greenwizard88 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 Somehow I don't think this is representative of what the Kinect will be like. I pair my WP8 with Ford Sync, and can dictate messages with very little error, even while driving with the windows down. If Microsoft can pull that off, they can surely pull off simple commands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWilliams87 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 So it's pretty much on par with every other voice control system in existence then? Non-truth. Google Now is extraordinarily amazing when it came to voice commands. Windows Phone, like kinect, was also very sub-par, but others tried to claim otherwise. The thing is terrible; any little background noise, and it's useless. Not so with Google Now. I brought this up a couple of times here on neowin, but people kept giving Microsoft a pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper11 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 I'm simply asking why it's negative news when I post it, and positive when it's someone else? It doesn't have to be Spenser. In this case it is Spenser and from what I gather, the same story simply reworded. And do we really need to highlight it with posts every time something is a positive or negative? Are people keeping score on a chalkboard or something? Who cares! Digest the news, discuss it, move on. We don't need a tally of "oh more bad topics I see" in the comments. Umm, your talking about two different stories. Spenser posted about a Verge video/article. Your posting about a different group of people sharing their experience. It wasn't just reworded. Plus, did I claim it was a glowing article? Nope. As far as highlighting when a post is negative, no that doesn't have to happen. I'll stop doing that if you feel its unfair. When I see a negative thread in this or the Sony section, I call it out. But maybe that is getting to people, so I wont do it anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunknMunky Veteran Posted November 9, 2013 Author Veteran Share Posted November 9, 2013 Umm, your talking about two different stories. Spenser posted about a Verge video/article. Your posting about a different group of people sharing their experience. It wasn't just reworded. Plus, did I claim it was a glowing article? Nope. As far as highlighting when a post is negative, no that doesn't have to happen. I'll stop doing that if you feel its unfair. When I see a negative thread in this or the Sony section, I call it out. But maybe that is getting to people, so I wont do it anymore. I wouldn't know, I'm just going by what little info he posted about it being the same. I don't read Verge/Polygon etc like I said, and I'm not clicking the links to find out. And by all means if you want to post those comments, go ahead. I'm not dictating to you what to do. I just feel they are unnecessary and they set the tone of replies to come, rather than focusing on what is important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George P Global Moderator Posted November 9, 2013 Global Moderator Share Posted November 9, 2013 Somehow I don't think this is representative of what the Kinect will be like. I pair my WP8 with Ford Sync, and can dictate messages with very little error, even while driving with the windows down. If Microsoft can pull that off, they can surely pull off simple commands. I think it's because the WP8 system is using a backend cloud service. And I mean it's using tellme which is, unless I'm wrong, running up on Azure and using all the Bing stuff and so on. Now the Kinect is probably doing everything on it's own locally, maybe if there's a internet connection it can use the cloud to work better, if it does. I don't know, we'll have to wait and see how it is on the 22nd when lots of people start to use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper11 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 I wouldn't know, I'm just going by what little info he posted about it being the same. I don't read Verge/Polygon etc like I said, and I'm not clicking the links to find out. And by all means if you want to post those comments, go ahead. I'm not dictating to you what to do. I just feel they are unnecessary and they set the tone of replies to come, rather than focusing on what is important. Well if you aren't going to read any other news at all, then its hard to comment on how they are different. Nothing else to say really. As far as the comments, I'll just stop doing that. I'm not here to be part of the problem. Believe it or not, I actually try to stick up for you warriors :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunknMunky Veteran Posted November 9, 2013 Author Veteran Share Posted November 9, 2013 Well if you aren't going to read any other news at all, then its hard to comment on how they are different. Nothing else to say really. As far as the comments, I'll just stop doing that. I'm not here to be part of the problem. Believe it or not, I actually try to stick up for you warriors :laugh: I'm happy to talk about news from sources that have a clue :p The 3 I have mentioned do not deserve the clicks for the **** they post or idiots working for them. Well Cortana will save the day soon Same tech, different name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper11 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 I'm happy to talk about news from sources that have a clue :p The 3 I have mentioned do not deserve the clicks for the **** they post or idiots working for them. There are many, many more news sources then the two you mentioned following. Argue about which are 'better' all you want, that's another one of those silly arguments that go no where. The reason the negative topics show up more from those sources is due to the fact that negative stories tend to trend higher. Those thread are more active and it drives them up the list. Its not a Xbox vs PS thing, just the way news tends to work in general. Negative topics draw more page hits, the more controversy the better, etc, etc. So that's why I read news from as many sources as possible. You never know what might fall through the cracks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunknMunky Veteran Posted November 9, 2013 Author Veteran Share Posted November 9, 2013 There are many, many more news sources then the two you mentioned following. Argue about which are 'better' all you want, that's another one of those silly arguments that go no where. The reason the negative topics show up more from those sources is due to the fact that negative stories tend to trend higher. Those thread are more active and it drives them up the list. Its not a Xbox vs PS thing, just the way news tends to work in general. Negative topics draw more page hits, the more controversy the better, etc, etc. So that's why I read news from as many sources as possible. You never know what might fall through the cracks. I'm not trying to start any arguments about those sites. Just letting you know why I didn't see the other post today etc. I have my reasons for not visiting them, I don't expect others to care why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incendy Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 It is funny how some people talk to the console differently than they talk to a person and expect them to register. When you address someone you usually pause and wait for acknowledgment. Xbox, can you help me. Not xbox can you help me. Voice recognition in general is designed this way, it wants to be addressed. Xbox the word can be used in many contexts and it is a very fine line as to when it should react. The proper way of initiating it, is to address it and then ask the question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper11 Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 I'm not trying to start any arguments about those sites. Just letting you know why I didn't see the other post today etc. I have my reasons for not visiting them, I don't expect others to care why. Perfectly fair. We all have preferred sources. Sometimes news come from a source you would otherwise not follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkMan Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 I'm happy to talk about news from sources that have a clue :p The 3 I have mentioned do not deserve the clicks for the **** they post or idiots working for them. Wait... what ? you're ignoring news fro polygon and Verge, BUT you gladly post "news" from the GAF..... seriously... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunknMunky Veteran Posted November 9, 2013 Author Veteran Share Posted November 9, 2013 Wait... what ? you're ignoring news fro polygon and Verge, BUT you gladly post "news" from the GAF..... seriously... I didn't post anything from NeoGAF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George P Global Moderator Posted November 9, 2013 Global Moderator Share Posted November 9, 2013 I don't think Cortana and what the Kinect are doing are the same, that is, one is tied to a larger cloud backend, same as with what Google does and Apple with Siri. Kinect seems to do it's job on it's own locally, so it doesn't have all the backend support and learning that has gone into other systems. This explains why it'll take some time at first to get used to the way you talk to it, for some people it could work great from the start, from others with heavy accents it'll have to learn this and take it into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkMan Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 I don't think Cortana and what the Kinect are doing are the same, that is, one is tied to a larger cloud backend, same as with what Google does and Apple with Siri. Kinect seems to do it's job on it's own locally, so it doesn't have all the backend support and learning that has gone into other systems. This explains why it'll take some time at first to get used to the way you talk to it, for some people it could work great from the start, from others with heavy accents it'll have to learn this and take it into account. Kinects voice and speech recognition is based on MS' excellent speech recognition tech introduced already in Vista. which was the best speech recognition I ever tried. beat Dragon, even after the long tutorial you have to do on dragon to teach it. Vista without any training recognized my bad Norwenglish and even some Norwegian words it wasn't supposed to understand. Same with speech recognition in WP and so on. Cortana, is sort of a layer on top of that again. it's just an assistant that uses the words and phrases the speech recognition engine feeds it to do stuff for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkMan Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 But yeah, Cortana will use the cloud like Siri to provide the AI routines to analyse the phrases and provide an "intelligent" response. Kinect "generally" responds to pre defined phrases. so when you say Xbox bing search why is xbox one awesome. the first words triggers the listening, the second is service and/or command (I'm not actually sure if bing requires you to say search afterwards) followed by the command if the frst word isn't a command, then the rest is the command string where it uses regular speech recognition to figure out what words you're actually saying. the search phrase, the name of the movie, music or whatever. most likely without checking more into it, it's this last part where the voice commands failed during the demo and it didn't translate the right words. the commands are fairly easy to get right as it knows what commands to look for and will pick the one that sounds closest if you don't hit it correctly. this is why Sony says they have voice commands and not speech recognition. most likely they don't have full speech rec. but merely "simple" voice commands. unless they've said more on this subject now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BajiRav Posted November 10, 2013 Share Posted November 10, 2013 Non-truth. Google Now is extraordinarily amazing when it came to voice commands. Windows Phone, like kinect, was also very sub-par, but others tried to claim otherwise. The thing is terrible; any little background noise, and it's useless. Not so with Google Now. I brought this up a couple of times here on neowin, but people kept giving Microsoft a pass.I seriously couldn't figure out how to text using Google Now so excuse me while I enjoy the terrible voice recognition on my Lumia 920.It makes calls, sends texts and finds stuff - three things I use frequently with voice commands. I may use voice commands on apps too but that is somewhat rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blerk Posted November 10, 2013 Share Posted November 10, 2013 Non-truth. Google Now is extraordinarily amazing when it came to voice commands. Windows Phone, like kinect, was also very sub-par, but others tried to claim otherwise. The thing is terrible; any little background noise, and it's useless. Not so with Google Now. I brought this up a couple of times here on neowin, but people kept giving Microsoft a pass. Experience will vary from person to person. Google Now in my experience was absolutely terrible, and only recently has it started to vaguely recognize what I am saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Audioboxer Subscriber² Posted November 10, 2013 Subscriber² Share Posted November 10, 2013 If your voice recognition system can understand Scottish, it's good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper11 Posted November 10, 2013 Share Posted November 10, 2013 If your voice recognition system can understand Scottish, it's good. Exactly! :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGHammer Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Exactly! :laugh: And all voice recognition systems require training - I haven't run across one yet that hasn't. If I'm not mistaken, the core of most (if not all) voice recognition software that isn't FOSS is sourced from a single algorhythm/IP set (currently under the control of Nuance, the owners of Dragon Naturally Speaking) - yes, that includes that of XBOX ONE, as Microsoft has been a longtime Dragon licensee, going back to Windows 9x/NT; a subset of Dragon is part of the Accessibility Features. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HawkMan Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 And all voice recognition systems require training - I haven't run across one yet that hasn't. If I'm not mistaken, the core of most (if not all) voice recognition software that isn't FOSS is sourced from a single algorhythm/IP set (currently under the control of Nuance, the owners of Dragon Naturally Speaking) - yes, that includes that of XBOX ONE, as Microsoft has been a longtime Dragon licensee, going back to Windows 9x/NT; a subset of Dragon is part of the Accessibility Features. I'm not so sure about that. The microsoft algorithm seems drastically different to Dragon. when I tried the MS one back in Vista, it required basically no training and recognized everything I said. even some Norwegian words it shouldn't. When I tried Dragon, it required at the very least an hour of training to understand anything, and even then it couldn't understand anything. I'm fairly certain MS was talking about how they developed their algorithm in house back in the Vista days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argi Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 Aint it funny that the Sony folks post the negative Xbox stories and the Xbox folks tend to post the negative Sony stories? :P In any case, it should be pretty obvious that all voice recognition works better over time with input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachlan Posted November 14, 2013 Share Posted November 14, 2013 ^and thats where headset with directed mic are superior than kinect's mic. Sorry but the whole point of voice control is convenience.. If I need to put on a headset to tell my tv to turn on then I might as well just use the remote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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