The Surface RT Challenge

[Dashel]

I've noticed that browsing on the SurtRT isn't as speedy as on my full computers, but it's definitely faster than browsing on my Android tablet on the same connection. But while it is slower than my full computers, it's not so slow as to be a problem.

Understood, but you set the bar as against actual PCs, not mobile. ;)

 

Page compatibility for ModernIE is usually more of a headache (no plugins) than the sluggish speeds.

[DConnell Member]

Understood, but you set the bar as against actual PCs, not mobile. ;)

 

Page compatibility for ModernIE is usually more of a headache (no plugins) than the sluggish speeds.

 

Honestly, I haven't had any problems. Even the interactive Wizard World map was in ModernIE.

 

And I was just making a comment on the relative browsing speed. It's something I'll need to consider when I decide if this little device can replace my laptop. Mind you, if I didn't have my tower system for the heavier stuff, I wouldn't even be considering the replacement.

 

But all things considered, the Surface is an impressive piece of tech. Why people are still buying iPads instead of these I'll never understand . . .

[Dashel]

Its a nitpick as SurfaceRT is a very impressive piece, especially for business.  Most seem more interested that their eight year olds have a digital pacifier...

 

I still hit a fair share of random Flash issues and other dev faux pas which can be troublesome without an alternate.  Plus my wife manages to lock it up here and there with too many tabs open (I'm still suspect of the processor and their app sleeping model).  Simple things to fix for the 3rd gen one (crosses fingers for digitizer + 3:2 ratio!; I want my Courier).

 

Another quirk is I would love to see a few of the more basic tools, particularly networking, be ported to ARM on the desktop...Still, powershell....

[FreeJAC1310]

I picked up a Surface 2 when they came out. Same sort of boat as you. I wanted a light tablet that wasn't an iPad and that wasn't full desktop Windows. At the time I didn't want the bulk or a device that could get malware. Surface 2 fit the bill. The touch cover is so nice and thin but not the greatest to type on. If I ever get into typing a lot on this device I would get the type cover. A few things to note about my setup:

 

1) Here is the bag I'm using http://travelstore.ricksteves.com/catalog/index.cfm?fuseaction=product&theParentId=8&id=508

It's real quality and has lots of room for my tech junk. I have downsized from a full Dell laptop backpack to this.

 

2) Remote Desktop. I have setup Windows 8.1 in a VM dedicated to remote apps for my Surface 2. Google Chrome as an example. I really don't use this much it was more of an experiment than anything. The only time it really came in handy was when I took an on-line course and the courseware was a DRM'ed PDF with lock lizard software. They didn't have a modern app only an app for iPad and Windows desktop software. I loaded the desktop software on the VM and then setup a remote app .rdp file for it and it worked perfectly. Here is the software I am using for the remote app stuff. http://www.kimknight.net/remoteapptool

I never tried the web interface stuff just stuck with a folder of .rdp files representing the remote apps on my Surface 2 desktop. I did manage to make the remote app icons show up when making the connection which is a nice touch. I also use the built-in remote desktop app to connect to the HTPC in the basement to manage my Media Center recordings etc. 

 

3) RT Desktop Apps. I have not tried this one but have been intrigued. If one comes along that is a must have I may decide to risk it. This basically allows you to run desktop apps that have been either deemed compatible with Windows RT or have been recompiled to work. You have to 'jail break' RT and the jail break expires on each reboot. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2092348

 

4) Memory expansion. I installed a 64Gb SD card and encrypted it just like the C: drive is on the Surface by default. Also moved my OneDrive sync to that memory card to free up C: space. I followed this guide. http://www.blogordie.com/2013/11/safely-extending-windows-rt-memory-with-a-micro-sd-card/

 

5) Remote printing. I have Google cloud print https://tools.google.com/dlpage/cloudprintservice setup as a service on my RemoteApp VM so that I can print from RT. I use the Kumo print modern app at home with Google cloud print as well as Thinprint modern app at my moms house. My kids like to print stuff off on Grandma's colour printer. ThinPrint was very easy to setup the Google stuff because the printer is not natively supported (classic printer?)was quite tricky. 

 

6) Multi user aspects. Really love that myself, wife, and the kids can  each sign in with their own Microsoft accounts and have their own personal settings apps wall paper etc. follow them. I use a picture password for quick access each of the girls use a pin password while wife uses a standard password.

 

7) Next on my todo list is to setup VPN access to my home LAN. I have Server Essentials setup as a home server so was hoping to try out the Direct Access VPN capabilities. That way when I am out and about with the Surface2 I can connect home securely and use the encrypted VPN tunnel for surfing over the open wi-fi.

 

Anyway this is my experience with an RT device, taking advantage of what it offers.

[DConnell Member]

I picked up a Surface 2 when they came out. Same sort of boat as you. I wanted a light tablet that wasn't an iPad and that wasn't full desktop Windows. At the time I didn't want the bulk or a device that could get malware. Surface 2 fit the bill. The touch cover is so nice and thin but not the greatest to type on. If I ever get into typing a lot on this device I would get the type cover. A few things to note about my setup:

 

1) Here is the bag I'm using http://travelstore.ricksteves.com/catalog/index.cfm?fuseaction=product&theParentId=8&id=508

It's real quality and has lots of room for my tech junk. I have downsized from a full Dell laptop backpack to this.

 

2) Remote Desktop. I have setup Windows 8.1 in a VM dedicated to remote apps for my Surface 2. Google Chrome as an example. I really don't use this much it was more of an experiment than anything. The only time it really came in handy was when I took an on-line course and the courseware was a DRM'ed PDF with lock lizard software. They didn't have a modern app only an app for iPad and Windows desktop software. I loaded the desktop software on the VM and then setup a remote app .rdp file for it and it worked perfectly. Here is the software I am using for the remote app stuff. http://www.kimknight.net/remoteapptool

I never tried the web interface stuff just stuck with a folder of .rdp files representing the remote apps on my Surface 2 desktop. I did manage to make the remote app icons show up when making the connection which is a nice touch. I also use the built-in remote desktop app to connect to the HTPC in the basement to manage my Media Center recordings etc. 

 

3) RT Desktop Apps. I have not tried this one but have been intrigued. If one comes along that is a must have I may decide to risk it. This basically allows you to run desktop apps that have been either deemed compatible with Windows RT or have been recompiled to work. You have to 'jail break' RT and the jail break expires on each reboot. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2092348

 

4) Memory expansion. I installed a 64Gb SD card and encrypted it just like the C: drive is on the Surface by default. Also moved my OneDrive sync to that memory card to free up C: space. I followed this guide. http://www.blogordie.com/2013/11/safely-extending-windows-rt-memory-with-a-micro-sd-card/

 

5) Remote printing. I have Google cloud print https://tools.google.com/dlpage/cloudprintservice setup as a service on my RemoteApp VM so that I can print from RT. I use the Kumo print modern app at home with Google cloud print as well as Thinprint modern app at my moms house. My kids like to print stuff off on Grandma's colour printer. ThinPrint was very easy to setup the Google stuff because the printer is not natively supported (classic printer?)was quite tricky. 

 

6) Multi user aspects. Really love that myself, wife, and the kids can  each sign in with their own Microsoft accounts and have their own personal settings apps wall paper etc. follow them. I use a picture password for quick access each of the girls use a pin password while wife uses a standard password.

 

7) Next on my todo list is to setup VPN access to my home LAN. I have Server Essentials setup as a home server so was hoping to try out the Direct Access VPN capabilities. That way when I am out and about with the Surface2 I can connect home securely and use the encrypted VPN tunnel for surfing over the open wi-fi.

 

Anyway this is my experience with an RT device, taking advantage of what it offers.

 

1) I should take a picture of the bag I picked. It's a Targus with a hard exterior, which should provide a nice amount of protection. It has enough extra space for my charger, HDMI cable, USB port and a few flash drives. I can't quite fit a full-sized mouse, so I'll probably have to get a little travel mouse. A little mouse for a little computer. It works, I guess. :)

 

2) I'm sure you've read my experiments with remote desktop here.

 

3) IIRC that jailbreak only works with RT 8.0. In 8.1 Microsoft closed off the method this uses. But you can always use remote desktop to simulate desktop programs.

 

4) I'm using a 32 GB card in mine. I'd love to go to 64, but I'm waiting for a good sale. 32 seemed to be the sweet spot for capacity vs. price, at least for me. It's enough space for documents, pictures and a few movies, so I'm satisfied.

 

5) I found a Brother Inkjet class driver that works well with my MFC-490CW, so I don't have to use any cloud services. I can just print directly. It took some playing, though. The funny thing is, the Windows compatibility site says the 490CW isn't supported. Maybe it's the scanner part that isn't supported, but I do my scanning on the big system.

 

6) Yeah, that's a nice feature. I'm the only user on my Surface, but it's nice to have the option,

 

7) Sounds interesting. Maybe you should create a thread when you do that. I know I'd love to read about it.

[DConnell Member]

Day 8:

Not too much to report today. Was fighting a headache, so I napped for most of the evening. I did a little web surfing and reading, but nothing too limit-challenging.

 

Although the other day I discovered the RT is robust enough to play Netflix video on a second screen at 720p while I do stuff on the primary. I wasn't expecting that - could be useful.
 

[DConnell Member]

Day 9:

 

Still not doing anything massively thrilling. I played a little Asphalt 8 using my Logitech gamepad and looked over the layout for Wizard World (only 2 days away!). Most of the night was spent on convention prep - laundry, custom T-shirt, etc.

 

At this point I'm open to suggestions on things to try - any ideas?

 

I'm still not really missing my laptop for routine casual computing. I think I need to call my cousin and see if a certain 3rd grader could use a laptop.

[neo158]

Day 9:

 

Still not doing anything massively thrilling. I played a little Asphalt 8 using my Logitech gamepad and looked over the layout for Wizard World (only 2 days away!). Most of the night was spent on convention prep - laundry, custom T-shirt, etc.

 

At this point I'm open to suggestions on things to try - any ideas?

 

I'm still not really missing my laptop for routine casual computing. I think I need to call my cousin and see if a certain 3rd grader could use a laptop.

 

If you have an Xbox 360 or One you could try using the tablet for SmartGlass if you haven't already.

[Dot Matrix]

Nice job on the thread, DConnell! (y)

[DConnell Member]

If you have an Xbox 360 or One you could try using the tablet for SmartGlass if you haven't already.

 

I do. I've played around with Smartglass a little, but haven't delved too deep. It's worth another play, though. I actually bought Pacific Rim with 2nd screen function for Smartscreen. I've never actually watched all the 2nd screen content - got too engrossed in the movie itself.

[DConnell Member]

Day 10:

 

My focus tonight was on packing for Wizard World, so I wasn't on the Surface much. Well, apart from a little reading, Facebook and typing this post. The next couple days will be a real test. I'll be away for a couple days, the sort of trip I'd usually bring my laptop on. And I won't have my  tower to fall back on.

 

It'll be interesting.

[primexx]

I pretty much replaced my laptop (tablet PC) with the original Surface as soon as I got it. I've moved my laptop < 10 times since then, only when I know ahead of time that I need the full x86 support. Otherwise I've used the Surface for regular daily schoolwork for about a year and a half as well as all my travel-time computing needs. Since it has full Office, there really wasn't much of anything that I used to be able to do that I couldn't anymore.

 

Surface was announced a year and something after I got the laptop, so now I have two "mobile" devices not including the phone. It's still very capable (very high end when I got it) so I'm going to repurpose it into a desktop replacement/supplement. I'll probably consolidate back down to one mobile device on my next upgrade cycle - probably will go with the Surface Pro to get the full tablet PC functionality in a smaller tablet form factor.

[DConnell Member]

Day 11/12/13:

 

Did a little last minute planning for the convention with my brother - I checked the schedule for the con while he checked the train schedule.

 

After the convention, I downloaded the pictures to the Surface and uploaded them to Facebook. I could have done it from my phone, but it's much more efficient using the browser version of FB than the app.

 

I also posted a couple cosplayer pics in the Pretty Girls thread. More to come. Resized them in Paint on the RT desktop. Not fancy, but it does the job. I should probably do the last couple in PhotoShop Express - I haven't played with it much yet.

[_dandy_]

I've only read a couple of entries from the start of this thread, but have you tried hooking up a USB hub to your RT, then a regular-sized keyboard and mouse (and maybe a monitor, if you have the adapter)...?

 

With that setup, and Microsoft's Remote Desktop program (or whatever alternative you prefer), you can pretty much use your RT as a dumb terminal and run anything off of your 'main' system from it.  That's how I use my Surface Pro (with a USB 3 hub, and running 3 1920x1200 monitors off of it).  I've retired my old AMD machine, and run everything off of a VM host I have set up elsewhere in the house, and RDP all day long into the individual VMs from my tablet.

[DConnell Member]

I regularly use a USB hub with the SurfRT, and I've got a micro-HDMI cable. I've mostly used it for movies, but, that's definitely a set-up worth trying.

[DConnell Member]

Day 14:

 

Did some catching up on messages, and followed the reports from Botcon (annual Transformers convention).

 

I set up a Win 7 virtual machine on the tower, but I'm having some issues with the screen resolution - the VM machine doesn't understand it's attached to a widescreen monitor. So I haven't tried remoting into this VM from the Surface yet.

 

Played around a bit with gaming using Splashtop - I discovered that I can't run games fullscreen and have them display on the client - they need to be windowed. I'll have to set that up on the tower itself and then try it again tonight.

 

Overall, I'm having a lot of fun with this project - it's interesting to find ways to get around the RT limitations for more advanced uses. This really is a far more capable machine and OS than a lot of people think.

[neo158]

Day 14:

 

Did some catching up on messages, and followed the reports from Botcon (annual Transformers convention).

 

I set up a Win 7 virtual machine on the tower, but I'm having some issues with the screen resolution - the VM machine doesn't understand it's attached to a widescreen monitor. So I haven't tried remoting into this VM from the Surface yet.

 

Played around a bit with gaming using Splashtop - I discovered that I can't run games fullscreen and have them display on the client - they need to be windowed. I'll have to set that up on the tower itself and then try it again tonight.

 

Overall, I'm having a lot of fun with this project - it's interesting to find ways to get around the RT limitations for more advanced uses. This really is a far more capable machine and OS than a lot of people think.

 

My Surface is one of the initial batch so I've seen it change a lot since the initial release on Windows RT, the one thing that hobbled it initially was Office Home & Student 2013 as under the license agreement you can't use it in a corporate environment. With the introduction of Outlook 2013 that has changed though and unless you're working for a company that uses a lot of desktop apps, then a Windows RT device is a perfectly suitable alternative to a Laptop or Ultrabook.

 

I actually wrote a good portion of my dissertation on my Surface.

[Dot Matrix]

I actually wrote a good portion of my dissertation on my Surface.

Impossible! Everyone knows Windows 8 is only good for browsing Facebook! :p

 

/s

[Darrian]

I wouldn't think it's too much of a stretch that you could do most everything you need to on a Surface.  Since I cannot afford a Surface I am still using my Nook HD+ with CM11 when I'm away from home (and I currently am and will be for several weeks) and while I miss my desktop games or having mass storage for my movies/shows it's pretty capable.  If Android can do it surely Windows can.

[DConnell Member]

Day 15:

 

Switched that game to windowed on my tower - now Splashtop can display it with no problem.

 

I reformatted the 32 GB microSD card I use as the Surface's data drive as NTFS. This way I can put the Onedrive folder on the card.

 

One potential concern down the road is that I only have about 9 GB left on the internal drive out of the original 32. I'm a little reluctant to remove the recovery partition to gain additional space - I have a recovery flash drive made, but I like having multiple recovery option. I frequently audit my installed apps, so this might not be an issue too soon. I might just have to give up Asphalt 8 on the Surface.

[DConnell Member]

Day 16:

 

    More routine use - Facebook, forums, light typing. I'm really thinking I should set aside some money for a Type Cover. Or use my wireless keyboard more. The Touch Cover can be annoying at times.

 

    Has anyone tried letting Windows compress old files on the RT? I'm a little hesitant to try it, even though the function is offered. I'm concerned that whatever space savings I'd get would be offset by worse performance due to decompressing the data.

 

   I've got a very interesting custom external hard drive on the way that I ordered at Wizard World. It'll likely be used for additional storage for the Surface, or maybe backup. I'll probably be posting a review when it arrives - if the product is as nice as the couple doing the customizing, then they deserve some publicity.

 

    I'm currently backing up my data to a share on my tower using File History. Does anyone have any more robust suggestions? I'm not keeping anything critical on the Surface yet, but if it becomes my main portable machine that could change.

[DConnell Member]

Day 17:

 

I thought of a consideration that might make me hold onto the laptop: connecting to and working on my router. A wired connection is best for that, and the SurfRT only does wireless. I've looked at USB to Ethernet adapters, but haven't found one that will work with the RT yet. So I might want to hold onto the laptop for maintenance tasks, even if I don't use it often. Maybe set the laptop up as an XBMC device so it's not just sitting idle in the bag?

 

Hooked up my wireless keyboard to the RT. As expected, it's a much nicer experience for typing. I might use this when I'm keeping the Surface stationary, and just use the touch cover as a cover, and when I'm out with the Surface.Or I could pick up one of the $90 type covers on Amazon. Unless someone knows of any better deals going on right now?

[DConnell Member]

Day 18:

 

 I got a suggestion on another forum about how to get a wired connection on the Surface. I gave it a try with the USB-Ethernet adapter I have. It didn't work, but I would have been surprised if it had. So it looks like I may be keeping the laptop for network maintenance. And maybe I'll set it up as my XBMC device as well.

[_dandy_]

From your Day 16 message:  I'm not convinced letting it compress files will result in much of a performance hit.  That may have been true in years gone by (pre-GHz CPUs), but even the lowly CPU in the RT should be able to keep things running smoothly.  Especially if it only compresses old files that are never touched--aside from the time required to perform the initial compression, what's the subsequent hit?

 

As for backups:  I haven't tried File History myself, but from my understanding of it, you're pretty much already doing it the way it's intended to be used.  I've been using robocopy.exe for years, and it's all I use to keep files in sync.  The .exe has been in the system32 folder for a number of Windows versions--I just checked on my RT, and it looks like they recompiled it for ARM.

 

However, unlike File History, it's not automated...though you can use Task Scheduler to invoke a batch file that'll run it, say, at 2:00am...or multiple times a day...or whatever suits you.

[Stup0t]

I have replaced my laptop with a RT and havent missed a thing, the only issue is the type keyboard, not as responsive as a proper keyboard, but for portability it gets the job done.  Thinking of getting one of those wallet covers with a semi proper keyboard.  Apart from that one issue I havent looked back to my laptop at all.