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Windows 8 Sales are actually Amazing - 40 million sold


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#196 Rickkins

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 20:25

Good god, if you're going to get your underwear curled up over the use of "tap" instead of "click", you really need to get out more.


You sound desperate.


#197 Dot Matrix

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 20:29

You sound desperate.


Tap, tap, tap, tap, tap, tap, tap!

Hold on, while I tap the "Post" button. ;)

#198 Rickkins

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 22:37

Bwahaha.... good one... :D

#199 PGHammer

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 00:41

Folder didn't make it to Windows until 95 (IIRC). I still say directory at times.


Oh well...it's not the first time this has happened though.
- Sleep a PC? really, how can it sleep?
- Cut? where are my scissors?
- Paste? can I get some glue please?
etc. etc.

It is a very trivial thing to pick and if they had gone "click here", he would be complaining about it on a tablet.


Actually, folders first appeared in Windows 1.1/286 - in File Manager; they have remained in Windows ever since. (It was File Manager that Windows Explorer would replace; the desktop - a modified version of the Workplace Shell from the IBM/Microsoft OS/2 joint venture (which would give way to OS/2 (IBM only), LAN Manager and finally Windows NT (Microsoft)) would replace Program Manager - in both Windows 3.x and Windows NT 3.x. From the Strange But True Factoid Department: Both Windows 95 and Windows NT Workstation 4.0 retained Program Manager and File Manager for backward-compatibility reasons - and one early piece of Windows 95 freeware - it actually launched simultaneously with Windows 95 - was the Workplace Shell for Win32 - an alternative to the desktop/Windows Explorer combo written by a group of IBM Austin employees. Therefore, even in the early days of Windows 9x, the Start menu/desktop/Explorer troika was FAR from universally loved.)

#200 Demz

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 01:08

windows8 will remain a flop. even i havent been tempted to buy it, problem with Windows8 atm AFAICT is there still aint a lot of programs that work correctly with 8, take a look at Firefox, there still in the middle of making that fully work under 8.

those figures might be a lot of windows8 licenses sold but how many people have gone back to windows7 if not back to XP from the disaster of 8? . M$$$ dont say that do they.

#201 PGHammer

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 01:11

It is not just about search. The fact that I need to change my workflow when using the Adobe products that I use the cool feature to detach the dialogs, means desktops apps DO NOT operate the EXACT SAME WAY as in Windows 7. Or was the charms and app switcher hot corners in Windows 7 as well?

I am not alone on this. I talked to several people who use Photoshop, Illustrator, and After Effects (though not so much on this one). Those that upgraded to Windows 8 say the same thing I do: "I keep activating the charms bar!". Some do not though. It depends on how you use the software.

I do not want to turn this into another Windows 8 hate thread, I actually like Windows 8. In fact that is the ONLY....ONLY issue I have with 8. Granted it is a big issue to me and many others. But come on, why is it you guys jump down our throats when we want an option? The way I, and many others, use the Adobe programs (by detaching some of the dialogs to give us more room and a better workflow), Windows 8 drives me crazy. Not everybody uses software and computers the same way.

My friend keeps activating the app switcher when he is browsing in Chrome. Every time he shuts down, he says "This is so stupid" because he needs to go to the charms bar instead of Start - Shut Down

The attitude here seems to be like "You are using your mouse incorrectly". I said it before, I like Windows 8 and think it will be a success. But for somebody that uses things in a productive way, probably more so than most of the people here, Windows 8 is a mess. If there was just ONE OPTION to disable the hot corners and COMPLETELY disable those bars while on the desktop, I would be very happy. Businesses would be happy (though most will be if there was an option to boot directly to the desktop). Everybody I know would be happy. You will be happy because you can ignore that option and use Windows 8 like it is now.

What is so horrible about an option?


The problem with options is that everyone tends to use (or not use) those options differently - you get TOO wooly with different methods of doing things and you wind up with Linux distributions. (I have nothing against Linux distributions per se - if I did, I wouldn't run them even in virtual machines, or recommend them for particular users OR uses. The sheer myriad of different ways of doing things has largely worked AGAINST Linux; worse, it has begun to infect UNIX and even the BSDs.)

And that is the criticism that is being laid *against* Windows 8. Not necessarily that the changes aren't necessary for the future of the survival of the OS itself - any IT follower with eyeballs and a brain HAS to see the approach of Android and iOS from underneath and start sweating - but it's that the changes are happening *now*. It's like replacing the lime sorbet with pistachio at Haagen Dasz; while both are green, they taste radically different from each other.

It's far from even being a Windows-only (or even OS/distribution-only) dilemma - look at the earlier-in-this-thread comparison between Adobe Creativity Suite (CS) products and Microsoft Office products; even on OS X - which has far greater UI cohesiveness than even Windows pre-8; look at how the Adobe CS products behave within that UI compared to Microsoft Office products. Different approaches to the same problem. Heck - just look at the differences between Pagemaker and Word (again, on OS X, not Windows).

The anger with Windows 8 is not necessarily that it's *bad* or that it's less-compatible with either hardware OR software than Windows 7 (which, as I have been pointing out, has gone nowhere; in fact, it will be supported until 2020 at the absolute earliest) - it's that it's too different from what the mass of the masses is used to. People find it far EASIER to accept a completely different paradigm altogether as opposed to a change in an existing one.

#202 PGHammer

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 02:01

windows8 will remain a flop. even i havent been tempted to buy it, problem with Windows8 atm AFAICT is there still aint a lot of programs that work correctly with 8, take a look at Firefox, there still in the middle of making that fully work under 8.

those figures might be a lot of windows8 licenses sold but how many people have gone back to windows7 if not back to XP from the disaster of 8? . M$$$ dont say that do they.


Horsefeathers.

Firefox (even Pale Moon and Waterfox) works just as well in Windows 8 (or even Windows Server 2012, which i dual-boot with 8 Pro) as they do in Windows 7. You are confusing the ModernUI version of FIrefox with the desktop browser you are used to. The bigger issue (with all three) is the interact5ion between the Plugin Container and Adobe Flash - a crash in either can be enough to bring the whole browser down around my ears (which is rather embarrassing when that happens on a server OS) and that is NOT OS-specific. If anything, any of the three browsers is more stable (desktop mode vs. desktop mode) on 8 (or 2012) vs. 7.

#203 BajiRav

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 02:48

Actually, folders first appeared in Windows 1.1/286 - in File Manager; they have remained in Windows ever since. (It was File Manager that Windows Explorer would replace; the desktop - a modified version of the Workplace Shell from the IBM/Microsoft OS/2 joint venture (which would give way to OS/2 (IBM only), LAN Manager and finally Windows NT (Microsoft)) would replace Program Manager - in both Windows 3.x and Windows NT 3.x. From the Strange But True Factoid Department: Both Windows 95 and Windows NT Workstation 4.0 retained Program Manager and File Manager for backward-compatibility reasons - and one early piece of Windows 95 freeware - it actually launched simultaneously with Windows 95 - was the Workplace Shell for Win32 - an alternative to the desktop/Windows Explorer combo written by a group of IBM Austin employees. Therefore, even in the early days of Windows 9x, the Start menu/desktop/Explorer troika was FAR from universally loved.)

I meant Folder the term/name not Folder the concept.

#204 contextfree

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 05:08

There is the whole debate on whether or not people need to shutdown at all, but the reality is they should be allowed to do whatever they want easily. The shutdown/sleep/hibernation option should have been placed on the charms bar directly and not buried.


You realize that this same logic ("people should be allowed to do whatever they want easily, therefore option X shouldn't be 'buried') could be applied to argue that literally everything a user might want to do should be a top-level charm. e.g., I use Notepad a lot, therefore I should be allowed to use it more easily than having to go to the start screen and click a tile, therefore there should be a Notepad charm. The reality is that not everything can be made equally prominent, so at some point you have to make a design decision about which functions should be prioritized over others in the UI. They decided that shutdown/restart should be more prominent than, say, checking for updates - hence it's at the top level of the Settings flyout and not 'buried' under Change PC settings - but not as prominent as, say, searching the current app or going back to Start. If you disagree with this, it's because you think they should treat shutdown/restart as more important than they do, or maybe you just don't think Settings is a good place for it, but it can't be because of a generic argument that 'burying' functions is always bad.

#205 seta-san

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 05:18

I have never been more annoyed by an OS as I have been by windows 8. I would recommend Windows ME before this. Windows 8 is beta at best showing a complete lack of regard for design and workflow with a poor attempt to make two paradigms work at the same time

#206 I am Not PCyr

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 05:32

I have never been more annoyed by an OS as I have been by windows 8. I would recommend Windows ME before this. Windows 8 is beta at best showing a complete lack of regard for design and workflow with a poor attempt to make two paradigms work at the same time


so in other words ypur just mad they took away your precious start menu..
and that you are a crotchety old man resistant to change and you were "doing it wrong"
and just simply didn't try hard enough to like the newer system.
You should have been taking a class on evenings and weekends learning keyboard combo's...
you should also be reminded that you are in an extreme vocal minority and there for
your opinion his little value.. besides the only opinion that matters is Microsoft's..
they know what is best for you and it is bad business to listen to their customers
*IF they do not like something you did..
I should probably just tell you that no one is forcing you to upgrade to windows 8
so don't use it ! ..even if they discontinue support to what you are using and
people here at neowin on other topics are making fun of you for using an older OS
and blaming you for doing damage to the safety security and reliability of the internet.
so sorry but your not allowed to be anoyed ;)

oh and on topic ?
M$ could say anything they want what does that really prove ?

#207 seta-san

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 06:00

so in other words ypur just mad they took away your precious start menu..
and that you are a crotchety old man resistant to change and you were "doing it wrong"
and just simply didn't try hard enough to like the newer system.
You should have been taking a class on evenings and weekends learning keyboard combo's...
you should also be reminded that you are in an extreme vocal minority and there for
your opinion his little value.. besides the only opinion that matters is Microsoft's..
they know what is best for you and it is bad business to listen to their customers
*IF they do not like something you did..
I should probably just tell you that no one is forcing you to upgrade to windows 8
so don't use it ! ..even if they discontinue support to what you are using and
people here at neowin on other topics are making fun of you for using an older OS
and blaming you for doing damage to the safety security and reliability of the internet.
so sorry but your not allowed to be anoyed ;)

oh and on topic ?
M$ could say anything they want what does that really prove ?


it's not just the start screen. it's metro apps in general. The messaging map give you absolutely no option to turn it off. it's on perpetually and everytime someone sends me a message it give me no way to stop the annoying pop-up box on the desktop informing me I have a message. Trying to uninstall that particular app uninstalls 3 or 4 others including the calendar and mail, and people apps. This is a product that Microsoft should truly be sorry for. This is the 'batman and robin' of OS's. I get why they tried to do and I think that's cool. It was executed so horribly

#208 HawkMan

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 06:12

Funny, I don't get any nag or stuff from my messaging app, only apps I get nags from is messenger and Skype. Both of which I turned off most of the notifications on.

#209 contextfree

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 06:41

it's not just the start screen. it's metro apps in general. The messaging map give you absolutely no option to turn it off. it's on perpetually and everytime someone sends me a message it give me no way to stop the annoying pop-up box on the desktop informing me I have a message. Trying to uninstall that particular app uninstalls 3 or 4 others including the calendar and mail, and people apps. This is a product that Microsoft should truly be sorry for. This is the 'batman and robin' of OS's. I get why they tried to do and I think that's cool. It was executed so horribly


You can actually turn notifications on/off for any new-style app including Messaging, or turn them on/off globally, in PC settings -> Notifications. You can also temporarily turn them off for a set amount of time via settings charm -> Notifications. Additionally any app can be prevented from running in the background via settings charm -> Permissions

#210 Kyang

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 06:52

it's not just the start screen. it's metro apps in general. The messaging map give you absolutely no option to turn it off. it's on perpetually and everytime someone sends me a message it give me no way to stop the annoying pop-up box on the desktop informing me I have a message. Trying to uninstall that particular app uninstalls 3 or 4 others including the calendar and mail, and people apps. This is a product that Microsoft should truly be sorry for. This is the 'batman and robin' of OS's. I get why they tried to do and I think that's cool. It was executed so horribly


Actually, there's a couple ways to disable notifications from the Messaging app.

They're listed right under "PC Settings, and "Notifications". Makes sense right?

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Also, you're wrong about not being able to turn it off. You can also disable the Messaging app right inside the app itself.

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