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I liked all Windows versions except for ME and Vista. ME was garbage and Vista was just awful and hard to get used to. Windows 7 is absolutely awsome and I loved it right from the start, since even before it was released I used it, and everything I love about it isn't in Windows 8, so I won't be downgrading to Windows 8.

Er... what? So, you're saying you really only loved the Start Button and Menu then?

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How was vista hard to get used to? it's not too far off from xp and 7 so far as UI navigation is concerned.

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The disruptive way of working is what sucks about Windows 8. With everything Microsoft have done they want to try and make apps behave more consistently, but by doing that they've completely forgot that apps have to do different things.

As it's been said before, the Wikipedia app is a brilliant example. You don't use Wikipedia to browse things and jump between pages all the time, you mostly use it to search for things. To search you need a search bar. Hiding behind too many clicks is just ridiculous. An app that's meant to be searched needs a good search bar.

And it's like that with pretty much all the apps. Moving actions to the charms bar might be good for touch devices but is extremely stupid for anything with a mouse or touchpad. Having to move your mouse aaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way to the upper right corner and then down again every time you want to do something like that is annoying as hell. I've tried Windows 8 on my laptop using my touchpad (which I love in Windows 7), but with Windows 8 it's just horrible.

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To search you need a search bar. Hiding behind too many clicks is just ridiculous.

Too many clicks!? Search is only one click away, dude.

Having to move your mouse aaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way to the upper right corner and then down again every time you want to do something like that is annoying as hell. I've tried Windows 8 on my laptop using my touchpad (which I love in Windows 7), but with Windows 8 it's just horrible.

You do have a few choices here, WIN+C will invoke the Charms bar, alternatively, it's not that much of a chore to throw your mouse into the corner. Complaining about it makes you looks idiotic, I hate to say it, but even on high resolution monitors, it's not a big deal. Tweak your mouse tracking if you need to. You could also invest in a cheap mouse. Laptop trackpads are a pain in the ass, no matter what OS you're using.

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The disruptive way of working is what sucks about Windows 8. With everything Microsoft have done they want to try and make apps behave more consistently, but by doing that they've completely forgot that apps have to do different things.

As it's been said before, the Wikipedia app is a brilliant example. You don't use Wikipedia to browse things and jump between pages all the time, you mostly use it to search for things. To search you need a search bar. Hiding behind too many clicks is just ridiculous. An app that's meant to be searched needs a good search bar.

And it's like that with pretty much all the apps. Moving actions to the charms bar might be good for touch devices but is extremely stupid for anything with a mouse or touchpad. Having to move your mouse aaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way to the upper right corner and then down again every time you want to do something like that is annoying as hell. I've tried Windows 8 on my laptop using my touchpad (which I love in Windows 7), but with Windows 8 it's just horrible.

You do have choices though. First of all you could continue to use your Windows 8 in exactly the same way as you use Windows 7 and then you'd find that it's ultimately the same. Alternatively, if you choose to run Metro apps you could use keyboard shortcuts to access the charms without having to move your mouse.

Personally, I think it makes sense to move the search function to the Charms bar so it appears in a common location for all apps and frees up space within apps for content.

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How was vista hard to get used to? it's not too far off from xp and 7 so far as UI navigation is concerned.

for one, some OEMs really liked to **** with some of the setting (mostly the default personalization settings and some explorer settings). and the vista personalization center was really not very good

those are the main things i personally didn't like about vista

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The disruptive way of working is what sucks about Windows 8. With everything Microsoft have done they want to try and make apps behave more consistently, but by doing that they've completely forgot that apps have to do different things.

As it's been said before, the Wikipedia app is a brilliant example. You don't use Wikipedia to browse things and jump between pages all the time, you mostly use it to search for things. To search you need a search bar. Hiding behind too many clicks is just ridiculous. An app that's meant to be searched needs a good search bar.

And it's like that with pretty much all the apps. Moving actions to the charms bar might be good for touch devices but is extremely stupid for anything with a mouse or touchpad. Having to move your mouse aaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way to the upper right corner and then down again every time you want to do something like that is annoying as hell. I've tried Windows 8 on my laptop using my touchpad (which I love in Windows 7), but with Windows 8 it's just horrible.

Update your drivers and your charms will be a swipe away (swipe in from the right on modern touchpads and it will show the charms bar)

Same gesture as on a tablet. And seriously, all you have to do is move your mouse a little further. Increase the sensitivity, I can put my mouse anywhere on the screen I want to instantly.

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Yes, I know about all of these things, and they make sense for touch-based devices. But I still think metro apps just aren't suited for desktop/laptop use as well as the regular Windows interface (as it is in 7) are. I also know you can use Windows 8 just like Windows 7 and I wouldn't mind using it that way, but it's still not what Microsoft 'meant' for us to do and that's what I don't like. They seem so focused on catching up in tablet and mobile markets that they're forgetting the vast majority of Windows users will always be in the desktop category.

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i can't wait for the 26th to come. the internet is going to explode after people see how w8 is on a non touchscreen device.

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i can't wait for the 26th to come. the internet is going to explode after people see how w8 is on a non touchscreen device.

Explode in a good way? I agree. ;)

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As it's been said before, the Wikipedia app is a brilliant example. You don't use Wikipedia to browse things and jump between pages all the time, you mostly use it to search for things. To search you need a search bar. Hiding behind too many clicks is just ridiculous. An app that's meant to be searched needs a good search bar.

Wikipedia app has been updated to support search as you type.

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They seem so focused on catching up in tablet and mobile markets that they're forgetting the vast majority of Windows users will always be in the desktop category.

The vast majority of Windows users are forgotten... not by Microsoft, but by developers. Seriously, nothing new has come for Windows in a while. That's a red flag that something's wrong, bro. That's a red flag, that times are changing, and maybe, just maybe, it's time to change with them.

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You do have choices though. First of all you could continue to use your Windows 8 in exactly the same way as you use Windows 7 and then you'd find that it's ultimately the same. Alternatively, if you choose to run Metro apps you could use keyboard shortcuts to access the charms without having to move your mouse.

Personally, I think it makes sense to move the search function to the Charms bar so it appears in a common location for all apps and frees up space within apps for content.

Absolutely true, jakem.

I moved lock, stock, and barrel to Windows 8 from Windows 7 (on a desktop, no less) - and was able to do it painlessly largely because I had far less to unlearn.

If you're used to the power mouser's playground that the Start menu had devolved into, you are going to have a major UNLEARNING CURVE ahead of you (unless you use something like Classic Shell or Start8).

You can actually add the Search functionality to the *desktop* simply by adding the Address Bar to the Taskbar (ala 7) or do it the really easy way - search via the StartScreen itself (if you're looking for a short cut to any application, applet, or utility - Modern UI or not) by tapping the Windows logo key.

Searching via the StartScreen is easier (for me) because I'm generally searching for something that is neither on my desktop OR in my presorted files by data-type; therefore, it's a seldom used app, applet, or game.

Presorted data types? Pretty much any download manager WILL offer to sort your downloads by file-type, and the one I use (Internet Download Manager) is no exception. Even better, those same download management utilities will also accept the default locations in Windows (that didn't change with Windows 8).

The real issue with migrating from Windows 7 to Windows 8 is more the unlearning curve than the learning curve.

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Explode in a good way? I agree. ;)

Do you honestly think that ALL Windows users need mice that much?

That Windows users are basically married to the Start menu?

The Start menu CAN be unlearned; back in the early days of Start8, I DID actually try it (I had already demoted Windows 7 to VM duty) and loathed it, and it had absolutely diddly to do with ModernUI or ModernUI apps. It acted and felt like both a hack AND a poor fit - if anything, it felt worse than OS X Mountain Lion (which I dual-booted with at one point on the same hardware). If you're THAT married to the Start menu, than Windows 8, plainly, is not for you.

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There it is with the keyboard shortcuts. Fine for geeks, but MOST consumers know nothing about them, so that's not really a good answer.

Could care less about "most consumers" !

i can't wait for the 26th to come. the internet is going to explode after people see how w8 is on a non touchscreen device.

if there is a lot of hate, I'll buy it. Usually when there is hate it means dumbasses are shooting off because the experience wasn't spoonfed to them in a simpleton manner. Therefore it'll be something splendid to behold for the intelligent among us. See, there are various levels of user. Those who create and program the OS (god tier). Those who program for the OS (upper echelons). Those who understand how to build a computer and install the OS themselves. Then use it reasonably successfully for years with no problems. (middle tier).

Then there are types of user who think it's cool to install 10 toolbars on Internet Explorer (which they only know by the name "the big E") and then complain that it's slow. Or who do nothing but post dribble on facebook all day - often about how ****ty aforementioned day in their life is. The sorts of people who need help with every task who then mess it up and then need help to fix all their **** ups anyway. Frankly, these "consumers" can GTFO.

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The disruptive way of working is what sucks about Windows 8. With everything Microsoft have done they want to try and make apps behave more consistently, but by doing that they've completely forgot that apps have to do different things.

As it's been said before, the Wikipedia app is a brilliant example. You don't use Wikipedia to browse things and jump between pages all the time, you mostly use it to search for things. To search you need a search bar. Hiding behind too many clicks is just ridiculous. An app that's meant to be searched needs a good search bar.

And it's like that with pretty much all the apps. Moving actions to the charms bar might be good for touch devices but is extremely stupid for anything with a mouse or touchpad. Having to move your mouse aaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way to the upper right corner and then down again every time you want to do something like that is annoying as hell. I've tried Windows 8 on my laptop using my touchpad (which I love in Windows 7), but with Windows 8 it's just horrible.

download classic Start or start8, check the option to boot direct to desktop, disable the lockscreen, disable charms and you're set.

Why do so many want to make everything about 8 sound so hard when the solutions are so easy?

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download classic Start or start8, check the option to boot direct to desktop, disable the lockscreen, disable charms and you're set.

Why do so many want to make everything about 8 sound so hard when the solutions are so easy?

It's not like I don't know those things are possible and I'll probably use them in the future (if my laptop ever gets updated drivers). It's the fact that I have to that pretty much means there is something wrong with Microsoft's design. I shouldn't have to do those things. It should either just work or be possible to make it work using built-in options.

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It's not like I don't know those things are possible and I'll probably use them in the future (if my laptop ever gets updated drivers). It's the fact that I have to that pretty much means there is something wrong with Microsoft's design. I shouldn't have to do those things. It should either just work or be possible to make it work using built-in options.

Just because YOU have to do that doesn't mean there's something wrong with Microsoft's design. Just because the manufacturer of a certain product doesn't adjust that product to suit or fit a particular need of an individual or group doesn't imply bad design. What most people, and by extension, organizations understand is you cannot please everyone as much as you may want to. To that end, you create the best you, organization, or product that you can, sell it like hell and hope it's enough.

The fact is, Windows 8 works really well for a whole lot of people and for some people it doesn't. Guess what? You can say that about damn near everything that exist. It's a bit self-centered to say that because something doesn't specifically work for you it's bad. It's also simply your opinion, not a fact. You are entitled to such, but I can assure you that millions of people will find that it does "just work" or is "possible to make it work using built-in options".

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I dont understand windows 8 on PC. On a phone it looks great. On a tablet it looks to be amazing. But PC? Im not upset, though. Nobody can make you stop using windows 7. I love windows 7

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I dont understand windows 8 on PC. On a phone it looks great. On a tablet it looks to be amazing. But PC? Im not upset, though. Nobody can make you stop using windows 7. I love windows 7

Exactly. This is my quirk with Windows 8. It simply does NOT work on a device that does not have a touchscreen. I wish there was an option to use the traditional desktop if it detected there were not touchscreen devices. Also, it is a huge change for the average consumer - think if WXP to W7 was a difficult transition, this will be exponentially more difficult for them. For us people who are computer savvy, it's not a huge transition.

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[. . .] It didn't, he said, and he quickly learned that working with the new software requires tossing out a lot of what he knows about Windows [. . .]

They say that as if it's a bad thing. It isn't. Innovation would be seriously harmed if we had to care about people being bothered by learning new software. It isn't hard to understand how Windows 8 works.

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Windows 7 is officialy the next Windows XP in terms of performance and life-time, yes i can see the future, its always the same story, let me explain: :)

Iv tried windows8 it boots great but lacks of the performance of Windows7.

So if you ask me MS is selling beta-testing OS like it did with Windows Millenium, Vista and now Windows8. They should make their homework better. Windows should have the possibility to turn on the start menu without the need of other software, its the first thing that all can see that is missing, and one important one.

Forget the domestic users windows8 just continue beta testing it, we will wait for Windows9 do adopt, once again, jumping a generation of MS OS.

For Tablet and Mobile i havent tried it, i bet its great i cant question about it, i can only speak for the PC version.

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The vast majority of Windows users are forgotten... not by Microsoft, but by developers. Seriously, nothing new has come for Windows in a while. That's a red flag that something's wrong, bro. That's a red flag, that times are changing, and maybe, just maybe, it's time to change with them.

Sounds like you are advocating change for the sake of change more than anything. It has to be for the better and I'm not convinced it is in 8.

I'm not anti-change. I actually quite enjoy change. I mostly skipped Vista (had it on a PC for about 3 months prior to 7) because it added little of value over XP and looked a bit of a mess. However I snapped up 7 instantly because it added loads of useful features that I could immediately see would help me work.

Originally I had loads of enthusiasm for 8 as well, as it initially looked like a well thought out concept. But now I've got zero interest because for anything productive the answer is basically "use the desktop". And on that side of things, just like Vista, there is little to get excited about - new inconsistent UI, can't go straight to desktop, a redesigned Task Manager (whoopy-dee????) and the Ribbon on Explorer (love the ribbon, but this is utterly pointless). I don't give a damn about the start menu, but I would desperately miss being able to have that list of pinned apps and the search/shutdown that are on it. Minor issues to most and I know someone will say I can still search and can still pin apps, but it just isn't the same IMO. In Windows 7 it is tucked away in the corner, barely inperceptable during my typical workflow. In Windows 8 it'd be in my face with a screen that is entirely useless to me in every other way.

I've just come to understand that despite all its initial premise, Windows 8 wasn't designed for what I use my computer for.

It isn't a good change to me, just a time wasting one.

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Iv tried windows8 it boots great but lacks of the performance of Windows7.

Now, is this a serious statement or were you just on a roll when responding? Even, those who hate Windows 8, exception being you, don't make this statement. I think that most people have universally agreed that Windows 8 outperforms Windows 7, if not significantly.

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Exactly. This is my quirk with Windows 8. It simply does NOT work on a device that does not have a touchscreen. I wish there was an option to use the traditional desktop if it detected there were not touchscreen devices. Also, it is a huge change for the average consumer - think if WXP to W7 was a difficult transition, this will be exponentially more difficult for them. For us people who are computer savvy, it's not a huge transition.

Been using Windows 8 on three normal non-touch systems, and love it. Not sure why people seem to think Windows 8 is touch only. It's not. The UI is more fluid and dynamic, but that doesn't mean it can't be used with a keyboard and mouse.

Sounds like you are advocating change for the sake of change more than anything. It has to be for the better and I'm not convinced it is in 8.

I'm not anti-change. I actually quite enjoy change. I mostly skipped Vista (had it on a PC for about 3 months prior to 7) because it added little of value over XP and looked a bit of a mess. However I snapped up 7 instantly because it added loads of useful features that I could immediately see would help me work.

Originally I had loads of enthusiasm for 8 as well, as it initially looked like a well thought out concept. But now I've got zero interest because for anything productive the answer is basically "use the desktop". And on that side of things, just like Vista, there is little to get excited about - new inconsistent UI, can't go straight to desktop, a redesigned Task Manager (whoopy-dee????) and the Ribbon on Explorer (love the ribbon, but this is utterly pointless). I don't give a damn about the start menu, but I would desperately miss being able to have that list of pinned apps and the search/shutdown that are on it. Minor issues to most and I know someone will say I can still search and can still pin apps, but it just isn't the same IMO. In Windows 7 it is tucked away in the corner, barely inperceptable during my typical workflow. In Windows 8 it'd be in my face with a screen that is entirely useless to me in every other way.

I've just come to understand that despite all its initial premise, Windows 8 wasn't designed for what I use my computer for.

It isn't a good change to me, just a time wasting one.

This isn't a change for the sake of change. If developers aren't developing for your system anymore, you have a problem. I'm productive using Metro apps, just as I am using the desktop. I've been able to use OneNote MX and EverNote Metro apps in class to take notes, Update my Calendar using the Metro app, yadi yadda... Not everything like this are going to be "fart apps". Also, come the 26th, the Metro Skype app will replace the desktop app for me as well.

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