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Vegan Sellout List outs, shames vegan 'traitors'

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#16 thomastmc

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 04:35

Maybe cult mightn't be the exact term I would use to describe it, but attacking and shaming apostates is usually a feature of cults, so it kind of fits.

 

It's like describing Republicans as a cult, or Democrats, or health nuts, or tech geeks (eh hmm, enthusiasts). It's a frivolous characterization, like calling any one who's strict a "Nazi", except no one actually believes that person might be an actual Nazi in those cases.

 

It's usually a feature of a cult to be religious in nature as well, and in a cult, most of the members are all on the same page. There's a group mindset in cults that causes members to lose their individuality and give over their free will in all aspects of their life to the doctrine of the group.

 

This list was made by vegan extremists. I don't think this is some sort of mainstream Vegan agenda that most vegans are on board with, or even know about.

 

Edit -> By the way, I'm not vegan. I'm actually about to make a hamburger in a little bit to have with dinner. So, I'm not privy to their secret meetings on how to shame us disgusting and immoral flesh eaters into giving our lives to Veganism :).


Edited by thomastmc, 02 July 2013 - 04:52.



#17 Torolol

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 05:01

I have two friends who stopped being vegans, both said to me that they was vegans, but not anymore.



#18 Bamsebjørn

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 05:30

I don't think that eating eggs and drinking milk contributes to the suffering of animals. I cut back on meat a lot already, I use about 1/4th of what I used to eat, almost no beef and no more chicken. I'm waiting for the moment when we can buy 'grown' meat. Animals deserve better. But like anyone said, we're born as carnivores, we have the urge to eat meat. We claim to be evolved and superior beings, but we humans are just animals, really.



#19 vetsanctified

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:18

It seems no one knows what a "cult" is...

 

The only problem I have with this is that people become vegans for different reasons, not necessarily just because they are jumping on the trendy bandwagon.

 

On the other hand, I do like the idea of exposing hypocrites and those who do just jump on a bandwagon and proselytize something fervently and then lose interest after a while and move on.

 

This is hardly hypocrisy. Anybody have the right to change their mind if they deem reasonable. If you dont change your mind despite your own evidence then what's on your mind is something closer to dogma, ergo cultism.



#20 thomastmc

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:33

This is hardly hypocrisy. Anybody have the right to change their mind if they deem reasonable. If you dont change your mind despite your own evidence then what's on your mind is something closer to dogma, ergo cultism.

 

I did acknowledge that... Maybe you missed this:

 

 

The only problem I have with this is that people become vegans for different reasons, not necessarily just because they are jumping on the trendy bandwagon.

 

 

A lot of people do become vegans just because it's popular, and they tell all of their friends, and they act holier than thou, and constantly use any mention of food to preach their vegan philosophy like it's the bible. Then, a year later, they're eating a steak, and are on some different kick. People do that with a lot of things. I do like the idea of those people being made to feel guilty for it, and hopefully they'll stop. I must be part of some other cult that enjoys humbleness, modesty, and consistency.

 

Do you consider Republicans and Democrats to be cults, or health nuts, or tech geeks, or race car fans, or football fans, or yoga lovers, etc.?

 

You do realize that this list isn't something that all of the vegans got together and decided to do, right? 



#21 vetsanctified

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:48

I did acknowledge that... Maybe you missed this:

 

 

A lot of people do become vegans just because it's popular, and they tell all of their friends, and they act holier than thou, and constantly use any mention of food to preach their vegan philosophy like it's the bible. Then, a year later, they're eating a steak, and are on some different kick. People do that with a lot of things. I do like the idea of those people being made to feel guilty for it, and hopefully they'll stop. I must be part of some other cult that enjoys humbleness, modesty, and consistency.

 

Do you consider Republicans and Democrats to be cults, or health nuts, or tech geeks, or race car fans, or football fans, or yoga lovers, etc.?

 

You do realize that this list isn't something that all of the vegans got together and decided to do, right? 

 

Any extremist group that dogmatically follows ideology is a cult. You are wrong to assume however that anyone who adheres to a set-of-principles system is, automatically, dogmatically following it.

 

An example: Not all Christians display signs of cultism mentality, however Fundamentalists do.



#22 thomastmc

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 06:53

Any extremist group that dogmatically follows ideology is a cult. You are wrong to assume however that anyone who adheres to a set-of-principles system is, automatically, dogmatically following it.

 

An example: Not all Christians display signs of cultism mentality, however Fundamentalists do.

 

Are you assuming that all vegans are an extremist group of people? 

 

Again, do you consider the Republicans and Democrats, or the Libertarians, etc. to be cults?

 

Exactly how have I assumed that anyone who adhere's to a set-of-principles system is automatically, dogmatically following it? (Because, I do disagree with that concept).


Edited by thomastmc, 02 July 2013 - 07:02.


#23 vetsanctified

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:02

Are you assuming that all vegans are an extremist group of people? 

 

Again, do you consider the Republicans and Democrats, or the Libertarians, etc. to be cults?

 

Exactly how have I assumed that anyone who adhere's to a set-of-principles system is automatically, dogmatically following it?

 

No, if you check my posts I NEVER said that vegans are extremist. I dont know why you're so defensive about it.

 

I just said that these specific vegans that posted this list are showing clearly signs of dogmatism.

 

I think I was quite clear with my example, but allow me to simplify my stance: Not all Reps, Dems, Libs, etc are dogmatic. Just the extremist ones.



#24 thomastmc

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 07:41

No, if you check my posts I NEVER said that vegans are extremist. I dont know why you're so defensive about it.

 

I just said that these specific vegans that posted this list are showing clearly signs of dogmatism.

 

I think I was quite clear with my example, but allow me to simplify my stance: Not all Reps, Dems, Libs, etc are dogmatic. Just the extremist ones.

 

If you read the prior comments about veganism in general being a cult, and the chronological context of your post with similar generalized references of it as a cult, it was seemingly apparent that you were using cult in the same context as the posts that came before your own. You might see that it was not odd for me to draw that conclusion, but I wasn't sure, which is why I asked. I wasn't being defensive, I was simply seeking clarification.

 

I also thought this because you disagreed with me. My comment was in that context, stating that veganism in general is in no way a cult. I'd assume you'd agree with that. This small group may very well be a cult, but there are no real indications of that except speculation and weak inference...

 

Dogmatism is not a sure sign of a cult. Cults do require dogmatism, but not everyone who's dogmatic is in a cult. Almost all professional basketball players are very tall, but just because someone is tall doesn't mean that they are a basketball player.

 

I assume you're not saying that all extremist Republicans, Democrats, etc. belong to a cult? 

 

A Primer on Cults and Ideologically Extremist Groups

 

This primer explores the question "What is a cult?" and attempts to explain some of these behaviors that may often seem incomprehensible.

 

What are cults, and how do they work? A useful definition of a cult builds on the work of Lifton, Singer, Arendt and others and encompasses the following five points:

 

• The group is led by a charismatic and authoritarian leader

• It has a closed, steeply hierarchical inner structure

• The group adheres to an exclusive or total belief system

• Processes of coercive persuasion (or brainwashing) are used to retain followers

• Followers are exploited 

 

The inner structure of a cult is closed, and steeply hierarchical. At the top sits the leader whose every whim must be obeyed. Followers must renounce ties to outsiders - unless they can be recruited or used in some way. Yet within the group itself, belying the stereotype of close "community" that exists within cults, followers are, in important ways, isolated from each other, allowed to communicate only within the narrow confines of the group's belief system.

 

http://blog.lib.umn....ist-groups.html

 



#25 vetsanctified

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:00

I assume you're not saying that all extremist Republicans, Democrats, etc. belong to a cult? 

 

No, at least not in our generally conceived way.



#26 thomastmc

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 08:05

No, at least not in our generally conceived way.

 

That's why I'm being as specific as possible, to avoid any misunderstanding.



#27 Javik

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 13:08

Groups like the ALF (animal liberation front) in the UK have been known to send mail bombs to people work in animal testing and meat production facilities. Some of them are extremely dangerous people.



#28 compl3x

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 13:16

It's like describing Republicans as a cult, or Democrats, or health nuts, or tech geeks (eh hmm, enthusiasts). It's a frivolous characterization, like calling any one who's strict a "Nazi", except no one actually believes that person might be an actual Nazi in those cases.

 

It's usually a feature of a cult to be religious in nature as well, and in a cult, most of the members are all on the same page. There's a group mindset in cults that causes members to lose their individuality and give over their free will in all aspects of their life to the doctrine of the group.

 

This list was made by vegan extremists. I don't think this is some sort of mainstream Vegan agenda that most vegans are on board with, or even know about.

 

 

 

Well cults aren't mainstream, so that perfectly why these particular vegans are displaying cult-like behaviours. As I said, I wouldn't use the word cult, I don't want the word to be diluted to the point anyone with extreme ideas is part of a cult, but I can see parallels there.



#29 +MikeChipshop

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 13:19

"Shame" them?

 

Not being funny but if i was once a vegan and i changed my mind, i wouldn't be ashamed of it.



#30 +timster

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 13:19

Sounds like a winner, but tonight we had a 6 lb rib roast w/mushroom gravy & roasted red potatoes, onions and carrots. I'll pick up some steaks tomorrow - and fix 'em nice & bloody ;)

your snack sounds a whole lot better than their tofurkey and organic salad