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The Xbox One and live TV -- here's what to expect

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#46 Steven P.

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 08:49

Thread cleaned, keep the personal insults to yourself.




#47 vetFourjays

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 09:30

This is an interesting comment/question because with that you opened a whole can of worms that really goes against your point while backing up other people's point of "entitlement". I'll explain.

Your premise that Microsoft should provide the means for everyone to watch tv on the Xbox one without the need to buy additional equipment regardless of provider or said provider technologies IS in and of itself a entitlement or at least carries a sense of it (entitlement).
Because then what about the people who doesn't have an hdmi equipped TV? Should Microsoft also provide RCA and RCA-HD cables in the box along with hdmi cables in the box?
What about those who's soround sound system doesn't use digital input? Should Microsoft also provide an digital to analog converter in the box?
I'm wondering if by now you see where your argument falls apart.

That is a poor comparison. TVs without any HDMI are few and far between now in the markets that the Xbox will be targeting. Those who still haven't got an HDMI port wouldn't be likely to be buying an Xbox either (although it isn't possible, but that is an edge case).

 

Nobody is saying that Microsoft need to support every possible usage scenario in every possible market. What they are saying is that it would be counter intuitive not to offer decent support for a majority market. And in the UK particularly (a key market for the Xbox) OTA TV is the way the majority of people watch TV and something Microsoft will need to take account of. To further complicate matters, it would be fair to assume that those most likely to buy an Xbox are also those most likely to have a TV with an integrated digital tuner (no idea on the prevalence of HDMI out on TVs though).

 

Microsoft could say that you need a non-integrated tuner, but expecting someone to buy one just for the Xbox isn't something that would necessarily sit well with consumers, especially the less technically minded. Not to mention that it uses more power (and adds more clutter) unnecessarily. Hence why most here have suggested (constructive criticism, not entitlement!) that the Xbox One should bundle or strongly recommend alongside it, a suitable USB/HDMI DVB tuner (they aren't expensive) or offer another sensible solution straight up. Making it Sky/Virgin/non-integrated OTA only in the UK would doom the TV features to minority use only (and the same would apply anywhere else with a similar TV market).

 

I don't know why the some here seem to be against having a system that is going to work for as many people as possible with as little effort as possible. Do you want it to fail or something?  :wacko:



#48 Yogurtmaster

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 09:45

So, MS are going to have available every TV code and every set top box code there is, for the XBox One to send?  What about the many people who get digital TV over the air, such as the majority of homes in the UK? In many cases, there IS no set top box, and almost none of those TV's have a HDMI out, either.

 

The TV features are nice, but I just don't see how they're going to work for many countries outside of the US.   For you guys, cable TV might be the norm, but outside the US it's a whole other story.  Even IN the US, I doubt it'll cover a huge number of folks...

 

Would be nice if MS actually ponied up some REAL information about how this is going to work...

 

   In the USA they would have to cover these and they would cover most of everyone....

 

   These first two can be accessed anywhere in the U.S.A as they are satellite companies. 

 

   Dish Network

   Direct TV

 

   These companies are regional in the U.S.A

 

   Comcast

   AT&T Uverse

   Time Warner

   Cox

   Charter

   Cablevision

   US Cable

   Atlantic Broadband

   Verizon

 

I personally have the Dish Network HD DVR It's 700 something as the model.  It's an HD DVR that records HD TV and has a HDMI port on the back and it's ready to go.  When I get my Xbox One, I can just put an HDMI cable from the back of that into the HDMI in to my Xbox One and then use the HDMI out on my Xbox One into HDMI 1. 



#49 Yogurtmaster

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 09:55

To stat the obvious.. I'll buy my Ceton Six Tuner (usb + network capabilities), and use a cable card in a HTPC.  I won't need to subscribe to Xbox Live to use any features I'm already paying for (hulu, netflix, etc).  I won't need another settop box on my entertainment center.  I'll have full DVR capabilities for up to 6 channels at one time recording.  I will not be limited by anything other than upgradable HD space.  Windows Media Center to this day is still the best Guide.  I can share any of my 6 tuners to any other pc in my house and over the internet anywhere in the world pending provide bandwidth host and client side.

 

Nothing to this date beats that.

 

My HTPC is my;

Gaming Machine

TV Tuner

Blu-Ray Player

Web Browser

 

One Input to rule them all.  And it all runs thought my HT Equipment.

 

How much does all of this cost you?



#50 JonnyLH

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 09:56

To give some more context to this article, there are very solid rumours that BT are wanting to provide their sport service on the X1 and Sky actually want to offer it subsidised as a fully fledged set-top box. In terms of the UK anyway.

#51 vetFourjays

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 14:43

To give some more context to this article, there are very solid rumours that BT are wanting to provide their sport service on the X1 and Sky actually want to offer it subsidised as a fully fledged set-top box. In terms of the UK anyway.

Wonder how that would work, as it sounds like it would be as an actual replacement for the Sky box. If it was I have to admit I would be very interested (assuming recording capabilities anyway) as the Xbox One makes much more sense as the TV box rather than as an additional overlay.



#52 Klownicle

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 15:34

How much does all of this cost you?

 

Depends, what are you asking about?

 

Considering this setup can be put into any pc, 169$ for a quad tuner card and since I have verizon fios, 3.99 a month for a cable card.  The cablecard is actually free on comcast, etc.  Another cool feature of this type of setup is you can add more tuners to your setup and increase your number of channels being watched at once, ie; a single quad tuner or six tuner can do 4 and 6 respectivly.  You can then add ANOTHER tuner, and have 8 and 12 tuners, etc.  



#53 Red Arrow

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 09:56

Has there been any talk on if the Sky app will work on the Xbox One and if so is it getting an update to bring it in line with all this Xbox TV stuff?

 

I’m not really interested in hooking up my Sky box to the Xbox since they will be in different rooms. But if they updated the Sky app it would be far more useful for those of us using the console in a different room to their main TV.



#54 Thief000

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 10:39

Wonder how that would work, as it sounds like it would be as an actual replacement for the Sky box. If it was I have to admit I would be very interested (assuming recording capabilities anyway) as the Xbox One makes much more sense as the TV box rather than as an additional overlay.Like

 

Like most TV providers will go in the future: IP based. Once IPv6 takes over completely, television providers and manufacturers are expected to go this way. You see many TV providers already do this with all-in-one subs that contain TV, internet and telephony. They mostly give or rent you an all-in-one modem/router that permits this.

Behind that router you can view your TV on your tablet for example and most certainly Xbox One if the app for it is available (WinRT capable app store). This could also make DVR capabilities work on the Xbox One if MS is willing to give those third party apps access to the drives (they don't on the Xbox 360).



#55 JonnyLH

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 10:48

Like most TV providers will go in the future: IP based. Once IPv6 takes over completely, television providers and manufacturers are expected to go this way. You see many TV providers already do this with all-in-one subs that contain TV, internet and telephony. They mostly give or rent you an all-in-one modem/router that permits this.

Behind that router you can view your TV on your tablet for example and most certainly Xbox One if the app for it is available (WinRT capable app store). This could also make DVR capabilities work on the Xbox One if MS is willing to give those third party apps access to the drives (they don't on the Xbox 360).

IPv6 won't take over fully for many many years. We're talking around 20-30 years. Even so, the technology in IPv6 won't dramatically increase the technical capabilities of an IP based network. For example on IPv4 currently (Virgin Media), its just IPv4 multicast streams which broadcast different TV stations. Simples.



#56 vetFourjays

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 10:56

Like most TV providers will go in the future: IP based. Once IPv6 takes over completely, television providers and manufacturers are expected to go this way. You see many TV providers already do this with all-in-one subs that contain TV, internet and telephony. They mostly give or rent you an all-in-one modem/router that permits this.

Behind that router you can view your TV on your tablet for example and most certainly Xbox One if the app for it is available (WinRT capable app store). This could also make DVR capabilities work on the Xbox One if MS is willing to give those third party apps access to the drives (they don't on the Xbox 360).

I sort of hope not. Not until the Internet in this country is really brought up to par (frankly, the telephone network should be sold off to other companies and/or BT given heavy fines for their laziness/ineptitude/lack of investment). And I don't see our telephone network (and thus Internet) being improved anytime soon. :/



#57 JonnyLH

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 11:21

I sort of hope not. Not until the Internet in this country is really brought up to par (frankly, the telephone network should be sold off to other companies and/or BT given heavy fines for their laziness/ineptitude/lack of investment). And I don't see our telephone network (and thus Internet) being improved anytime soon. :/

As someone who has and still works at the 3 of the top 3 ISP's of the UK, the backbone of the UK is far from inferior. Its the grade of the copper BT used when first installing the phone network where the bottleneck lies. It was very low, hence the degrading of it after all these years and the low speeds you see, unstable lines. For example, one of these ISP's has around 600GBs throughput from the north to the south. This was at around 60% utilized in peak times.

 

If you could get FTTC with BT or in a Virgin Media area then you're speeds will carry on increasing because there's no bottlenecks. The peering charges the UK has with Tier 1 ISP's on the other hand are ridiculous. This is to do with legislation, tax etc etc and is what mainly drives the prices up.

 

Most ISP's are LLU now which means they don't use BT hardware in their exchanges and drive it themselves. Its getting much better, just stay away from BT's copper lines.



#58 vetFourjays

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 11:50

As someone who has and still works at the 3 of the top 3 ISP's of the UK, the backbone of the UK is far from inferior. Its the grade of the copper BT used when first installing the phone network where the bottleneck lies. It was very low, hence the degrading of it after all these years and the low speeds you see, unstable lines. For example, one of these ISP's has around 600GBs throughput from the north to the south. This was at around 60% utilized in peak times.

 

If you could get FTTC with BT or in a Virgin Media area then you're speeds will carry on increasing because there's no bottlenecks. The peering charges the UK has with Tier 1 ISP's on the other hand are ridiculous. This is to do with legislation, tax etc etc and is what mainly drives the prices up.

 

Most ISP's are LLU now which means they don't use BT hardware in their exchanges and drive it themselves. Its getting much better, just stay away from BT's copper lines.

Interesting to hear from someone who knows how it all actually works. :) Problem at the moment is that BT seems loathe to do anything outside of the major cities. Last time I checked the local rollout plans, not even semi-major cities in my area (e.g. Stoke) appear to be getting 20Mbps broadband anytime soon, let alone the towns and villages around them. I get this sense from BT that they don't care so long as people are tied to their line rental fees. Hence I really wish someone or something would stick a boot up their backside and get them upgrading the network everywhere. As far as I know, the average Internet speed across the UK is still around 1.5Mbps, which is way too low for this day and age.

 

I am perhaps incredibly fortunate that I get 6 out of my 8Mbps in my relatively rural area. Is partly why I refuse to move from my bandwidth-limited ISP. But I do wonder if it going to go any faster within the next decade. :/



#59 JonnyLH

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 12:01

Interesting to hear from someone who knows how it all actually works. :) Problem at the moment is that BT seems loathe to do anything outside of the major cities. Last time I checked the local rollout plans, not even semi-major cities in my area (e.g. Stoke) appear to be getting 20Mbps broadband anytime soon, let alone the towns and villages around them. I get this sense from BT that they don't care so long as people are tied to their line rental fees. Hence I really wish someone or something would stick a boot up their backside and get them upgrading the network everywhere. As far as I know, the average Internet speed across the UK is still around 1.5Mbps, which is way too low for this day and age.

 

I am perhaps incredibly fortunate that I get 6 out of my 8Mbps in my relatively rural area. Is partly why I refuse to move from my bandwidth-limited ISP. But I do wonder if it going to go any faster within the next decade. :/

BT have only been upgrading and installing lines in the areas with a low overall general broadband percentage. They only did this to bring their averages up, then stopped. These are BT's market 2/3 areas, which they charge more line rental for. 

 

Even with FTTC from BT, ISP's have to pass on an 18month contract to the customer because BT actually contract the provider to lease that line for the customer for 18 months.

 

To be honest, you have more look with a local funded project providing better connectivity. Google Digital Region whats in South Yorkshire, similar to that. BT have to go through so much legislation and legal process before they get approval for a lot of their work. That's why they bought Plusnet, to essentially own an ISP without the governments overlook. 



#60 vetFourjays

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 12:18

BT have to go through so much legislation and legal process before they get approval for a lot of their work. That's why they bought Plusnet, to essentially own an ISP without the governments overlook. 

So we have the government to blame for it?