Noir Angel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 So instead of a chunk of money going to MS, It'll go to Valve instead? How is that any less "unfair". Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. f0rk_b0mb 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Whether their customers are prepared to use it isn't their issue, it's the freedom Microsoft are giving developers that Valve have the problem with. Most people don't even seem to be interested in trying to understand the point Valve are making they just fly off the handle the moment anyone says anything negative about Microsoft. Valve don't HAVE a point. They're just spreading FUD so they can attempt to protect their own revenue stream. StepASide 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dashel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Lets see, one is part of a monopolistic OS and one isn't? Doesn't seem very hard to distinguish if you try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noir Angel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Valve don't HAVE a point. They're just spreading FUD so they can attempt to protect their own revenue stream. Of course they have a point, if the direction taken with 8 is a part of a move to close Windows as a platform, it's bad news for companies like Valve, and anyone who produces anything that isn't a casual game or a fart app. f0rk_b0mb 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BajiRav Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. Who decides what's "fairer"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. Really? From what I can find online (and info is rather scarce on this). Valve appear to take a 30-40% cut of all sales. Is that fairer than MS's cut? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazirian Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. I'm not aware that Valve's distribution costs are standardised or even published. Quick research suggests that Valve takes a share of 30%+, which means that they're equal to, or more expensive than the Windows store. Hardly less arbitrary or fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudtrooper Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. Got any proof to back this up with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athernar Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Valve don't HAVE a point. They're just spreading FUD so they can attempt to protect their own revenue stream. Yeah, Valve don't have a point. Because they never said that 8 was closed in the first place. Every person in this thread so far crying their eyes out over the "closed" comment has been trolled by the OP, because it doesn't exist in the original article linked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0rk_b0mb Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 So instead of a chunk of money going to MS, It'll go to Valve instead? How is that any less "unfair". How is that ANY different to what Valve do with Steam? They don't put games on their store they don't want, and they take a cut of every sale, just like MS are doing with the Windows 8 store. Gabe is just throwing his toys out of the pram because MS, unlike EA with their Origin store, have the muscle to affect his bottom line. If you submit your game in Steam Greenlight, It costs you a flat 100 dollars. Like Javik said: Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. If I remember right Microsoft takes 30% Noir Angel 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noir Angel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Who decides what's "fairer"? Developers Really? From what I can find online (and info is rather scarce on this). Valve appear to take a 30-40% cut of all sales. Is that fairer than MS's cut? Evidence I've seen suggests otherwise, most indie game developers in particular have been full of praise for both the helpfulness of Valve's staff and the fairness of the deals Valve gave them. Got any proof to back this up with? Proof of the arbitrary restrictions is pretty evident to be honest. Proof of the fair deals is in the words of indie developers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Of course they have a point, if the direction taken with 8 is a part of a move to close Windows as a platform, it's bad news for companies like Valve, and anyone who produces anything that isn't a casual game or a fart app. IF. There's a lot of supposition there from such a small word. Tell me. Can you think of any sane justification as to why Microsoft would actually WANT to cut off the literally millions of desktop application developers out there, and actually FORCE people to move to another OS? Why would any company in their right mind do something so monumentally stupid? The W8 app store is there for one thing, for MS to get their hands into the tablet market. They improve their chances of this by having those tablet "cool" tablet apps also running on the desktop for a single, unified experience. There is no way they'll drop the desktop side of things, or seal Windows off from the millions of desktop developers out there. There's just too much you CANNOT do in metro. StepASide 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0rk_b0mb Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Also with Windows 8, you can only install the app on 5 computers. With Steam, you can install it on as many computers as you want, with 1 active login. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noir Angel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 For the same reason that Apple do it. Controlling your ecosystem like a megalomaniac forces developers and consumers to dance to your tune and increases profits. farmeunit 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Evidence I've seen suggests otherwise, most indie game developers in particular have been full of praise for both the helpfulness of Valve's staff and the fairness of the deals Valve gave them. Proof of the arbitrary restrictions is pretty evident to be honest. Proof of the fair deals is in the words of indie developers. Oh please, show us this evidence proving that it's a fairer deal than MS's, or even Apple's or Google's. I suspect the comparison the Indie devs are making is against traditional games publishing, which is a horrendously expensive business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jazirian Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 The W8 app store is there for one thing, for MS to get their hands into the tablet market. They improve their chances of this by having those tablet "cool" tablet apps also running on the desktop for a single, unified experience. There is no way they'll drop the desktop side of things, or seal Windows off from the millions of desktop developers out there. There's just too much you CANNOT do in metro. Add to this, Microsoft get fined several hundred million dollars by the EU for bundling Internet Explorer. If they were to close off the desktop in x86/x64 they would be sued to hell and back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giantpotato Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 If you submit your game in Steam Greenlight, It costs you a flat 100 dollars. Like Javik said: Less arbitrary restrictions and fairer distribution costs. If I remember right Microsoft takes 30% You seem to be confused. Just submitting to Greenlight does not guarantee your game will be sold on Steam. Developers could pay the $100 and never have their game go on sale. If Valve decides to sell a game, then they take 30%+ of every sale, just like Microsoft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudtrooper Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Developers I haven't seen any developers say their apps have been refused from the windows 8 market place.. got any proof? Evidence I've seen suggests otherwise, most indie game developers in particular have been full of praise for both the helpfulness of Valve's staff and the fairness of the deals Valve gave them. That's great, but what does that even mean? are you saying Microsoft is mean to its developers? i'd beg otherwise.. Proof of the arbitrary restrictions is pretty evident to be honest. Proof of the fair deals is in the words of indie developers. No it isn't.. that's an absurd statement to make. StepASide 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 You seem to be confused. Just submitting to Greenlight does not guarantee your game will be sold on Steam. Developers could pay the $100 and never have their game go on sale. If Valve decides to sell a game, then they take 30%+ of every sale, just like Microsoft. And to clarify further. MS charge $99 a year to submit apps to their store (individuals can get it for $49 I think). You can submit multiple apps for that fee, priced or free, and it WILL go on to the store, not "may" go on to it. Also, your app can (depending on the developer), run on three different platforms, greatly increasing the target audience. StepASide 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudtrooper Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Add to this, Microsoft get fined several hundred million dollars by the EU for bundling Internet Explorer. If they were to close off the desktop in x86/x64 they would be sued to hell and back. EU already said they're not interested in IE on Windows RT.. The old browser ballet is a bandaid on a problem that doesn't exist today and just wastes money for everyone involved. Times have changed and man, some people need to get over this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noir Angel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I haven't seen any developers say their apps have been refused from the windows 8 market place.. got any proof? I never said apps are getting refused en mass, but they will if the developers don't do exactly what Microsoft tells them to. What they can and cannot do is being arbitrarily controlled. No it isn't.. that's an absurd statement to make. No it isn't, you're more than capable of using google and reading the app store guidelines for yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0rk_b0mb Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 You seem to be confused. Just submitting to Greenlight does not guarantee your game will be sold on Steam. Developers could pay the $100 and never have their game go on sale. If Valve decides to sell a game, then they take 30%+ of every sale, just like Microsoft. I'm on a campus computer now, so I can't verify that. I'll check it out when I have the chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloatingFatMan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 No it isn't, you're more than capable of using google and reading the app store guidelines for yourself. Value also pick and choose what apps they publish to Steam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noir Angel Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Valve introduced the fee for Greenlight to cut down on spam and malicious entries, it was initially free, and all proceeds will be donated to charity. How much of Microsoft's fees get donated to charity? Source Dolan and f0rk_b0mb 2 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f0rk_b0mb Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Value also pick and choose what apps they publish to Steam. Users choose what goes and blows with Greenlight. Valve introduced the fee for Greenlight to cut down on spam and malicious entries, it was initially free, and all proceeds will be donated to charity. How much of Microsoft's fees get donated to charity? Source ^THIS!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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