Xbox One is indeed selling better without Kinect

[techbeck]

Windows "9" sales increased ten-fold because start menu returned? :p or because it is a free upgrade from 7/8?

 

(read my post mid next year)

 

Yea, forgot about the free upgrade.  Doh!

[Ryster]

Without surveying everybody who buys an Xbox One, you're never going to know whether the increased sales are because it doesn't have Kinect, or because it's cheaper.  At the end of the day though, the end result is the same.  No kinect = Cheaper Price = More Sales

[farmeunit]

but this "price drop" is mainly caused by Kinect removal.

and this sales boost caused by previously said "price drop".

 

Lets not forgot why price drop was possible.

This. I don't know why everyone is trying to separate the two. And the title of thread is correct because of this.

[spenser.d]

April was a slow month for both consoles because the boom Titanfall and inFamous brought in March died.

 

The Kinectless SKU was announced in May, hence the 77K estimate for the month. PS4 had 197~K in May for comparisons sake.

 

X1:

Jan 145~K

Feb 258~K

March 310~K

April 115~K

May 77~K

June 150~K

 

So to say this is a "boost" is disingenuous. A "boost" because a sizable chunk waited for a cheaper SKU in June, but overall two poor performing months (average 113~k) due to an early announcement. Hence back to numbers they were seeing. Sony only needs to sell 30~K in June to outsell X1 for the same time period.

 

No doubt a slow release lineup has it's part, factor in that it's exam time for most younger demographics, people going on holiday, the world cup etc. All of those reasons are going to be affecting Sony's numbers too. What's the excuse if the PS4 outsells them tomorrow in NPD?

 

The Kinectless SKU was announced in mid-April actually. And I'll gloss over the fact that your Jan and May numbers are guesses (and thus also June). And I don't know why you need an excuse for Sony to sell more. They're more popular and they have momentum. It's a no-brainer. If you want a dumb excuse though, let's go with the new SKU not being on sale until June 9th. They probably could've gone +30k easily in 9 days if we're assuming people were waiting for the new SKU. That's a dumb excuse, but you asked for one.

 

Sales were slowing before the announcement. They tanked even more for obvious reasons after, then they saw a huge increase in a month with nothing going for it except a new SKU. It's good news. I would consider it a bad sign if their sales cut back significantly during July.

 

I don't expect Microsoft to outsell Sony for a while (if ever, apart from a few months here and there). But so what? It doesn't make it a less enjoyable console, or a market failure, or doomed. Sony would've been gone last gen long ago if that were true.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

The Kinectless SKU was announced in mid-April actually. And I'll gloss over the fact that your Jan and May numbers are guesses (and thus also June). And I don't know why you need an excuse for Sony to sell more. They're more popular and they have momentum. It's a no-brainer. If you want a dumb excuse though, let's go with the new SKU not being on sale until June 9th. They probably could've gone +30k easily in 9 days if we're assuming people were waiting for the new SKU. That's a dumb excuse, but you asked for one.

 

Sales were slowing before the announcement. They tanked even more for obvious reasons after, then they saw a huge increase in a month with nothing going for it except a new SKU. It's good news. I would consider it a bad sign if their sales cut back significantly during July.

 

I don't expect Microsoft to outsell Sony for a while (if ever, apart from a few months here and there). But so what? It doesn't make it a less enjoyable console, or a market failure, or doomed. Sony would've been gone last gen long ago if that were true.

 

http://news.xbox.com/2014/05/xbox-delivering-more-choices

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-05-13-microsoft-to-sell-xbox-one-without-kinect

 

And they're not my guesses, that is what has been deciphered by the sales data. Not to mention I've fully disclosed they are estimates, but that goes for both consoles not just X1.

[JonnyLH]

April was a slow month for both consoles because the boom Titanfall and inFamous brought in March died.

 

The Kinectless SKU was announced in May, hence the 77K estimate for the month. PS4 had 197~K in May for comparisons sake.

 

X1:

Jan 145~K

Feb 258~K

March 310~K

April 115~K

May 77~K

June 150~K

 

So to say this is a "boost" is disingenuous. A "boost" because a sizable chunk waited for a cheaper SKU in June, but overall two poor performing months (average 113~k) due to an early announcement. Hence back to numbers they were seeing. Sony only needs to sell 30~K in June to outsell X1 for the same time period.

 

No doubt a slow release lineup has it's part, factor in that it's exam time for most younger demographics, people going on holiday, the world cup etc. All of those reasons are going to be affecting Sony's numbers too. What's the excuse if the PS4 outsells them tomorrow in NPD?

Eh?

 

Doesn't matter how you word it, double sales from the previous month is no way bad. Imagine if they didn't make these changes and they stayed around the 77~k mark...

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Eh?

 

Doesn't matter how you word it, double sales from the previous month is no way bad. Imagine if they didn't make these changes and they stayed around the 77~k mark...

 

The 77K sales wouldn't have been so low in the first place if the wait between announcement and availability of the new SKU wasn't so long :s Unless you're actually implying the X1 is performing so badly that they were 100+K lower than the competition for another reason?

[compl3x]

It is fair to say correlation doesn't imply causation. This is one month compared to the next since the Kinect has been removed.

 

I'd be willing to say I believe that removing Kinect and dropping the price has spurred sales but I think we'd need more months of increased sales for a useful comparison.

[JonnyLH]

The 77K sales wouldn't have been so low in the first place if the wait between announcement and availability of the new SKU wasn't so long :s Unless you're actually implying the X1 is performing so badly that they were 100+K lower than the competition for another reason?

All I'm saying is, this news is not a negative at all.

[uxo22]

Or it could be both. Getting rid of something people don't want and lowering the price of something people do.

 

It's just too bad MS had to do this whole Kinect dance in the first place.

I happen to like Kinect, and most people that I know that have xbox ones have and like Kinect also.  So please don't say "People don't want"  as if it's a general consensus.

 

Let's say some people won't use it and thus have a hard time spending money on it, while others do.  You sound as if, the 499.99 model has completely stopped selling.

[compl3x]

So please don't say "People don't want"  as if it's a general consensus.

 

 

Seemed general enough for MS to drop it.

[trooper11]

I haven't mentioned anything about expectations. I'm just commenting on the spin. MS have actually hurt themselves in May by announcing the SKU too early and now they've only returned to numbers they were already seeing on a monthly basis. It's not good news.

Not good news? Sales increases are not good news.

No doubt a slow release lineup has it's part, factor in that it's exam time for most younger demographics, people going on holiday, the world cup etc. All of those reasons are going to be affecting Sony's numbers too. What's the excuse if the PS4 outsells them tomorrow in NPD?

The excuse will be that the X1 is less powerful than the ps4 and that people are not interested in paying for a console that is inferior.

I think there is a chance that the numbers are nearly identical, but you could be right and its another blow out month. We will see soon.

 

Seemed general enough for MS to drop it.

The online community had a loud enough voice to convince MS to change. Now, we don't know if MS made the move in order to get rid of Kinect or just to get the price down, but either case was a reaction to negative feedback from people online.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Not good news? Sales increases are not good news.

The excuse will be that the X1 is less powerful than the ps4 and that people are not interested in paying for a console that is inferior.

I think there is a chance that the numbers are nearly identical, but you could be right and its another blow out month. We will see soon.

 

The online community had a loud enough voice to convince MS to change. Now, we don't know if MS made the move in order to get rid of Kinect or just to get the price down, but either case was a reaction to negative feedback from people online.

 

A sales "boost" that you created after you killed your sales the previous month is not good, no. As I said, they've only averaged 113K each month.

 

The competition is almost double that. Even if Sony have a slow month they aren't at risk of dropping below X1 numbers in tomorrow's results.

[LaP]

So have we decided if its because Kinect is gone or because of the cheaper price?

 

 

I would lean toward cheaper price.

[LaP]

That is possible too. People will believe what they want to believe.

 

I mean the author of the article clearly believes that Kinect is the reason, hence the title.

 

I agree though, MS should have not attempted another Kinect release. Damage done.

 

Kinect is a really interesting piece of tech and MS should definitely continue to develop it.

 

But unless Microsoft can bundle the tech inside the console for the same price as the PS then it should remain an addon. I mean by bundle the tech inside that the cameras and mic would be inside the console like smartphones.

 

The point of having Kinect sold with the XBox is to have more support. But does Kinect really need more support? I mean while it is fun and interesting it is not the future of games control. It will never replace controllers for games like fps and such. There's no problem with Kinect having only an handful of party games available. This is what the tech is all about when it comes to gaming.

[trooper11]

A sales "boost" that you created after you killed your sales the previous month is not good, no. As I said, they've only averaged 113K each month.

 

The competition is almost double that. Even if Sony have a slow month they aren't at risk of dropping below X1 numbers in tomorrow's results.

Alright, you have convinced me. This is bad news. They need to be tripling or quadrupling sales in order for it to hit 'good news' territory.

So, now that it is settled that this is not good news at all, then you could say that MS move had little impact at all on sales, putting into question the need to drop Kinect and/or the price at this point. If this move was suppose to be the savior of the console and sales don't move much overall, then maybe it wasn't as big a deal as some claimed.

 

Kinect is a really interesting piece of tech and MS should definitely continue to develop it.

 

But unless Microsoft can bundle the tech inside the console for the same price as the PS then it should remain an addon. I mean by bundle the tech inside that the cameras and mic would be inside the console like smartphones.

Most people online do not want MS to continue with Kinect at all, hence the positive reaction when they added the sku. As far as building the camera and mic into the console, that would be suicide. Do you realize how utterly destroyed MS would get online? The negative sentiments would trickle down and result in mass rejection.

No, this time has proven that very few want something like Kinect around their console. The few of us that are interested in it simply don't represent enough of a group to cater to.

VR is the new fad to take the place of motion/voice controls, so the companies that invest there will get the positive reactions.

[spenser.d]

A sales "boost" that you created after you killed your sales the previous month is not good, no. As I said, they've only averaged 113K each month.

 

The competition is almost double that. Even if Sony have a slow month they aren't at risk of dropping below X1 numbers in tomorrow's results.

 

Yes it is. Maybe May isn't the best month to compare it to, but they still beat out both January and April if we go by popular guesses, and they did it in, as I said, about three weeks time. The only months they haven't beaten are the ones they had Titanfall to ride on. So they're selling more in less time with nothing going on. You can spin it however you want (don't even know why you want to), but it's good news, even if they don't beat Sony.

[George P Global Moderator]

It's a boost, so it's good, but overall sales are average at best for the month, there's no big hit game to push sales for June.  The best thing they could do is show off what's coming and get people to buy into it now and not wait for them to buy when the games come in the fall/winter period.   I sure hope they can space things out better and not have a down period going forward, I don't think it'd be that hard to do, don't see why everyone wants to release new games in the same Spring/Fall period all the time and totally skip Summer.

[macrosslover]

It's a boost, so it's good, but overall sales are average at best for the month, there's no big hit game to push sales for June.  The best thing they could do is show off what's coming and get people to buy into it now and not wait for them to buy when the games come in the fall/winter period.   I sure hope they can space things out better and not have a down period going forward, I don't think it'd be that hard to do, don't see why everyone wants to release new games in the same Spring/Fall period all the time and totally skip Summer.

Rockstar usually takes the summer with their May release.  However more developers do need to recognize that if your game is good then it will sell regardless of which month it was released.

[uxo22]

Seemed general enough for MS to drop it.

perhaps....However, I think they were just looking for answers to the sells disappointment.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Yes it is. Maybe May isn't the best month to compare it to, but they still beat out both January and April if we go by popular guesses, and they did it in, as I said, about three weeks time. The only months they haven't beaten are the ones they had Titanfall to ride on. So they're selling more in less time with nothing going on. You can spin it however you want (don't even know why you want to), but it's good news, even if they don't beat Sony.

 

I'm not spinning anything at all, if anything I'm unspinning MS's PR. I can see through it, BajiRav can see through it, and countless people elsewhere online can.

 

Broken down further they have sold maybe 3 or 4K extra per week in June. Absolutely nowhere near "double" anything, unless of course you can't look past the headline and 77*2 = 150~. The demand for the console hasn't grown and they haven't sold more consoles on trend than they normally would. The only difference is half the sales from May were "lost" (more delay) and sold to in June at a reduced price.

 

I'm completely baffled you can't grasp this.

[spenser.d]

As expected...

 

 

June 2014 NPD: PS4 still outsells Xbox One despite Microsoft?s price cut

 

Console sales are on fire.

 

Gamers spent $736.4 million on new physical gaming products at U.S. retail in June, according to industry-tracking firm The NPD Group. That?s up 24 percent from $593.5 million in the same period last year.

 

The new consoles once again were the big driver of that revenue, as more and more gamers rush to upgrade to Xbox One and PlayStation 4. While hardware performed well, software was down despite a strong second month for Watch Dogs and Mario Kart 8. That?s because new games released last month didn?t do much at retail.

 

?Sales of launch titles in June 2014 did not compare favorably to those launched in June 2013, which included the PS3 exclusive The Last of Us, along with Nintendo?s Animal Crossing: New Leaf, and a retail version of Minecraft for the Xbox 360,? said NPD analyst Liam Callahan.

 

Gamers spent $286.8 million on new games at retail in June. That?s down 3 percent from $296.1 million year-over-year.

 

The Last of Us is a tough act to follow, and it doesn?t help that a ton of consumer spending was tied up in $292.7 million for new hardware. That number represented a 106 percent increase over June 2013.

 

As always, we like to point out that the NPD figures are not comprehensive. They only include new games sold at physical retailers in the U.S. That means no pre-owned sales, no digital distribution, and no mobile. That said, it is a decent snapshot of how the market is behaving.

 

Alright, with that out of the way, let?s get to the top-selling games.

Software

1. Watch Dogs (PS4, 360, Xbox One, PS3, PC)
2. Mario Kart 8 (Wii U)
3. Minecraft (360, PS3)
4. UFC (PS4, Xbox One)
5. FIFA 14 (PS4, 360, Xbox One, PS3, Vita)
6. NBA 2K14 (360, PS3, PS4, Xbox One, PC)
7. Wolfenstein: The New Order (PS4, Xbox One, 360, PS3, PC)
8. Call of Duty: Ghosts (360, PS4, PS3, Xbox One, Wii U, PC)
9. Tomodachi Life (3DS)
10. Grand Theft Auto V (360, PS3)

 

Watch Dogs was the big winner. Ubisoft revealed that is has already sold 8 million copies of the game worldwide, which is an astounding number. It?s no surprise that the open-world hacking game topped the list at U.S. retailers, but it is a bit of a surprise that the Xbox 360 version outsold the Xbox One game. All we?ve heard since November is that gamers want new-gen games. That?s still true for PS4, which was the top platform for Watch Dogs.

 

Another big winner in June was Mario Kart 8. Nintendo?s mascot racer snatched the No. 2 spot despite availability on just one platform. The only other single-platform exclusive game to make the top 10 was also a Nintendo release: the social-life simulator Tomodachi Life.

 

Minecraft at No. 3 still shows the strength of that phenomenon. While the physical PS3 version only debuted a few weeks ago, the year-old Xbox 360 version is still outselling it.

 

The rest of the list is sports or violence ? sometimes both. UFC debuted at No. 4, Wolfenstein: The New Order returned at No. 7, and and Grand Theft Auto V hit No. 10.

 

?In terms of software titles, many of the top games in June 2014 mirrored those of May 2014, with six of the same games ranking in the top ten,? said Callahan. ?Three of these top ten games were also new launches from May 2014 ? Watch Dogs, Mario Kart 8, and Wolfenstein: The New Order ? indicating the weakness of new launches in June.?

 

Finally, the World Cup gave EA Sports? FIFA 14 a boost up to No. 5.

Hardware

The PlayStation 4 was the top-selling console for the sixth month in a row, according to Sony. We?ve reached out for specific numbers, and we?ll update with any new information. This means that not even a $400 Xbox One could outsell the superhot PS4 ? at least not yet.

 

NPD noted that home-console sales were the big reason for the increase in spending.

 

?The 106 percent increase in hardware sales versus June 2013 was lifted entirely by console hardware sales, which were up by over 200 percent,? said Callahan. ?The strong sales performance of console hardware helped to offset the declines seen in portable hardware.?

 

While Xbox One didn?t outsell PS4, it?s clear that both systems are selling well. Microsoft dropped the price of the Xbox One from $500 to $400 (and removed the Kinect camera), and the company revealed yesterday that the sales of the system doubled month-over-month.

 

?Combined sales of Xbox One and PS4 are over 80 percent higher than the combined totals for Xbox 360 and PS3 ? an indication of the strength of the start of this new console generation,? said Callahan.

 

http://venturebeat.com/2014/07/17/june-2014-npd-ps4-and-xbox-one-have-another-strong-month-as-watch-dogs-tops-charts/

I'm not spinning anything at all, if anything I'm unspinning MS's PR. I can see through it, BajiRav can see through it, and countless people elsewhere online can.

 

Broken down further they have sold maybe 3 or 4K extra per week in June. Absolutely nowhere near "double" anything, unless of course you can't look past the headline and 77*2 = 150~. The demand for the console hasn't grown and they haven't sold more consoles on trend than they normally would. The only difference is half the sales from May were "lost" (more delay) and sold to in June at a reduced price.

 

I'm completely baffled you can't grasp this.

 

Yes and I'm not surprised at all that you can't grasp it :rolleyes: You're spinning it your own way and it's rather a lot of nonsense. But say what you will, not a whole lot less to discuss.

[Guest]

from a marketing standpoint this makes absolutely no sense. I'm all for getting more bang for my buck, but the xbox one kinect has proven to be a failure. No titles, bad reviews, and it don't live up to the hype MS's PR dept slung around last year... Probably why they killed it and removed the initiative for developers to even bother wasting their time.

 

What bad reviews? And how did they review it?

[Bigkaye]

What bad reviews? And how did they review it?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fighter_Within is a good one, and that review accounts for 20% of fully-supported kinect games.

[Mr. Gibs]