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Killer Instinct to run 720p 60FPS

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Posted

We recently got a chance to interview lead producer Michael Willette and design director David Verfaillie from Double Helix Games. Double Helix are developing Killer Instinct which is a launch title for the Xbox One and will be running at a slick 60 frames per seconds.

On being asked how difficult or easy it was to run the game at 60 FPS at 1080p, the duo replied:

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I wouldn't be surprised. Titanfall is another game that will run at 60fps and the developers won't commit to 1080p - in fact they've stated that the framerate is more important, so it will likely end up somewhere between 720p and 1080p. Other games at 1080p will be sticking to 30fps. Foza is the exception rather than the rule. The next generation of consoles really aren't all that powerful and are way behind top-end PCs.

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Maybe it's native 720p textures/assets but upscaled to 1080p?   I don't think the majority of gamers actually notice the difference between 720p and 1080p but they will notice a frame rate drop so I can understand the developers trying to get a constant 60fps down to start.  I have no doubt that later titles will see 1080p@60fps as a constant though but it's early days yet and no new consoles launch titles are that much of a step up from the older ones at the time.

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Maybe it's native 720p textures/assets but upscaled to 1080p? I don't think the majority of gamers actually notice the difference between 720p and 1080p but they will notice a frame rate drop so I can understand the developers trying to get a constant 60fps down to start. I have no doubt that later titles will see 1080p@60fps as a constant though but it's early days yet and no new consoles launch titles are that much of a step up from the older ones at the time.

I think maintaining 1080p 60fps, Will be a case by case scenario... Even for future games.

I think first party will try their hardest to hit the mark, but some of the 3rd party developers out their are just gonna settle either on 1080p/30fps or 720p/60fps... Or even 720/30...

Just hope it's 768 at least.

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Posted

This is kinda sad. It's not like there's much happening on screen anyway. If they can't render 2 characters and a background in 1080p, I don't have much hope for more graphically intensive games.

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Posted

This is actually true. One of the developers confirmed 60 FPS on 720p last night on twitter. The Double Helix forums blew up because of it. I think it makes sense, it's the beginning of a new generation, no one has enough time to get the best out of the console. These are the launch window games. It'll be fine. Game still looks great.

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Posted

This is actually true. One of the developers confirmed 60 FPS on 720p last night on twitter. The Double Helix forums blew up because of it. I think it makes sense, it's the beginning of a new generation, no one has enough time to get the best out of the console. These are the launch window games. It'll be fine. Game still looks great.

Darn! Do you have a source for the developer confirmation?

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Posted

This is kinda sad. It's not like there's much happening on screen anyway. If they can't render 2 characters and a background in 1080p, I don't have much hope for more graphically intensive games.

Exactly. At least with the X360 the target was 720p @ 30fps and while some games dropped the resolution to up the framerate (Call Of Duty) or handle larger game worlds (GTAIV) there was a clear standard. Now we're looking at games with significantly different resolutions and framerates. I mean, at a pixel level 1080p is more than twice the resolution of 720p and that does make a difference. It won't be long before 4KTVs are standard and 720p gaming just won't cut it.

 

This is the first time that PC gaming has had such a definitive lead over a new generation of consoles, with high-end PCs already able to run games at 1600p @60fps. It won't be long before PCs can comfortably handle 4K @ 60-120fps with much higher graphical fidelity. In fact I think it's likely that by the end of this upcoming generation most tablets will easily outpower them.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if this is that last generation of consoles in their traditional sense. More likely is we'll see a move to an open platform like Android where more powerful devices will run games better but without needing the technical knowledge that accompanies PC gaming. Neither Microsoft or Sony make profits from their console brands so at some point something has to change.

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Posted

This new generation hasn't even started yet and news like this is showing it's already lined up to disappoint right out of the gate.

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Posted

This is kinda sad. It's not like there's much happening on screen anyway. If they can't render 2 characters and a background in 1080p, I don't have much hope for more graphically intensive games.

Fighting games while there isn't a log on the screen. Have very high poly characters, which doesn't sound like a big issue until you understand a few other things. These characters have a LOT of soft body dynamics and transformation and deformation, on a very high res skin.

All the deformation and soft transformation is a lot more intensive on the god than pushing any number of static polys on a race car.

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Posted

That said I do believe they have enough power in the console to do this game and better at 1080p60 fluidly. But they may need more time and more mature api's

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Posted

I found this part interesting:

 

 

We also asked their thoughts on Microsoft

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Posted

Of course. Only the extremely gullible thought the cloud would do that.

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Posted

I found this part interesting:

 

Essentially they think it good for Data Mining and for social functionality.  Nothing that actually increases the games performance or play ability.

 

 

Sounds like to me that they are saying they like getting usage data to confirm if their game design choices are working.  For a fighting game, this data would be very useful to help them craft balancing updates, etc.

 

But of course, its easier to just pan this as something not useful.

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Posted

Sounds like to me that they are saying they like getting usage data to confirm if their game design choices are working.  For a fighting game, this data would be very useful to help them craft balancing updates, etc.

 

But of course, its easier to just pan this as something not useful.

It is just Data Mining.   It is the same as pulling back computer specs so that Game Developers know what kind of hardware their players are running.  Yes it is useful in that it allows an easy way to pull back and store data without being intrusive.. it isn't directly affecting the game as it runs.  It allows for patches and such to be made.. based on the data pulled back.

However you won't see the game change without direct code changes (patches).  The cloud has a lot to offer.. but I feel that many people are misinformed or are expecting things you just won't see off the bat.

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Posted

one developer isn't using the cloud to enhance the game or offload other tasks to free more resources for graphics.

 

conclusion: all the other devs who are offloading other tasks or using the cloud to increas playability are wrong and the cloud is useless for anything but data mining.

 

it's like the fricken moon hoax thread.

 

either way, if you want to discuss the cloud capabilities of the xbox one, I'm sure there's another thread you can bring that up instead of here. 

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It is just Data Mining.   It is the same as pulling back computer specs so that Game Developers know what kind of hardware their players are running.  Yes it is useful in that it allows an easy way to pull back and store data without being intrusive.. it isn't directly affecting the game as it runs.  It allows for patches and such to be made.. based on the data pulled back.

However you won't see the game change without direct code changes (patches).  The cloud has a lot to offer.. but I feel that many people are misinformed or are expecting things you just won't see off the bat.

 

 

And I never said it did.

 

 

I'm not sure why people go out of their way to make this about how 'the cloud' is over hyped.  Its something that has been done in the past and they will be doing it now, leveraging the server platform from MS.  I get it that you guys are quick to try and shut down those that do indeed make crazy claims.  But where is that here?  They told us how they are using MS' server infrastructure.  I didn't see them claim it was revolutionary or that it meant better game performance. 

 

Anyway, as I said, the data they get could be useful to patching efforts and a fighting game needs a team that can quickly roll out changes as needed. Rebalancing is a big deal in the fighting game community.

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Posted

Exactly. At least with the X360 the target was 720p @ 30fps and while some games dropped the resolution to up the framerate (Call Of Duty) or handle larger game worlds (GTAIV) there was a clear standard.

 

When you consider the big titles only i think there was more games running at under 720p than games running at 720p.

 

I know Gears was not 720p but 540p think.

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Posted

Nice to see some developers understand the value of temporal resolution. 720p is a decent level of spatial detail, 30fps is not a decent level of fluidity, however used to it console gamers might be. That said, it's just a matter of time before 1080p 60fps becomes the norm on the next-gen consoles, there's enough power there to do it I'm pretty confident. The problem with the early launch titles is that their engines aren't built from the ground up to take best advantage of the console hardware, just give them a few years.

 

Personally I'd rather see console developers prioritize 1080p60fps over particle count and fancy visual effects, but if they feel they have to choose to sacrifice framerate or resolution I'm glad to see many choose resolution.

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Posted

one developer isn't using the cloud to enhance the game or offload other tasks to free more resources for graphics.

 

conclusion: all the other devs who are offloading other tasks or using the cloud to increas playability are wrong and the cloud is useless for anything but data mining.

 

it's like the fricken moon hoax thread.

 

either way, if you want to discuss the cloud capabilities of the xbox one, I'm sure there's another thread you can bring that up instead of here. 

I was simply quoting a part of the article.  Saying I had found it interesting, as all we have heard is how the cloud can increase the game capabilities and such.  So the discussion.. while not 100% related to the 60fps/720p is still part of the article posted.

 

 

And I never said it did.

 

 

I'm not sure why people go out of their way to make this about how 'the cloud' is over hyped.  Its something that has been done in the past and they will be doing it now, leveraging the server platform from MS.  I get it that you guys are quick to try and shut down those that do indeed make crazy claims.  But where is that here?  They told us how they are using MS' server infrastructure.  I didn't see them claim it was revolutionary or that it meant better game performance. 

 

Anyway, as I said, the data they get could be useful to patching efforts and a fighting game needs a team that can quickly roll out changes as needed. Rebalancing is a big deal in the fighting game community.

My point was more that there is large hype about the server platform, and I find it interesting that one of the highly anticipated games coming to x1 is not using the cloud in a way hyped by others.

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Posted

I find it funny that 60FPS at 1080p is still considered a technical challenge on consoles...we're forever hearing about how good the hardware is.

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I don't think it will always be about 1080p/60fps for Xbox One games... Sure they will want developers to hit that 1080p if they can...

 

But I feel that MS, probably feels that the 60fps is more important at this moment.  Good enough graphics for now (720p), fluid gameplay (60fps), with Wifi Direct Controllers = better overall gameplay...???  

 

Can someone smarter than me answer this...???

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I find it funny that 60FPS at 1080p is still considered a technical challenge on consoles...we're forever hearing about how good the hardware is.

 

whats the cheapest priced system you could build that plays the latest games at 1080p 60fps?

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Posted

 

 

My point was more that there is large hype about the server platform, and I find it interesting that one of the highly anticipated games coming to x1 is not using the cloud in a way hyped by others.

 

 

Then your saying you decided to make the comment in order to make a jab at other people that have made silly comments in other threads? 

 

Its just more of the same old console war back and forth. 

 

What is fairly ironic in this is that you guys are arguing amongst yourselves.  This is not about MS or the developers themselves.  They have all kept the hype in check as far as I have seen.  The developers that are using more of the server infrastructure due to the design of their game have more to say about it vs the developers that aren't.  Its not really a good or bad thing.

 

 

Anyway, this thread is about 720p/60 fps features of Killer Instinct.

 

On that note, I don't really care about the resolution as long as it isn't a glaring issue when watching the game first hand.  So far, the videos I have seen look very nice, so the 720p aspect has not resulted in a poor looking game.  When it comes to fighting games, 60 fps is more important than 1080p vs 720 in my opinion. 

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whats the cheapest priced system you could build that plays the latest games at 1080p 60fps?

Precisely my point.

 

Console performance is a fiction.

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