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Mindovermaster

Linux, as a Whole

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Windows to Linux ports are cheaper and easier than 360 to Windows ports, not at all about "big names throwing millions into linux ports of games" which is a kind of an uneducated statement.

Not actually true, and you're talking a lot of money in any case.

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HL3 on Linux? That would devalue the title from 'epic' to 'casual'

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Not actually true, and you're talking a lot of money in any case.

I recall reading an article a little while back where a developer that's very experienced in porting windows games to linux said its actually fairly cheap to do and can be done by a very small team. I'd wager it is much easier than a 360 to windows port, because they aren't having to port between two totally different architectures.

DIrextx > opengl isn't as huge of a deal, afiak valve just uses some sort of shim to translate directx calls to opengl. There's also game engines that make multiplatform development very easy, for example with the unity engine the game can easily be exported to multiple platforms, such as linux.

I guess if the developer tries to port games in the most stupid and inefficient way possible, then yeah it may be expensive, but if done right it can be done without massive costs...

Your posts seem to be exceedingly filled with FUD.

EDIT: Found the article (interview): http://cheerfulghost.com/panickedthumb/posts/771

One of the major reasons publishers and developers give for not releasing a Linux version of their games is that the demand doesn't justify the extra development cost. Having been involved in this process numerous times to do this very thing, what do you think about this stance?

I think it's short-sighted. A one-man team--me--can take a completed game and port it to Linux. Usually this is pretty fast and cheap.

If they had concerned themselves with portability right from the start, there would be no problem at all. Maybe have a single Linux (or Mac, or whatever) developer on the team, who would be responsible for that platform but otherwise is just building the game the same as everyone else. No doubt some of their time would be spent on platform-specific issues, but this cost would be amortized into the project. Also, as they find bugs that are exposed through cross-platform development (which are otherwise hidden until your customers find them for you), it's possible you save time and money.

Blizzard has a handful of Mac developers that maintain all their titles in a similar fashion. It's an insanely small portion of their devteam, and it's clearly been profitable for them.

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Actually, DX<->OGL is the easiest part of porting, it may as well not count. but there's significantly more than just changing between DX and OGL that goes into porting.

And again, you still forgetting that atm there's s few linux users interested in gaming, especially ones that don't have another gaming device they prefer, that there's no reason for devs to port games, and as I said, game devs have no interest in porting games to promote another platform, it's not their job, and in the end it would just add on to their costs. even with a small team doing the job, they would actually have to hire that small team to do the job. They would rather not.

the only exception here is Gabe and Valve, and that's because Gabe has an agenda, and he's putting his own personal agenda ahead of the companies interests. of course the linux camp will call him a pioneer and a fighter for freedom and all that. Stock holders would rather call him a nutcase wasting their money for no good reason :)

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Actually, DX<->OGL is the easiest part of porting, it may as well not count. but there's significantly more than just changing between DX and OGL that goes into porting.

And again, you still forgetting that atm there's s few linux users interested in gaming, especially ones that don't have another gaming device they prefer, that there's no reason for devs to port games, and as I said, game devs have no interest in porting games to promote another platform, it's not their job, and in the end it would just add on to their costs. even with a small team doing the job, they would actually have to hire that small team to do the job. They would rather not.

the only exception here is Gabe and Valve, and that's because Gabe has an agenda, and he's putting his own personal agenda ahead of the companies interests. of course the linux camp will call him a pioneer and a fighter for freedom and all that. Stock holders would rather call him a nutcase wasting their money for no good reason :)

You are making wild speculations that "no one that runs linux is interested in gaming". So far that's proven to be untrue. Devs do have interest in porting to linux because it can potentially make a profit. For example the humble indie bundle games sold quite well on linux. There are plenty of linux users interested in games and they are willing to pay for games.

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I stopped using Linux when I encountered problems, I turned to Linux forums for help and they started telling me to perform things in Terminal, I explained I didn't know what to type for those things and asked for specific commands, I was effectively laughed out the forum after being told

"If you don't know how to use the Terminal, you don't deserve to use Linux"

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I stopped using Linux when I encountered problems, I turned to Linux forums for help and they started telling me to perform things in Terminal, I explained I didn't know what to type for those things and asked for specific commands, I was effectively laughed out the forum after being told

"If you don't know how to use the Terminal, you don't deserve to use Linux"

There are plenty of friendly linux communities, I don't know where you found those douchebags but thats definitely not the norm for communities of distros targeted at being userfriendly like ubuntu or mint. Generally when someone tells you to do something in the terminal they will paste the command for you... thats why when asking for help about linux people often have you run terminal commands, not necessarily because you have to use the terminal for said task, but because its easier to just have someone copy/paste command(s) then to tell them to "go here, go here, click this, click that" etc...

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There are plenty of friendly linux communities, I don't know where you found those douchebags but thats definitely not the norm for communities of distros targeted at being userfriendly like ubuntu or mint. Generally when someone tells you to do something in the terminal they will paste the command for you... thats why when asking for help about linux people often have you run terminal commands, not necessarily because you have to use the terminal for said task, but because its easier to just have someone copy/paste command(s) then to tell them to "go here, go here, click this, click that" etc...

I agree with this 100x. I've had issues where I will need to do something, a quick google search ends with a forum where people have my exact problem, and there is a post like this:

Run commandX

Should output Y

Once you have the Y, if you type commandA fileA/fileb.conf it should show a file like: R

Now at line 124 you will see a line that looks like X, if you comment that (Press i and type #) then press Z twice

Now, run this command to restart the service

Type commandX and it should look like this,

And you are good to go.

Instead of:

Click this, and scroll through the list till you find this

Disable this option, and try it

If it doesn't work, find out what the exact error message you see is

Then download the file based on the error

You may need to install X,Y,Z in order for it to run though

Oh, and make sure you run the file as admin.

Now that that is done, if you launch the program it should work.

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There are plenty of friendly linux communities, I don't know where you found those douchebags but thats definitely not the norm for communities of distros targeted at being userfriendly like ubuntu or mint. Generally when someone tells you to do something in the terminal they will paste the command for you... thats why when asking for help about linux people often have you run terminal commands, not necessarily because you have to use the terminal for said task, but because its easier to just have someone copy/paste command(s) then to tell them to "go here, go here, click this, click that" etc...

No, that actually is the norm. I've found a few non-douchey Linux communities, but they're the exception rather than the rule, and that's because I really want to like Linux that I've continued looking past all the crap ones.

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No, that actually is the norm. I've found a few non-douchey Linux communities, but they're the exception rather than the rule, and that's because I really want to like Linux that I've continued looking past all the crap ones.

No, its not, unless you are spending all your time on the arch or gentoo forums

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No, its not, unless you are spending all your time on the arch or gentoo forums

I'm on the Arch forums a lot, and I have yet to see issues with douchebaggery in the topics I've gone into.

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No, its not, unless you are spending all your time on the arch or gentoo forums

Funny thing is Arch used to be one of the friendly ones. That just shows how much worse it has gotten.

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Funny thing is Arch used to be one of the friendly ones. That just shows how much worse it has gotten.

They are decently friendly as long as you read the wiki before posting :)

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Yeah I've been to those forums

"What, you come here and ask that, didn't you read the Wiki, it's clearly described in this page on this 5000 page wiki, on this page that you can't easily find and is not at all referred to by your problem, but also fixes your problem, you should have read that page first".

not impressed.

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the thing is, while Valve might release their games, you're not going to see EA, Activision, Ubisoft and the other big names throwing millions into Linux ports of games, for such a low market.

If Steam for Linux takes off, I can guarantee you EA Origin will take off to Linux too. EA isn't going let Valve have a monopoly. EA wants to get it's name in the headlines next. Besides, EA already has games in the Ubuntu software center.

Also, you keep bringing up the 1% thing. Stop, it's irreverent! 1% = hundreds of millions of people. If EA released and ported Crysis 3 to Linux tomorrow and sold it for 60 dollars a copy...well then you have yourself a nice chunk of change---and that's just counting Linux users. That revenue PAID for the Linux port. It's been proven time after time Linux users are willing to pay for high quality software. Why not use that to your advantage to line your pockets? You get money, we get kick ass games.

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Yeah I've been to those forums

"What, you come here and ask that, didn't you read the Wiki, it's clearly described in this page on this 5000 page wiki, on this page that you can't easily find and is not at all referred to by your problem, but also fixes your problem, you should have read that page first".

not impressed.

Well, you should have read it. That's no ones fault but yours. They even told you exactly where to look. They could have just said "Google It".

Just sayin'

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The problem with companies like EA is that they'll bump up the prices of games just because they need to develop games even longer so they work with Linux. :/

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Well, you should have read it. That's no ones fault but yours. They even told you exactly where to look. They could have just said "Google It".

Just sayin'

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. If you don't think Linux communities are douchey, it's because you're one of the douches.

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i agree, linux is fun when you're setting it up and getting it to work and look the way you want, but after that its like meh, i'd rather go back to windows so i can play decent games and use attractive software.

I think windows 8 is making alot of people want to move to linux. including devs, so it'll get better within the next few years. Especially after Valve gets games to run better on it.

Yep agreed, Windows 8 just made me want to install 7 again :)

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If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. If you don't think Linux communities are douchey, it's because you're one of the douches.

The fact that you are sitting here spreading ridiculous FUD makes you no better than the people you are complaining about. I've had mostly good experiences with linux communities, and always try to be friendly and helpful myself when providing help. I don't particularly appreciate people going around spouting nonsense like "most linux users are douchebags". Every community has its share of unpleasant people, no need to resort to such stereotyping.

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I don't particularly appreciate people going around spouting nonsense like "most linux users are douchebags"

Meh you get that sort of thing regardless of what you're talking about, be it operating systems, games, or even what your favorite phone is. Always going to be some dumbasses in the mix with a superiority complex going.

Sure, I've ran into a few "elitist" types occasionally, usually the first things out of their mouth was the obligatory "Did you read the man pages????" (even when you mention specifically that you did), but you'll see the exact same nonsense on any Windows centric forum too. Nothing new. The only ones who tend to get on my nerves are the "Church of Stallman" types (who I can't resist baiting when they get started), or conversely the "Linux is too hard so it sucks" types.. the other people with attitudes just get ignored like usual.

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They are decently friendly as long as you read the wiki before posting :)

It may be stereotyping, but that stereotype fits you.

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If Steam for Linux takes off, I can guarantee you EA Origin will take off to Linux too. EA isn't going let Valve have a monopoly. EA wants to get it's name in the headlines next. Besides, EA already has games in the Ubuntu software center.

Also, you keep bringing up the 1% thing. Stop, it's irreverent! 1% = hundreds of millions of people. If EA released and ported Crysis 3 to Linux tomorrow and sold it for 60 dollars a copy...well then you have yourself a nice chunk of change---and that's just counting Linux users. That revenue PAID for the Linux port. It's been proven time after time Linux users are willing to pay for high quality software. Why not use that to your advantage to line your pockets? You get money, we get kick ass games.

http://www.internetworldstats.com/stats.htm

Latest data of total worldwide internet users: 2,405,518,376. that means 1% is 24 055 183. Not exactly hundreds of million.

Now let's see out of the 2 400 million est. windows users, the biggest selling FPS franchise, CoD sells like 5 millions. that means it sold to roughly 0.2% of windows users. assuming the same percentage applies to linux it'd sell a whopping 48 000. yeah, that'd be totally worth it ;)

ps I give no guarantee my math is correct :p

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If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. If you don't think Linux communities are douchey, it's because you're one of the douches.

Actually, I don't post in the forums, as I use them for finding thing out. My point is, the forums and communities are helpful. They do point you in the right direction, and have had many problems I've faced be solved with a quick google search and going into the first linux forum that comes up.

So, no, I am not a "Douche" nor are the people in the communities I've gone to for support.

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i agree, linux is fun when you're setting it up and getting it to work and look the way you want, but after that its like meh, i'd rather go back to windows so i can play decent games and use attractive software.

I think windows 8 is making alot of people want to move to linux. including devs, so it'll get better within the next few years. Especially after Valve gets games to run better on it.

They said that about every windows since 95....

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