Update to Xbox One dev kit gives Devs access to more GPU bandwith

[Showan]

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[vcfan]

/\ nvm u fixed it

[Showan]

fixed :)

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Thank you so much....LOL...

 

Chrome is giving me a hard time right now with the embed

[George P Global Moderator]

I posted about this in the June update thread.  Interesting news all around.

[Showan]

I posted about this in the June update thread.  Interesting news all around.

 

I really hope that Kinect doesn't take a performance hit.  Yes I'm the only person on Earth who enjoys their Kinect.

[George P Global Moderator]

I really hope that Kinect doesn't take a performance hit.  Yes I'm the only person on Earth who enjoys their Kinect.

 

I don't think it will, I expect there's still enough left to run the voice controls, which don't take up as much as the camera tracking does I'm sure.  So that rumored 10% reserved figure could have been cut down to 5% or as low as 2% just for voice and a little video.  We don't know how they did it, it could also be that they just updated the SDK to the point that it takes better advantage of the 32MB ESRAM that developers have had to manually manage for now?   Either way it should be interesting to see how this works out going forward.

[Showan]

I don't think it will, I expect there's still enough left to run the voice controls, which don't take up as much as the camera tracking does I'm sure.  So that rumored 10% reserved figure could have been cut down to 5% or as low as 2% just for voice and a little video.  We don't know how they did it, it could also be that they just updated the SDK to the point that it takes better advantage of the 32MB ESRAM that developers have had to manually manage for now?   Either way it should be interesting to see how this works out going forward.

 

That makes sense.  

[Alladaskill17]

Woohoo!!

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Hopefully be the end of 792p, 900p minimum now?

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Let's hope it makes an impact. Would be nice if current releases got an update to make use of it too :yes: This along with the net patch for BF4 might actually convince me to pick it back up. We shall see...

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Sounds like MS had to choose between Kinect and 10% resources rather kinect / sales

 

By Jeffrey Matulef Published Wednesday, 4 June 2014

 

UPDATE 10.25pm: Microsoft has confirmed that this boost in performance is in fact due to Kinect being stripped from the package. When asked if the two were related, a Microsoft spokesperson sent Eurogamer the following response:

"Yes, the additional resources allow access to up to 10 per cent additional GPU performance. We're committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better by giving them the option to use the GPU reserve in whatever way is best for them and their games."

 

And will this mean more games will hit the 1080p 60fps benchmark that's all the rage these days, I asked?

 

"Xbox One games look beautiful and have rich gameplay and platform features. How developers choose to access the extra GPU performance for their games will be up to them. We have started working with a number of developers on how they can best take advantage of these changes. We will have more to share in the future."

 

Microsoft also offered the following statement on the dev kit update in general:

 

?Just as we're committed to making ongoing system updates for our fans to enjoy new features of Xbox One, we're also committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better. In June we're releasing a new SDK making it possible for developers to access additional GPU resources previously reserved for Kinect and system functions. The team is continually calibrating the system to determine how we can give developers more capabilities. With this SDK, we will include new options for how developers can use the system reserve as well as more flexibility in our natural user interface reserve (voice and gesture). We'll continue to work closely with developers to help them bring great games to Xbox One.?

 

ORIGINAL STORY 9.21pm: Xbox One dev kits are receiving an increase in GPU bandwidth this month, announced head of Xbox Phil Spencer today on Twitter.

 

"June #XboxOne software dev kit gives devs access to more GPU bandwidth. More performance, new tools and flexibility to make games better," the Microsoft exec wrote.

 

Could this new potential have anything to do with the console no longer being tethered to Kinect all the time? Also, will it mean more games will hit the 1080p 60fps benchmark that's all the rage these days? We've asked Microsoft to clarify what sorts of performance boosts we can expect from this and will update as we find out more.

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-06-04-xbox-one-dev-kits-receive-more-gpu-bandwidth

 

Think that puts into perspective how important "resolutiongate" is to them.

[spenser.d]

Sounds like MS had to choose between Kinect and 10% resources rather kinect / sales

 

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-06-04-xbox-one-dev-kits-receive-more-gpu-bandwidth

 

Think that puts into perspective how important "resolutiongate" is to them.

 

Obviously it was going to be important - numbers make easy cannon fodder, even they don't actually make much of a difference.

 

As long as I can still say "Xbox Watch TV" after I'm done gaming and it works I'm okay with this (or "Xbox Unsnap" when I accidentally hit LT in a TItanfall lobby...) :P

[dipsylalapo Supervisor]

As long as I can still say "Xbox Watch TV" after I'm done gaming and it works I'm okay with this (or "Xbox Unsnap" when I accidentally hit LT in a TItanfall lobby...) :p

 

Ha, glad I'm not the only one that does that ;)

[vcfan]

Sounds like MS had to choose between Kinect and 10% resources rather kinect / sales

 

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-06-04-xbox-one-dev-kits-receive-more-gpu-bandwidth

 

Think that puts into perspective how important "resolutiongate" is to them.

actually, it sounds to me like its something they said they were going to do back in october of last year

 

"The current reservation provides strong isolation between the title and the system and simplifies game development - strong isolation means that the system workloads, which are variable, won't perturb the performance of the game rendering. In the future, we plan to open up more options to developers to access this GPU reservation time while maintaining full system functionality."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-microsoft-to-unlock-more-gpu-power-for-xbox-one-developers

[George P Global Moderator]

They did say they were going to open it up more, this isn't unexpected, the only thing here is how and how much.  There's no way they completely got rid of any type of reserve just because a user might not have the Kinect at all, that would break things, and the reserve IMO, isn't just for Kinect, it's for smooth app switching and snapping of apps and so on.

 

I think the SDK update is a combination of a reduction in reserve, improved drivers, and optimized tools to better take advantage of the hardware to begin with.    If people think unplugging your Kinect will now somehow give you a automatic performance boost in games then I think they're wrong.

[George P Global Moderator]

And just to prove my point this just hit twitter.

 

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Just incase anyone still had the wrong idea here.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

actually, it sounds to me like its something they said they were going to do back in october of last year

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-microsoft-to-unlock-more-gpu-power-for-xbox-one-developers

 

They did say it, but now they are expanding that in order to do it they had to remove Kinect. Maybe in future they'll be able to manage the resources on the fly better.

[spenser.d]

They did say it, but now they are expanding that in order to do it they had to remove Kinect. Maybe in future they'll be able to manage the resources on the fly better.

 

Well they didn't have to remove Kinect, they just had to decide not to reserve unnecessary resources for it. It doesn't take 10% of the GPU to listen for commands :P The restriction just became pointless when they removed Kinect.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Well they didn't have to remove Kinect, they just had to decide not to reserve unnecessary resources for it. It doesn't take 10% of the GPU to listen for commands :p The restriction just became pointless when they removed Kinect.

 

Just going by the comments given to EG, they say the two are related. No idea where these reports of "extra HP" nonsense comes from. EG's quote is the original source but without extra added.

 

Rewind a few weeks ago and I think it was Yusuf who said they didn't remove Kinect to increase sales. That begs the question why did they remove it then if not for sales / the 10% which will be in the SDK...

 

Why not keep it in the box, release the SDK which auto-manages the resources and not upset the kinect-fans?

[Ironman273]

Just going by the comments given to EG, they say the two are related. No idea where these reports of "extra HP" nonsense comes from. EG's quote is the original source but without extra added.

 

Rewind a few weeks ago and I think it was Yusuf who said they didn't remove Kinect to increase sales. That begs the question why did they remove it then if not for sales / the 10% which will be in the SDK...

 

Why not keep it in the box, release the SDK which auto-manages the resources and not upset the kinect-fans?

This generation seems to be a mirror image of last gens at this point.  Sony had the success of the PS2 to float the PS3 until they worked the kinks out but the 360, while a success for Microsoft, wasn't the leader that the PS2 was in its generation.  They need to fix things fast before it keeps heading further down.

[trooper11]

Just going by the comments given to EG, they say the two are related. No idea where these reports of "extra HP" nonsense comes from. EG's quote is the original source but without extra added.

 

Rewind a few weeks ago and I think it was Yusuf who said they didn't remove Kinect to increase sales. That begs the question why did they remove it then if not for sales / the 10% which will be in the SDK...

MS was claiming the access to more of that 10% of resources would come at some point for a very long time, way before there was even talk of unbundling Kinect.

What isn't helping is the conflicting comments. Its clear though that removing Kinect was not part of the plan for giving developers more access to resources. My guess is that MS had a long term plan that involved giving developers the ability to tap into extra resources while using Kinect or not. Now that there is a sku without Kinect, MS might be able to offer developers even more access to resources, but I kind of doubt that.

Even if a developer does not use Kinect, MS integrated the thing with the OS, so some amount of resources must be devoted to its usage while your in a game. So unless developers want to deal with 2 builds of a game (one that works on X1s using Kinect and one that works with X1s without), then what is more likely is that MS simply opens up more resources thanks to optimizations across the board.

 

Why not keep it in the box, release the SDK which auto-manages the resources and not upset the kinect-fans?

Really? The kinect-fans represent the minority in this discussion. That ship has sailed. Heck, MS may have been planning to offer a sku without Kinect from the beginning and simply remained flexible on when that happened based on factors like sales, etc.

They sure did make statements that pointed to freeing up resources well before Kinect's removal.

[vcfan]

They did say it, but now they are expanding that in order to do it they had to remove Kinect. Maybe in future they'll be able to manage the resources on the fly better.

they arent removing kinect. they are selling a new sku without kinect. they will still sell kinect skus and sell kinect separately. its not like if you don't have Kinect plugged in your box will be faster. it just means developers can now choose to use those reserves if they don't use Kinect in their games, as opposed to the reserves being locked regardless.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

MS was claiming the access to more of that 10% of resources would come at some point for a very long time, way before there was even talk of unbundling Kinect.

What isn't helping is the conflicting comments. Its clear though that removing Kinect was not part of the plan for giving developers more access to resources. My guess is that MS had a long term plan that involved giving developers the ability to tap into extra resources while using Kinect or not. Now that there is a sku without Kinect, MS might be able to offer developers even more access to resources, but I kind of doubt that.

Even if a developer does not use Kinect, MS integrated the thing with the OS, so some amount of resources must be devoted to its usage while your in a game. So unless developers want to deal with 2 builds of a game (one that works on X1s using Kinect and one that works with X1s without), then what is more likely is that MS simply opens up more resources thanks to optimizations across the board.

Really? The kinect-fans represent the minority in this discussion. That ship has sailed. Heck, MS may have been planning to offer a sku without Kinect from the beginning and simply remained flexible on when that happened based on factors like sales, etc.

They sure did make statements that pointed to freeing up resources well before Kinect's removal.

 

The plan was always there, but maybe it came to a roadblock of some sorts which forced the ultimatum to remove it. Only MS know that sort of detail, otherwise they wouldn't have removed it when Yusuf said it wasn't to increase sales. For now the official word is the two are related. How much and in what sense, we don't know and I doubt we'll know them for some time either. I think most were scoffing at Yusuf's comments and it wouldn't be the first time he has said something stupid. So it very well might be the two are related, but not impossible with it in the box, and indeed the removal was to boost sales primarily.

 

It won't come down to 2 versions of games. People suggested that same idea when the HD DVD drive released and space was beginning to be questioned on DVD9. It's just going to take a lot of resourcement management to offer enough to listen for commands when the game doesn't include other kinect features but still allow OS access. Something we won't even have to think about, hence why MN said you don't need to unhook it for "more HP". That would be a ridiculous solution and ultimately most people would probably disconnect as soon as they hear their games can perform better (particularly the casual crowd who don't really understand it all).

 

Again, I'm well aware of the comments on freeing up the 10% long before kinect was taken out. I posted the articles remember :laugh: The idea of removing Kinect was Phil Spencer's idea apparently (there's a quote online somewhere). He started that ball rolling as soon as he took over. The conflict in message is caused by the quote from EG yesterday.

 

they arent removing kinect. they are selling a new sku without kinect. they will still sell kinect skus and sell kinect separately. its not like if you don't have Kinect plugged in your box will be faster. it just means developers can now choose to use those reserves if they don't use Kinect in their games, as opposed to the reserves being locked regardless.

 

I never said any of those things? Not sure why you're replying to me as if I did.

 

 

This generation seems to be a mirror image of last gens at this point.  Sony had the success of the PS2 to float the PS3 until they worked the kinks out but the 360, while a success for Microsoft, wasn't the leader that the PS2 was in its generation.  They need to fix things fast before it keeps heading further down.

 

Agreed, and I've said as much here on NW before. That's why I am all in favour of the "tough love" treatment as it arguably made Sony much more stronger and taught them some very valuable lessons. MS spent 2013 learning them and to their credit have responded much faster than Sony did. Hopefully they don't forget it though and they remember the gaming market can make and break you.

[vcfan]

I never said any of those things? Not sure why you're replying to me as if I did.

didnt you say in order to do it,they had to remove kinect? that doesnt make sense if they will still be selling a sku with kinect.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

didnt you say in order to do it,they had to remove kinect? that doesnt make sense if they will still be selling a sku with kinect.

 

No, the spokesperson who answered EG said the two are related. There's no sense in quoting something from last year when the circumstance may have changed and any plans they had originally to do it didn't work. There is a conflicting message.

 

I've never said any of the following:

 

1: kinect is gone

2: kinect won't be sold separately or never again included with another SKU

3: disconnecting the kinect offers more power