PGHammer Posted July 4, 2013 Share Posted July 4, 2013 >Implying those against are always religious - false >Implying marriage is a religious institution or construct - false >Implying being homosexual is normal. It might be "naturally occurring" but it's clearly a deviation for the norm. And let's be clear. None of this is about "rights". It's about money and taxation. Exactly - the *plaintiff* in the case that saw Prop 8 struck down stated exactly that. There ARE benefits - in tax law - to marriage (just as there are benefits in other parts of the law). Didn't a similar push - ALSO centered in California - occur involving common-law relationships and cohabitation? (Started in California, and quickly spread to other blue states, and is threatening to turn all of family law upside down in the process.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPreston Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 That is excuse-making (and a lot of my fellow Blacks are JUST as guilty, and use a similar excuse). Bad behavior is bad behavior - don't make excuses for it. Deny straight couples marriage because of the actions of straight people on the Maury show! They need to tone it down or im pulling the plug! And have you seen their festivals ? Why a friend of mine Hank Hill was telling me about the time he and his mother were trapped in the same town as one! Women flashing everywhere! And the men were completely drunk! Imagine if his children were with him! Clearly these straight people are not ready for marriage! derp! ClassicTrekker 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogurtmaster Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 When a group of people are oppressed as much as homosexuals still are in America sometimes you have to do that to get your point across. Once they have those rights then things will return to normal. Europe isn't all that homophobic any more so sometimes it's hard for us to appreciate how bad it can be but I certainly wouldn't want to be a gay person in the states if I lived outside of New York. Things are changing though, soon you'll be able to go back to your bubble they will be able to go back to theirs and it won't be an issue any more but social progression always takes time. I am a white male and I can't get a grant for my business because I am a white male. There are times that everyone is being discriminated against. Nothing new there. Am I happy about it? No, but I am dealing with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rev Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 People who regularly spit on the institution of marriage should be complaining about how gay marriage is "destroying their institution" ... As if straight people's adultery, spousal abuse, marriages of convenience, work related marriages, divorces, and Hollywood marriages haven't already done the deed. There is no sanctity left to marriage, not in a majority of cases... People need to just let this go... There are more important things that are wrong with society than who's allowed to have a piece of legal paper. ClassicTrekker 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogurtmaster Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 People who regularly spit on the institution of marriage should be complaining about how gay marriage is "destroying their institution" ... As if straight people's adultery, spousal abuse, marriages of convenience, work related marriages, divorces, and Hollywood marriages haven't already done the deed. There is no sanctity left to marriage, not in a majority of cases... People need to just let this go... There are more important things that are wrong with society than who's allowed to have a piece of legal paper. There are some people that are not happy that Marriage has been watered down, straight or not. Some people that Marriage is a device that has been designed from God himself and getting a divorce when people feel like it without no justification except "I made a mistake", isn't really good enough. The fact that marriage is like this, is a symptom of a sick society and a society that is already starting to fall apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPreston Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 There are some people that are not happy that Marriage has been watered down, straight or not. Some people that Marriage is a device that has been designed from God himself and getting a divorce when people feel like it without no justification except "I made a mistake", isn't really good enough. The fact that marriage is like this, is a symptom of a sick society and a society that is already starting to fall apart. Good for them, Congress on the other hand shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. Regardless allowing gay people to get married is tiny compared to this On display every day on American TV, But those gays are destroyin marriage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisj1968 Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Stop. Just stop. I have nothing against gays nor them marrying each other but this day-to-day propaganda about it is really getting too much already. Yay! You got your rights. Now shut the hell up already and go get married. People who are opposed to it have different views on things, big deal, live with it, not everyone is like you or as tolerant as you. I'm sorry if I offend someone by saying this but this is how I feel about it. +1. they got what they wanted. fine. don't try to shove it down our throats. this quote says it all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Showan Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 That's not what it says actually. If you properly translate what it says you get that for a man to lay with another men (= human being) instead of his own, so if he were to commit adultery. In general what the bible speaks of does in no way imply that homosexuality is abnormal nor does it say it is sinful anywhere. It is the 'modern' interpretation of it that makes that claim. If you translate what is written to the time it was written in it has a completely different meaning. In the time the Bible was written it was quite normal for humans to have sexual relations of the same sex. It was also normal for older men to marry and have sex with girls around 12-13. Does that mean that people in those days were paedophiles? I'd be careful what you quote from the Bible... GOD also says that his words hold true to the end of time... What was said then does NOT change for today's time... Now people want to keep church and state separate... Ok... But GOD ordained marriage so marriage would count as Church and not state... Government has taken it over as a way of keeping tabs on people (a census per se...).... http://www.bible.ca/ef/topical-what-the-bible-says-about-marriage.htm I'm no ones judge... But be careful of the waters you stir up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogurtmaster Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Good for them, Congress on the other hand shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. Regardless allowing gay people to get married is tiny compared to this On display every day on American TV, But those gays are destroyin marriage! All of it is destroying marriage. The video you posted including. First marriage and then the family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaDude Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Wanna hear something funny? When my father went to church the other day (a Catholic Church, that is), the priest brought up the topic of gay marriage in his sermon. He said he knows two gay people who are good, successful people. He knew them for many years and they've been such good friends. The gay couple have kids and they are good kids, according to the priest. Well, the priest said that because of him knowing this gay couple for so many years and being such good friends with them, he cannot oppose gay marriage nor say that anything is wrong with being gay. He said that it's a mystery on how people become gay and therefore, we need to be more understanding about it. Very interesting because this is the first Catholic priest I've ever seen that didn't oppose gay marriage. I wonder if he'll get into any trouble for what he said since the Catholic Church is supposed to be strongly against it. But I have to say, he does have a point. I'm not gay, so I don't know what gay people go through. So, I do agree that we need to be more understanding. As a straight guy, I can't help but get attracted to women. To be honest, I wish I didn't because it drives me crazy sometimes, lol. So, I'm sure gay people go through the same thing. They have an attraction towards the same sex that they can't help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soniqstylz Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 What's funny is California voted for Obama, yet... Prop 8 passed? Explain that. Actually, the black community (in general) is fairly socially conservative, especially when it comes to homosexuality. Obama didn't even publicly get behind gay marriage until a few months ago. Also, there was a ######-ton of money that came in from Utah Mormons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soniqstylz Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 That's not what it says actually. If you properly translate what it says you get that for a man to lay with another men (= human being) instead of his own, so if he were to commit adultery. In general what the bible speaks of does in no way imply that homosexuality is abnormal nor does it say it is sinful anywhere. It is the 'modern' interpretation of it that makes that claim. If you translate what is written to the time it was written in it has a completely different meaning. In the time the Bible was written it was quite normal for humans to have sexual relations of the same sex. It was also normal for older men to marry and have sex with girls around 12-13. Does that mean that people in those days were paedophiles? 1) True enough -- there are many scholars who are looking at the translation from the aspect of the patriarchal society: to treat a man as you would treat a woman, to put him under you and dehumanize him so as to play the proverbial incubus -- that was the issue. Women were property, and to treat a fellow man like property was the abomination. 2) It was fairly common for 12 - 13 year old girls to be having sex and be married really only a couple hundred years ago. They weren't going to school, they weren't being taught to read or run a business or learn a trade. They were there to bear children. "Old enough to bleed", and such. Which brings me to 3) Pretty much all of this is set up by random ebb and flow of societal norms, many of which in this country were set up by puritanical ######. The Catholic Church actually has written down rights of same sex marriages that were performed in Europe as late as the 14th Century. Polygamy, which is given the ol' okay in the Bible was made illegal in the US because it is "something only the savages do". Basically, ###### the Puritans, who wouldn't even celebrate Christmas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClassicTrekker Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Good for them, Congress on the other hand shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. Regardless allowing gay people to get married is tiny compared to this On display every day on American TV, But those gays are destroyin marriage! My f-I-l (father-in-law) once asked me why I watch shows like Maury, and The Steve Wilkos Show. I said, "Simple, Dad. They remind me that there are people in this country, who are DUMBER, and MORE IRRESPONSIBLE than ME!!" I mean, I'm not the brightest, most responsible person on the planet by any stretch of the imagination...but, I've been married to the same woman for 18-1/2 years. never cheated on that woman (thus, don't have multiple women calling me their baby daddy). never hit my wife... So, next to the idiots on shows like Maury, and Steve Wilkos, I'm a freaking GENIUS!! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torolol Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 people who have a problem with homosexuality because its unnatural obviously cant see half of the wildlife that humps the same sex ...being gay is just natural selection... also its good for those children who need to be adopted.... (against two men having a child together in a lab though ) but they can still adopt and make good parents :D (or one can be the bio dad i guess) except in natural 'gay' life, theres no adoption policy, they simpy perish without offspring, except for those which bi. Original Poster 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadEndAccount Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Prop 8 was bankrolled by the Mormons and conservative evangelicals. It's ironic the Mormons' involvement given that their preferred form of marriage (polygyny) is illegal, so they too have suffered discrimination on marriage issues. Prop 8 had 52% of the vote in 2008. Now the feeling in California is 58% in favour of gay marriage. People are changing their views fast. Bitter old people are dying off in droves and young people are demanding tolerance. It isn't surprising given for years that Mormons have been changing their practices to make themselves more acceptable to mainline Christianity - polygamy was the first to go even though Joseph Smith and all the founders/first converts also practiced it. If they can change things so quickly on something that seemed to be foundational to the religion then why not change their position regarding homosexuality? Regarding the change in opinion - maybe the masses realised that letting a small noisy minority decide at the boot on what can/cannot happen isn't a good thing for democracy but then again the whole idea of a binding referendum is stupid to begin with or if it must exist then the threshold should be very high such as 90% voter participation with an over welcoming majority (75% or more) achieved at voting time. 4CxbqFxVnstmA 1 Share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandor Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Yeah because if your partner has a medical issue while your traveling outside states where your marriage is regonised you can totally make medical decisions based on your "just friends" relationship What is it with fiscal conservatives ? Would you sell out the civil rights act if it would save you a few bucks on your taxes ? I'm neither American and I doubt I'm a "fiscal conservative". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Original Poster Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 except in natural 'gay' life, theres no adoption policy, they simpy perish without offspring, except for those which bi. not true ;D animals can adopt... they do it all the time... sooooo yup :) FAIL good bye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Audioboxer Subscriber² Posted July 9, 2013 Subscriber² Share Posted July 9, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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