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Dota 2 - Coming from LoL... HELP!

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#1 Scraggles

Scraggles

    RootLeak

  • Joined: 11-September 03
  • Location: Troy, New York

Posted 20 May 2014 - 15:49

So last night I decided to give DoTA 2 another shot. I had played maybe 2 games since beta and didn't like it. I felt like it was exceptionally unbalanced. Well, without flaming me.... I still feel that way. I know a big part is that I don't know the Heroes. I was flamed harder in my 5-6 games of dota2 last night than in all of my 5000 games of LOL combined. I know the mechanics. Last hits. I know the 'unique' mechanics, like denying your enemy the kills although I'll admit I'm not the best at that.

 

However I noticed in every game a few things:

The hero that got first blood, snowballed and won every game.

People say the game is balanced, but the storm guy... sheesh. One of the games, his entire team left except him. so it was 1v5. I figured, oh this is going to be fast and easy. Wrong. He dove in 1v5 against us and crushed us. He ended up goign 119-2-0. We would use every ounce of CC we had and it did nothing. he would get away with full HP and all 5 of us would be dead. 

Also I noticed the community is worse than any other game I have ever played.... including WoW and Minecraft... every other word was 'F this' and 'you stupid N'... I felt like I was in the 1800's with the way the N word flew around. 

I also noticed that ranged chapions dominated every game.

 

Now, I expect the same as League of Legends. The idiots are the low ranked people. As  you hit higher levels they mature. I could be wrong. 

 

So I guess I'm in need of some help. One of the things that confused me.... I thought if you were an agility champ, agility increased your damage... same for strength and Intelligence... If so... wtf is the 'damage' stat on everything? Why would you get 'damage' if your personal stat does the exact same thing and gives you added bonuses like health or whatever...?

 

Help a brutha out!!! Suggestions for some champs to try to not be completely stomped every game so I can get to a point where I enjoy it? After playing League of Legends for 5 years, I would like a change of pace.




#2 neoadorable

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    Neowinian Senior

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 06:12

No idea dude as i don't play it, but a friendly bump never hurts..on a forum, that is.



#3 Crimson Rain

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  • Joined: 29-September 12
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  • Phone: Lumia 1020 Yellow

Posted 23 May 2014 - 07:14

So last night I decided to give DoTA 2 another shot. I had played maybe 2 games since beta and didn't like it. I felt like it was exceptionally unbalanced. Well, without flaming me.... I still feel that way. I know a big part is that I don't know the Heroes. I was flamed harder in my 5-6 games of dota2 last night than in all of my 5000 games of LOL combined. I know the mechanics. Last hits. I know the 'unique' mechanics, like denying your enemy the kills although I'll admit I'm not the best at that.

 

You don't know the mechanics, you don't know the game, you don't know anything; no flame. The sooner you admit it, the sooner you will start to learn the game.

 

This game's depth is immense and anyone saying they know the mechanics etc without playing this game for at least a year is simply wrong.

 

Small example from a few months ago:

- a player learning dota and after a few days challenged me.

- lost badly and the player guessed themselves guessed it will take a month of practice before they can fight me on equal terms.

- after a month of practice and learning, we play again.

- lost badly and the player guessed themselves guessed it will take 3 months of practice before they can fight me on equal terms.

- after 3 month of practice and learning, we play again.

- lost badly and the player guessed themselves it will take a year of practice before they can fight me on equal terms.

I'm pretty sure if we play again now, they will say it will take 3 years of practice. It is not that they have no improved at all or I have improved a lot, they have improved a LOT. But that additional knowledge helped them to understand more about how much more things there are to learn.

 

Moral of the example: You think you know most/basic things and just need to learn a few more things. In reality, you only think like that because you have no idea about the depth and the more you learn, the more you understand that there is much more to learn.

 

 

It is much more balanced than LoL. It appears unbalanced to you because of the above reason. You do not understand it and others do. Thus they exploit your weakness and you feel the game is imbalanced.

 

One of the key differences between LoL and Dota is that LoL doesn't punish you much for your mistakes but it can reward your opponent for that. In Dota, your mistake will not only reward your opponent, it will punished you too, often much more compared to the reward your opponent got. In other words, mistakes in dota are punished extremely harshly and since you are new, you are going to make mistakes left and right.



#4 Crimson Rain

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 07:35

> The hero that got first blood, snowballed and won every game.

Baseless anecdote. More likely, that player is way over your level.

 

> People say the game is balanced, but the storm guy... sheesh. One of the games, his entire team left except him. so it was 1v5. I figured, oh this is going to be fast and easy. Wrong. He dove in 1v5 against us and crushed us. He ended up goign 119-2-0. We would use every ounce of CC we had and it did nothing. he would get away with full HP and all 5 of us would be dead. 

If you think Storm is so much over powered, why don't you play it and see if you can even go 30-2-0?
What happened is the guy you played against probably has 4500+ MMR (matchmaking rating) but they are using a new account aka smurf. After they play a few games, their account will be shot up in the bracket so you wont have to play with that player again but...smurfs like this keep coming in.

So what you need to do is keep playing and once you have played 20 to 30 games, you will be out of this "new player" bracket and you wont have to face smurfs again.

 

Smurfing is a big problem of Dota 2 and new players like you get put off because of this. You just need to bear with it until you are out of this hellhole bracket.

 

 

> Also I noticed the community is worse than any other game I have ever played.... including WoW and Minecraft... every other word was 'F this' and 'you stupid N'... I felt like I was in the 1800's with the way the N word flew around. 

Depends on where you are playing, when you are playing. Also, since a simple mistake like pressing that meka hotkey 1 second later can cost you the whole game (remember? mistakes are usually punished harshly), people usually get really ###### off if you play bad. Also, Russian/pinoy/br/Peruvian kids do not help the situation either.

 

> I also noticed that ranged chapions dominated every game.

Baseless anecdote. You just don't know how to play against them. No flame.

 

Also, stop using champion word. You will get flamed to death just for this.

 

> I thought if you were an agility champ, agility increased your damage... same for strength and Intelligence... If so... wtf is the 'damage' stat on everything? Why would you get 'damage' if your personal stat does the exact same thing and gives you added bonuses like health or whatever...?

 

Your question is not clear.

 

All heroes have 3 attributes; one being primary.

STR gives health points, hp regen.

AGI gives armor points and attack speed

INT gives mana pool, mp regen

 

Whichever the primary attribute is, also counts as your damage.

 

Apart from these above, a hero also has:

- base hp and hp regen

- base mp and mp regen

- base armor

- base attack speed (BAT)

- base magic reduction (25% on all, 35% on meepo)

- base movement speed

- base damage (can be a range like 45 to 55)

- attack range (128 for melee usually; range heroes usually 600 but there are exceptions)

- attack animation delay

- (spell) cast animation delay/backswing

- missile speed (instant for melee)

- sight range

- acquisition range

 

So your total damage is: base damage + primary attribute value + any damage item you have.

 

 

These are your best friends right now:

http://www.playdota.com/learn

http://www.playdota.com/mechanics



#5 Andrew

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 12:10

Topic Cleaned.

 

Stick to the topic please, this isn't a Dota 2 vs LoL debate.

 

Help OP or don't take part in the discussion



#6 Crimson Rain

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 02:27

@OP here is melee hero owning range heroes and "storm guy"...

https://www.youtube....eature=youtu.be



#7 Athernar

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    ?

  • Joined: 15-December 04

Posted 24 May 2014 - 03:15

First point of advice would probably be to forget everything you know about LoL when playing Dota , especially when it comes to terminology. Riot games and certain employees have done a number of things to harm Dota in the past, so in certain company you are likely to get targeted and abused for using LoL terms.

 

I would suggest maybe sticking to bot games until you've got a decent grasp of the game, if not just so you can quickly elevate yourself out of the "new user" tier of matchmaking, which is rather infested with smurfs, kiddies and other clichés. You would be surprised how quickly the quality of MM improves once you do.

 

Beyond that, check out hero guides in the client, general guides on the various fansites - and maybe even take a gander at some of the pro games like in the video Crimson Rain linked.



#8 ShockD

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  • Joined: 15-October 13
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Posted 26 May 2014 - 21:36

Here's what. Comparing LoL to Dota 2 is technically incorrect. Yes, they're the same genre, but that's all. Play for a while and see for yourself.



#9 HawkMan

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 18:02

Any Neowinians play Dota2 casually now ? 

 

getting into DoTA2 now since I don't feel like playing HoTS untill it's out of alpha/beta, as all the work I do to unlock heroes and earn gold will be wiped which doesn't seem enticing atm.



#10 Knive Party

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 20:02

Any Neowinians play Dota2 casually now ? 

 

getting into DoTA2 now since I don't feel like playing HoTS untill it's out of alpha/beta, as all the work I do to unlock heroes and earn gold will be wiped which doesn't seem enticing atm.

Yes I play it. It is my religion. All Praise Ice Frog.

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#11 HawkMan

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 20:30

"casually" :p