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Common sense fixes to Windows 8

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#181 xWhiplash

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 19:53

It was more of a UI comparison. With Movie maker live they basically DUMB'ed the UI down.... apparently they thought the old movie maker was to complicated.

I know they removed most of the features from the new movie maker, but what if they had given all the features of the old but with the new UI? It would still suck balls because of the removal of the old timeline.


I know what you are saying. How can Adobe Photoshop or 3ds Max (many many many many more programs like these) POSSIBLY become a metro application? Can you imagine all the issues with it?

I do not see metro applications become a serious thing.


#182 Dot Matrix

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 19:57

I know what you are saying. How can Adobe Photoshop or 3ds Max (many many many many more programs like these) POSSIBLY become a metro application? Can you imagine all the issues with it?

I do not see metro applications become a serious thing.


Photoshop already has a mobile app. Hell, they even have a web app. There's nothing there preventing them from making a metro app.

Office will becoming to Metro soon too. The current OneNote app, Evernote app, the Skype app, Lync, etc all are proving Metro's worth. Yes, it is a "serious" thing.

#183 xWhiplash

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 20:02

Does that mobile application do every single thing that Photoshop CS6 can do? No. I am not referring to a photoshop elements - like feature set. I am referring to the full Photoshop CS6 Extended feature set. There is no way a metro application can exist with all the tools, filters, mini windows, and more. It will be a productivity nightmare.

#184 Dot Matrix

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 20:06

Does that mobile application do every single thing that Photoshop CS6 can do? No. I am not referring to a photoshop elements - like feature set. I am referring to the full Photoshop CS6 Extended feature set. There is no way a metro application can exist with all the tools, filters, mini windows, and more. It will be a productivity nightmare.


Metro supports in-app menus. Look at the circular menu in OneNote. It's all but guaranteed Metro will evolve to fill a bigger role.

#185 Dashel

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 20:08

Not a single example you listed is better than their desktop component, nor removes the need to install 'both' on Win8.

Do you guys just ignore history? Last I checked, 'apps' (aka widgets) were never meant to compete with 'full' applications. Sure, functionality has marginally increased, but philosophically I can't help but think you simply don't get the niche mobile apps fill (and hence why they can be more simple). Unless we adopt the (stagnant) premise that such simplicity is 'good enough' for everyone.

#186 George P

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 21:57

Metro apps don't have to be simple if a dev wants to make something more beefy. There are UI elements in place to allow you to expose just as much functionality as a desktop app if you want. The bottom app bar, the top bar, the right side slide out section, you can have menus, you can use a radial dial to if you want. The only difference here is that the WINRT API is so new and Win32 has 20 odd years of development behind it. How advanced were desktop apps in their first few years, do any of you even remember?

To say or think metro/WINRT apps can or will never become more advanced in time is silly.

#187 Scorbing

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 22:05

I have an easier, better solution to Windows 8: Windows 7

#188 Dashel

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 22:10

To say or think metro/WINRT apps can or will never become more advanced in time is silly.


I didn't mean to imply that. I actually agree with you, but you must admit we are still waiting to see. I'm just saying their competition has quite a different approach. The problem(s) is still that, yes, while it is exciting that we are starting over in a sense and are in many ways forking from '20 years ago', there is still quite a climb ahead. Not only do they still need to invent the new paradigm, they at some point will have to set guidelines on use. I'm sure you've noticed already that MS has quite a problem with apps not following the guidelines, yet somehow MS keeps approving them (and these are major ones like ESPN etc).

It just doesn't fit with a closed marketplace to have little to no oversight of the end game.

#189 George P

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 22:17

I didn't mean to imply that. I actually agree with you, but you must admit we are still waiting to see. I'm just saying their competition has quite a different approach. The problem(s) is still that, yes, while it is exciting that we are starting over in a sense and are in many ways forking from '20 years ago'. Not only do they still need to invent the new paradigm, they at some point will have to set guidelines on use. I'm sure you've noticed already that MS has quite a problem with apps not following the guidelines, yet somehow MS keeps approving them (and these are major ones like ESPN etc).

It's just quite a lot of resources for those that would use Live Movie anyways.


I agree with your points, lots of developers aren't putting in the effort needed but at the same time MS needs more apps so I think they're not being tough on things. I believe once we get metro versions of the other office apps that developers will step up their efforts.

#190 Dot Matrix

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Posted 19 March 2013 - 22:18

I have an easier, better solution to Windows 8: Windows 7


Oh, waah, 10 years from now that statement won't hold any water. People said they'd cling to XP forever, but nowadays, they given up on that, same will come of Windows 7.

Not a single example you listed is better than their desktop component, nor removes the need to install 'both' on Win8.

Do you guys just ignore history? Last I checked, 'apps' (aka widgets) were never meant to compete with 'full' applications. Sure, functionality has marginally increased, but philosophically I can't help but think you simply don't get the niche mobile apps fill (and hence why they can be more simple). Unless we adopt the (stagnant) premise that such simplicity is 'good enough' for everyone.


Apps != widgets

#191 BajiRav

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:59

That would actually benefit a fairly small group. More than 85% of Desktop-PC Windows users and more than 95% of Laptop Windows users take advantage of only a single monitor.

They still improved multi-monitor support in Windows 8...

#192 ahhell

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 13:21

I have an easier, better solution to Windows 8: Windows 7

I wish all you whiners would actually just move back to Windows 7 and STFU already.
:crazy:

#193 OP Syrah

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 13:40

They still improved multi-monitor support in Windows 8...

And I'm not saying they won't do this. Only that it wouldn't make a difference for 90% of Windows users. And multi-monitor usage is concentrated in the high-end enthusiast/professional space where I would expect Metro to be used much more sparingly (if at all) to begin with. Thus I personally wouldn't see this as a high priority item at all. It would also seem to be an admission that there's real value to keeping multiple apps up and visible at once (d'oh) when Microsoft has been promoting a way of working with apps where you concentrate only on a single one of them with at most an additional sidebar, even on 30" screens. At that point, why not go all the way and allow windowing or at the very least flexible tiling of Metro apps which would at once solve the multiple monitor issue as well and would allow a far greater amount of people to take advantage of the new functionality.

#194 OP Syrah

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 16:01

By the way, the latest version of ModernMix supports
- restricting the minimum size of Metro windows
- a button for activating the Charms bar in the upper right corner of the app
- having the task bar visible next to a "full screen" Metro app

Pretty good.

Attached Images

  • mm.png


#195 Dot Matrix

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 16:54

By the way, the latest version of ModernMix supports
- restricting the minimum size of Metro windows
- a button for activating the Charms bar in the upper right corner of the app
- having the task bar visible next to a "full screen" Metro app


The whole point of Metro is to eliminate clutter. These things don't need to be visible on screen every second. It's nice to have my screen space available to my content and work, and not cluttered with every single control known to man.