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Posted

...of digital only titles.

 

I believe one AAA game is going to take the risk of going digital only and have great profits (which is the biggest factor) to start the waterfall effect. Yes, we know digital isn't for everyone right now, and I don't think any publisher is going to take that risk on a huge game anytime soon (2 years time...maybe year 3). What I do think is when it happens, Gamestop would have wished that Microsoft kept the "old" policies of the Xbox One, which actually kept Gamestop and other vendors in the loop for trade in. With both Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo having the ability to download a game without any involvement from Gamestop, it effectively kills their business, unless they do some type of transformation, which I don't even think it's possible.  

 

Yes, physical discs aren't going away any time soon, but this generation will definitely start movement of digital only titles (I believe anyways) for AAA games. All we need to know how is...who's going to take the plunge.

 

What are your thoughts?

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Posted

I hope Mass Cause (Mass Effect prequel) goes digital only and puts Gamestop out of business.

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I hope Mass Cause (Mass Effect prequel) goes digital only and puts Gamestop out of business.

 

I couldn't help but thinking: "The mass effect of Mass Effect on Gamestop..." after reading that. lol.

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I hope Mass Cause (Mass Effect prequel) goes digital only and puts Gamestop out of business.

 

 

Why? Decreased competition isn't good for consumers.

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Posted

...of digital only titles.

 

I believe one AAA game is going to take the risk of going digital only and have great profits (which is the biggest factor) to start the waterfall effect. Yes, we know digital isn't for everyone right now, and I don't think any publisher is going to take that risk on a huge game anytime soon (2 years time...maybe year 3). What I do think is when it happens, Gamestop would have wished that Microsoft kept the "old" policies of the Xbox One, which actually kept Gamestop and other vendors in the loop for trade in. With both Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo having the ability to download a game without any involvement from Gamestop, it effectively kills their business, unless they do some type of transformation, which I don't even think it's possible.  

 

Yes, physical discs aren't going away any time soon, but this generation will definitely start movement of digital only titles (I believe anyways) for AAA games. All we need to know how is...who's going to take the plunge.

 

What are your thoughts?

Stardock already did with Fallen Enchantress from what I know.

 

I don't expect many other publishers to follow suit, at least not for another 3-5 years.

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Posted

Decreased competition isn't good for consumers.

Of course, but GameStop's policy of undercutting publishers through used games is taking money out of the gaming industry and away from the developers making the games. There is plenty of competition when it comes to digital distribution

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Posted

Of course, but GameStop's policy of undercutting publishers through used games is taking money out of the gaming industry and away from the developers making the games. There is plenty of competition when it comes to digital distribution

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Posted

Of course, but GameStop's policy of undercutting publishers through used games is taking money out of the gaming industry and away from the developers making the games. 

 

Yeah, publishers hate gamestop so much they jump in bed with them at every opportunity to offer exclusive DLC and exclusive collector's/limited editions. GameStop is seeming less and less like the bogeyman publishers make them out to be.

 

There is plenty of competition when it comes to digital distribution

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Posted

What's the benefit of going digital-only? There will always be people that want to buy a disc for various reasons. Maybe they don't want to waste bandwidth on a game download or want a disc so they could later sell the game or give/lend it to a friend or family member. I'm fairly sure you can download major games from Xbox Live or PSN so forcing everyone to download the game seems unfair.

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Posted

Why? Decreased competition isn't good for consumers.

Online Market <> Physical Game Market

 

You'd still have competition between online retailers which work on different models to disc based retailers.

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Posted

What's the benefit of going digital-only? There will always be people that want to buy a disc for various reasons. Maybe they don't want to waste bandwidth on a game download or want a disc so they could later sell the game or give/lend it to a friend or family member. I'm fairly sure you can download major games from Xbox Live or PSN so forcing everyone to download the game seems unfair.

I just found a bunch of articles over here pointing out that our games are trading quality for length or DLC or many other ways to extend the current sales model that not that many devs actually like doing.

 

http://www.edge-online.com/features/the-developers-view-on-preowned-why-game-players-must-support-their-hobby/

 

So there may not be a immediate benefit to any of us to kill the used/retail market, but for the overall ecosystem it seems like it'd be a good deal.  I just (as I mentioned) don't see it happening in the next few years.

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Posted

Online Market <> Physical Game Market

 

You'd still have competition between online retailers which work on different models to disc based retailers.

The online market for consoles is controlled by one company for each platform. It's not like PC gaming where you have the option to buy/download a game from Steam, GOG.com, Green Man Gaming, Origin, and Impulse. The fact that PC gamers have the choice to buy their games from various distribution platforms forces them to compete with one another. That's why you see a lot of sales and bundles at low prices. The same can't be said for Xbox Live, PSN, or Nintendo's platform.

 

I just found a bunch of articles over here pointing out that our games are trading quality for length or DLC or many other ways to extend the current sales model that not that many devs actually like doing.

 

http://www.edge-online.com/features/the-developers-view-on-preowned-why-game-players-must-support-their-hobby/

 

So there may not be a personal benefit to any of us to kill the used/retail market, but for the overall ecosystem it seems like it'd be a good deal.  I just (as I mentioned) don't see it happening in the next few years.

After reading that, I can see the benefit of eliminating the used games market. I didn't know developers lost a lot of potential revenue from people that buy used instead of new. We're still far away from going digital-only because of convenience and Internet connection-related issues (e.g. bandwidth, speed). If we had the same kinds of speeds and bandwidth in North America/Europe that people have in some parts of Asia, then we'd likely see a faster shift to digital over physical.

 

However, I don't think we'll ever see the shift to digital-only until consoles start shipping with 2 TB hard drives and the average download speed is 30 Mbps.

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Posted

The online market for consoles is controlled by one company for each platform. It's not like PC gaming where you have the option to buy/download a game from Steam, GOG.com, Green Man Gaming, Origin, and Impulse. The fact that PC gamers have the choice to buy their games from various distribution platforms forces them to compete with one another. That's why you see a lot of sales and bundles at low prices. The same can't be said for Xbox Live, PSN, or Nintendo's platform.

 

 

Exactly. I already pointed that out:

 

A totally digital system on consoles wouldn't be anything like the on that exists on PC. There would be zero competition on console marketplaces, so the console makers would be free to charge whatever they pleased and we would have to like it or lump it.

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Posted

After reading that, I can see the benefit of eliminating the used games market. I didn't know developers lost a lot of potential revenue from people that buy used instead of new. We're still far away from going digital-only because of convenience and Internet connection-related issues (e.g. bandwidth, speed). If we had the same kinds of speeds and bandwidth in North America/Europe that people have in some parts of Asia, then we'd likely see a faster shift to digital over physical.

 

However, I don't think we'll ever see the shift to digital-only until consoles start shipping with 2 TB hard drives and the average download speed is 30 Mbps.

A lot of people don't know.  And while it's not policy obviously and you'd think they wouldn't want to bull**** their customers, I have encountered GS sales reps in other cities that tried to convince me used game sales did kick back to the developers.  No, they don't, and I wish I could smack that guy upside the head without that just making both of us tools.

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Posted (edited)

As OP asked, 'what are your thoughts'

I'm not convinced on the idea, nor do I find myself all that interested, (no I haven't read the other replies)

I just feel that disc based gaming is more competitive as far as the 'cash in your pocket' goes, brand new titles, are x amount of money, they are that because stores compete for your cash as well as try to get the latest titles to the consumer, a digital copy, 'one could argue could be cheaper' as it negates the 'middle man' but for those who do not have great internet, they could be waiting until the following day for said purchase to complete downloading, (this is a valid concern for some, not all, I accept this fact)

 

And as far as older titles go, new consoles come with 500 gb hard drives

(at least in sony's case I know is user upgradeable, didn't follow the xbox topic so I will freely admit I do not know if it does or not, I'm sure someone here will put me right on this, and probably blast me for my ignorance, which is what normally happens)

That's great but what if the majority of users don't upgrade their hard drives and have a vast library? They'd have to uninstall games to make room for new ones, and in like me, you are the kind of person who goes back to older games bought earlier on in the year, you'd have to uninstall, redownload, install just to play it (this is where my slow and unstable internet arguement becomes valid) a user who suffers with bad internet would simply be frustrated to hell, all he/she wanted to do was play something because they felt nostalgic.

 

Then I have a concern about used titles, this is actually valid at least in the UK (As I'm from the UK I can only talk about the UK preowned market I'm sure user from their respective nations could give information on their used markets respectively) I can but a 3 week or even 3 year old title for a lot less than launch price as a used disc, but and I checked this, the same game (in this instance, need for speed most wanted)as a digital download one month after launch on sony  was still full price,  though they did lower the price soon after, but the point I guess I was trying to make in this regard was that the disc is quicker, cheaper, and available for when I want it.

As a consumer I'm sure we all want what we want, when we want it, afterall it is your money, you decide how to spend it, me personally, if I buy a new title, I want to play it asap, not wait 4 hours for a digital download.

 

Please forgive me if this has sounded off as a rant, this wasn't my intention, as I'm not a highly educated man I lack a certain eloquence, that readers and reporters here might be used to.

 

(Edit, afterthought

I fear the digital download could harm retail stores, maybe a full game as a disc, then offer the online multiplayer option as a code bought from the respective online store or given in a 'special edition' of the game like nfsmw or battlefield 3 for instance, 'just to meet you halfway')

Edited by Dushmany

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Posted

Just to be clear, I rarely resell games. I think I have only ever resold 1 game. This is just my 360 and ps3 games (No PC, 3DS, VIta, PSP titles which I also own)

 

 

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Posted

The online market for consoles is controlled by one company for each platform. It's not like PC gaming where you have the option to buy/download a game from Steam, GOG.com, Green Man Gaming, Origin, and Impulse. The fact that PC gamers have the choice to buy their games from various distribution platforms forces them to compete with one another. That's why you see a lot of sales and bundles at low prices. The same can't be said for Xbox Live, PSN, or Nintendo's platform.

 

After reading that, I can see the benefit of eliminating the used games market. I didn't know developers lost a lot of potential revenue from people that buy used instead of new. We're still far away from going digital-only because of convenience and Internet connection-related issues (e.g. bandwidth, speed). If we had the same kinds of speeds and bandwidth in North America/Europe that people have in some parts of Asia, then we'd likely see a faster shift to digital over physical.

 

However, I don't think we'll ever see the shift to digital-only until consoles start shipping with 2 TB hard drives and the average download speed is 30 Mbps.

What if online retailers can provide full game downloads through a code similar to points?

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Posted

A lot of people don't know.  And while it's not policy obviously and you'd think they wouldn't want to bull**** their customers, I have encountered GS sales reps in other cities that tried to convince me used game sales did kick back to the developers.  No, they don't, and I wish I could smack that guy upside the head without that just making both of us tools.

It wouldn't be in their best interests to inform customers that used game sales hurt the publisher and developer. But to deliberately mislead customers with false information, well... that's not right at all. If a customer asks about where the money goes, then a sales rep should give an honest answer.

 

As OP asked, 'what are your thoughts'

I'm not convinced on the idea, nor do I find myself all that interested, (no I haven't read the other replies)

I just feel that disc based gaming is more competitive as far as the 'cash in your pocket' goes, brand new titles, are x amount of money, they are that because stores compete for your cash as well as try to get the latest titles to the consumer, a digital copy, 'one could argue could be cheaper' as it negates the 'middle man' but for those who do not have great internet, they could be waiting until the following day for said purchase to complete downloading, (this is a valid concern for some, not all, I accept this fact)

 

And as far as older titles go, new consoles come with 500 gb hard drives

(at least in sony's case I know is user upgradeable, didn't follow the xbox topic so I will freely admit I do not know if it does or not, I'm sure someone here will put me right on this, and probably blast me for my ignorance, which is what normally happens)

That's great but what if the majority of users don't upgrade their hard drives and have a vast library? They'd have to uninstall games to make room for new ones, and in like me, you are the kind of person who goes back to older games bought earlier on in the year, you'd have to uninstall, redownload, install just to play it (this is where my slow and unstable internet arguement becomes valid) a user who suffers with bad internet would simply be frustrated to hell, all he/she wanted to do was play something because they felt nostalgic.

 

Then I have a concern about used titles, this is actually valid at least in the UK (As I'm from the UK I can only talk about the UK preowned market I'm sure user from their respective nations could give information on their used markets respectively) I can but a 3 week or even 3 year old title for a lot less than launch price as a used disc, but and I checked this, the same game (in this instance, need for speed most wanted)as a digital download one month after launch on sony  was still full price,  though they did lower the price soon after, but the point I guess I was trying to make in this regard was that the disc is quicker, cheaper, and available for when I want it.

As a consumer I'm sure we all want what we want, when we want it, afterall it is your money, you decide how to spend it, me personally, if I buy a new title, I want to play it asap, not wait 4 hours for a digital download.

 

Please forgive me if this has sounded off as a rant, this wasn't my intention, as I'm not a highly educated man I lack a certain eloquence, that readers and reporters here might be used to.

 

(Edit, afterthought

I fear the digital download could harm retail stores, maybe a full game as a disc, then offer the online multiplayer option as a code bought from the respective online store or given in a 'special edition' of the game like nfsmw or battlefield 3 for instance, 'just to meet you halfway')

It's an issue of convenience, really. For some people, it's faster to just drive to the store, buy the game, and head back in 15 minutes or less. If people want to download their games, then they'll have the option to do so. A digital-only model screws over people that want to buy a disc so they don't have to keep the game on their hard drive, have something to give when they want their friends or family members to enjoy the game, and don't have to waste bandwidth on downloading gigabytes of data.

 

I haven't used my Xbox 360 in a long time so I don't know how quickly digital downloads are available. I assume they're available to purchase the day of release. If that's the case, then there's really no point in going digital-only now.

 

What if online retailers can provide full game downloads through a code similar to points?

What's the point of creating an extra step for users? It's much simpler to buy a game and download it immediately. The reason digital distribution platforms still use product keys is because games and other content are offered outside of the platform (e.g. in store, a product code from a developer contest, etc). Consoles are different because you either buy the disc or buy the digital version. There's no need to offer a product key for the game itself unless it's done so as part of a contest. As for DLC and other content (e.g. skins, pre-order bonuses), then yes... there's a need for product keys.

 

As for points, I believe companies are ditching points in favour of local currencies.

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What's the point of creating an extra step for users? It's much simpler to buy a game and download it immediately. The reason digital distribution platforms still use product keys is because games and other content are offered outside of the platform (e.g. in store, a product code from a developer contest, etc). Consoles are different because you either buy the disc or buy the digital version. There's no need to offer a product key for the game itself unless it's done so as part of a contest. As for DLC and other content (e.g. skins, pre-order bonuses), then yes... there's a need for product keys.

 

As for points, I believe companies are ditching points in favour of local currencies.

Me, like many, have used online retailers to get points codes because they're cheaper. If the same was for games, then I'd save myself the money. Creates competition like your mentioning. I doubt full games being available from alternative retailers as downloads though, so it makes this point invalid.

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Posted

1) The cost to produce, for example, one million boxes with DVD copies is minuscule compared to total game developmental costs. So it's a non-issue for any major studio.

 

2) I haven't bought physical copies of games in ages: battle.net, steam.net, and origin.com satisfy all my game purchasing needs.

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1) The cost to produce, for example, one million boxes with DVD copies is minuscule compared to total game developmental costs. So it's a non-issue for any major studio.

You're forgetting that retailers get a 70% cut.  Digital sellers get a 30% cut (on average.)  And that's not counting shipping costs.

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Posted

You're forgetting that retailers get a 70% cut.  Digital sellers get a 30% cut (on average.)  And that's not counting shipping costs.

The point is that there's no reason for a studio to ditch physical media.

 

Obviously, it's best to sell directly to customers and charge full retail prices. That's what Blizzard, for example, is doing.

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Posted

...of digital only titles.

 

I believe one AAA game is going to take the risk of going digital only and have great profits (which is the biggest factor) to start the waterfall effect. Yes, we know digital isn't for everyone right now, and I don't think any publisher is going to take that risk on a huge game anytime soon (2 years time...maybe year 3). What I do think is when it happens, Gamestop would have wished that Microsoft kept the "old" policies of the Xbox One, which actually kept Gamestop and other vendors in the loop for trade in. With both Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo having the ability to download a game without any involvement from Gamestop, it effectively kills their business, unless they do some type of transformation, which I don't even think it's possible.  

 

Yes, physical discs aren't going away any time soon, but this generation will definitely start movement of digital only titles (I believe anyways) for AAA games. All we need to know how is...who's going to take the plunge.

 

What are your thoughts?

There is only one AAA game that would be able to pull it off.

 

And ironically the developer has their own digital distribution store.

 

Im not going to say the game or the developer.

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Posted

What's the benefit of going digital-only?

1) Better for the environment

2) Digital media can't break or get too scratched to use

3) More convenient

4) Major bugs can be patched out and won't affect as many people

5) More money goes to developers

 

I don't think it's a case that physical media should be forced out but there will come a time when it's no longer economically viable. The PC has moved over to DD very quickly and relatively smoothly. Microsoft was trying to do something similar with the X1 but it backed down after the consumer backlash. People forget that Steam was also poorly received to start with but is now widely praised.

 

A totally digital system on consoles wouldn't be anything like the on that exists on PC. There would be zero competition on console marketplaces, so the console makers would be free to charge whatever they pleased and we would have to like it or lump it.

Not necessarily. Regulators have the power to force competition and the EU has a history of opposing abusive business practices. For example, Microsoft and Sony could be forced to support multiple stores and users could be prompted by a digital distribution ballot to select which store they want to use. Microsoft has received a lot of scrutiny from the EU and it couldn't simply eliminate competition like that without consequences.

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Posted

What's the benefit of going digital-only? There will always be people that want to buy a disc for various reasons. Maybe they don't want to waste bandwidth on a game download or want a disc so they could later sell the game or give/lend it to a friend or family member. I'm fairly sure you can download major games from Xbox Live or PSN so forcing everyone to download the game seems unfair.

 

There's the Video game collection/library crowd that would love collect discs. The benefit of going digital-only is to save gas, a bit of time and save space on your shelf. lol. 

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