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Are OEM's Giving AMD a bad name?


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#61 OP +warwagon

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:28

But war. you need to keep in mind also that Intel probably spends billions on ads in a quarter, more than AMDs marketcap is. its been like that for a loooong time now. OEMs wont stand up and pay for you to advertise your CPU/w.e for nothing.

 

Yes, that's true. But in the end consumers associate slow with AMD




#62 alwaysonacoffebreak

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:32

Not just the price but also the "local IT guy" reccomendations which usually are so biased towards Intel (in some cases they are true,sure, like the E series) its actually funny.

 

Go look on the biggest hardware sites on the net and see what the "IT Pros" are saying whenever someone asks about AMD or their desktop CPUs for example.

 

Slow = AMD. Whos fault is that they bought the cheapest crap they found? You get what you pay for. You wouldnt be much better of with an Atom or an Celeron anyway, all those CPUs are meant for casual use like browsin, email etc.



#63 Alera

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:39

In my opinion it's about 10 years too late to ask this question, the answer is yes. You only have to look at Intels marketing strategy and use of OEMs to push their own products into the market while ignoring AMD to notice how they push others out of the game, there is a reason that the revenue gap of both companies is widening, it has nothing to do with AMDs recent collapse in competition.

 

Coupled with the adverts and anyone who continues to push Intel (mostly fanboys that say you need a 4770K to play games with) despite the price/performance benefits of switching every now and then between camps and you have people unwilling to give AMD a try, thinking they're slow or simply not good enough.



#64 alwaysonacoffebreak

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:42

Lets just put this here and remind some people why AMD doesnt have OEM support in the first place. http://www.dailytech...rticle19265.htm

 

Or Google/Bing

 

Intel paid 6 billion to Dell (Not to use AMD, which they still dont)



#65 TheExperiment

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:46

I think the point is pretty well moot.  AMD tech has been improving massively for some time now, and it's starting to come back to the only true advantage Intel having is their fabs.  Things releasing this year and onward are pretty impressive.

 

I know, no E series stuff has released yet this year, but it looks like the E1-6010 and E2-6110 are due soon.  I'd love to see how those compare to the Atom 3xxx line since that was also released this year.

 

- (Hmm, looks like they'll be pretty competitive http://www.tomshardw...sor,3813-2.html )



#66 OP +warwagon

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:53

I guess it would also show, Intel is wasting their money on advertising :D

 

I think the point is pretty well moot.  AMD tech has been improving massively for some time now, and it's starting to come back to the only true advantage Intel having is their fabs.  Things releasing this year and onward are pretty impressive.

 

I know, no E series stuff has released yet this year, but it looks like the E1-6010 and E2-6110 are due soon.  I'd love to see how those compare to the Atom 3xxx line since that was also released this year.

 

- (Hmm, looks like they'll be pretty competitive http://www.tomshardw...sor,3813-2.html )

 

 

 

The problem is regardless on how good these CPU's will be when I hear the name E1 and E2 I think Crap. It's the same problem Intel has with their Atom brand. The Atom brand was completely destroyed by slow netbooks, which is why when the new Atoms came out people said, for the love of god intel, do not use the Atom brand name because people instantly think crap.



#67 +dreamsburnred

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 16:56

I have a AMD in my HP laptop. (AMD A8-5545M w/ AMD RADEON HD 8510G), with 8.1 with no issues. I can play sims 3 and war thunder no issues. 

 

There is two HP all in ones in the house as well, which are also AMD based. There also incredibly fast. Actually feels faster then mine (but probably because there hard drive is 7200 RPM vs 5400 RPM).

 

Yes the low AMD's are to stay away from, but here in Canada (or at least Alberta), the god awful Pentiums are common. The i3 and higher end AMD's are common in the price range of $550+, but anything under that is crap Intel or AMD.



#68 TheExperiment

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 17:04

The problem is regardless on how good these CPU's will be when I hear the name E1 and E2 I think Crap. It's the same problem Intel has with their Atom brand. The Atom brand was completely destroyed by slow netbooks, which is why when the new Atoms came out people said, for the love of god intel, do not use the Atom brand name because people instantly think crap.

I used to agree with that sentiment wrt Atoms, then I used a Asus Transformer T100TA(?) and I loved it.  I kinda want one, but I'd prefer to wait for an AMD version.  If that will actually happen.



#69 hagjohn

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Posted 28 May 2014 - 17:04

And this is why OEM's are not selling computers. They should know slow chips mean slow computers. I think AMD should drop a fair number of their slower chips.



#70 +goretsky

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 08:18

Hello,
 
My experience with AMD CPUs has been quite limited:

▪ ThinkPad X100e with AMD Athlon Neo Single-Core MV-40 (1.6GHz, 512KB L2) 8GB RAM, 60GB SSD (circa 2010)
▪ ThinkPad X100e with AMD Turion Neo X2 Dual-Core L625 (1.6GHz, 1MB L2) 8GB RAM, 60GB SSD (circa 2010)
▪ ThinkPad X120e with AMD Fusion E-350 (1.6Ghz, 1MB L2) 16GB RAM, 120GB SSD (circa 2011)

but it was my impression that the Neo's offered lower overall CPU performance than their Atom equivalents, but better graphics due to their integrated Radeon IGPs. The Turion-equipped X100e was a little better, but both X100e's suffered from higher than expected TDP. The X120e works much better, and is definitely usable for Microsoft Office type productivity apps, web browsing and maybe even some casual gaming.

In any case, these systems were pretty much eclipsed by my 2007-era Intel C2D-equipped T61p in everything but price.

As I said, though, my experience with recent AMD systems is limited to these systems.

The main issue or concern I have with AMD is that I would like to see them manufacture motherboards. For years, one of the reasons I kept to the Intel camp was because I knew that if I plugged an Intel CPU into an Intel motherboard, I would get a system that worked perfectly. No weird issues, no economizing on components, no missing drivers. Just stability. Of course, there was typically no overclocking with Intel brand motherboards, but that's a non-issue for me.

I don't think that AMD has really had the ability to showcase the reliability of systems based on their processors because the majority of OEMs are focused on making AMD CPU motherboards as inexpensively as possible, and investing more in designing higher-end, more reliable motherboards for Intel CPUs. There are exceptions, of course: All the Tier 1 motherboard manufacturers have their gaming editions, but there's also the Biostar, ECS and FICs of the world, who rarely seem to be mentioned in comparison to ASUS, Gigabite and MSI.

I think that if AMD were to manufacture (or even OEM, as Intel sometimes did) its own motherboards which stringent quality controls on the components, assembly, driver software, etc., they would have a much better stock valuation. But, I suspect that being tied up so intimately with so many other motherboard manufacturer precludes this, and thus, there's less high-end AMD kit being ordered, which perpetuates the race to the bottom of AMD's CPUs.

Regards,

Aryeh Goretsky

#71 alwaysonacoffebreak

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Posted 29 May 2014 - 08:25

 

The main issue or concern I have with AMD is that I would like to see them manufacture motherboards. For years, one of the reasons I kept to the Intel camp was because I knew that if I plugged an Intel CPU into an Intel motherboard, I would get a system that worked perfectly. No weird issues, no economizing on components, no missing drivers. Just stability. Of course, there was typically no overclocking with Intel brand motherboards, but that's a non-issue for me.

 

I think you've had some strange AMD motherboards go trough you if you have had problems with issues, components or missing drivers. Of course I've only dealt with higher end mobos like Sabertooth or Asus PRO versions but those two haven't had a single problem. Just put the CPU in and you're ready to go, except of course for graphics drivers since AMD CPU's don't have an IGP.

 

Sure there have been some pretty crap mobos, especially from the early GB versions but thats on them I think not AMD. I had and 970 something mobo from GB and that plain out sucked, after that I just went with Saber and got to say, it's one of the best AMD mobos out there. I don't even thinkk after Saber the ROG version is worth it's price.



#72 PGHammer

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 02:20

I think you've had some strange AMD motherboards go trough you if you have had problems with issues, components or missing drivers. Of course I've only dealt with higher end mobos like Sabertooth or Asus PRO versions but those two haven't had a single problem. Just put the CPU in and you're ready to go, except of course for graphics drivers since AMD CPU's don't have an IGP.

 

Sure there have been some pretty crap mobos, especially from the early GB versions but thats on them I think not AMD. I had and 970 something mobo from GB and that plain out sucked, after that I just went with Saber and got to say, it's one of the best AMD mobos out there. I don't even thinkk after Saber the ROG version is worth it's price.

I've seen good and bad (and just plain awful) AMD-based portable hardware (of the same era) - the worst of all in my experience came from (shockingly) Toshiba.

 

Toshiba may be known for great portables - in fact, Toshiba doesn't build desktops at all.  However, the AMD-powered Satellite subseries (as opposed to their Intel-powered relatives) I refuse to recommend whatsoever.  (Rather amusingly, I have no such issue recommending AMD-driven portables from Acer or HP - of the same age; tell me, what did both HP and Acer get right that Toshiba fumbled?)

 

Now, AMD's Fusion APU-powered portables are slick pieces of work - they all support Hyper-V, which isn't the case with the Celeron or Pentium-driven portables they compete against.  If you want a portable for business - not gaming - use, that is why I have nary a problem recommending an AMD-driven portable - especially one from either Acer or HP.)

 

I personally haven't built an AMD-driven desktop since the infamous AM386DX-40 (which was the core of the first desktop I ever built) - however, that has more to do with trying to avoid getting caught behind any eight-balls (due to ongoing issues concerning the financial viability of AMD).



#73 +goretsky

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Posted 30 May 2014 - 09:43

Hello,

 

From about 2001-2004, I ran a typical computer fixit business, repairing, cleaning systems and subcontracting out to various local network and software consultants when they needed a "Windows OS /PC guy" to go on site.  At some of the larger businesses (and even a few small, very well-run ones) there were some attempt at standardization, and tended to get either higher-end consumer or business-grade systems.  But I usually ended up working on systems that were either from a brand name (from big box retailer like BestBuy; ordered from web site like Dell, HP, Compaq, Gateway, IBM etc.) or they had been sold by one of the handful of local computer stores.

 

The latter were, by far, the worst.  I saw far more motherboards in those from companies like Biostar, DFI, Elitegroup, Foxconn, Freetech, Lucky Star, Matsonic, PC Chips, etc., than I did from companies like Abit, EPoX, IWill, Shuttle, Soyo (which I considered to be good mid-tier brands, not too expensive) or even top-tier manufacturers like ASUS, Gigabyte, Intel, MSI, SuperMicro, Tyan, etc.  I spent a lot of time doing things like hunting down motherboard manuals, BIOS updates, vendor-specific drivers (when silicon drivers from ALI, AMD, Intel, SiS, ULI, VIA, Winbond, etc. would not enumerate) and the like.  Aside from crashing (which, admittedly, could often be due to Windows 95/98/Me/2000/XP cruft) these computers were never great performers even with a fresh OS load, reinstall of apps, patching and restore of old customer data.  Another thing they all had in common was that the computer owner had usually been told they were getting a "super high-end" gaming computer, workstation, etc., and instead had been given systems with low end Celerons (for Intel) and a lot of Durons and Semprons (for AMD).  I remember one person, a moviemaker, who paid thousands of dollars for a nonlinear digital editing workstation, and got a Pentium 4 CPU on a motherboard that used PC133 SDRAM.  Not exactly the kind of high-performance component to put into a system, especially when RDRAM and DDR-RAM were battling it out for "who's fastest" on the desktop.

 

Regards,

 

Aryeh Goretsky

 

I think you've had some strange AMD motherboards go trough you if you have had problems with issues, components or missing drivers. Of course I've only dealt with higher end mobos like Sabertooth or Asus PRO versions but those two haven't had a single problem. Just put the CPU in and you're ready to go, except of course for graphics drivers since AMD CPU's don't have an IGP.

 

Sure there have been some pretty crap mobos, especially from the early GB versions but thats on them I think not AMD. I had and 970 something mobo from GB and that plain out sucked, after that I just went with Saber and got to say, it's one of the best AMD mobos out there. I don't even thinkk after Saber the ROG version is worth it's price.



#74 OP +warwagon

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Posted 03 June 2014 - 21:57

Just got a call from a customer who called about his new Windows 8 Machine. Said it was slow (Slower than their XP machine) and that they just got it. Apparently they got a cheap walmart one before that and took it back and replaced it with this one. I checked out his CPU and it was a E1-2500. I told him to return it and get something decent like an i3



#75 OP +warwagon

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Posted 14 June 2014 - 14:02

This cracked me up!

 

14439585293_f0a8ee2313_h.jpg

 

The rest of the conversation went like this ( I don't have a screenshot of)

 

Adam : Umm... Atom is a Intel CPU

Him : Let me reword that, they don't care if it has an AMD or intel sticker. (A.k.a trying really hard not to look like an idiot after what he just said above.

 

He has since removed all of his posts responding to mine.





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