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Mother defends kids, shoots intruder

224 posts in this topic

Its amazing seeing the idiotic arguments being used by the pro-gun people. The guy implying it was a first step to the slaughter of american citizens was just...inbred.

I never understand the hunting thing either, why is it considered so masculine...hiding in a bush and shooting an animal minding its own business. Maybe they use fake masculinity to make up for intelligence in the south..but wow...wrestle it with your bear hands if you wanna be a man, then you only need a knife.

Which is it? Wrestle with your bear bare hands or use a knife? And you're questioning the intelligence in the south? :rolleyes:

Many people (men and women) hunt and eat what they kill. Venison is delicious, as is boar, pheasant, duck, moose and elk, etc. Masculinity has nothing to do with it. People in isolated areas rely on hunting to provide for themselves and their family, meat can be very expensive. Wildlife conservation serves multiple purposes, protecting animals and their environment, while still allowing for hunting.

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Oh and I agree with ya but are you certain he was there to do them harm? Were you there?

Absolutely irrelevant if he was there to do harm or not.

If she reasonably believed there was a threat to the livesof, or threat of great boldily injury to her or the children, then she had every right in the world to use as much force as it takes to stop the threat. Apparently thats 5 bullets to the head/neck in this case.

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which is why this anti 2nd amendment issue is absolutely ludicrous. suppose she was forced to turn the .38 in? we'd have one woman and several dead children..

Now that is an assumption you have nothing to back up with.

Who else could she have hit? The pizza delivery girl across the street?

Could happen, has happened.

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All you anti-gun people in this thread are just angry at the fact that this thread topic is the truth. Guns stop crimes and prevents them because a criminal wont attack you if he has to worry about being killed. The woman successfully saved her and her family's lives and you have the nerve to judge her!? You all are just crazy.

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All you anti-gun people in this thread are just angry at the fact that this thread topic is the truth. Guns stop crimes and prevents them because a criminal wont attack you if he has to worry about being killed. The woman successfully saved her and her family's lives and you have the nerve to judge her!? You all are just crazy.

also don't forget that when stories like this come out it likely prevents thousands of additional crimes just for fear of the possibility of a gun being in the house.

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All you anti-gun people in this thread are just angry at the fact that this thread topic is the truth. Guns stop crimes and prevents them because a criminal wont attack you if he has to worry about being killed. The woman successfully saved her and her family's lives and you have the nerve to judge her!? You all are just crazy.

Well that assumes you know what the guy was planning, at this point in time it didn't stop anything, it killed a person and made another person a killer. who knows what would have happened had she announce herself first. Called out that, I have a gun, I'm willing to use it to protect myself and my kids, I will shoot n sight and the cops are on the way.

also don't forget that when stories like this come out it likely prevents thousands of additional crimes just for fear of the possibility of a gun being in the house.

Looks at America crime stats... obviously not.

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All you anti-gun people in this thread are just angry at the fact that this thread topic is the truth. Guns stop crimes and prevents them because a criminal wont attack you if he has to worry about being killed. The woman successfully saved her and her family's lives and you have the nerve to judge her!? You all are just crazy.

The guy didn't know she was in, you are talking like he broke in just to rape and kill them. He rang the bell constantly and she didn't call out and tell him to go away, she didn't run out the back to get away, she called her husband then went to get the gun and hid.

She didn't even give the guy chance to back down, she just pulled the trigger till the gun was empty.

If she was scared she should have just got the kids and ran out the back and into a neighbours house to call the police.

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Still, what that woman did was overkill.

And that's all that needs to be said on the matter.

You have to think this from the woman's perspective:

You're at home with your kids, when some unknown person starts ringing the doorbell. When you don't answer, the person starts to break in. You hide in a closet with your kids and you hear the guy break your door (presumably using some heavy tool).

Then you hear the person going through your house and coming closer and closer to your hiding spot. The fear your experiencing is growing exponentially every second. You have no idea what he is going to do, when he will eventually find you. He is not a good person, since he already has broken into your house. You're probably out of mind by fear at this point; you fear for your well being and for your kids life. You have a good reason to fear that you and your kids will be hurt, when he finds you.

Then he comes to your hiding place and opens the door. You have a gun, so you raise it and start firing wildly, in panic.

Fear is the key-word here.

Think about it: the woman emptied her gun and after that considered ordering the person to leave. If she had been thinking straight, she would have left at least one bullet in the gun, so her demands would not have been just empty words.

As a side note: I do consider that ALL guns should be banned from everyone, expect police officers and army personnel. Civilians should not have guns (I'm a civilian myself).

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You have to think this from the woman's perspective:

I'm not saying she was at fault or that she shouldn't do anything to protect her family, owning guns and using them as home/self defence is legal and I accept that.

I just don't get how anyone thinks its acceptable to murder someone who breaks into your home. That's what the courts and prison is for.

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I just don't get how anyone thinks its acceptable to murder someone who breaks into your home. That's what the courts and prison is for.

i am anti-gun but have to say its not murder when they have broken into your house. I would shoot too IF the person actually broke a window or door to get in. You never know ones intentions. I am not a gambling man and would rather the thug die than the possibility of them even remotely touching my kids. If the person is willing to break into a house, its very possible they are willing to do worse.
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I'm not saying she was at fault or that she shouldn't do anything to protect her family, owning guns and using them as home/self defence is legal and I accept that.

I just don't get how anyone thinks its acceptable to murder someone who breaks into your home. That's what the courts and prison is for.

I do not think it is right to murder a burglar, but if you have a gun and do not have a formal training (I mean a serious police/military training), you pretty much have no change to fire nonlethal shots. You aim for the hands or legs and you'll probably miss. So in order to protect yourself with the gun, you need to aim for the head or the chest, so you'll at least hit something.

That is, if you actually have to fire the gun in order to save yourself. If the mere presence of a gun is enough, you shouldn't ever fire it.

In this woman's case, I do UNDERSTAND why she fired all six shots, she wasn't at her right mind. Fear was driving her.

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i am anti-gun but have to say its not murder when they have broken into your house. I would shoot too IF the person actually broke a window or door to get in. You never know ones intentions. I am not a gambling man and would rather the thug die than the possibility of them even remotely touching my kids. If the person is willing to break into a house, its very possible they are willing to do worse.

I have done illegal things in the past, petty little things, does that mean I would rape someone?

He broke in to steal things after assuming that there was no one in the house after ringing the bell constantly, thats a little bit different than rape or murder.

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I have done illegal things in the past, petty little things, does that mean I would rape someone?

He broke in to steal things assuming that there was no one in the house after ringing the bell constantly, thats a little bit different than rape or murder.

Sure, his intentions was to steal things, without anyone being around. But what happens, when he suddenly comes a cross a woman hiding in a closet? He has a crowbar in his hand and he is surprised by the woman. He doesn't have high morals, which is proven by the fact that he broke in to house with a crowbar.

So: he has low morals, he has already committed a criminal offense and he is surprised. He COULD strike without thinking...

Or do you automatically assume that there was NO CHANCE the he would've hurt the woman?

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I never said there was no chance, I just think is funny that pro-gunners automatically jump to the conclusion that he was there to rape and murder everyone.

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I have done illegal things in the past, petty little things, does that mean I would rape someone?

He broke in to steal things after assuming that there was no one in the house after ringing the bell constantly, thats a little bit different than rape or murder.

See, flaw in your logic. You do not know what his intentions were. Maybe his intentions were to just steal items...but can you say that something would have "flipped" if he came across an unarmed female? You do not know if when he saw her he would have been like "my bad" or whatever. You don't know, she didn't know and luckily she neutralized the situation before she or her kids were harmed.

She isn't a criminal, a murderer or anything that you trying to paint her as. She is a mother who defended herself and her kids from a CRIMINAL.

Edit: And considering he was on probation from a prior jail sentence (for battery)...well...yea she is the BAD one here.

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I just don't get how anyone thinks its acceptable to murder someone who breaks into your home. That's what the courts and prison is for.

She had every legal right to pull the trigger.

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I have done illegal things in the past, petty little things, does that mean I would rape someone?

He broke in to steal things after assuming that there was no one in the house after ringing the bell constantly, thats a little bit different than rape or murder.

You assume he broke into the house to steal. But...the article says he walked through the entire house before he found the lady without touching anything. Sounds to me like he had a specific reason he was there for and it wasn't to steal.

Sorry, but he gave up any right he had to live the moment he set foot through the door to some one elses house without their permission.

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I never said there was no chance, I just think is funny that pro-gunners automatically jump to the conclusion that he was there to rape and murder everyone.

I have read the entire 13 pages.. I see you are trying to prove a certain point but it's not worth it. The subject is too serious to be taken light-hearted when someone's family is at stake. Which IS at stake as many very wisely contribute to the fact that you CANNOT assume someone's intention. You don't have to be an already convicted felon of rape or murder or 1st degree assault or whatever to commit them. There's always a FIRST time! Just WISH and I wish too that person's FIRST time IS NOT my family or yours. He might even had hit her on the head to shut her up and fatally wounding her. And while at since he already committed his first murder, why not go all the way.. Let's have some fun with 2 9y old kids.. FOR F*CKS SAKE!!

Really?? He could even slice them piece by piece AFAIK.

So even if I see that you try to prove a certain point(that is not right to take a person's life in almost under any circumstances) with a flaw logic here,

I will let my 5'5" frame wife and my young 2 daughters know that when someone forces his way in our house with a crowbar or even a gun, to warm him first, politely of course(manners always matter right?) and then if he/she/they don't oblige, I will tell them to drop on their knees and start praying not to harm then in ANY way physically or mentally.

P.S: I really wish you NOT but if you have a family and a similar scenario comes into play and well what you know, no 0.38 here, and you go to the hospital after your wife and kids are harmed or raped or even killed.. I wish I could see you STRAIGHT in the eyes if you can say with a STRAIGHT face that you WOULDNT WISH your wife had a f*cking gun in her hands at that time...

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Could happen, has happened.

You need to take some physics classes if you really think so.

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I have read the entire 13 pages.. I see you are trying to prove a certain point but it's not worth it. The subject is too serious to be taken light-hearted when someone's family is at stake. Which IS at stake as many very wisely contribute to the fact that you CANNOT assume someone's intention. You don't have to be an already convicted felon of rape or murder or 1st degree assault or whatever to commit them. There's always a FIRST time! Just WISH and I wish too that that someone's FIRST time IS NOT my family or yours. He might even had hit her on the head to shut her up and fatally wounding her. And while at since he already committed his first murder, why not go all the way.. Let's have some fun with 2 9y old kids.. FOR F*CKS SAKE!!

Really?? He could even slice them piece by piece AFAIK.

So even if I see that you try to prove a certain point(that is not right to take a person's life in almost under any circumstances) with a flaw logic here,

I will let my 5'5" frame wife and my young 2 daughters know that when someone forces his way in our house with a crowbar or even a gun, to warm him first, politely of course(manners always matter right?) and then if he/she/they don't oblige, I will tell them to drop on their knees and start praying not to harm then in ANY way physically or mentally.

P.S: I really wish you NOT but if you have a family and a similar scenario comes into play and well what you know, no 0.38 here, and you go to the hospital after your wife and kids are harmed or raped or even killed.. I wish I could see you STRAIGHT in the eyes if you can say with a STRAIGHT face that you WOULDNT WISH your wife had a f*cking gun in her hands at that time...

Also when you walk down the street carrying your legally concealed gun, you could also assume that everyone on that street is a murderer and rapist and or sadist, and simply start shooting them.

Why bother warning people first and serif they leave just shoot.

You need to take some physics classes if you really think so.

Oh really, so since he was apparently coming up a set of stairs, we could assume there's windows at the end of that stair/hallways. One bullet fired in a blind panic misses his head, goes flying through the window and hits the pizza guy on the other side of the street, the kid out playing, the neighbor out sunbathing.

Could happen, has happened.

Or is this somehow kind of physics where billets stop dead after 50 meters or can't penetrate ordinary household glass panes...

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This story just doesn't seem complete, if someone knocks on my door I answer it or at least ask who it is. Seems to have been spun in a way to cause reaction, a convenient reaction at that.

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Question: Would it not better all around if people armed themselves tazers?

I mean, maybe there's a disadvantage to them, I honestly don't know.

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Also when you walk down the street carrying your legally concealed gun, you could also assume that everyone on that street is a murderer and rapist and or sadist, and simply start shooting them.

Why bother warning people first and serif they leave just shoot.

Where the f*ck did this come from?? FFS with what god damn logic did you conclude a thing like that from my comment? Holy ****. Really? You read(if you did) my comment and came to a conclusion that I might be person to think or have a logic that the one you give in your reply?

And here I thought my writing was clear and understandable.

I didn't expect a reply like that from a 14k post person. Really? Comparing walking down the street with someone entering ILLEGALLY your house while your wife and 2 9y are home? You must be the other guy's friend.

Also on a side note. Your reply even if you quoted my post, has nothing to do with it nor does it contain anything from it in your reply. I wonder why you even quoted me. No, I take it back. I do not wonder. I don't even care.. Say what you have to say and I will do the same.

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If she was scared she should have just got the kids and ran out the back and into a neighbours house to call the police.

You seem to think that it is the police's job to protect you. In the United States, according to the Supreme Court, it isn't. It is a personal responsibility in the United States to protect yourself. Stop telling people they should just let happen whatever happens. Stop defending criminals. Until you do that, your opinion will continue to be considered absurd.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/28scotus.html?_r=0

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This story just doesn't seem complete, if someone knocks on my door I answer it or at least ask who it is. Seems to have been spun in a way to cause reaction, a convenient reaction at that.

Police report would say otherwise. :rolleyes:

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