corners.

TY827.jpg

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