Microsoft's most boneheaded product is about to be killed off

[MorganX]

Agree. Windows RT is Windows on ARM, nothing more. Tablet happens to be a form factor that it supports. I would say Windows 8 and RT was supposed to "usher in the tablet era" for Microsoft. However, windows has been running on tablets for at least a decade, but not well.

It is an opinion piece, but my point being it was posted in CNN Money in the news section as news about Nadella's announcement. And his opinion about "axing" windows RT is just wrong.

To my knowledge, Windows RT is not being axed and neither is Windows 8. I'm not sure how he formed that statement based on Nadella's announcement. This is pretty much my issue with this article. The headline of the article is "Microsoft's most boneheaded product is about to be killed off". Does this sound like it's supposed to be an opinion article? Or news?

People read financial site for opinions, preferably from financial analysts. TBH, this article is probably a net positive for Microsoft, regardless of it's accuracy (it's hit and miss). It's basically telling investors, MS is dumping a boat anchor, and that is a good thing for investors. It's always good to tell investors you're fixing your unprofitable mistakes.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Title and OP updated.

 

Please follow the BPN guidelines when posting in this subforum.

[airedwin]

People read financial site for opinions, preferably from financial analysts. TBH, this article is probably a net positive for Microsoft, regardless of it's accuracy (it's hit and miss). It's basically telling investors, MS is dumping a boat anchor, and that is a good thing for investors. It's always good to tell investors you're fixing your unprofitable mistakes.

True, I did not think of it that way. I prefer to read facts. I don't think it's good to make financial investments based on someone else's opinion =/

Title and OP updated.

 

Please follow the BPN guidelines when posting in this subforum.

Sorry, I don't post here very often.

[eddman]

Windows RT is a misunderstood OS, some of it is MS' fault, but mostly it's the doings of the so called "tech journalists" (whatever that even means) who fault it for not having the ability to run desktop apps, yet at the same time they are ok with iOS not being compatible with OS X and android not being compatible with chrome OS. Bunch of less informed hypocrites. They poisoned the public's mind against RT, IMO.

 

This CNN writer is one such.

 

The solution would be for MS to completely port the control panel, explorer and of course office to metro and hide the desktop. Maybe then RT might have a chance.

 

P.S. I hope they leave an option to access the desktop though.

[airedwin]

Windows RT is a misunderstood OS, some of it is MS' fault, but mostly it's the doings of the so called "tech journalists" (whatever that even means) who fault it for not having the ability to run desktop apps, yet at the same time they are ok with iOS not being compatible with OS X and android not being compatible with chrome OS. Bunch of less informed hypocrites. They poisoned the public's mind against RT, IMO.

 

This CNN writer is one such.

 

The solution would be for MS to completely port the control panel, explorer and of course office to metro and hide the desktop. Maybe then RT might have a chance.

 

P.S. I hope they leave an option to access the desktop though.

This pretty much sums up what I'm trying to say about this article lol.

[+Asmodai MVC]

As has already been said in this thread the article is simply factually incorrect and sensationalist.

It is factually incorrect because "Windows RT", as others have stated, is just a marketing name for WIndows on ARM.  It is most certainly not going away, although they may choose to name it something else. (in fact they already dropped the "RT" on the Surface 2).

Windows RT will form the basis for the ARM version of Windows 9.  When Nadella said one Windows he means one code base not one shipping product.  When you compile the code base for x86(32 or 64 bit) it is Windows and when you compile the same code for ARM it is what they were calling RT.  Windows 9 will have both versions.  If any product is being dropped it is Windows Phone.  Windows Phone 7.x and 8.x are being replaced by what is basically Windows RT 9.  Likewise I expect there will be server versions of Windows on ARM once the 64bit ARM chips start hitting data centers and they too will be based on the RT code.

[simplezz]

Real world numbers would say otherwise.

There might be a small uptick after Microsoft forced everyone off XP, but overall, the trend is definitely on the decline.

 

There's an awful lot of software out there that isn't suited for or just can't run on a mobile OS.

Let's be realistic here, most of the software you're talking about (programming, professional graphic design, desktop publishing etc), is niche. And Windows isn't necessary for that either. I can do all of that on my Linux PC.

 

Even in the gaming segment, it's on the rise outselling consoles, not decline.

Hardcore gamers who build their own PC's or buy high-end ones, are again a niche market. Lucrative, yet still niche compared with the casual gaming market available on mobile. Even the consoles are getting in on the act.

 

Intel is reporting record desktop CPU sales.

Isn't that coming from the enterprise as they are forced to move away from XP due to support cut off? Long term, that's not sustainable.

 

Yes, the phone and X1 aren't doing the best.. but you're still choosing to ignore the, what is it now, billion and a half people who use Windows daily?

And most of those are old devices. No one's buying a new Windows PC every year like they do smartphones and tablets. I'd like to know how many out of that billion figure Microsoft touted were XP/7 PC's that don't run RT API's or the MS app store. I know I'm running one, so they're counting me. Yet my main system is GNU/Linux. Hardly a good target for would-be Windows developers.

[airedwin]

As has already been said in this thread the article is simply factually incorrect and sensationalist.

It is factually incorrect because "Windows RT", as others have stated, is just a marketing name for WIndows on ARM.  It is most certainly not going away, although they may choose to name it something else. (in fact they already dropped the "RT" on the Surface 2).

Windows RT will form the basis for the ARM version of Windows 9.  When Nadella said one Windows he means one code base not one shipping product.  When you compile the code base for x86(32 or 64 bit) it is Windows and when you compile the same code for ARM it is what they were calling RT.  Windows 9 will have both versions.  If any product is being dropped it is Windows Phone.  Windows Phone 7.x and 8.x are being replaced by what is basically Windows RT 9.  Likewise I expect there will be server versions of Windows on ARM once the 64bit ARM chips start hitting data centers and they too will be based on the RT code.

Yup. Which basically means Windows RT isn't boneheaded or stupid. It's actually a great OS to leverage ARM processors in ways that iOS and Android cannot.

[airedwin]

There might be a small uptick after Microsoft forced everyone off XP, but overall, the trend is definitely on the decline.

Let's be realistic here, most of the software you're talking about (programming, professional graphic design, desktop publishing etc), is niche. And Windows isn't necessary for that either. I can do all of that on my Linux PC.

Hardcore gamers who build their own PC's or buy high-end ones, are again a niche market. Lucrative, yet still niche compared with the casual gaming market available on mobile. Even the consoles are getting in on the act.

Isn't that coming from the enterprise as they are forced to move away from XP due to support cut off? Long term, that's not sustainable.

And most of those are old devices. No one's buying a new Windows PC every year like they do smartphones and tablets. I'd like to know how many out of that billion figure most touted were XP PC's that don't run Windows RT API's or the MS app store. I know I'm running one, so they're counting me. Yet my main system is GNU/Linux. Hardly a good target for would-be Windows developers.

PC gamers are niche, but like you said lucrative. I don't think the casual gaming market isn't as big as you think it is. Most mobile devices are cheap low end devices that don't play games.

[The_Observer]

So my Surface RT is a collectors item?

[+Warwagon MVC]

 Do iPads run all OS X software, of course not, but they sell tons and have made huge inroads into enterprise computing.

 

But Apple also doesn't call the Operating systems running on the iPad OSX RT

[_dandy_]

I'll say one thing for the Surface RT:

 

If all grandma wants from a tablet is to browse the web, and do so with the only browser she's familiar with, then it's the best of both worlds:  Since code has to be recompiled to run on the ARM CPU, there's practically no way to get a virus to run on it.

 

So if you can still find it cheap and all you want from a tablet is to browse the web--by all means, the RT is, IMO, a pretty damn good bet.

 

(The iPad still won't run Flash, right?--that's what I remember first and foremost with my first experience with the RT--web sites "just work")

[airedwin]

But Apple also doesn't call the Operating systems running the iPads OSX RT

They call it Windows 8 on their Surface Pro, which does run all the apps. And you're nitpicking... MAC OSX vs iPad iOS, wow they both share "OS" in the name therefore they should be exactly the same. You'd have a point if the ARM version of their OS was called Windows 8.

[Eric Veteran]

Because RT looks "IDENTICAL" to Windows 8 x86 which can run all those applications.

So? iOS looks like OS X.

[PGHammer]

PC gamers are niche, but like you said lucrative. I don't think the casual gaming market isn't as big as you think it is. Most mobile devices are cheap low end devices that don't play games.

Yet they sell, and Android gaming sells by the ton.  (So does iOS-based gaming; in fact, how many iOS games have ZERO equivalent, on either Android OR Windows - either Modern/RT or even Win32?)

 

The theory that iOS gaming is going nowhere isn't borne out by the hard data - heck, the data on Neowin alone pokes a rather large hole in that argument.  The same applies to Android-based gaming.

 

Yes - the games on either, by and large, are casual - however, that is where most of the game-development action is.  (And no, I am NOT referring to either Zynga OR KING.com - the biggest flaw for both is their LACK of presence on either platform; in fact, King.com has a larger Android presence than Zynga, and even King.com's presence on Android is more a byproduct of their presence on browsers.)

 

I have pointed specifically to casual gaming as the biggest lack in Windows - and that is ALL forms of Windows, not just ModernUI.  It's definitely NOT fun for me to admit, as I am primarily a Windows user - however, I can't ignore the hard data, however much I may want to.

[airedwin]

Yet they sell, and Android gaming sells by the ton.  (So does iOS-based gaming; in fact, how many iOS games have ZERO equivalent, on either Android OR Windows - either Modern/RT or even Win32?)

 

The theory that iOS gaming is going nowhere isn't borne out by the hard data - heck, the data on Neowin alone pokes a rather large hole in that argument.  The same applies to Android-based gaming.

 

Yes - the games on either, by and large, are casual - however, that is where most of the game-development action is.  (And no, I am NOT referring to either Zynga OR KING.com - the biggest flaw for both is their LACK of presence on either platform; in fact, King.com has a larger Android presence than Zynga, and even King.com's presence on Android is more a byproduct of their presence on browsers.)

 

I have pointed specifically to casual gaming as the biggest lack in Windows - and that is ALL forms of Windows, not just ModernUI.  It's definitely NOT fun for me to admit, as I am primarily a Windows user - however, I can't ignore the hard data, however much I may want to.

Maybe it's true, but I hardly think anybody goes out to buy a mobile phone just to play games on.

[+Warwagon MVC]

So? iOS looks like OS X.

 

Yes but Windows puts the new version after the word windows

 

Windows 1.0

Windows 2.0

Windows 3.0

Windows 3.1

Windows 3.1

Windows NT

Windows 95

Windows 98

Windows 98SE

Windows ME

Windows 2000

Windows XP

Windows Vista

Windows 8

Windows 8.1

 

All of these run Windows applications

 

Now we have

 

Windows RT .... Da Fuk.

 

In comparison with OSX.

 

OS 6

OS 7

OS 9

OS X

 

Not

 

6 OS

7 OS

8 OS

9 OS

XOS

 

Thus iOS should be far less confused with OSX

 

as Windows RT is with Windows 8.

[neufuse Veteran]

Not long after Windows RT came out, there was internal discussions going on about killing Windows RT... literally not even months after release it was seen as a failure internally, but they held out for a while.. and now we are seeing that push again

[airedwin]

Yes but Windows puts the new version after the word windows

 

Windows 1.0

Windows 2.0

Windows 3.0

Windows 3.1

Windows 3.1

Windows NT

Windows 95

Windows 98

Windows 98SE

Windows ME

Windows 2000

Windows XP

Windows Vista

Windows 8

Windows 8.1

 

All of these run Windows applications

 

Now we have

 

Windows RT .... Da Fuk.

 

In comparison with OSX.

 

OS 6

OS 7

OS 9

OS X

 

Not

 

6 OS

7 OS

8 OS

9 OS

XOS

 

Thus iOS should be far less confused with OSX

 

as Windows RT is with Windows 8.

I still don't get your point =/ Windows XP is different from Windows 8, so how is it hard to say that Windows RT is different from Windows 8 and Windows XP?

[+Warwagon MVC]

I still don't get your point =/ Windows XP is different from Windows 8, so how is it hard to say that Windows RT is different from Windows 8 and Windows XP?

 

Because Windows RT can't run x86 software and Windows XP and Windows 8 can.

[airedwin]

The point in this discussion is that Windows XP and Windows 8 BOTH run x86 software. Sure Windows 8 might be picky on some software but for the most part it works.

 

Now lets Throw in Windows XP and Windows RT ..

 

Well they both say Windows so I should be able to run all my apps on RT right?

Does Windows NT stuff run on Windows XP?

[+Warwagon MVC]

Does Windows NT stuff run on Windows XP?

 

No but you can still install x86 software not specific to NT on  XP.

[airedwin]

Does Windows NT stuff run on Windows XP?

Name doesn't mean compatibility. PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1 games all aren't expected to run on each other and vice versa.

 

If I were to drive a Honda Civic in 2014 doesn't mean that all parts from a Honda Civic 2001 are supposed to work in my car. Wtf are you smoking?

[TAZMINATOR]

Yes but Windows puts the new version after the word windows

 

Windows 1.0

Windows 2.0

Windows 3.0

Windows 3.1

Windows 3.1

Windows NT

Windows 95

Windows 98

Windows 98SE

Windows ME

Windows 2000

Windows XP

Windows Vista

Windows 8

Windows 8.1

 

All of these run Windows applications

 

Now we have

 

Windows RT .... Da Fuk.

 

In comparison with OSX.

 

OS 6

OS 7

OS 9

OS X

 

Not

 

6 OS

7 OS

8 OS

9 OS

XOS

 

Thus iOS should be far less confused with OSX

 

as Windows RT is with Windows 8.

 

The naming format is fine... 

 

Same thing to the vehicles like this:

 

Ford Mustang

Ford Mustang GT

Ford Mustang GT500

 

Ford F-150

Ford F-150 Limited

Ford F-350

Ford F-350 HD  (Heavy Duty)

etc.

 

The companies can name their products whatever they want. No matter that they sound great or odd.

[airedwin]

No but you can still install x86 software not specific to NT on  XP.

Ok, and I can install apps not specific to Windows 8 on Windows RT in the app store.