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Posted

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Xbox One owners won't be able to connect the console's new Kinect sensor to their PCs, but Microsoft will be offering a separately sold model for home computers.

 

The website Ars Technica has received an official statement from Microsoft confirming that the Kinect 2.0 sensor for Xbox One will not work with PCs. The unit uses a specially designed, proprietary connector instead of USB. The company will not be making, as some had hoped, an adapter that allows the unit to plug into a PC's USB port.

 

The company will be releasing separate Kinect hardware for Xbox that will use a USB connector. A Microsoft spokesperson told Ars Technica, "The new generation Kinect for Windows sensor will be a fully tested, licensed, and supported Kinect experience on Windows. Kinect for Xbox One is being built for and tested with the Xbox One."

 

[Source: Ars Technica]

 

 

Source

 

Not surprising considering it has a unique/proprietary connector. Although, I would ask why it couldn't have just been USB 3.0? Surely that would provide enough speed? (Not trolling or hating, a serious question)

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Posted

USB 3.0 can do 5Gbp/s and according to the marketing blurb, the X1 Kinect does 2Gbp/s so that's not a problem. Maybe there's another technical reason behind it? I don't have a clue. Couldn't the first Kinect go to USB?

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Posted

They don't want you to hack it, because I'm pretty sure some authentications are to be made by the camera

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Posted

USB 3.0 can do 5Gbp/s and according to the marketing blurb, the X1 Kinect does 2Gbp/s so that's not a problem. Maybe there's another technical reason behind it? I don't have a clue. Couldn't the first Kinect go to USB?

 

Kinect 1.0 was USB 2.0 with a proprietary plug I believe (however I think it was more just just a different plug though, since it could power Kinect while normal USB 2.0 could not). I think it would be pretty fair to assume Kinect 2.0 is based on USB 3.0 connectivity technology, but uses a proprietary plug and have other hardware tweaks. That is the general gist of it anyway (that I understand, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong). 

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Posted

i doubt it was technical problem that prevent the USB 3.0 usages, its more likely marketing strategy going on.

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Posted

i doubt it was technical problem that prevent the USB 3.0 usages, its more likely marketing strategy going on.

 

It's not marketing nor is it technical, the "issue" is very simple. It's money! Kinect for X1 is subsidised [along with the console itself] (i.e. they are taking a loss on the sale of each one) and if people went out and bought X1s just for the Kinect MS will stand to lose alot of money (since the money is made of software sales + XBL) and I believe making it mandatory for the operation of the console prevents people who don't want Kinect to sell/give it to someone else. Translated: if you want to use Kinect on a PC you have to pay the full price for the privilege. 

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Maybe the X1 Kinect draws more power than USB3 allows.

That would be logical but using logic is hard and it's much easier to jump to conclusions that it's a money grab.

 

MS IS teh devi1!!1!  afterall.

:rolleyes:

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Posted

It's possible it is to draw more power and keep it from being used on machines without that capability, it's also possible it's not USB at all (the port looks similar to Thunderbolt.)

 

It's hard to say without someone doing a proper teardown of the machines innards.

 

The original Kinect just needed an adapter cable to hook to PCs, might be the same here...but who knows.

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Posted

Maybe the X1 Kinect draws more power than USB3 allows.

That would be logical but using logic is hard and it's much easier to jump to conclusions that it's a money grab.

 

MS IS teh devi1!!1!  afterall.

:rolleyes:

 

 

 

 

That is also a reasonable possibility.

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Posted

but that can be easily solved  with external power adapter, i mean my 5 years old scanner & printers just do that, USB cable & power cable, why can't xbox one kinect?

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Posted

Maybe the X1 Kinect draws more power than USB3 allows.

That would be logical but using logic is hard and it's much easier to jump to conclusions that it's a money grab.

 

MS IS teh devi1!!1!  afterall.

:rolleyes:

Aha, simple yet very plausible.

 

Doesn't this Kinect have more on-board chips to help with the processing whereas the 360 one didn't. If so then we probably have a reason. 

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Posted

but that can be easily solved  with external power adapter, i mean my 5 years old scanner & printers just do that, USB cable & power cable, why can't xbox one kinect?

 

You mean have one adapter for the Xbox and one for the Kinect? I doubt people would want to plug in two devices. Makes more sense to have the peripherals draw power from the Xbox itself.

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Posted

It could use an external power adapter, but that would make it more expensive to manufacture and be a mess of cables (X360s original Kinect setup did that and it was annoying, the Slim and past that had a custom port.)

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Posted

Aha, simple yet very plausible.

 

Doesn't this Kinect have more on-board chips to help with the processing whereas the 360 one didn't. If so then we probably have a reason. 

 

 

 

 

the new Kinect uses a 1080p wide-angle time-of-flight camera (in comparison to the VGA resolution of the previous version), and processes 2 gigabits of data per second to read its environment

 

 

So maybe the power theory is entirely the reason.

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Should be interesting. Remember that the originally XBox controller was not compatible with a PC.... well unless you cut the connector off and connected the wire to a USB cable. No reason to spend $50+ for a PC xbox controller when you can make your own for less than $15 and learn something while you are at it. Maybe someone will do something similar with their Kinect.

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Posted

You mean have one adapter for the Xbox and one for the Kinect? I doubt people would want to plug in two devices. Makes more sense to have the peripherals draw power from the Xbox itself.

Its completely possible though, just like composite Video & Audio RCA Jack, you know that yellow, white, red colored jack?

 

just bind the usb cable with one of such cable/jack, hell some of such USB-combo cable already employed by some android tablets.

as i said, its doubtful it was technical problem that prevent xbox one kinect form using USB3.

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Its completely possible though, just like composite Video & Audio RCA Jack, you know that yellow, white, red colored jack?

 

just bind the usb cable with one of such cable/jack, hell some of such USB-combo cable already employed by some android tablets.

as i said, its doubtful it was technical problem that prevent xbox one kinect form using USB3.

Considering there would be a separate line in the cable to pull power, it would simply be a matter of giving that one line an external power source.

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Considering there would be a separate line in the cable to pull power, it would simply be a matter of giving that one line an external power source.

and this 'External Power Source' can be easily place just beside the USB3 port on Xbox One, just need to labeled for kinect.

 

but i guess whoever design xbox one, deliberately skip that possibility.

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Posted

Doing some reading, the old (current?) Kinect used 12 watts. The new Kinect I would imagine is considerably more power hungry so the USB 3, which I read is 4.5 watts, wouldn't suffice.

 

But all of that is irrelevant if it has its own adapter anyway. Or am I missing something?

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Doing some reading, the old (current?) Kinect used 12 watts. The new Kinect I would imagine is considerably more power hungry so the USB 3, which I read is 4.5 watts, wouldn't suffice.

 

But all of that is irrelevant if it has its own adapter anyway. Or am I missing something?

Kinect v1 needed extra adapter on 360 or a special connector on 360S. I think it's power + subsidy on the console model. The "Windows" version also has on going SDK support.

In a nutshell,

1. Power

2. Licensing

 

The v1 Kinect itself used unencrypted connection, I don't see why they would suddenly change that. (i.e. you can buy it with console and use it on a PC).

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Doing some reading, the old (current?) Kinect used 12 watts. The new Kinect I would imagine is considerably more power hungry so the USB 3, which I read is 4.5 watts, wouldn't suffice.

 

But all of that is irrelevant if it has its own adapter anyway. Or am I missing something?

It is a good excuse for having a proprietary adapter but like I was saying, you would only have to cut the cable and give that one line its own 12 watt power source and it should work just fine on a PC. The question is, where are our electrical engineers that will do it first and give us a tutorial :P.

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Posted

I'm sure someone will come along with an adapter to allow us to use the X1 Kinect with a pc. Its just a matter of time.

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I agree with some that this is a combination of power needs and licensing.  That $300 fee for the Kinect for windows early dev program is a bargain if you break it down.  You initially get the beta/dev unit but then you ALSO get the final unit later on.   They're giving you two of them plus the SDK plus direct support from the people who make the damn thing.  That makes the price tag pretty cheap. 

 

Also as far as power goes, I'm betting it uses more than v1.  The cameras are in HD now, but you also have other abilities the v1 didn't, like seeing in the dark, etc.  There's more logic stuffed in there I'm sure, in order to make up for any limits on the Xbox One itself.  Remember the Kinect 2 on the X1 has to do all that without getting in the way of the console itself that's playing a game and doing other tasks to, which again means it probably has extra bits in it to help process all that data.   The windows version coming next year will probably not, since the developers can use more of their PCs CPU/RAM/GPU etc, they're not going to have to balance the Kinect + running some new AAA game at the same time.    This probably means the Kinect 2 for windows units they ship in final form will be smaller even, use less power so that USB3 supports it, and so on.

 

The final part being costs and licensing or however you want to think of it.  No way the new Kinect comes in at just $100 with $300 being for the X1 alone.  Not when the v1 Kinect is sold for $150, so you know MS is taking a hit even at $500 for both.  This means they want to make it up with the software/games not have a chunk of them being bought only for the Kinect and seeing the X1 tossed aside.  

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I agree with some that this is a combination of power needs and licensing.  That $300 fee for the Kinect for windows early dev program is a bargain if you break it down.  You initially get the beta/dev unit but then you ALSO get the final unit later on.   They're giving you two of them plus the SDK plus direct support from the people who make the damn thing.  That makes the price tag pretty cheap. 

 

Also as far as power goes, I'm betting it uses more than v1.  The cameras are in HD now, but you also have other abilities the v1 didn't, like seeing in the dark, etc.  There's more logic stuffed in there I'm sure, in order to make up for any limits on the Xbox One itself.  Remember the Kinect 2 on the X1 has to do all that without getting in the way of the console itself that's playing a game and doing other tasks to, which again means it probably has extra bits in it to help process all that data.   The windows version coming next year will probably not, since the developers can use more of their PCs CPU/RAM/GPU etc, they're not going to have to balance the Kinect + running some new AAA game at the same time.    This probably means the Kinect 2 for windows units they ship in final form will be smaller even, use less power so that USB3 supports it, and so on.

 

The final part being costs and licensing or however you want to think of it.  No way the new Kinect comes in at just $100 with $300 being for the X1 alone.  Not when the v1 Kinect is sold for $150, so you know MS is taking a hit even at $500 for both.  This means they want to make it up with the software/games not have a chunk of them being bought only for the Kinect and seeing the X1 tossed aside.  

 

Actually it probably uses less power than V1.

 

the cameras, RGB or IR aside don't use very much power. what required power on v1 was the motors that are no longer there. 

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Actually it probably uses less power than V1.

 

the cameras, RGB or IR aside don't use very much power. what required power on v1 was the motors that are no longer there. 

 

 

That's a good point, I forgot that they removed the motors. I guess they were able to do that thanks to wider viewing angle of the new Kinect hardware.

 

The lack of motors should mean more reliable hardware that puts out less heat.

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