54 posts in this topic

Posted

This isn't about the console "lifecycle" (10 years?  OMG XBOX 2 will be out then!!1!!).  It's about how the hardware itself has been designed to "survive" being powered on for 10 years.

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Posted

If that was directed at me, I know what the topic is about. I was chiming in to the previous comment that brought up XB1/MP servers.

 

I'm honestly not bothered about the hardware durability as I'll be turning it off from the wall if there is no option via the dash to turn off low powered states. And both the PS4/X1 will both have hardware issues. Doesn't matter how much they test, it'll always happen.

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Posted

I love how certain people can't find a negative spin on this so they go completely off-topic to make the thread a flame war. Immature beyond belief.

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Posted

Don't believe you. If you threw it away solely based on how "old" the graphics were, you would have thrown it away the day it came out as it was already years behind PC graphics. Try again.

I only played two PC games; COD: MW and AA.

Why else would I throw away an xbox? I bought the 360 in 2009.

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Posted

I only played two PC games; COD: MW and AA.

Why else would I throw away an xbox? I bought the 360 in 2009.

Which are games that look better on the PC the day they came out so your statement suggesting your sole reason for throwing it away was due to old graphics couldn't be true. The console launched in 2005 and had old graphics on it the day it launched so if you actually based your decisions solely on graphics, you would have never bought it in the first place, let alone throw it away.

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Posted

This article has nothing to do with connecting to servers or "talking to the mother ship" though.  Where are you getting all that from?  This is about how long the physical box can last turned on.

 

But to entertain your thought - if MS implemented a server connection requirement, why would the assumption be that they would end communication between X1's and the servers just because they're pushing out a new Xbox.  That doesn't make sense.  And if they did plan on that, they would most certainly release an update to remove the requirement, or be slapped by a rather large class action.

once again..... I know this is about the life of the hardware.... if you read what I wrote last, I said if you bought it at the end of the time period that MS was selling it, aka like the 360 is now... would you still be able to use it in that 10 year life cycle period they are estimating... aka would MS still give you the rights connect your system to their network after this period to make any good use of it... MS has no commented on this yet... if their system wants to pull information or anything else back from a sever its expecting to see (I am not saying always on per say, just expecting to see a server to log in or use some of the features of it that require it) how would it react

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Posted

Honestly who ever keeps a console for 10 years? I'm sure the next XBox that comes out in 2017 will be 10x more powerful than this one and everyone will rush out and replace their existing boxes.

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Posted

Honestly who ever keeps a console for 10 years? I'm sure the next XBox that comes out in 2017 will be 10x more powerful than this one and everyone will rush out and replace their existing boxes.

I still have an Atari 2600, SNES, Genesis, N64, XBOX, 360, Wii, Wii u, Gameboy original, Gameboy color, TI 99/A4... so who keeps a console for 10yrs?.... some of us do and like playing old games too

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Posted

Companies closing down some specific games MP servers are one thing but MS closing off XBL to, say, the XB1 when the next gen comes?  I don't see why they would, if anything they've been expanding XBL to support not just the Xbox console but the PC and the phone now.   I honestly don't see them closing the service off to older systems, now if some third party publisher like EA wants to stop supporting their games MP or online elements that's a different subject.

 

So far it looks like the 360 will keep connecting and using XBL like it always has been even when the XB1 has been out for a while.   Heck we're even getting yet another update to the 360 that's already in testing, so I think this worry that 10 years later the XB1 won't be able to access and using XBL service the same for some odd reason just won't be the case.

 

And even for things like a specific game, running a MP specific server and closing that is one thing but like what Forza is doing with cloud supported AI shouldn't be a issue.  The model MS has, from what I remember reading, is not the one people think of when they hear about MP servers being shutdown.  Since they're running these cloud tasks on Azure and probably in VMs and, iirc, charging the developers by how much compute time is used and not server instance, then you can leave, for example, the forza AI bit set and it'll just spin up and run when needed and then turn off, there's no specific server being rented out 24/7 365 by the developer which adds to costs regardless of how many people play the game.   Respawn talked about this specifically and how MS' model has made it practical for developers to finally use the cloud more.

 

So as far as some game using the cloud for a few things like AI, then I don't see why the developer would even worry about it much if they leave the task up to run when needed by a few people.     If that isn't there anymore though then they'll just default to the same old local processing of AI and so on that we've had till this point, you'll still play your game fine though.

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Posted

once again..... I know this is about the life of the hardware.... if you read what I wrote last, I said if you bought it at the end of the time period that MS was selling it, aka like the 360 is now... would you still be able to use it in that 10 year life cycle period they are estimating... aka would MS still give you the rights connect your system to their network after this period to make any good use of it... MS has no commented on this yet... if their system wants to pull information or anything else back from a sever its expecting to see (I am not saying always on per say, just expecting to see a server to log in or use some of the features of it that require it) how would it react

 

Well, they're still letting you connect to servers with the 360, so that should allay your fears.  Not really sure what makes you think they'd just block access to one console because they're putting another one out.

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Posted

Honestly who ever keeps a console for 10 years? I'm sure the next XBox that comes out in 2017 will be 10x more powerful than this one and everyone will rush out and replace their existing boxes.

 

I do. I still own every single console/game I've bought :ermm:  You do realise that the 360 and PS3 are fast approaching 10 years right? Are you saying that still owning a 360 today is somehow odd or uncommon?

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Posted

Companies closing down some specific games MP servers are one thing but MS closing off XBL to, say, the XB1 when the next gen comes?  I don't see why they would, if anything they've been expanding XBL to support not just the Xbox console but the PC and the phone now.   I honestly don't see them closing the service off to older systems, now if some third party publisher like EA wants to stop supporting their games MP or online elements that's a different subject.

 

So far it looks like the 360 will keep connecting and using XBL like it always has been even when the XB1 has been out for a while.   Heck we're even getting yet another update to the 360 that's already in testing, so I think this worry that 10 years later the XB1 won't be able to access and using XBL service the same for some odd reason just won't be the case.

 

And even for things like a specific game, running a MP specific server and closing that is one thing but like what Forza is doing with cloud supported AI shouldn't be a issue.  The model MS has, from what I remember reading, is not the one people think of when they hear about MP servers being shutdown.  Since they're running these cloud tasks on Azure and probably in VMs and, iirc, charging the developers by how much compute time is used and not server instance, then you can leave, for example, the forza AI bit set and it'll just spin up and run when needed and then turn off, there's no specific server being rented out 24/7 365 by the developer which adds to costs regardless of how many people play the game.   Respawn talked about this specifically and how MS' model has made it practical for developers to finally use the cloud more.

 

So as far as some game using the cloud for a few things like AI, then I don't see why the developer would even worry about it much if they leave the task up to run when needed by a few people.     If that isn't there anymore though then they'll just default to the same old local processing of AI and so on that we've had till this point, you'll still play your game fine though.

 

Well I'm only going from what they've done in the past. The OG Xbox is definitely a special case and I can see why Microsoft would want to close XBL 1.0 for it. If they're smart they've left some room for 360 to still grow beyond the release of X1, and although it won't get all the new features, hopefully there will still be some support to keep it alive. But for all we know Microsoft will want to retire those servers and free up their resources to fuel X1s growth. It all comes down to cost to them and what activity there is to justify running them.

 

AFAIK the new 360 dash won't actually add any new features? I know the beta notes revealed they'd removed WLM but I don't think that means they'll add Skype to replace it? Although the console is perfectly capable of using the service considering we have both the 360 Vision & Kinect for video/voice calls. Most of the update is to create parity across their devices from what I've read.

 

The reason I wouldn't doubt Turn 10 shutting servers down is they've already shut Forza 2's Auction House down a few months ago completely blocking people from 1) using it obviously and 2) blocking achievements.

 

Like I said in the Forza topic though, I'd be more worried that Local AI won't receive as much attention during development because the Cloud AI will act as a crutch to them. I hope that's not the case though. As long as AI never gets worse than what we have now then I'm fine :)

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Posted

10-Year always-on life time expectancy is pretty good for modern electronics. What is the warranty cover?

 

Also the Xbox One should continue to operate after Microsoft releases the next version of Xbox after it, If Microsoft had its original restrictive DRM policies then Microsoft shutting down the servers would have effectively made it an expensive brick. But with Microsoft reversing DRM restrictions and no longer requiring internet connectivity then the Xbox One will now work the same way as any other console you have bought in previous generations.

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Posted

I don't get the argument for "turning the servers off". The whole platform is powered by Azure which is used by 50% of the financial fifty and one of few billion revenue makers at MS. The whole market will shift to this in 10 years. It isn't going anywhere.

 

There isn't a server A or a server B for powering something. It deploys applications on the fly with a brand new virtual instance. The whole platform would have to be shut down.

 

Also, regarding the consoles heat and powered lifetime, this was a given due to what happened on 360 launch.

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Posted

It's good to know it'll be engineered to last that long, but considering rising electricity costs, i'd rather not have it on 24/7.

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Posted

I see on sites like Ars that one of the components most likely to fail is the hard disk. I wonder if the custom designed hard disk that the XB1 uses is designed with a 10 year lifespan in mind...

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Posted

Good to hear. Hope it doesn't mind being turned off-off though. Not a fan of leaving electronics in any kind of standby mode.

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Posted

I see on sites like Ars that one of the components most likely to fail is the hard disk. I wonder if the custom designed hard disk that the XB1 uses is designed with a 10 year lifespan in mind...

 

 

Depends on what's "custom" about it?  I'm thinking it might be a hybrid with a good chunk of NAND flash which keeps the rest of it from not spinning much if at all. 

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Posted

Always on for 10yrs does not necessarily mean, fully powered on and HDD spinning for all day and night.

That would be a BEAR on people's electric bills.

Just a super lower power instance, that borderlines on being completely off, but just enough juice to hear "Xbox On"...

Will game updates that happen during down time be "optional"?..

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Posted

Just thought, my original Xbox is 7 years old and still going strong (I'm as surprised as the rest of you!) it's been retired to the office and a quieter model is in it's place in the living room.

 

Obviously it's not been on that whole time but still good to know.

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Posted

Just thought, my original Xbox is 7 years old and still going strong (I'm as surprised as the rest of you!) it's been retired to the office and a quieter model is in it's place in the living room.

 

Obviously it's not been on that whole time but still good to know.

Im at the 7yr stage with my Xbox aswell, and yip its still going strong!

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Posted

Which are games that look better on the PC the day they came out so your statement suggesting your sole reason for throwing it away was due to old graphics couldn't be true. The console launched in 2005 and had old graphics on it the day it launched so if you actually based your decisions solely on graphics, you would have never bought it in the first place, let alone throw it away.

 

Guess you're completely right on correcting me on my actions of why I threw my xbox away! /s

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Posted

Guess you're completely right on correcting me on my actions of why I threw my xbox away! /s

? Not sure how? I am just trying to understand why you would throw away a device since it wasn't because of the graphics being out dated since it was never not out dated from its very conception.

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