microsoft surface Like your Surface? No, you can't (or shouldn't). It's a bad dev

[jakem1]

I haven't noticed any lag on my Surface. Some apps take a fraction of a second longer to load than you'd expect and the back gesture in IE10 needs fixing (it performs a full refresh as opposed to just using the back button which works instantly and as expected) but I haven't noticed lag. Animations are all smooth, multitasking is smooth and efficient and, once loaded, all my apps run perfectly smoothly and quickly.

I find the comments about Cut the Rope interesting. I initially avoided it because I'd read reviews that mentioned poor performance but I decided to try it anyway and it's fine. The performance of some of the built in apps such as Music and Video is a bit disappointing but I've found better alternatives in the Store for those anyway.

I'm quite happy to put up with an occasional second or two wait for an app to load because that delay is easily offset by the other benefits of the Surface. Besides, MS seem to be releasing updates fairly regularly so I expect they'll iron out any performance issues before too long. IMO there are far more pros to this device than cons.

[The King of GnG]

You are a reporter for Neowin, a tech site, and that's your attitude towards technology?

"If I don't like it, it's crap?"

I don't like how tech companies are treating me and my computer habits during the latest years.

[siah1214]

Yes, that is the easiest way to do it. You then have to be sure to navigate the Desktop Windows Update to see all updates and select Office as it is an optional update. If it were a mandatory update you'd get it eventually without having to dig in there, but the didn't flag it as one oddly enough.

BS, you can select optional updates from metro as well. I never had to load desktop windows update to get the office update. Have you actually used surface or are you regurgitating what ignorant bloggers tell you?

[+LogicalApex MVC]

BS, you can select optional updates from metro as well. I never had to load desktop windows update to get the office update. Have you actually used surface or are you regurgitating what ignorant bloggers tell you?

Where? I have access to the one at work for mobile dev so I have used it and the only place I saw to do it was in desktop Windows Update.

[threetonesun]

I call BS. I haven't met a single person that wasn't downright impressed by the Surface and didn't want to buy one after playing with mine.

... sarcasm?

I played with one in the store, it's not there yet. Window 8 Metro, in general, isn't there with the apps yet either. I would have also needed the hard keyboard, which jacks up the price, which makes the whole thing a bit overpriced.

I mean, it's a nice concept, but it's not a magical wonder tablet like it could be.

[siah1214]

Where? I have access to the one at work for mobile dev so I have used it and the only place I saw to do it was in desktop Windows Update.

When you check for updates it tells you that there are x number of important updates. Tap on that line and it shows you all updates, with optional updates checked. Tap outside the box, tap Install updates, and they'll install.

[+LogicalApex MVC]

When you check for updates it tells you that there are x number of important updates. Tap on that line and it shows you all updates, with optional updates checked. Tap outside the box, tap Install updates, and they'll install.

In desktop Windows Update? As when I did this multiple times the only update that wasn't checked until done manually was Office. As this was a major topic of discussion in the office.

[BajiRav]

so I have seen iOS "lag" on multiple devices (iPhone 4, 4S, iPad2) - especialy with the Settings, Mail, Calendar and sometimes in the Camera app. I have seen many Apple apps crash randomly but I didn't see these tech-reporters ever writing anything of this sorts for iOS - bias much?

For all these people saying how Surface is not as good as iPad, have they actually used Surface to its full potential? Connect your camera and download photos, print documents, increase storage when needed?

I haven't had a chance to try out Surface in person much but it looks like when reviewing anything non-Apple, these writers start from 0 and then climb up slowly towards 10 whereas with Apple they start from 10 and then go in the opposite direction.

Almost all iOS releases from iOS3 onwards have been buggy intially and patched overtime to be actually usable. The latest Maps debacle haven't stopped these same people from writing glowing reviews of iPhone 5 whereas if Nokia or LG or HTC or Samsung had one minor bug in any app, then they get bad reviews.

In a nutshell - these guys are crap, don't pay attention.

Surface's main problem is that it is not made by Apple, all other problems can be fixed by updates.

[Josh_LosAltosHills]

I had a couple of issues with the surface. one was the audio in xbox music skipping when the display shut off. a thread was started a couple of days ago on the MS Surface support forums and after a lot of replies, me included someone from tech support said they were on it. today they pushed out an update to fix it. Moral of the story, have patience and let MS know directly via their forums about issues you have. they don't see people complain here.

[Wyn6]

I had a couple of issues with the surface. one was the audio in xbox music skipping when the display shut off. a thread was started a couple of days ago on the MS Surface support forums and after a lot of replies, me included someone from tech support said they were on it. today they pushed out an update to fix it. Moral of the story, have patience and let MS know directly via their forums about issues you have. they don't see people complain here.

There's an update that hit today that fixes the Xbox music thing. I never experienced but it's good to know that people who have will get a fix.

[Wyn6]

... Anyway, the lag was too much and was present everywhere. Once you use the Surface you'll notice the lag without question and it isn't any fun...

you mean once YOU use it. I have yet to experience anything resembling lag on the device. It runs every game I've thrown at it nice and smooth. Cut the Rope, Jetpack Joyride, and so on. Local 1080p video? Likewise. Streaming 1080p video... likewise. The only thing I have noticed is that if you have a lotta apps open it will drop frames when flipping between them if you go really fast. So, there may be issues with some multitasking. But, it drops the frames, so instead of sliding in apps just pop into frame instead.

Outside of that, it's been pretty darn king. But, that's my experience and perhaps somehow I got lucky and got a stellar device. But, their evidently are performance issues for quite a few people as MS has stated a fix is coming. Again... my experience isn't the same for everybody just as yours or others aren't the same for everybody else.

[+devHead Subscriber²]

If you're in love with the iPad, enjoy it and shut up. Why is it Apple fans among all others feel the need to constantly bash every other product there is out there? Oh, wait, maybe it's because Apple does the same thing. Any device or technology that might start to impinge on their empire of mediocre garbage is sued and mocked. So, I guess it makes sense. 1/2 a second? Are you for real?

[TheLegendOfMart]

Oh no!! Half-seconds of my life will be wasted!!!

I think he has a point, I'm no Apple fanboy but they have the UI and smoothness down to a 'T', same with Project Butter in Jellybean, everything needs to be smooth, have the same visual polish, needs to load instantly. When you load an app on IOS or Android they load pretty much instantly, menus transition and react instantly.

Microsoft is betting heavily on the Surface and even though in real world terms half a second means nothing, compared to the competition it means everything, they are targeting the surface as a premium device and when it slow to react and lacks visual polish it cheapens the product. When 'joe public' look at it they will wonder why its not as 'good' as the iPad.

[jakem1]

... sarcasm?

I played with one in the store, it's not there yet. Window 8 Metro, in general, isn't there with the apps yet either. I would have also needed the hard keyboard, which jacks up the price, which makes the whole thing a bit overpriced.

I mean, it's a nice concept, but it's not a magical wonder tablet like it could be.

There's absolutely no reason why you need a physical keyboard for the Surface. It's just a nice option to have if you want to do more than just watch a movie or play Angry Birds but the tablet works perfectly well without it.

[neo1911]

I am holding back on Surface RT simple because it is a First gen product. I have no problem to wait for the platform to mature along with hardware refinements/upgrades next year.

But current assumption on Neowin is that if you say something slightly against any Microsoft product, you automagically become iSheep. :(

[threetonesun]

There's absolutely no reason why you need a physical keyboard for the Surface. It's just a nice option to have if you want to do more than just watch a movie or play Angry Birds but the tablet works perfectly well without it.

Considering it comes with Office installed, I disagree. They're clearly pitching it as a laptop replacement for the average person, which I think it would be perfect at, assuming it cost slightly less and had more apps.

[jakem1]

Considering it comes with Office installed, I disagree. They're clearly pitching it as a laptop replacement for the average person, which I think it would be perfect at, assuming it cost slightly less and had more apps.

You don't need to use Office though and I'm not sure they're pitching it as a laptop replacement. I'd say it's competing with other tablets but provides additional options which makes the keyboard optional as well. I've been using mine for the last week and haven't needed a keyboard once but it's nice to know that I can add one if I need to do something that's not suited to a touchscreen. In that sense, the keyboard isn't any more essential than the optional keyboard that's available for the iPad - it's just a lot more useful.

[threetonesun]

You don't need to use Office though and I'm not sure they're pitching it as a laptop replacement. I'd say it's competing with other tablets but provides additional options which makes the keyboard optional as well. I've been using mine for the last week and haven't needed a keyboard once but it's nice to know that I can add one if I need to do something that's not suited to a touchscreen. In that sense, the keyboard isn't any more essential than the optional keyboard that's available for the iPad - it's just a lot more useful.

Well, I don't see the point in buying it if you're not going to use the keyboard. If I'm limited to poking things with my finger, my phone does fine. This is true of the iPad as well, but considering the Surface actually built the keyboard in, to some extent, I have hopes for it being a semi-useful computing device in the future.

[jakem1]

Well, I don't see the point in buying it if you're not going to use the keyboard. If I'm limited to poking things with my finger, my phone does fine. This is true of the iPad as well, but considering the Surface actually built the keyboard in, to some extent, I have hopes for it being a semi-useful computing device in the future.

Oh, no worries, that's a bit different then. If you mean that you feel that you need it for specific cases then I understand why you feel it's necessary. There's a lot that can be done with just your fingers though and it's certainly easier than doing the equivalent on a phone for long periods of time.

I bought the touch cover separately and it arrived a couple of days ago. I have to say that it works surprisingly well considering what it is although I haven't really had a reason to use it in anger yet.

[psreloaded]

A look through his articles gave me the impression too that he is a little opinionated towards Apple and I am trying to be modest by saying a little.

[migo]

The Surface RT is a pretty terrible device. At $500 it has WXGA resolution against the iPad's QXGA, and the Nexus 10 comes in at $400 with WQXGA. It has the smallest software selection of any tablet out there. The only reason to buy one is because you like having the newest toys and you don't care about whether something is particularly useful or worth what you're paying for it (much like the first iPad).

Any Windows RT tablet is going to be useless at least until 2014. The Surface Pro on the other hand looks pretty good. Full HD resolution and a massive back catalog of software to take advantage of, and pen input to better make use of that back catalog with the touch screen.

[SionicIon]

The only major noticeable time I notice lag is when I use the Music app. Everything tends to slow down to a crawl when I use it. Heck I can't even get it to a play a song in a decent amount of time, I have to tap it a couple times, and then the action bar or whatever it's called pops up at the bottom and you see the name and the album art just begin to change, it might even switch the play button to a pause button, but it takes like over 10 seconds to begin playing a song, and sometimes it forgets if I quickly try to play a song and go to another app. If I try snapping the Music app with IE, IE has trouble drawing the webpages as I scroll and browse webpages. I've refreshed my Surface, updated my Surface, installed the Music app updates, but it still is a bitch of an app to use...

[SionicIon]

The Surface RT is a pretty terrible device. At $500 it has WXGA resolution against the iPad's QXGA, and the Nexus 10 comes in at $400 with WQXGA. It has the smallest software selection of any tablet out there. The only reason to buy one is because you like having the newest toys and you don't care about whether something is particularly useful or worth what you're paying for it (much like the first iPad).

Any Windows RT tablet is going to be useless at least until 2014. The Surface Pro on the other hand looks pretty good. Full HD resolution and a massive back catalog of software to take advantage of, and pen input to better make use of that back catalog with the touch screen.

You contradicted yourself... The Surface Pro is as much a novelty device as the Surface RT, if not a hell of a lot more. The Surface Pro weighs 2lbs, it's clunkier, less battery life, etc. Sure it may be as fast as my home PC and will have no lag with the Music app or any app for that matter...but lets not forget that comes with a very special signature price tag of $1000.00. It might be cheaper or more expensive, but there is no way it will be anywhere near the price of $500.00. Which is why I find it hard to compare it to the iPad, this is no second generation Surface that succeeds the Surface RT, it sells alongside the Surface RT, but with much more at a much higher price, it's not going to be better at the same price...

I like my Surface RT, I am just awaiting software updates to improve Windows RT's performance. It's hard to place Windows RT in the market, considering it is trying to be something it is clearly not, but it will get there, slowly but surely it will.

[redfish]

I'll put it this way: Surface is a blatant, unbearable betrayal of the general purpose, open computing platform the "Wintel" standard has been for me during the latest couple of decades. The ARM-based Microsoft uber-**** is unforgivable, for me.

And regarding the ARM-based "desktop computers": I have x86 software archives, I play x86 games, I need x86 software, programs and applications, I won't even consider a "general purpose" ARM device a proper computer because until now, ARM chips have been implemented in castrated machines (a machine that depends on "app store" on-line remote services is a castrated machine, imo) and never in computers.

If the big corporations want a "cloud war" over digital data ownership, I'm pretty much armed already and I won't spare a single bullet against this "mobile cloud on-line tablet smartphone app store" crap.

Its not really unprecedented, there was a version of Windows NT released for ARM, also MIPS, PowerPC, etc... Microsoft wanted Windows NT to be processor independent.

[stockwiz]

my netbook is definitely faster with windows 8, but it's still far from what i could call 'lightning fast' ... tablets are expected to be fast I suppose, everyone has the bar held up to the nexus 7.