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Snake89

SteamOS offically released

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So it is a Debian based distro. All kinds of good can come from this. Once Valve gets its Intel and AMD drivers up that should be minimal work for Base Debian, Ubuntu, Elementry etc to get optimized support. Even if Steam OS isn't a hit with the masses, having Valve coerce other companies to invest in Linux will only benefit the consumer in the end. Regular driver updates and the Steam touch controller to be for  Linux as the Xbox 360 controller is for Windows. This will be exciting.

AMD may decide to release updated official Linux video drivers for graphics cards other than their top of the line ones.  Been running open source drivers for years now on this desktop because the ATI Radeon HD 4200 on-board graphics card, while decent for all the gaming I do, isn't supported by ATI in the Linux version of their driver package.

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Running SteamOS in a VM defeats the point, if you just want to see what the UI is like you can just load Big Picture on your current Steam install.

Not really - some of us don't have Steam in our Linux installs (and almost certainly not if we also run any version of Windows).

 

And there IS a way to install it into any VM software that supports UEFI or EFI - there's a post in the Steam Universe SteamOS topic (Steam Community) about doing so in VMware (I followed similar steps for Oracle Virtual Box, which also has an EFI/UEFI emulation mode, where it is installing as I type this) - I'll be posting the steps both here on Neowin and there when I have finished my run-throughs (to make sure that the same ISO works in any UEFI emulation - not just that of Oracle VB, which works a treat).  I may also try Hyper-V, if there is a UEFI option.

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Thanks, I'll check it out.  Since it was not enabled by default, maybe that means its mostly there for developers.

 

It's more idiot-proofing for the eventuality of when less competent users start using it. As I understand it, it's just a simple tickbox in the settings.

 

im keen to look and underline code. keen to seen what i can do with it. 

 

All the Steam stuff is still proprietary, beyond that it's just standard Debian 7.1 with some newer package releases / kernel version+patches for performance - which are all meaningless if you're running it in a VM.

 

Not really - some of us don't have Steam in our Linux installs (and almost certainly not if we also run any version of Windows).

 

Yes really. Grabbing the Steam package in your Linux distro of choice or installing it in Windows is far easier, currently more compatible, and gives you access to the same UI. (Big Picture)

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Yeah, if you already run Steam on your pc, this isn't anything new or amazing, just a different way of doing the same thing.

 

But its also cool for those of us that like to tinker or use Linux full time. 

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It's more idiot-proofing for the eventuality of when less competent users start using it. As I understand it, it's just a simple tickbox in the settings.

 

 

Oh I agree that its buried in the settings so that the general gamer/user doesn't somehow do something stupid :laugh:

 

It is just one check box, so anyone wanting it can get to it.  I wonder what happens when you check the box.  do you have to restart and it boots you to the desktop instead of Steam maybe?

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Oh I agree that its buried in the settings so that the general gamer/user doesn't somehow do something stupid :laugh:

 

It is just one check box, so anyone wanting it can get to it.  I wonder what happens when you check the box.  do you have to restart and it boots you to the desktop instead of Steam maybe?

 

Nah, at most it'll just start/stop the relevant daemons. I'm not entirely sure how everything works, but it's probably all running within the default DE (GNOME).

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All the Steam stuff is still proprietary, beyond that it's just standard Debian 7.1 with some newer package releases / kernel version+patches for performance - which are all meaningless if you're running it in a VM.

 

 

 

 

Who cares if this on a VM, i would like to install and see it up and running. Yes i will not do much with once i have it loaded, but i get to look at it myself and see for myself. Your comments are very pointless and not very helpful at all. 

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Hello,

*fires up VMWare Workstation*

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Just saw a quick walkthrough of SteamOS on Youtube.  It was more or less big picture mode with some extra options.  The video didn't show the desktop but I expect more videos over the next couple of days that will show that.

 

 

Our little Steam is all grown up :wub:

 

Exciting times ahead.

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I think once this is as feature packed as something like Xbox live on 360 or PSN. Then this has a chance.

Tho Id say mainly as I really love the idea of being able to build my own console.

Also lets get the ability to stream from our main pc`s to these smaller steam machines. So as we dont go from the Windows library to the Linux library on steam with a loss of 90% of our games.

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I think once this is as feature packed as something like Xbox live on 360 or PSN. Then this has a chance.

Tho Id say mainly as I really love the idea of being able to build my own console.

Also lets get the ability to stream from our main pc`s to these smaller steam machines. So as we dont go from the Windows library to the Linux library on steam with a loss of 90% of our games.

 

 

For me, its just a novelty right now.

 

I still can't find a reason to build or buy a steambox or to say dual boot this with windows.  I can get the same Steam experience on my pc that I use for gaming.  If I wanted a dedicated gaming console, well there is the X1 and PS4.

 

That's just my personal usage, but I realize this could appeal to a lot of gamers that do not have a pc for gaming already.

 

Regardless, I'm excited to see where this goes and how quickly they can get it up to snuff feature wise.

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Are we able to use the "stream" option yet?

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Who cares if this on a VM, i would like to install and see it up and running. Yes i will not do much with once i have it loaded, but i get to look at it myself and see for myself. Your comments are very pointless and not very helpful at all. 

 

Your entire endeavour is very pointless and not very helpful either, yet you're still going ahead with it. But I apologise for trying to save you from wasting vast amounts of time trying to shoehorn SteamOS into an unsupported configuration, for reasons that amount to "ooh it's new and shiny".

 

You'll be rather disappointed when you find out it's just Debian with Big Picture running. (And when you could have just loaded BPM on your current OS)

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How to convert Steam OS ZIP into ISO:

 

Download this: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=30652

 

You only need to install this component: 

G03PweB.png

 

Use Windows search for term: "Deployment" and run as Administrator Deployment termed Command Prompt.

 

and follow this tutorial: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/steamuniverse/discussions/1/648814395813782335/

 

 

0. Get a freakin' UEFI computer and trash this PC from the 80's

1. Get a blank DVD media, duh!
2. Get a copy of Microsoft's oscdimg.exe tool. It is part of the Windows Automated Installation Kit (or Windows AIK for short). It is a ~1Gb file, but Google around and you shall find the single 120Kb file you need
3. Think twice about what the heck you are doing
4. Download ANY of the SteamOS zip files
5. Extract the file to a folder, let's say C:\Users\Public\SteamOS\
6. Open a Command Prompt
7. Go to the folder you saved the oscdimg.exe at step 1 (probably your downloads folder) on that command prompt (tip: "cd \users\joeuser\downloads")
8. Type in the following command - should be EXACTLY AS IS, but I may allow you to change the path to the one you extracted on step #5:
 
oscdimg.exe -m -o -j2 -h -pEF -bC:\SteamOS\boot\grub\efi.img -lSteamOS C:\SteamOS\ SteamOS.iso
Its space between last S\ and SteamOS.iso and is small L.
 
9. Use your favorite ISO burner to record the just created SteamOS.iso file to a DVD
10. From this point on, get ready to lose your data if you are too lazy to not understand Valve's instructions
11. Boot with the DVD and again follow ALL the instructions as if you were using an USB drive
12. Send me a beer
13. Enjoy your SteamOS

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is it just for games or will there be a way to watch movies over a nas drive for instance...

 

looking for an alternative media centre os

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is it just for games or will there be a way to watch movies over a nas drive for instance...

 

looking for an alternative media centre os

 

Precisely.  That will be at least a possible target market for Steam Machines (either OEM or build-your-own), the HTPC/media center market.

 

THAT is why I'm doing VM-based evaluation (just as I do any other Linux DE) - to look at what the distribution can do outside of gaming (specifically, the differences compared to standard Debian, and especially Debian wheezy).  This is NOT Debian wheezy exactly - there ARE differences, and ignoring them could come back and bite me in the butt.  (Remember, assumptions are the mother of all muckups.)

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I can't believe that even while basing their "OS" on basic Debian they can't to what every other home cooker can do, make a regular installable OS, and on top of that it requires UEFI... The OS that's supposed to let you build your own steam boxes or use existing computers to stream from a powerful gaming computer somewhere else...

Quality... I've seen 12 year old home cookers do better. Heck the guy making his fantasy Linux distro on this forum before he got predictably tired of it did better.

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For me, its just a novelty right now.

 

I still can't find a reason to build or buy a steambox or to say dual boot this with windows.  I can get the same Steam experience on my pc that I use for gaming.  If I wanted a dedicated gaming console, well there is the X1 and PS4.

 

That's just my personal usage, but I realize this could appeal to a lot of gamers that do not have a pc for gaming already.

 

Regardless, I'm excited to see where this goes and how quickly they can get it up to snuff feature wise.

The X1 and PS4 (not to mention the older and now-discounted XB360 and PS3) are some of the targets for the SteamMachine - that means they HAVE to at least come close to matching even the older consoles feature-for-feature outside of gaming.

Further, among those same targets (especially if you're an OEM or would-be OEM) are more plebian HTPCs/SFF PCs running other Linux DEs, if not Windows - a SteamMachine MUST offer "value-add" if it is going to knock out any of those already-existing choices, especially given the price premium.

 

Lastly, as much as Gabe Newell has disparaged Windows 8.1, a Windows 8.1 PC (of nearly any vintage) can outpace a SteamMachine at this stage of things *just by adding Steam* - remember, Big Picture Mode is ALREADY a feature of the Steam client for Windows.  In fact, my current PC (which is below the minimum requirements due to lacking UEFI support) could outpace a Steam Machine - and it's composed entirely of no-longer-manufactured (dead) hardware.  That isn't just a big problem - it's a monstrous problem (at least for prebuilt SteamMachines, if not the SteamOS itself); how does Valve face that issue?

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I can't believe that even while basing their "OS" on basic Debian they can't to what every other home cooker can do, make a regular installable OS, and on top of that it requires UEFI... The OS that's supposed to let you build your own steam boxes or use existing computers to stream from a powerful gaming computer somewhere else...

Quality... I've seen 12 year old home cookers do better. Heck the guy making his fantasy Linux distro on this forum before he got predictably tired of it did better.

HawkMan - the UEFI issue can be worked around - depending on how you want to do the evaluation process.  (Both Oracle VirtualBox and vmWare have EFI support; there's a post in the SteamOS SteamCommunity forums on how to create a bootable ISO for vmWare in EFI mode - it also works for Oracle VB, vmWare Player 5, or vmWare Workstation 10; that is something I have tested personally.)

Still, I think the UEFI "requirement" is simply a screen-out factor - it eliminates older hardware (basically, anything older than LGA1366 or the AMD equivalent) from consideration by OEMs.

 

Here are the settings I used for vmWare Workstation 10:

 

Guest RAM: 1536K (I have 4096K total on the host - this setting is just under half the total RAM available, and leaves room for running other software on the host while the VM is running.)

Guest HDD: 32 GB (This figure is actually high for vmWare Debian guests - vmWare recommends less than a quarter of this figure.  SteamOS did NOT use it all.)

Guest OS setting:  Debian 7 (64-bit) (Directly from the SteamOS FAQ.)

 

Other than enabling EFI support in the VM via an edit (vmWare requires it, in Oracle VB, it's a switch in the VM settings), the same settings work in Oracle VB.  (Naturally, you can, and likely should, increase the amount of RAM if you can, as my own settings are less than half what Valve specifies - however, it will still work, despite being under-spec.)

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The X1 and PS4 (not to mention the older and now-discounted XB360 and PS3) are some of the targets for the SteamMachine - that means they HAVE to at least come close to matching even the older consoles feature-for-feature outside of gaming.

Further, among those same targets (especially if you're an OEM or would-be OEM) are more plebian HTPCs/SFF PCs running other Linux DEs, if not Windows - a SteamMachine MUST offer "value-add" if it is going to knock out any of those already-existing choices, especially given the price premium.

 

Lastly, as much as Gabe Newell has disparaged Windows 8.1, a Windows 8.1 PC (of nearly any vintage) can outpace a SteamMachine at this stage of things *just by adding Steam* - remember, Big Picture Mode is ALREADY a feature of the Steam client for Windows.  In fact, my current PC (which is below the minimum requirements due to lacking UEFI support) could outpace a Steam Machine - and it's composed entirely of no-longer-manufactured (dead) hardware.  That isn't just a big problem - it's a monstrous problem (at least for prebuilt SteamMachines, if not the SteamOS itself); how does Valve face that issue?

 

 

Oh I agree, its going to be an uphill climb for Valve. 

 

I have a pc made especially for htpc duties and I have leveraged Win 8 for a great 10ft UI via the start screen.  I pin everything I want to access there, which happens to include Steam, which launches itself into Big Picture mode and I can use a remote control to do it all.  Right now, I already feel like I have the best of both worlds as far as an OS that can handle any app I want, any game I want, plus all the media stuff I could want.

 

SteamOS and Steamboxes are kind of in the middle of everything right now.  But hey, its very early and until we see production machines being sold and the OS being out of beta, I'm not going to judge the platform.  It needs time to mature and then maybe I will find where it fits into my own device needs. 

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I can't believe that even while basing their "OS" on basic Debian they can't to what every other home cooker can do, make a regular installable OS, and on top of that it requires UEFI... The OS that's supposed to let you build your own steam boxes or use existing computers to stream from a powerful gaming computer somewhere else...

Quality... I've seen 12 year old home cookers do better. Heck the guy making his fantasy Linux distro on this forum before he got predictably tired of it did better.

Most of the work is focused on Big Picture mode (which is crossplatform) and getting developers to support Linux. The reason it has been released so early is to give OEMs a chance to work with it and to allow enthusiasts to help test it out. It's not consumer ready, nor is Valve claiming it to be. In fact at the moment it doesn't even support AMD or Intel GPUs yet. Your criticism is misguided.

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Early or not, there is NO excuse for such a shoddy build. The install and setup is already there, it's the base of every Linux distro and it comes packaged ready for them to use. Not being consumer ready would mean the used a dirty non customized and easy steps OS installer, not not installer at all.

And this isn't going to get any developers to start supporting Linux, if anything, this early release will make some rethink actually doing it or delaying any Linux support.

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Most of the work is focused on Big Picture mode (which is crossplatform) and getting developers to support Linux. The reason it has been released so early is to give OEMs a chance to work with it and to allow enthusiasts to help test it out. It's not consumer ready, nor is Valve claiming it to be. In fact at the moment it doesn't even support AMD or Intel GPUs yet. Your criticism is misguided.

 

Pretty much this. SteamOS was released mainly because of the hardware prototypes that are shipping. It's for early testing, not for people cram onto VMs for "ooohs and ahhs".

 

Early or not, there is NO excuse for such a shoddy build. The install and setup is already there, it's the base of every Linux distro and it comes packaged ready for them to use. Not being consumer ready would mean the used a dirty non customized and easy steps OS installer, not not installer at all.

And this isn't going to get any developers to start supporting Linux, if anything, this early release will make some rethink actually doing it or delaying any Linux support.

 

You obviously have never used Arch Linux.

Edited by Andrew G.

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Most of the work is focused on Big Picture mode (which is crossplatform) and getting developers to support Linux. The reason it has been released so early is to give OEMs a chance to work with it and to allow enthusiasts to help test it out. It's not consumer ready, nor is Valve claiming it to be. In fact at the moment it doesn't even support AMD or Intel GPUs yet. Your criticism is misguided.

Besides, it's not like it's that HARD to add support for the missing GPUs, as support for both is in the Debian wheezy repos right now.  UEFI was a higher hurdle, and even that is clearable, if you want to do VM-based testing.  Right now, it's basically a quibble.

Other than it being a locked-down version of Debian's existing install (if you've installed any version of Debian 5 or later, other than the lack of options, the installer is, quite literally, basic Debian), once you get over the UEFI requirement, it is, literally, no different from a typical non-custom Debian installation.  (Quibble, quibble.)

 

Athernar - the jury is merely at the start of deliberations;  SteamOS could STILL fail.  There are so many trip-over points (compared merely to other Linux distributions, let alone consoles and Windows), it's definitely far from funny.  However, Valve and the SteamOS community has to recognize those trip-over points - and clear them.

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Early or not, there is NO excuse for such a shoddy build. The install and setup is already there, it's the base of every Linux distro and it comes packaged ready for them to use. Not being consumer ready would mean the used a dirty non customized and easy steps OS installer, not not installer at all.

It's for experienced users, making a simplified installer unimportant for the beta. I'm sure things will change for when it's released.

 

And this isn't going to get any developers to start supporting Linux, if anything, this early release will make some rethink actually doing it or delaying any Linux support.

Developers will go where the money is and if Valve is putting its full weight behind Linux then that's where they'll go. This is a long term commitment by Valve and a slightly unpolished initial release won't make any difference in the long run. Don't forget that Steam was pretty terrible when it first launched and it's now the definitive digital distribution platform.

 

I just don't see any merit in your claims.

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