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Having touch screens is a terrible idea on a computer that is used by everyday people! People will destroy them quickly and the parts are either very expensive or non-serviceable (see the Dell Latitude XT, the entire assembly has to be replaced if the screen stops working, cracks, whatever - expensive parts).

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Most of the peeps I know are looking for a new PC when the time is nigh and they don't pick "hero PCs", but PCs that will do what's required. PCs aren't looked at in the same way smartphones are looked at. Smartphone = features, has got the apps I need PC = has OS, is newer than current machine, doesn't cost a fortune = will do the trick; also: Windows anyways= runs my software Glassed Silver:mac

You're right, but Microsoft's point is a desktop isn't the only PC anymore. They wanted hero laptops, ultrabooks, tablets, etc etc.

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Having touch screens is a terrible idea on a computer that is used by everyday people! People will destroy them quickly and the parts are either very expensive or non-serviceable (see the Dell Latitude XT, the entire assembly has to be replaced if the screen stops working, cracks, whatever - expensive parts).

How often do you seen busted kiosks? I've never seen any. My school has a couple dozen or so throughout campus. The local mall even has a few, and I've never seen one that was broken.

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Having touch screens is a terrible idea on a computer that is used by everyday people! People will destroy them quickly and the parts are either very expensive or non-serviceable (see the Dell Latitude XT, the entire assembly has to be replaced if the screen stops working, cracks, whatever - expensive parts).

The same things were probably said of laptops years ago. "Oh no, we can't let "everyday people" have the ability to move their computers around!!!"

Funny, like any delicate piece of electronic equipment, people learned to handle them properly. Sure, if you're careless, you'll pay the price. Otherwise, not a big deal.

Have you seem some of the torture test the Surface has gone through? Hell, folks can get an OtterBox if they're that worried.

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Here's a fact: In my country, Portugal, a month after the Windows 8 launch, there were still no RT/8 tablets available for purchase.

So yeah, Microsoft is right in blaming manufacturers.

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Here's a fact: In my country, Portugal, a month after the Windows 8 launch, there were still no RT/8 tablets available for purchase.

So yeah, Microsoft is right in blaming manufacturers.

Interesting that the OS itself couldn't convince people, no?

I mean it was pretty cheap at the time of introduction...

Glassed Silver:mac

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Came to thread to confirm headline was a total troll.

Confirmed.

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How often do you seen busted kiosks? I've never seen any. My school has a couple dozen or so throughout campus. The local mall even has a few, and I've never seen one that was broken.

That's ok then, you have never seen any so they never break, case closed.

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I think MS need to seriously question the people behind Win 8. Actually, I think the powers that be, need to seriously question themselves as they allowed this to happen, following the mess with Vista marketing. Windows 8 could have been a huge success, a Windows 7 with enhancements plus the touch UI if required... instead they tried to tell the educated consumer what they need.

I am so happy that they failed. I really like MS hardware and software but i think they need this wake up call.

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I certainly think OEMs underwhelmed. Still, there are very few "attractive" really "designed for W8" devices out there. Laptops, ultrabooks, etc. Even big OEMs like Lenovo and Asus are struggling to ship their stuff (anyone tried to buy a Lenovo X1 Carbon touch? How about an Asus Zenbook Prime Touch? I have...)

I certainly think the stores underwhelmed; as mentioned - you can still go to any computer store and see a series of old boxy 10 lb laptops anywhere, that just had W8 grafted onto them. They want to clear inventory and were hoping that putting W8 will do it, I guess?

I certainly think that MS messed stuff up too though: the whole confusion of W8 Pro vs. W8 RT did not help. The relatively short lead time that was there for people to even learn about W8 before the holiday season did not help.

There is plenty to blame on all sides, IMO.

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I think it's weak of MS to blame Manufacturers for the less than stellar acceptance of Windows 8. But then I blame the consumers for being sheep. I broke out of that herd mentaity and embranced Windows 8 and the Metro. The OS isn't fundementally changed at all. People convince themselves that it has. Sure there are some irritating differences, mostly just makes it harder to find stuff sometimes. But the common stuff I use isnt' all that difficult. Overall, Windows 8 is faster and better than Windows 7. Those who don't think so need to pull their heads out of their rear parts.

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That's ok then, you have never seen any so they never break, case closed.

Wasn't the point. Point is, they don't break as often as some here believe. If people are afraid of other's breaking everything, we would not have the society we do now. No ATMs, no self checkouts, etc, etc.

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I'm gonna have to agree with Microsoft on this one. Just look at Windows Phone 8. It would not have been successful if Nokia hadn't produced the quality Lumia 920.

If any OEM had produced hardware comparable to an iPad, it would have been successful as well.

Microsoft clearly had a plan for Windows 8 and the OEMs did not stick to it. Microsoft had the same plan for Windows Phone 8 (hero devices, featured devices, marketing, etc etc), Nokia and HTC stuck with it, and they have been succesful.

PC sales were already falling even with Windows 7, because of crap hardware. That is the point.

I always find it amusing when someone mentions the success of Windows Phone considering Microsoft hasn't gained any market share in almost a year, and even then it was just a brief 0.1% increase amid sinking before and since. Windows Phone is the opposite of successful.

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I blame the consumers for being sheep. I broke out of that herd mentaity and embranced Windows 8 and the Metro.

The things we tell ourselves... :rofl:

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It goes both ways but with MS's business model, they are still leading the charge so if OEM's weren't ready, thats on them too.

Ballmer has to go.

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I think it's weak of MS to blame Manufacturers for the less than stellar acceptance of Windows 8. But then I blame the consumers for being sheep. I broke out of that herd mentaity and embranced Windows 8 and the Metro. The OS isn't fundementally changed at all. People convince themselves that it has. Sure there are some irritating differences, mostly just makes it harder to find stuff sometimes. But the common stuff I use isnt' all that difficult. Overall, Windows 8 is faster and better than Windows 7. Those who don't think so need to pull their heads out of their rear parts.

I don't understand what makes it better than Windows 7. I don't think its a case of people convincing themselves that their OS has changed for the worse, as users we all want the best experience and if its not there for some people, then shouldn't they be allowed to voice their opinion without being told they need to "pull their heads out of their rear parts"

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The things we tell ourselves... :rofl:

Not sure what you are referring to. I like most people resistant to change. In this case, I did not like the preview as it seemed buggy. But the upgrade price was spot on. I bought and gave it a side by side chance. I found exactly what I have stated to be true. Windows 8 isn't Vista redux. It actually is better than the previous OS. Unfortunately it was marketed wrong. There should have been two versions as was pointed out or at least a way to disable metro.

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I always find it amusing when someone mentions the success of Windows Phone considering Microsoft hasn't gained any market share in almost a year, and even then it was just a brief 0.1% increase amid sinking before and since. Windows Phone is the opposite of successful.

Nokia disagrees.

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according to some here on neowin, Windows 8 was a smashing success

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according to some here on neowin, Windows 8 was a smashing success

60 million+ licenses sold says that it's not the failure people want.

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I don't understand what makes it better than Windows 7. I don't think its a case of people convincing themselves that their OS has changed for the worse, as users we all want the best experience and if its not there for some people, then shouldn't they be allowed to voice their opinion without being told they need to "pull their heads out of their rear parts"

You're taking that statement too personally. The home networking, speed to boot, speed in operation, compatibility (arguable I agree), initial support, stability are all empirically better. Win7 is a good OS. One should grab a upgrade license and dual boot while it's still cheap. Download a partition program or imaging Program cause windows has partition built in.

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60 million+ licenses sold says that it's not the failure people want.

sure, the world still keeps on making PC's and 90% of them do have windows 8, not sure if its what people want or rather just having no other viable option

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Nokia disagrees.

Nokia can say whatever they want. Their job is to make investors feel good, and they aren't doing a good job. After massive losses last year, they barely turned a profit this year with revenue decreasing, meaning all they did was spend less. Sales were down, and they can't break into the biggest markets in the world, US and China. As small as Nokia has become, the Lumia line was only responsible for less than a quarter of their phone sales, which were down 15% overall since last year. They cancelled paying a dividend out to shareholders to save money to push the Lumia line, and their stock is down 5-10% worldwide today. So let them be as delusional as they want and act like their Lumia line is a big hit. Bottom line, it's not.

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Nokia can say whatever they want. Their job is to make investors feel good, and they aren't doing a good job. After massive losses last year, they barely turned a profit this year with revenue decreasing, meaning all they did was spend less. Sales were down, and they can't break into the biggest markets in the world, US and China. As small as Nokia has become, the Lumia line was only responsible for less than a quarter of their phone sales, which were down 15% overall since last year. They cancelled paying a dividend out to shareholders to save money to push the Lumia line, and their stock is down 5-10% worldwide today. So let them be as delusional as they want and act like their Lumia line is a big hit. Bottom line, it's not.

Care to post a source? Because this, this, and this (PDF) say otherwise.

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You're taking that statement too personally. The home networking, speed to boot, speed in operation, compatibility (arguable I agree), initial support, stability are all empirically better. Win7 is a good OS. One should grab a upgrade license and dual boot while it's still cheap. Download a partition program or imaging Program cause windows has partition built in.

I think its important that we do take it personally, as we personally buy the operating system based on our own requirements. The features you list may be better, but they did not come about as a direct result of the UI design and direction.

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