36 posts in this topic

 

It's amazing, I had chicken pox as a child and have never had shingles...I must have an ultra super incredible immune system to be able to last so long without getting it. I never suggested not to vaccinate, but like I said above, vaccinating just to vaccinate is a personal decision which I choose not to make. But hey, keep insinuating that because people don't agree with the social norm of vaccinate or you'll die they are against all modern medicine...it makes you seem real smart. You are correct about chemotherapy though, that #### will kill you.

 

 

It's irritating to see people dismiss vaccines because they're "unnatural". The thing about vaccines is that they are overwhelmingly safe. People who are adversely affected are not very common, and those who suffer very bad vaccines are .. very rare indeed. Sure, argue about 'naturalness' of foods and whatnot all you like, but vaccines are so safe that generally speaking, you'd be silly to not get the standard regimen. 

 

And indeed, some vaccines are pointless - but generally they are not part of a standard regimen. Vaccinations are also not great cash cows for companies. Sure, the quadrivalent influenza vaccines are supposed to help the "profitability" of the influenza vaccination, but vaccinations generally are not that good for business, and drug companies aren't really constantly coming up with new vaccinations to treat every other infectious disease.

 

Now - about the varicella vaccination. I actually agree with you (somewhat), as contracting chicken pox as a child is generally a small inconvenience that may or may not be offset by the ability to stay home and muck around. I am not aware of any particular increased risk for other worse diseases - like HPV is associated with various carcinomas. Routine vaccination in children is therefore not something I particularly agree with. Indeed, where I am, the VZV immunization is only really recommended for adults at risk (i.e. those never infected), though I know that the U.S may be different. 

 

However, given the opportunity, I would generally vaccinate someone against VZV. Even if this is done privately - it's rather cheap. It is safe. It protects against those times you are immunocompromised (and you don't have to have an ultra super incredible immune system to be able to last so long without shingles - just a normal one), and if you are an adult and you have never gotten chicken pox before - it is much much better to be immunized than not. 

 

And while I understand the general worry about babies getting vaccinations especially in their first year, the overwhelming majority of babies are fine. But as long as your kids do get all vaccinations, even if the time scale is slightly distorted, I don't think anybody really minds. 

 

Chemotherapy - nasty stuff - and yes, it is supposed to kill you. The brilliant but terrifying part of it though is that it is supposed to kill the cancer just a little bit faster than it, and the cancer, kills you. :p

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's irritating to see people dismiss vaccines because they're "unnatural". The thing about vaccines is that they are overwhelmingly safe. People who are adversely affected are not very common, and those who suffer very bad vaccines are .. very rare indeed. Sure, argue about 'naturalness' of foods and whatnot all you like, but vaccines are so safe that generally speaking, you'd be silly to not get the standard regimen. 

 

And indeed, some vaccines are pointless - but generally they are not part of a standard regimen. Vaccinations are also not great cash cows for companies. Sure, the quadrivalent influenza vaccines are supposed to help the "profitability" of the influenza vaccination, but vaccinations generally are not that good for business, and drug companies aren't really constantly coming up with new vaccinations to treat every other infectious disease.

 

Now - about the varicella vaccination. I actually agree with you (somewhat), as contracting chicken pox as a child is generally a small inconvenience that may or may not be offset by the ability to stay home and muck around. I am not aware of any particular increased risk for other worse diseases - like HPV is associated with various carcinomas. Routine vaccination in children is therefore not something I particularly agree with. Indeed, where I am, the VZV immunization is only really recommended for adults at risk (i.e. those never infected), though I know that the U.S may be different. 

 

However, given the opportunity, I would generally vaccinate someone against VZV. Even if this is done privately - it's rather cheap. It is safe. It protects against those times you are immunocompromised (and you don't have to have an ultra super incredible immune system to be able to last so long without shingles - just a normal one), and if you are an adult and you have never gotten chicken pox before - it is much much better to be immunized than not. 

 

And while I understand the general worry about babies getting vaccinations especially in their first year, the overwhelming majority of babies are fine. But as long as your kids do get all vaccinations, even if the time scale is slightly distorted, I don't think anybody really minds. 

 

Chemotherapy - nasty stuff - and yes, it is supposed to kill you. The brilliant but terrifying part of it though is that it is supposed to kill the cancer just a little bit faster than it, and the cancer, kills you. :p

Thank you for a reasonable and educated response.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The natural state, you mean the one where they are vulnerable to very painful and potentially deadly (yet completely preventable) diseases?

Why don't you ask this baby how it likes its natural state:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3oZrMGDMMw

 

What a stupid argument. An parent that refuses vaccinations should have their child taken away.

 

 

Offtopic, but... such a sad video to watch :( I couldn't even finish it, poor child... 

 

So glad my own kids are getting their shots every now and then!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I didn't say anything in my original post to sway a person one way or another. I simply stated that if someone chooses not to vaccinate, that's their decision and it is most definitely NOT child abuse, neglect, or whatever other adjective you choose to use. There were no lies, misinformation, or conspiracies stated. 

 

Common substances found in vaccines include:

  • Aluminum gels or salts of aluminum which are added as adjuvants to help the vaccine stimulate a better response. Adjuvants help promote an earlier, more potent response, and more persistent immune response to the vaccine. 

    See also: "Aluminum in Vaccines: What you should know icon_pdf.gif [2 pages]icon_out.png" Also available in Spanish icon_pdf.gif [2 pages]icon_out.png

  • Antibiotics which are added to some vaccines to prevent the growth of germs (bacteria) during production and storage of the vaccine. No vaccine produced in the United States contains penicillin.
  • Egg protein is found in influenza and yellow fever vaccines, which are prepared using chicken eggs. Ordinarily, persons who are able to eat eggs or egg products safely can receive these vaccines.
  • Formaldehyde is used to inactivate bacterial products for toxoid vaccines, (these are vaccines that use an inactive bacterial toxin to produce immunity.) It is also used to kill unwanted viruses and bacteria that might contaminate the vaccine during production. Most formaldehyde is removed from the vaccine before it is packaged.
  • Monosodium glutamate (MSG) and 2-phenoxy-ethanol which are used as stabilizers in a few vaccines to help the vaccine remain unchanged when the vaccine is exposed to heat, light, acidity, or humidity.
  • Thimerosal is a mercury-containing preservative that is added to vials of vaccine that contain more than one dose to prevent contamination and growth of potentially harmful bacteria.

Source: CDC.gov

Formaldehyde is in almost every vaccine, you can see an ingredient breakdown on a vaccine by vaccine basis on the CDC website. Vaccines are not a simple as you make them out to be, there are a ton of other things aside from the virus/bacteria. I am not against all vaccination, what I am against is vaccinating just because the pharmaceuticals come out with a new vaccine to cure this or that. I am also against giving my children 5 vaccines in one visit, that's just crazy. I'm also very hesitant to vaccinate during the first year of life, it's a personal decision and one that my wife and I choose to make.

The issue isn't what vaccines contain but whether or not they are safe. Statistically they are much, much safer than the viruses / diseases they protect against and parents are foolish if they choose not to immunise their children. Every time you see immunisation rates drop you see a return of the infectious conditions they protect against. The problem is that this discussion has arisen out of a concern for autism, which has no scientific link to vaccines. It's extremely concerning to see people promoting such misinformation. I don't respect people who buy into these conspiracy theories.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know haters will still gonna hate but science, medicine here even for them:

Autism 'begins long before birth' By Helen Briggs of BBC 27 March 2014 00:48 AM
Scientists say they have new evidence that autism begins in the womb.
Patchy changes in the developing brain long before birth may cause symptoms of autism spectrum disorder (ASD), research suggests.
The study, in the New England Journal of Medicine, raises hopes that better understanding of the brain may improve the lives of children with autism.
It reinforces the need for early identification and treatment, says a University of California team.
Source
33jpjy9.png33jpjy9.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It'll be good to have a genuine marker to diagnose Autism, as it seems these days, for many, it's used as a cop out excuse for bad parenting. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just leaving this here for the truth... (nsfw language)

 

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^^ PRECISELY!!!!

* Aluminum. Cookware, aluminum foil food wraps and use in cooking, deodorants, antacids etc. etc. etc.

* our bodies produce formaldehyde as a result of DNA demethylation (an important process for controlling gene expression, such as in developing embryos) and other biological processes, with a normal blood concentration of about 2-3?g of formaldehyde/gram of blood.

* glutamates are also a natural constituent of our diet and bodies. The real problem in MSG is its high sodium content, bad for blood pressure etc., which makes glutamic acid into a salt which is easily dissolved without the metallic taste of other salts. It activates the highly desirable umami taste. Look it up.

* you get more mercury from regularly eating wild caught fish and other environmental and diet sources than from timerosal.

Etc.

And as has been said, autism is caused in the uterus during he late first to early second trimester. As such, it's not what the born child is exposed to but what the mother has been expose to shortly before and during pregnancy, especially fire retardants, pesticides etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

<snip>

 

DocM covered most of these adequately. You're exposed to such substances daily in much larger amounts, you're just pointing at a list with the subtle implication that these substances are somehow harmful.

 

It's really quite a dishonest tactic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't forget Monsato products and cell phone/WiFi radiation too as possible causes.

Anything that affects the mother, also affects the child. Therefore, environmental influences cannot be discounted. Remember, this discovery doesn't explain the cause of the neural development disruption. It's quite possible that manmade toxins and genetically modified foods could be causing a whole host of conditions. 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

wish i had been vaccinated against chickenpox :/ ive ended up with it twice and ive scarred both times thanks to it :/ it was painful iw as sick and i would not wish that on my own children, i basically spent 2 weeks in a salen bath

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.