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XBOX One Disc For Code

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Hi guys,

 

just wondering how come Microsoft don't include a code with physical media so we can play games without having to insert the disc, Steam games allow support this so why doesn't Microsoft?

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Hi guys,

 

just wondering how come Microsoft don't include a code with physical media so we can play games without having to insert the disc, Steam games allow support this so why doesn't Microsoft?

They tried and people complained so we are back to old way of doing things.
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They tried and people complained so we are back to old way of doing things.

Not exactly.

 

They could have codes (much like UltraViolet), but that would require that you download the game from XBOX Live (to disable disc drm and enable downloaded drm) and god knows no one that owns an XBOX One has an internet connection. (which is the reason we still have discs.)

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They tried and people complained so we are back to old way of doing things.

Wrong and wrong again.

Nobody ever complained about that. People complained about having to phone home once every day and not be able to sell their games on eBay, Kijiji and such. MS just had to make people phone home once every 2 or 3 weeks and let people untie their games from their account to sell online and the problem would have been solved.

It would be fun if MS fans would stop to spread lies here about that.

MS decided on their own to backtrap on digital only. Complains have nothing to do with it. And considering next gen games are between 30 to 40GB and the One's HD is 500GB only i think it might have played a bigger role in the backtracking. I just don't see how it could have worked with such a small HD. Not everyone want to use an external HD with their console. MS just did not think about their plan carefully enough. It was badly planned from the start.

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I don't think there is anything to say that in the future that can't happen. The problem is the DRM reversal came so late in the development phase they went for what would seem like the safest option - remove DRM.

 

Hopefully sometime in the future MS will return to some comprimise between the two because I would happily take the full DRM right now to save me swapping disks. Either that or they start being competitive with their digital prices to stop me looking at physical.

 

 

Wrong and wrong again.

Nobody ever complained about that. People complained about having to phone home once every day and not be able to sell their games on eBay, Kijiji and such. MS just had to make people phone home once every 2 or 3 weeks and let people untie their games from their account to sell online and the problem would have been solved.

It would be fun if MS fans would stop to spread lies here about that.

MS decided on their own to backtrap on digital only. Complains have nothing to do with it. And considering next gen games are between 30 to 40GB and the One's HD is 500GB only i think it might have played a bigger role in the backtracking. I just don't see how it could have worked with such a small HD. Not everyone want to use an external HD with their console. MS just did not think about their plan carefully enough. It was badly planned from the start.

I would argue semantics on this, the functionality at the time they came up with to allow this was the phone home checks aka DRM. The above poster specifically states options of how they could have gotten around DRM checks.

So yes people did complain about "phone home" but replace phone home with DRM and you have the same thing. People complained about their method of DRM and they attempted to please the masses by taking a route to remove it. 

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Wrong and wrong again.

Nobody ever complained about that. People complained about having to phone home once every day and not be able to sell their games on eBay, Kijiji and such. MS just had to make people phone home once every 2 or 3 weeks and let people untie their games from their account to sell online and the problem would have been solved.

It would be fun if MS fans would stop to spread lies here about that.

MS decided on their own to backtrap on digital only. Complains have nothing to do with it. And considering next gen games are between 30 to 40GB and the One's HD is 500GB only i think it might have played a bigger role in the backtracking. I just don't see how it could have worked with such a small HD. Not everyone want to use an external HD with their console. MS just did not think about their plan carefully enough. It was badly planned from the start.

May be in an alternate reality where people complained only about "phone home once every day". My post in context of OP is entirely accurate.

There were many complaints but main "DRM" complaints were

1. NO private used games sales & swapping(This was the main complaint, not the phone home)

2. 24hr check-in, that enabled used games sales at all

The #1 above is what relevant to OP (steam like feature set)

Your last paragraph is pointless because HDD size is still a limiting factor on both consoles due to mandatory installation.

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Hopefully sometime in the future MS will return to some comprimise between the two because I would happily take the full DRM right now to save me swapping disks. Either that or they start being competitive with their digital prices to stop me looking at physical.

I actually "enjoy" DRM features on my Xbox 360 that let me switch between games without getting off my sofa. I know I will be all digital whenever I get an XBO.
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The op is basically asking for a console feature that works like the pc.

On the pc, you install your game using a code and then you no longer need to put the disc in.

The side affect of this is that there is no used pc game market to speak of.

So if MS had adopted that feature, it would mean that there would be no Xbox used game market to speak of, which was upsetting to many people.

What this all means is that pc gamers are already use to not owning a physical copy of a game and even if they do, having no chance to resell it. For many console gamers, there is no interest in this. That means we still need to put our disc in the system to play it.

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If they included a code with the current system you could buy retail, redeem the code, then sell the disc. Steam can do this because you can't play the game with just the disc, on XBOX One you can. The initial system was like Steam where the disc was only used to install and was useless by itself.

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MS decided on their own to backtrap on digital only. Complains have nothing to do with it. And considering next gen games are between 30 to 40GB and the One's HD is 500GB only i think it might have played a bigger role in the backtracking. I just don't see how it could have worked with such a small HD. Not everyone want to use an external HD with their console. MS just did not think about their plan carefully enough. It was badly planned from the start.

You don't see how it could have worked? All games on both next gen console are required to be installed to play them. So whatever issue there is with storage space, it exists now as much as it would have then.

As far as MS, I agree that they didn't market their plans well enough. They allowed false rumors and misinformation to balloon out of control without making proper statements to the contrary. They also made some stupid pr statements to fuel the anger.

But that's history now.

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I actually "enjoy" DRM features on my Xbox 360 that let me switch between games without getting off my sofa. I know I will be all digital whenever I get an XBO.

:D  I found myself looking at the $40 Ryse sale recently and not biting because I wanted it digital.  Much like if I see a game on the PC side but it's not Steam I'll usually pass.

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Like others have said the problem is, if I buy a physical copy and it gives me a code and I no longer need the physical copy then why even get the physical copy in the first place? I mean why not JUST buy the code? Also if I have the physical copy what do I do with it? The fear is, can you give it a friend which means they can play it but do not get the code for the digital copy which means you and him have the game?  

 

Also Ironman brings up a good point I was looking at the other day myself. Bestbuy had Ryse on sale for $38 bucks!! I was thinking about getting it, but I WANTED the digital copy of it.. Well when I looked at the store the digital copy was still $59.99!! Shouldn't the store lower the price to match retail? OR no because it means they aren't selling enough retail copies so they drop the price to get rid of them.. See those are the things I don't like

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The phone home was disliked as much as if not more than not being able to resell. PC owners have limited resale ability (some sites allow trading in digital titles), but they aren't saddled with ridiculous DRM and prices and therefore on the whole can accept their current digital ownership rights/clauses.

 

At the end of the day just let people dream that the solution MS had was great, we'll leave the reality of it to the real thinkers, and MS themselves, as a company rarely buckles if it thinks its genuinely onto a winner. Personally I think they (MS), and a lot of the pro-MS media (those furiously playing down the DRM rumours/effect of potential DRM rumours) thought Sony were going to do something similar.

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The phone home was disliked as much as if not more than not being able to resell. PC owners have limited resale ability (some sites allow trading in digital titles), but they aren't saddled with ridiculous DRM and prices and therefore on the whole can accept their current digital ownership rights/clauses.

 

<snip> MS themselves, as a company rarely buckles if it thinks its genuinely onto a winner. Personally I think they (MS), and a lot of the pro-MS media (those furiously playing down the DRM rumours/effect of potential DRM rumours) thought Sony were going to do something similar.

The reality was that parts of MS' plan was good. Some parts were not good and those parts were the ones that people wanted to see changed. MS was not able to keep the good parts without the bad because they were so far into the development process that they lacked the time to replace the bad parts. So they shelved it all with the hopes of bringing back the good parts later.

Trying to claim that it was all bad or all good is just not correct.

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The reality was that parts of MS' plan was good. Some parts were not good and those parts were the ones that people wanted to see changed. MS was not able to keep the good parts without the bad because they were so far into the development process that they lacked the time to replace the bad parts. So they shelved it all with the hopes of bringing back the good parts later.

Trying to claim that it was all bad or all good is just not correct.

 

Calling home is never anything other than all bad. Has never been proven otherwise in our whole gaming history, playing offline parts of a game should never NEED an online connection. Ask EA how calling home works for them every time they try it in a game, or how it worked for Blizzard after they ripped it out of Diablo 3 for consoles.

 

<snip> Even a title like Demons Souls/Dark Souls, with it's heavy online supported single player mode allows you to play completely offline.

Edited by Andrew G.

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If they would just stay competitive with Amazon and other retailers' price drops on the digital side, I would buy them. Their insistence to sell the games at full price is what forces me to stay with discs. I am not going to spend $59.99 for a game I can purchase a half a mile away for $39.99.

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Calling home is never anything other than all bad. Has never been proven otherwise in our whole gaming history, playing offline parts of a game should never NEED an online connection. Ask EA how calling home works for them every time they try it in a game, or how it worked for Blizzard after they ripped it out of Diablo 3 for consoles.

Even a title like Demons Souls/Dark Souls, with it's heavy online supported single player mode allows you to play completely offline.

Calling home wasn't the only part of MS' plan, which was my point.

Good parts and bad parts. Calling home was a bad part.

My thinking is that MS was too deep into development to implement an alternative to the check in and so they had to scrub the whole plan since its likely a lot of the deals they were making with publishers revolved around having a rather strict drm in place to insure no one took advantage of the system.

Again, some of the plan was good and MS seems to want to bring those parts back in ways that don't involve the bad things like a 24hr check in.

<snip>

Edited by Andrew G.

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Calling home wasn't the only part of MS' plan, which was my point.

Good parts and bad parts. Calling home was a bad part.

My thinking is that MS was too deep into development to implement an alternative to the check in and so they had to scrub the whole plan since its likely a lot of the deals they were making with publishers revolved around having a rather strict drm in place to insure no one took advantage of the system.

Again, some of the plan was good and MS seems to want to bring those parts back in ways that don't involve the bad things like a 24hr check in.

 

Well that I can agree with.

 

Locally storing content licensing is what the current consoles already do, at least the PS3 does. When you download a title digitally it also downloads/approves the license of the PS3 it is being downloaded on, and it can go up to a maximum of 2 consoles (used to be 5 and still is for older PSN content).

 

So you only NEED to be online at the point of downloading (you can't avoid being online to download anyway, duh), and then you can play offline indefinitely afterwards. It has to work like this or similar because any sort of online required nonsense stopping people playing their offline games offline is a detrimental and genuinely hostile threat to gaming.

 

It doesn't and never will matter about anyone's pleas of their 100mb connection being stable 365 days of the year, the second one person somewhere in the world has some sort of outage, or goes on holiday somewhere without internet and cannot play their games it is unacceptable.

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Calling home is never anything other than all bad. Has never been proven otherwise in our whole gaming history, playing offline parts of a game should never NEED an online connection. Ask EA how calling home works for them every time they try it in a game, or how it worked for Blizzard after they ripped it out of Diablo 3 for consoles.

 

<snip> Even a title like Demons Souls/Dark Souls, with it's heavy online supported single player mode allows you to play completely offline.

Ironic, given that you seem to spew the same line about the ordeal over and over without really thinking, at least not about anyone but yourself.

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Can we quit the bickering guys?

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Well that I can agree with.

 

Locally storing content licensing is what the current consoles already do, at least the PS3 does. When you download a title digitally it also downloads/approves the license of the PS3 it is being downloaded on, and it can go up to a maximum of 2 consoles (used to be 5 and still is for older PSN content).

 

So you only NEED to be online at the point of downloading (you can't avoid being online to download anyway, duh), and then you can play offline indefinitely afterwards. It has to work like this or similar because any sort of online required nonsense stopping people playing their offline games offline is a detrimental and genuinely hostile threat to gaming.

The problem is that doesn't work for disc based games. MS was trying to create a system where disc based games could be handled just like digital games or the way retail pc games are handled. The disc is basically worthless and you tie the install to your account.

Unfortunately, they were only able to come up with the 24hr check in as a way to combat those that would try to resell their disc even though they were still playing the game digitally. Maybe that was down to pressure from game publishers or something else, but that is what happened.

So they scrubbed the plans in the face of backlash against the check in and the loss of a used game market for discs.

I think what we will see in the future is that MS will roll out the features they had planned to offer just on digitally purchased titles, leaving the disc based purchases as they are. No need to mess with that side at all unless they figure out a way to do it that does not seem so controlling.

As far as the digital side goes, your exactly right, there are systems already in use for those. However, I do believe that digital games will check in with the server from time to time on all consoles. Correct me if I'm wrong though, I just thought that was still happening.

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Ironic, given that you seem to spew the same line about the ordeal over and over without really thinking, at least not about anyone but yourself.

 

The only irony is the people actually thinking about others are people like me, see my reply directly above you. You don't need a statisticians report to know how underdeveloped large parts of the worlds internet infrastructure is. You instantly leave those people behind, aka not thinking about them, when you impose system wide calling home.

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The problem is that doesn't work for disc based games. MS was trying to create a system where disc based games could be handled just like digital games or the way retail pc games are handled. The disc is basically worthless and you tie the install to your account.

Unfortunately, they were only able to come up with the 24hr check in as a way to combat those that would try to resell their disc even though they were still playing the game digitally. Maybe that was down to pressure from game publishers or something else, but that is what happened.

So they scrubbed the plans in the face of backlash against the check in and the loss of a used game market for discs.

I think what we will see in the future is that MS will roll out the features they had planned to offer just one digitally purchased titles, leaving the disc based purchases as they are. No need to mess with that side at all unless they figure out a way to do it that does not seem so controlling.

s far as the digital side goes, your exactly right, there are systems already in use for those. However, I do believe that digital games will check in with the server from time to time on all consoles. Correct me if I'm wrong though, I just thought that was still happening.

 

Not on the PS3. The license file checked at the initial stage of downloading keeps it valid offline, when you attempt to download on a 3rd console it would just say maximum amount of activations already being used. At that point you would have to sign on one of the other two consoles and deactivate them before the 3rd console could download.

 

With consoles being encrypted closed environments, it really is much easier to prevent faking licenses etc, so you should never need more archaic DRM than what the PC currently has.

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Not on the PS3. The license file checked at the initial stage of downloading keeps it valid offline, when you attempt to download on a 3rd console it would just say maximum amount of activations already being used. At that point you would have to sign on one of the other two consoles and deactivate them before the 3rd console could download.

I remember some xbla games on the 360 checking for an internet connection when playing them, but I don't remember that for any of my psn games, so sounds about right.

I haven't noticed those checks on my X1 or ps4 digital games, so I guess that is completely gone for the next gen.

I would assume that ps+ games require an online check so that the system knows if your still an active subscriber to access the free games. I haven't tried to play my ps+ games offline, so maybe there is no such check.

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I remember some xbla games on the 360 checking for an internet connection when playing them, but I don't remember that for any of my psn games, so sounds about right.

I haven't noticed those checks on my X1 or ps4 digital games, so I guess that is completely gone for the next gen.

I would assume that ps+ games require an online check so that the system knows if your still an active subscriber to access the free games. I haven't tried to play my ps+ games offline, so maybe there is no such check.

 

What happens with PS Plus is when you redeem your 12 months, or however long you are redeeming another license file is downloaded to your PS3/PS4 which sets a time bomb for the date your Plus sub will last to. So if you subscribed today for 12 months, downloaded a digital title and then never turned your PS3 online again you'd get to keep playing till the time bomb hit on the 4th of Jan 2014. It doesn't need periodic checks to function. Obviously if you are online it will check to see if you've added more time to your Plus sub and update it's bomb accordingly, but at the point of you subbing to 12 months initially, Sony have their money for 12 months and you have your right to play for 12 months online or not.

 

Personally when the proof is already there that DRM doesn't have to be kicking you up the ass every day/week it leaves such a bad taste in my mouth when a company tries furiously to proclaim their online DRM is the only way. Look at how bad things blew up for EA when they and the journalists that got in bed with them (Polygon) tried to say Sim City needed to be online to work and do calculations. Then along comes hacker #1 and makes the game completely playable offline...

 

You can't pull wool over the eyes of those who have been gaming since the 80s/90s, so while my comment earlier about thinking might of rustled some feathers and I guess was bluntly harsh (sorry), I'm not necessarily wrong asking you to think a bit harder. Go do some rearch online, single player games have never needed to be attached so rigidly to an online component that they completely cease to function unless you check in/stay online. Its the suits, greed and publishers obsession with control that are the reasons, not the actual games.

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