61 replies to this topic

[theyarecomingforyou]

Fractalize, on 08 October 2012 - 06:26, said:

I do to some degree but I don't support the US approach entirely and I would of preferred that he was brought in alive to face trial and due process BUT I agree with what the officer did to the extent of, this guy is on drugs and he is not calming down and I have seen the skinniest people drop the biggest guys and anyone is capable of anything at any given time

But that's exactly why you need a police system that works properly. If police work in pairs, wear stab-proof / bulletproof vests, are equipped with non-lethal weapons, have access to support, having training in psychology and unarmed combat and are taught how to deal with violent suspects then you can eliminate the need to use guns when dealing with unarmed suspects, as is the case in the UK. Further, when dealing with people off their head on drugs you need special training - pointing a gun at them and trying to use reason isn't going to work. People in the US are dying needlessly because the police system there is simply not resourced or trained to deal with situations properly, as well as a culture that supports an excessive use of force. I'm not defending the actions of the suspect here - he was clearly behaving in an unacceptable manner and his actions cost him his life. But he shouldn't have been killed and that is a clear and obvious failing of the justice system.

There was a video of another case where a man with a knife was running down the street in New York. In that police all ran after him, pointed guns and were shouting at him, while he seemed to be under the influence of drugs. The police lacked any coordination, any obvious command structure and they clearly hadn't been trained in basic psychology - it was pandemonium and unsurprisingly the guy ended up being shot about ten times and dying instantly. It's the same with police chases where you see a dozen police cars all speeding after a suspect - there's no strategy. I would say it's a joke but that's not appropriate when people are dying as a result of police incompetence (and by that I don't just mean the officers involved but the entire command structure).

[tiagosilva29]

The man involved was a campus police officer. What exactly does that mean? Is he a real police officer or a security guard?

[Gerowen]

tiagosilva29, on 08 October 2012 - 08:02, said:

The man involved was a campus police officer. What exactly does that mean? Is he a real police officer or a security guard?

At the University I attended we had campus police officers that were legitimate and trained officers with jurisdiction on and around campus. Their primary focus was the campus itself, and that's where their station was, but they had cruisers, sidearms, uniforms, and were required to complete the same training as everybody else. I think they probably just pulled people from the local city police to use as the campus police.

[+remixedcat]

he proly thought the naked guy was a zombie.... lots of those around lately....

[Hardcore Til I Die]

MDboyz, on 07 October 2012 - 15:50, said:

Really? why don't you try to stop these kind of people high on drug w/o using force. What you do if you don't have anything besides gun at that time? You want to stop him with bare hand alone?

tiagosilva29, on 07 October 2012 - 16:01, said:

When was the last time you faced someone under the influence of PCP/bath salts? I am not going to describe what I had to do in order to get out of his grip.

LETHAL FORCE.

Read my god damn post

I have no problem with officers knocking someone out, spraying them, etc. Shooting an unarmed person dead is beyond ridiculous, high or not.

[psionicinversion]

couldnt he have just shot him in the legs

[MDboyz]

You really need to stop watching movies.

statm1, on 08 October 2012 - 02:55, said:

Did the officer forget that he could of shot the guy in the feet or arms or aimed for the shoulders. Eventually no matter what drugs hes on he won't have the ability to get up. Instead he went straight for the deadly shot......

[Ambroos]

Campus officers shouldn't even be carrying guns, period. As far as I know in the UK for example not even regular police officers carry guns.

[Xilo]

Ambroos, on 08 October 2012 - 21:02, said:

Campus officers shouldn't even be carrying guns, period. As far as I know in the UK for example not even regular police officers carry guns.

The UK and the US are two entirely different countries. Just because something works in your country doesn't mean it works in another country.

Is it that hard of a concept for UKers to understand instead of preaching and belittling others to why everyone should be like them?

[Nihilus]

Xilo, on 08 October 2012 - 21:06, said:

The UK rest of modern society and the US are two entirely different countries entities. Just because something works in your country, doesn't mean it works in another country we'll support it.

Is it that hard of a concept for UKers foreigners to understand instead of preaching and belittling highlighting potential issues to others to why and claiming everyone should be like them adopt stances based on reason?

Fixed.

But on a serious note, there are some issues that have been highlighted with the American police force in the past. I believe concerns over being too quick to resort to violence, poor training in dealing with crisis situations etc. have all come up and been well documented.

Wasn't there a fad not long ago about videoing police officers doing rather dubious things?

[Hardcore Til I Die]

Xilo, on 08 October 2012 - 21:06, said:

The UK and the US are two entirely different countries. Just because something works in your country doesn't mean it works in another country.

Is it that hard of a concept for UKers to understand instead of preaching and belittling others to why everyone should be like them?

If this had happened in the UK, nobody would be dead.

[suprNOVA]

probably bath salt.

[Growled]

Hardcore Til I Die, on 08 October 2012 - 22:16, said:

If this had happened in the UK, nobody would be dead.

How do you know the guy on bath salts wouldn't have killed the policemen?

[shakey]

Growled, on 08 October 2012 - 23:47, said:

How do you know the guy on bath salts wouldn't have killed the policemen?

Because the policemen over there are actually trained and not retarded like most people here in america.

[Growled]

shakey, on 08 October 2012 - 23:50, said:

Because the policemen over there are actually trained and not retarded like most people here in america.

Trained or not, you never know what a person on drugs is going to do or what they are capable of. Besides, this wasn't even a real cop. He was a campus officer.