57 posts in this topic

As far as the reserve, it's still there, it sounds to me like developers have to code specifically for it and ask for more, the system will then do what it can to give them what they need.  Apps you've loaded will get paged out and they'll be suspended so I'm willing to bet that with or even without Kinect, if we have a game that we know for sure is using more resources and has tapped into that extra reserve, multitasking could very well take a hit.  People could see more apps have to reload/redraw their UI when you switch to them compared to before.

 

they dont need to reserve anything for system content rendering. the hardware will automatically slot the system stuff in when appropriate without affecting graphics performance. its obvious the hard reserve was done because they were behind on the driver. this stuff is designed in the hardware for a reason.

 

To facilitate this, in addition to asynchronous compute queues, the Xbox One hardware supports two concurrent render pipes. The two render pipes can allow the hardware to render title content at high priority while concurrently rendering system content at low priority. The GPU hardware scheduler is designed to maximise throughput and automatically fills "holes" in the high-priority processing. This can allow the system rendering to make use of the ROPs for fill, for example, while the title is simultaneously doing synchronous compute operations on the Compute Units.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-the-complete-xbox-one-interview

 

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they dont need to reserve anything for system content rendering. the hardware will automatically slot the system stuff in when appropriate without affecting graphics performance. its obvious the hard reserve was done because they were behind on the driver. this stuff is designed in the hardware for a reason.

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-the-complete-xbox-one-interview

 

 

Some would say that having to handle two instead of just the game is part of the reason why games aren't hitting that magic 1080p/60fps number.    We'll see how it goes with games that are coming out after this point, because odds are they're going to use the new SDK but we could see older games get updates but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

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Yeah I really do think the updates for Kinect are being brushed aside. Its kind of sad to see that happen considering how much of a positive impact it seems to be having for those that want to use Kinect, but were having trouble getting it to work right.

Instead, that news is buried and ignored underneath the discussion of the new SDK. Don't get me wrong, the new SDK is a big deal, but improving Kinect should also be a big deal in my opinion.

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I don't think it will, I expect there's still enough left to run the voice controls, which don't take up as much as the camera tracking does I'm sure. So that rumored 10% reserved figure could have been cut down to 5% or as low as 2% just for voice and a little video. We don't know how they did it, it could also be that they just updated the SDK to the point that it takes better advantage of the 32MB ESRAM that developers have had to manually manage for now? Either way it should be interesting to see how this works out going forward.

I do realize I am late to the game but I thought I could clarify something. From talking to people I know who mess with this, it's my understanding that the Kinect should still work fine if the game explicitly calls for the Kinect. In those scenarios the Kinect will work as usual. What is changing from what I've heard is that those reserves for the games are no longer held if the game doesn't explicitly use it.

Core system utilization that is reserved for system level Kinect from what I understand is for the most part unchanged.

Of course all of this is early on, and actual real world implementation could be different

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I do realize I am late to the game but I thought I could clarify something. From talking to people I know who mess with this, it's my understanding that the Kinect should still work fine if the game explicitly calls for the Kinect. In those scenarios the Kinect will work as usual. What is changing from what I've heard is that those reserves for the games are no longer held if the game doesn't explicitly use it.

Core system utilization that is reserved for system level Kinect from what I understand is for the most part unchanged.

Of course all of this is early on, and actual real world implementation could be different

That was exactly my impression based on all of the reports leading up to this.

Its just that some people have seized on the idea that this is all down to eliminating Kinect resulting in more performance. Instead, it seems more reasonable to think that MS have optimized the sdk/system in order to still allow for Kinect to function as normal in all situations and give developers more to work with with easier controls.

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'Destiny' 'Sunset Overdrive' will use extra Xbox One power from dev kit update

 

http://majornelson.com/cast/2014/06/08/phil-spencer-on-the-eve-of-e3-2014/

 

Xbox head Phil Spencer made an appearance on Major Nelson?s podcast Sunday evening on the eve of E3 2014 where he confirmed that upcoming games like ?Destiny? and ?Sunset Overdrive? will make use of the upcoming Xbox One dev kit update that makes more of the console?s GPU power available. He also clarified exactly what the upcoming dev kit does and doesn't mean for gamers.

The Xbox One dev kit update that is being made available to developers in June will free up 10 percent of the console?s GPU that was reserved for use with the Kinect. Spencer was the one to make the original announcement and confirmed that ?Sunset Overdrive? will take advantage of the update.

?They are going to use the increased capabilities that lowering the reserve will have to actually make a more vibrant and more alive gameplay space,? Spencer claimed. ?Even our friends at Bungie?they are going to up the resolution of ?Destiny? based on this change.?

Both Major Nelson (aka Xbox Director of Programming Larry Hyrb) and Spencer called the freeing up the reserve a normal cycle in console development that was also seen with the Xbox 360. Spencer also reiterated that, despite reports to the contrary, Xbox One owners who unplug their Kinect will suddenly see an increase in power. That?s not the way it works as the freeing up of the power reserved from the GPU for the motion sensor happens on a game by game basis through code.

?Everybody should leave Kinect plugged in,? Spencer explained. ?Because as soon as the game isn?t running anymore, you quit the game, you go back to the dash, you are going to have all the great functionality that you ever had.?

As mentioned before, the freeing up of resources and general tool improvements with the Xbox One dev kit will have no effect on current Xbox One games. It?s not even known if developers will be able to go back and tweak the game with a patch to run at a higher or more stable framerate. That does nothing for resolution though which would require a rework of all of a game?s assets

 

 

http://www.examiner.com/article/destiny-sunset-overdrive-will-use-extra-xbox-one-power-from-dev-kit-update

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I do realize I am late to the game but I thought I could clarify something. From talking to people I know who mess with this, it's my understanding that the Kinect should still work fine if the game explicitly calls for the Kinect. In those scenarios the Kinect will work as usual. What is changing from what I've heard is that those reserves for the games are no longer held if the game doesn't explicitly use it.

Core system utilization that is reserved for system level Kinect from what I understand is for the most part unchanged.

Of course all of this is early on, and actual real world implementation could be different

Yup, exactly right.

From an architectural point of view, the only thing the GPU needs to do is process and understand the raw video data being fed from the Kinect. The snapped apps and OS portion is handled by the reserved CPU cores and the voice processing from Kinect is done by SHAPE (which was mentioned in that technical interview).

 

That should mean full functionality with the Kinect plugged in with the game using the reserved 10%. Obviously any Kinect explicit functionality, voice excluding, wouldn't be possible. 

 

They always said this was coming, even before launch so this is hardly surprising. What I'm interested in is if this leads to any patches for games like Titanfall where they said they would increase the resolution on the back of this. Even games like PvZ which run at a lock 60 in 900p. The game even runs in 1080p in split-screen with no AA so if that was patched, that'd be cool.

 

The Destiny/SO article is nice to read as well, especially Bungies comments. It was rumored for the X1 version to be 900p so if there's an increase, most likely 1080p.

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