Jump to content



Photo

Sell MBA and buy Windows 8 machine? / Windows 8 in Boot Camp

macbook windows

  • Please log in to reply
44 replies to this topic

#16 manosdoc

manosdoc

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 03-December 08
  • Location: Greece

Posted 27 October 2012 - 15:56

Um...what? When you use Bootcamp, you are running windows natively. Bootcamp is not a virtual machine. I can max any game I want to even in Bootcamp. If you have the Mac Pro like I do, you do not need to even install the bootcamp drivers since I have all Windows and Mac compatible accessories.


Bootcamp is not virtual machine, yet OSX still exists, that is the reason I said natively, without OSX involved.


#17 OP cnl1980

cnl1980

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 27-October 12

Posted 27 October 2012 - 17:43

Did anybody do this? Installed Windows 8 without boot camp? I read about some driver issues with the trackpad and the soundcard when using Windows 8 with boot camp.

What I don't like about Mac OS? I think Windows 8 is a more modern approach. Campuses to that Mac OS X looked dated. So it's not about me thinking that Mac OS is a bad OS but thinking that Microsoft is more innovative.

#18 Enron

Enron

    Windows for Workgroups

  • Tech Issues Solved: 1
  • Joined: 30-May 11
  • OS: Windows 8.1 U1
  • Phone: Nokia Lumia 900

Posted 27 October 2012 - 17:45

Did anybody do this? Installed Windows 8 without boot camp? I read about some driver issues with the trackpad and the soundcard when using Windows 8 with boot camp.

What I don't like about Mac OS? I think Windows 8 is a more modern approach. Campuses to that Mac OS X looked dated. So it's not about me thinking that Mac OS is a bad OS but thinking that Microsoft is more innovative.


I'm about to try it. I am backing up my files right now and I'll report on my success (or failure) later.

#19 TokiToki

TokiToki

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 19-July 07
  • Location: California

Posted 27 October 2012 - 18:16

You can wipe completely OSX and install Windows 8 native.
Don't use Bootcamp. One thing for sure, your graphics card will see a huge improvement.


Um...what? When you use Bootcamp, you are running windows natively. Bootcamp is not a virtual machine. I can max any game I want to even in Bootcamp. If you have the Mac Pro like I do, you do not need to even install the bootcamp drivers since I have all Windows and Mac compatible accessories.


Bootcamp is not virtual machine, yet OSX still exists, that is the reason I said natively, without OSX involved.

Boot Camp is nothing more than an assistant which helps partition your hard drive with an MBR partition table and sets up your Mac to have BIOS emulation so Windows (7) can install. Windows is still running natively when you use bootcamp, so your assertion that graphical performance will suffer is wrong.

#20 TokiToki

TokiToki

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 19-July 07
  • Location: California

Posted 27 October 2012 - 18:24

Did anybody do this? Installed Windows 8 without boot camp? I read about some driver issues with the trackpad and the soundcard when using Windows 8 with boot camp.

I had a lot of problems with Windows 8 in EFI mode on my Macbook Air 2012, mainly that it is completely unusable. There is apparently a bug in the Intel drivers which crashes in EFI mode leaving you with a black screen. I haven't looked to see if anyone posted a fix recently, but I'm just going to wait until Apple updates their bootcamp drivers.

#21 OP cnl1980

cnl1980

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 27-October 12

Posted 27 October 2012 - 22:28

I am looking forward to any experiences anyone makes with Windows 8 on a MacBook air. Did anyone make the jump to a "real" Windows 8 device yet?

#22 a1ien

a1ien

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 24-March 09

Posted 27 October 2012 - 22:38

BOOTCAMP is bad news bears on an ultraportable. The thing you really notice is that the power subsystem drivers are not good and your battery life takes a big hit. So in the laptop world, I'd let go of the MacBook and get a nice ultraportable from Lenovo or HP. The Thinkpad X1 Carbon has my attention right now - I"m just hoping for some kind of coupon deal on Black Friday. If you're all in on Windows 8 you might look for a model with a touchscreen.

#23 vetTHolman

THolman

    Mystery Tramp

  • Joined: 17-September 11
  • Location: Georgia

Posted 27 October 2012 - 23:31

Bootcamp is not virtual machine, yet OSX still exists, that is the reason I said natively, without OSX involved.


OS X exists on a totally seperate partition. If you're running Windows in Bootcamp, you're running Windows, period. OS X is not running alongside it, and nothing is slowing it down.

#24 ingramator

ingramator

    Hacker

  • Joined: 04-July 12
  • OS: Windows 7/8, OSX 10.8, Linux/UNIX/BSD
  • Phone: Lumia 920, iPhone 5, GS3

Posted 28 October 2012 - 03:40

OS X exists on a totally seperate partition. If you're running Windows in Bootcamp, you're running Windows, period. OS X is not running alongside it, and nothing is slowing it down.


The word Bootcamp is not being used correctly around here. MacOSX you find the bootcamp assistant, all this is is a partitioning tool, nothing more. The real use of Bootcamp is for the drivers required for Windows, in particular the Apple manufactured parts such as the touchpad. Bootcamp drivers are awful, really awful and Apple has them so poorly written that they hinder performance and in particular, battery life (thats why you will see all these "side by side"s tests on youtube claiming Macs have greater battery life when really its the bootcamp drivers and services chewing it up). My advice, sell the MBA and go for a straight out Windows 8 optimized PC, if you like touch or think you may use it then go for it!! If you're still keen on using an Apple product or for some very obscure reason OSX is a requirement for you then I will give you some pointers on what to do as I have done it all.

Tips:
  • Never ever single boot Windows, at start-up EFI will search for an OSX volume and only after it has scanned the whole disk will it decide to search for another suitable OS, in your case, Windows 8. This can be a real annoyance as it adds a good 20-30 seconds to boot and restart.
  • Don't try and multi-boot. I have had OSX, Linux and Windows all at once and you are bound to run into problems at one stage with the disks or an OS corrupting/not being able to start
  • You can't run two versions of Windows, so don't try and run Win8 win Win7
  • If you rarely use MacOSX or just want their "in case" you need it, remove all the language files, uninstall any unnecessary (to you that is) crap like iLife etc. to make room for your new Windows partition :D
  • Select your default start up OS from OSX (or bootcamp control panel... if you have it installed :p) or if you frequently change OSes and don't want to have to keep holding in option key at boot then consider setting up rEFIt: http://refit.sourceforge.net/ it will give you a nice interface at start-up for OS selection
  • Don't expect things to work like they do on a normal PC, your working at a second rate standard and as I said before it is absolutely no replacement for a real PC :p
How to do it:
  • Remove any unnecessary crap from your hard drive or back it up for transfer to Windows later (better to have it on NTFS than HFS)
  • Run bootcamp assistant and partition your hard drive to your desired size allocations
  • If you're installing Windows 8 you're going to need the Bootcamp 4.0 drivers, in the assistant it will have an option to download them, last I checked, those servers were dead and it was pretty much impossible to download them, so PM me if you need a copy :p
  • Restart your Mac, when the power comes back on hold the option/alt key at the chime screen (goes gray) and wait for the boot selector to come up
  • Insert you're Windows 8 OEM copy (if you have an upgrade version then you have to install windows 7 first then override it)
  • Select the Disc icon which should say Windows under it
  • Run through the setup till you hit the hard drive selector screen
  • Bootcamp assistant, being the novice software that it is, doesn't partion the hard drive as NTFS so go ahead and click advanced then format it
  • Install to that partition and continue on through the setup until everything is done and your at the start screen
  • As you will see Windows 8 has actually got drivers that are working for most of the OS ie screen, keyboard and likely mouse/trackpad
  • NOW, this is where the fun begins :p, you have 2 options:
Option 1
  • Install bootcamp drivers and services from the disc or USB by running setup (to eject the disk you can do it via file explorer or you can hold down 2 fingers at the chime or if you have a mouse then the secondary click)
  • Restart your computer (hold option to now select the Windows 8 Drive) and then set your bootcamp control panel settings from the system control panel or tray icon such as tap to click etc.
  • You will now be able to use the touchpad features like 2 finger horizontal scrolling and also altering brightness and volume (mind you the overlay won't come up nor will the now playing for the music app)
  • HOWEVER you will not be operating at real speeds or have great battery life
Option 2
  • Once Windows 8 is up and running go ahead and install the latest graphics and sound drivers (the stock Windows 8 ones are pretty good but if your attempting to game... :p then get the latest proper ones)
  • If you have a trackpad and you want some awesome extra Windows 8 features go ahead and install touchpad ++ http://trackpad.powerplan7.com/ which gives you some seriously cool and powerful options unlike the stock and bootcamp ones, if your getting an error than you may need to install the bootcamp one first which is located in the bootcamp install folder/drivers/apple/AppleMultiTouchTrackPadInstaller.exe (64 bit is in the 64 folder)
  • Change your Keyboard setting to English US (apple) and then everything should be mapped correctly ;)
  • If you need brightness and volume control there are free programs on the web that can use them as hot keys to mimic that functionality just do a quick Bing search :p :p :p
  • Enjoy closer to native speeds!!
Pros and Cons for bootcamp
Pros:
  • No extra work involves, should just work
  • Easy control panel options
  • Difficulty = Easy/Medium (depends if you encounter any problems)
Cons:
  • limited in what you can do (especially the trackpad)
  • TAXING ON PERFORMANCE AND BATTERY LIFE
Native drivers pros and cons:
Pros:
  • Significant increase in battery life and performance
  • Greater flexibility and options (write your own drivers like me :p)
Cons:
  • If your not good with trouble shooting and working with low level system features it could be a painful experience
  • You will miss out on some functionality and won't have one control panel to change everything
  • No simple update system
  • DIFFICULTY = HARD/EXPERT

The third option:

What I have going is a mixture of bootcamp drivers, native drivers, third party drivers and my own drivers/programs to make Windows 8 on a Mac an enjoyable experience. So feel free if your not going to install the whole bootcamp collection to pick and choose what you need/want and fill the gaps with other more stable drivers, the majority of important ones you won't find alternatives to (except of course touchpad with touch ++) are located in the /Drivers/Apple folder in the Bootcamp Drivers folder

Wow. That was a long post, I think I might put this into a thread where Mac users can find it so they can have the best of both worlds without having to try and figure everything out :p if your unclear about any of this then PM me and I'd be happy to help :p

Windows 8 is the best!
Ingramator

#25 OP cnl1980

cnl1980

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 27-October 12

Posted 28 October 2012 - 14:53

Thank you for the very detailed instruction. but my question remains: how good is windows 8 on a late 2010 macbook air?

#26 Shadrack

Shadrack

    Neowinian Senior

  • Tech Issues Solved: 3
  • Joined: 20-December 01

Posted 28 October 2012 - 23:39

I too have found that running Windows 7 on my mid-2009 MBP would eat up battery life a lot faster than Mac OS X. I buy that it is probably due to Apple not properly supporting things with their "bootcamp" drivers.

That being said, I found that performance was about what I expected. In general games ran faster in Windows than they did in OS X. If my MBP was plugged into the wall there weren't any real issues. But I much prefer OS X and eventually just erased my windows partition. I kind of set it up for when I wanted to work at home, but since I have a Windows laptop for work I would prefer to use that. So with that I'd probably just recommend getting a proper Windows laptop if you want to run Windows. Apple's attitude has been that their driver support is just good enough to keep saying it is a feature. I doubt that will change.

#27 ingramator

ingramator

    Hacker

  • Joined: 04-July 12
  • OS: Windows 7/8, OSX 10.8, Linux/UNIX/BSD
  • Phone: Lumia 920, iPhone 5, GS3

Posted 29 October 2012 - 22:24

Thank you for the very detailed instruction. but my question remains: how good is windows 8 on a late 2010 macbook air?


It will run just fine!! Don't expect to be doing any gaming or visually intense stuff but once it's installed it is definitely a smoother, faster and less battery hogging experience!

#28 mrmomoman

mrmomoman

    Neowinian

  • Joined: 21-January 09

Posted 30 October 2012 - 20:50

Sell the MBP and get a WIN8 PC.

Thinkpad X1 Carbon is a great machine.

Acer Aspire S7 - 13.3 or 11.6" both 1080p displays. - This would be on the top of my list at the moment for this form factor. Has touch display.

The Asus Zenbook UX31E or the UX31A are nice machines as well.

#29 LaP

LaP

    Forget about it

  • Tech Issues Solved: 4
  • Joined: 10-July 06
  • Location: Quebec City, Canada
  • OS: Windows 8.1 Pro Update 1

Posted 30 October 2012 - 20:54

Why not try to install Windows 8 on it ?

[edit] well i should have read all the replies before lol anyway can't delete so ...

#30 kevpan815

kevpan815

    Apple Developer Program + Ubuntu Tester

  • Joined: 06-December 05
  • Location: Algonquin, IL, USA
  • OS: Open Source Linux Ubuntu 12.10 RTW
  • Phone: Apple IPhone 5 Running IOS 6.1 Beta 3!

Posted 31 October 2012 - 02:27

You can wipe completely OSX and install Windows 8 native.
Don't use Bootcamp. One thing for sure, your graphics card will see a huge improvement.


NO YOU CAN'T! ALL NON-OEM COPIES OF WINDOWS 8 ARE UPGRADE ONLY! IT'S IN THE EULA. OTHERWISE YOU ARE COMMITING SOFTWARE PIRACY AND I WILL REPORT YOU TO PIRACY@MICROSOFT.COM! JUST FYI!