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Neowin's 'Club Orange' - a dying breed?

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#76 Glassed Silver

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 18:51

I agree with the sentiment but not the example. That thread was intended as troll bait >.> There is something of a pro-Microsoft moderation policy here, but it's greatly increased by the amount of hardcore trolling against Microsoft here.. /shrug

(To preface the following, a forum is 99% about it's community. If the community is a pain in the arse, the forum is not going to be a fun place to be >.> So yeah, I'm railing against the community as much as the moderation direction.)

Honestly, I am just sick of all the people calling out Windows 8 (and I don't think I am alone..). Everyone who uses it knows that they not everyone loves it, but I'm ****ing sick of people coming and telling us AGAIN how much you hate it.

It's gotten to the point of narcissism. There's a member on here who has a user tag like: "Windows 8 (With start 8 OTHERWISE UNUSABLE)". There's a half dozen members who have said things like "We need to keep pointing out how **** it is otherwise Microsoft will think it's ok". It's like they think this forum is Microsoft's user feedback forum.. There are other members running from thread to thread saying the same thing repeatedly and not engaging in a discussion; but instead continuing to fire off cliches with little interest in discussing it and a lot of interest in just getting their **** out there.

I originally came to Neowin after cracking the ****s with another tech forum because their journalists had lost the plot. I stayed because I found intelligent people with different opinions who could justify them with something other than "**** YOU MICROSOFT BOY". Unfortunately this isn't the case anymore. The people interested in serious debate have been driven away by the stupidity on the forums (or occasionally dragged into it) and the moderators have all responded differently with differing and inconsistent reactions.

Whilst there are a collection of decent and dedicated mods, there have been numerous occurrences where in their actions have been markedly inconsistent or disingenuous. This is compounded by a self review system that is markedly against the posters appealing moderation actions (by way of mods all (ha) being friends or the global mods being busy/uncaring about the request/query).

These are issues I raised a number of times and got nowhere with. After a particularly pointed statement by my oh so subtle self, someone asked if I hated the place why I didn't just leave. I subbed about 5 minutes later :\ I subbed to support the site and to make my position on my support known.

I want a "home" where I can talk to like minded people about technical and interesting things. I want to learn from other peoples opinions and experiences and I want somewhere I can ask questions and get serious feedback. Neowin isn't really that place anymore, but at the moment I blame Windows 8 (and the members who can't pull their heads out of their asses) and hope that in a couple of months things will sort themselves out.

Would I sub again? Perhaps, but only to support Neobond and the site. All I really gain from my subscription is the ability to edit my posts for an extended time after posting (I tend to clean up my posts after posting).

I just hope Neowin (the community that is) comes around and gets back to what it was before the retards gained a divisive target to call out with their loud and repetitive voices :\

In b4 someone calls me pro8.

This has to be one of the best, if not the best post of them all in this thread and probably one of the best overall I've read on Neowin for quite a long time.

Thanks for sharing, bro.

Glassed Silver:mac


#77 +Majesticmerc

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 22:05

I agree with the sentiment but not the example. That thread was intended as troll bait >.> There is something of a pro-Microsoft moderation policy here, but it's greatly increased by the amount of hardcore trolling against Microsoft here.. /shrug

(To preface the following, a forum is 99% about it's community. If the community is a pain in the arse, the forum is not going to be a fun place to be >.> So yeah, I'm railing against the community as much as the moderation direction.)

Honestly, I am just sick of all the people calling out Windows 8 (and I don't think I am alone..). Everyone who uses it knows that they not everyone loves it, but I'm ****ing sick of people coming and telling us AGAIN how much you hate it.

It's gotten to the point of narcissism. There's a member on here who has a user tag like: "Windows 8 (With start 8 OTHERWISE UNUSABLE)". There's a half dozen members who have said things like "We need to keep pointing out how **** it is otherwise Microsoft will think it's ok". It's like they think this forum is Microsoft's user feedback forum.. There are other members running from thread to thread saying the same thing repeatedly and not engaging in a discussion; but instead continuing to fire off cliches with little interest in discussing it and a lot of interest in just getting their **** out there.

I originally came to Neowin after cracking the ****s with another tech forum because their journalists had lost the plot. I stayed because I found intelligent people with different opinions who could justify them with something other than "**** YOU MICROSOFT BOY". Unfortunately this isn't the case anymore. The people interested in serious debate have been driven away by the stupidity on the forums (or occasionally dragged into it) and the moderators have all responded differently with differing and inconsistent reactions.

Whilst there are a collection of decent and dedicated mods, there have been numerous occurrences where in their actions have been markedly inconsistent or disingenuous. This is compounded by a self review system that is markedly against the posters appealing moderation actions (by way of mods all (ha) being friends or the global mods being busy/uncaring about the request/query).

These are issues I raised a number of times and got nowhere with. After a particularly pointed statement by my oh so subtle self, someone asked if I hated the place why I didn't just leave. I subbed about 5 minutes later :\ I subbed to support the site and to make my position on my support known.

I want a "home" where I can talk to like minded people about technical and interesting things. I want to learn from other peoples opinions and experiences and I want somewhere I can ask questions and get serious feedback. Neowin isn't really that place anymore, but at the moment I blame Windows 8 (and the members who can't pull their heads out of their asses) and hope that in a couple of months things will sort themselves out.

Would I sub again? Perhaps, but only to support Neobond and the site. All I really gain from my subscription is the ability to edit my posts for an extended time after posting (I tend to clean up my posts after posting).

I just hope Neowin (the community that is) comes around and gets back to what it was before the retards gained a divisive target to call out with their loud and repetitive voices :\

In b4 someone calls me pro8.


This. Oh god, this.

My experience has been very similar to yours. I joined Neowin mainly after leaving abandoning another community that had gone to hell. I stuck around in article comments for about 3 years. It wasn't until about 2006/2007 that I actually started posting in the forums.

I'm currently not in a position to subscribe (citing lack of money), but I have been considering it for a long time, and I'll be happy to when funds arise. I must admit though that the hostility of the community, particularly over the last year or so, has given me cause to stop and think.

Neowin has been a great community for many years, and it mostly still is. I've always felt I could express my opinion without people resorting to ad hominem attacks. If I am (or someone else is) wrong about a particular topic, there's no animosity, simply disagreement and explanation. But I feel that this has started slipping away in a wave of "Learn 2 Metro noob" and "Start menu 4eva".

I don't think anyone in particular is to blame, but there's a sense of militant fanboyism growing around Neowin (particularly around Windows 8 topics). There's an attitude of "if you're not with us, you're against us" with regard to Windows 8, and it is de-railing topics within minutes, full of nonsense like "If you don't like Metro, you're not using it right" or "go back to Windows 7" (which I find hilariously hypocritical given the chorus of mockery we pointed towards Apple when Jobs made his famous "you're not holding it right" gaffe). I fear that it's making the Windows forum look particularly hostile to people who don't fap over Windows 8 constantly. At the same time, there's a constant in-flow of people creating topics linking to anti-Win8 articles, opinion pieces, anything to support their view. It's basically trolling by citation.

The thing that really worries me though is that this attitude is starting to spill onto the front page too. Looking only today, I see intellectual gold like this in the comments:

learn boy... learn. watch youtube videos they will help cure your ignorance


Blah Blah Blah Blah
Next article - 'Why smart people annoy me!'
(Maybe then you can get more than 10% of the readers to agree with you, especially if you target people with an IQ over 115, and identify why you don't like THEM.)
Ignorance is corrosive, and sadly people often don't know what they don't know, nor how silly they sound. Thank you for the laughter at your inept understanding of a simple OS UI. LOL


This kind of unsubstantiated trolling should be getting killed off ASAP. Having it in the forums, while annoying, is not so bad, but when this stuff is getting on the front page, it's making the site look bad IMO.

On the other hand, when you have content like this in front page articles, what can we expect...

It's been pointed out in the comments, and rightly so that neither Apple or Google are under any pressure to add a similar screen into their OS. OS X and iOS have Safari as standard and Android, on phones, tablets and Chromebooks have Chrome. While yes, Microsoft could be creating a monopoly in the browser market, it's hardly their fault that 90% of the OS' installed are Windows. It's also common knowledge that users are more than able to download and install another browser, if they so wish.
Microsoft are almost victims of their own success; Android resides on more than 50% of smartphones, but we can't see them getting a browser ballot screen. The same goes for the iPhone, with more than 30% of the market. So if Microsoft has to introduce this into their Windows OS for desktops and laptops, why not the Windows Phone OS? At the moment, Windows Phone only controls around 5% of the mobile OS market, so is there a certain figure that you need to hit before you're being hauled over hot coals and accused of anti-trust violations? Google and Apple, let this be a warning to you both.


That kind of uninformed garbage should have been an author's comment or an editorial, not an "update to the original article".

I'd just like to point out that while this all sounds negative, I think it's very localised, and historically the mods here have a very good history of dealing with this sort of stuff. Barney et al have done an exemplary job of cleaning up the Linux forums, and we very rarely have any kind of trouble from the trolls over there as we have in the past, and the Gamers Hangout is a much nicer place to be these days.

#78 Raa

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 22:39

I used to be an orange, but I cancelled my subscription. Not worth it for me for numerous reasons.

#79 remixedcat

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:19

really the windows 8 threads don't really anger me I just look at em and LOL at the cute little wars that happen and grab popcorn or doritos or rice krispy treats and it's like watching reality tv.quite entertaining.

#80 Haggis

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:45

I will be subscribing as soon as the money situation sorts it self out

I love coming on here there is a wealth of knowledge available from the community as a whole

The staff i have come across have been good to me, there was a thread i was reading through that had turned into a flame ware between two people, i reported it and within 24 hours the thread was cleaned and people warned in the thread about behaviour.

There is a problem on here though of people thinking they know better and getting all high and mighty against other members, sometimes i want to ask a question which i think may be a stupid question but i tend not to post it because of the abuse i would get from other members who think it is a stupid question and then proceed to question my intelligence.

But in the side of the staff they are not able to do anything about behaviour on here unless its reported, you cant expect them to monitor every single thread on the board, i mean they have a life too......right?

#81 Reverend Spam

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:52

I'm a subscriber for a couple 3 years now.... I do it for the ad-free forum. I hate ads. Loathe. Despise. Did I mention I hate ads? :-p

#82 Syanide

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 13:21

The reason I don't subscribe is that it would indirectly mean I'm also supporting the front page, which I refuse to do. Aside from the Australian guy who does the reviews for phones, which are always in-depth and interesting, the rest seems like a 2000-ish Linux fansite. "OMG WINDOWS 8 FEATURED IN A TV SHOW! YEAR OF THE METRO!!!1!"

And I get that this site is Microsoft-oriented for the most part, which is absolutely fine by me, I'm using Windows 8 myself, and I can read so I get why it's called Neowin. The problem is the articles often lack actual substance or anything news-worthy, and all they do is fuel the fire of the horrible fanboy subculture.

#83 Javik

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 13:25

I'm going to call bull **** on this. Check out ANY MS thread and it's full of pointless and blatant trolling. NOTHING is ever done about it. Don't even get me started on John and his "articles".
If threads are going to moderated, it needs to happen evenly across the board.


It's not even, I report the trolling in the Google threads all the time and mostly it's just ignored.

I agree with the sentiment but not the example. That thread was intended as troll bait >.> There is something of a pro-Microsoft moderation policy here, but it's greatly increased by the amount of hardcore trolling against Microsoft here.. /shrug


The thread about the iPad was troll bait as well, given that the Surface in no way makes the iPad obsolete (disclaimer: I cannot stand Apple products) so why shouldn't that one also have been closed?

#84 Brandon C.

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 13:35

I've been a Subscriber since 07 and let my anonymous Tier 2 run out in March because I forgot.

Like the other moderators have said, if in doubt of a warn, PM PM PM. If you don't hear back from them, go to another moderator or up to a Supervisior. Remember, we all have real lives, jobs, and other things that it might take us some time to get back to you.

I've been proud of my paid subscriptions to Neowin for the 5 years that I have, might resub again to get rid of the ads.

#85 Glassed Silver

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 14:26

I've been a Subscriber since 07 and let my anonymous Tier 2 run out in March because I forgot.

Like the other moderators have said, if in doubt of a warn, PM PM PM. If you don't hear back from them, go to another moderator or up to a Supervisior. Remember, we all have real lives, jobs, and other things that it might take us some time to get back to you.

I've been proud of my paid subscriptions to Neowin for the 5 years that I have, might resub again to get rid of the ads.

Mods have to sub to get rid of the ads?
What the hell...

Glassed Silver:mac

#86 +InsaneNutter

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 23:18

To be honest i have thought about subscribing several times in the past, the main reason i never have have is the price.
I think £18ish per year is a lot to be honest, i would sooner pay my way by viewing adverts. However i could argue for and against subscribing and make a good argument for each.

Having been here so long at some point i do plan to sub once, however i feel a better contribution would just be to help out with questions and make good posts by i can.

#87 +Phouchg

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 20:21

Will be living on crackers and tapwater for the rest of this month because of Neowin sub :wacko:

*just kidding*