How do you feel about the Ribbon UI?

[simonlang]

I have QTTabBar for Windows. I enjoy it very much. I still think it's something that should be provided by Microsoft and not a third party program. I tried to find Dolphin. It did look good, but I couldn't find the Windows version.

 

you can get it over there:

http://windows.kde.org

 

when running the installer just select dolphin (you don't need to install the other kde apps)

[Ian S.]

Just hide it. Technically, you don't need the Ribbon in Office either, if you know the shortcuts.

I do, issue being the touch targets for the tabs are too small, there are no gestures to move between tabs (like swiping) so hiding it makes It difficult to do with more tapping involved.

[Ian W]

No, No I wasn't complaining. :)

 

Anyways Office's ribbon is great, yet on Windows 8 I wish you could have a choice between the ribbon and the Windows 7 UI. I find the Ribbon obscures too much of the screen on my Surface, while on Laptops and Desktops it is great. I agree that it shows more commands up front.

Oh, I didn't think you were complaining or anything. :) I only wanted to explain why I linked to the PDF.

 

I hear you about consistency, but as per Microsoft's example, the best use of the Ribbon is for programs that have quite a large number of features. Notepad is quite simple. As zhangm suggested, why not wordpad? 

True. Perhaps they could update Notepad without removing functionality so that it could have a Ribbon? Then again, it seems kind of pointless since WordPad already has one.

 

except that are not original, the tabbed toolbar already exist far before Jensen promoting his works.

I am aware that Microsoft did not invent the tabbed toolbar. However, when I wrote that I like to use 'official terminology', I was referring to Microsoft's usage of the term 'Ribbon'. Microsoft refers to the feature as such, which is why I prefer to.

 

It looks nice and It works well with the few programs that use it like Windows Live Essentials & Microsoft Office. However, I don't think it would work well for some programs as I can't imagine using it in Paint.NET or FileZilla. And honestly, I think programs need to have a ton of functionality before it should even be considered for use of a program's main interface.

I actually switched from FileZilla to FTP Voyager because the latter uses the Ribbon. FTP Voyager also follows many of Microsoft's Aero design guidelines.

[LimeMaster]

I actually switched from FileZilla to FTP Voyager because the latter uses the Ribbon. FTP Voyager also follows many of Microsoft's Aero design guidelines.

Hmm, I guess it sort-of looks like it works for that program. Admittedly it probably isn't something that I'd expect to see in FTP software since they don't usually have tons of menu options.

[Dot Matrix]

One application that I wish used the Ribbon: Wireshark. Its cluttered drop downs keeps many people I know (including myself) from fully utilizing the application's features.

 

[Nick H. Supervisor]

I've never got on with the Ribbon UI. I still think that I'm more productive with the old menu layout, but I've come to accept that it won't be changing.

[Rudy]

I've hated the ribbon the first time I saw it and it never grew on me

[Ian S.]

I've hated the ribbon the first time I saw it and it never grew on me

Have you even tried to embrace it, use it for a year? Or did you get stuck on Office 2003.

[Ian W]

Hmm, I guess it sort-of looks like it works for that program. Admittedly it probably isn't something that I'd expect to see in FTP software since they don't usually have tons of menu options.

I really like it in FTP Voyager. The program even allows you to change the appearance of the Ribbon with styles such as Office 2007 Blue, Silver, Black; Windows 2000, etc.

 

One application that I wish used the Ribbon: Wireshark. Its cluttered drop downs keeps many people I know (including myself) from fully utilizing the application's features.

 

Wireshark.PNG

That would make for an interesting discussion. Are there any other applications you would like to use the Ribbon, Dot?

 

I've never got on with the Ribbon UI. I still think that I'm more productive with the old menu layout, but I've come to accept that it won't be changing.

This is understandable, and is one of the reasons I like applications that allow one to use either the old menu layout or the Ribbon interface. Sadly the only application that I know of which offers this feature is Foxit Reader. Windows 8.x itself can use either interface (as it still uses the conventional menus and toolbars here and there), though as mentioned before, one would need to use a utility to disable the Ribbon.

[Charisma Veteran]

I can never find the tool I am looking for, so it slows me down, and it takes up more screen space. So no, I don't particularly like it, but I know it isn't going away so I deal with it. Even after all this time I can never seem to find what I want right away.

[MS Bob 11]

I think the Ribbon is a poor replacement for menus but a good replacement for static toolbars (but not customizable ones like the one Classic Shell adds where you can add ANYthing - any command, any shortcut, any file/folder). The reason it is inferior for me to a menu is because I find the text is easier to read in a vertical menu when it's aligned as a list/column. Plus, you can go through multiple menus using the mouse very quickly by hovering from one menu to another, without any further clicks required. You need to click on Ribbon tabs more than a menu to find the right command. Personally, I replace Ribbons with toolbars wherever possible via add-ins. (Explorer, and Office at least).

 

Except for Office, I find most Ribbon implementations very poor - Paint, WordPad, Explorer, EMET are examples of screen-estate being wasted especially to the right of the commands on tabs even when there's plenty of space available, and then there are commands split/distributed across multiple tabs, increasing the number of clicks to access those commands. The Office Ribbon is least justified somewhat because the number of commands is very very high and because it's easily-customizable as of Office 2010. But then the Office 2010 Ribbon is accompanied by a full-screen backstage view which is really a bad UI because it covers your document.

 

Finally, I think that Microsoft people like Julie Larson Green and Jensen Harris should be fired from Microsoft for not giving users a permanent choice between classic UI vs Ribbon. It is just plain rude. It should be on Nadella's to-do list to fire them eventually for such outrageous changes and a cold attitude.

 

Design/aesthetics wise too, I find pulldown menus more organized and the Ribbon more cluttered unless it's minimized, but then again, even if you minimize the Ribbon, unlike a menu, you need to click on each Ribbon tab to access its commands, a simple hover isn't enough. Along with the Ribbon, some other nice changes did come to Office such as Live Preview so it's not all bad in Office but in other apps, it's a total abomination.

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

I like the ribbon UI on the whole. It depends on the app whether or not its use is justified. MS Office? Definitely. All the features which were previously buried in submenus are now much more easily discoverable.

Windows Explorer? Here too it makes sense to use the ribbon UI.

An example where the ribbon UI makes no sense at all would be web browsers.

So yes, I am in favour of the ribbon UI.

[Dot Matrix]

Finally, I think that Microsoft people like Julie Larson Green and Jensen Harris should be fired from Microsoft for not giving users a permanent choice between classic UI vs Ribbon. It is just plain rude. It should be on Nadella's to-do list to fire them eventually for such outrageous changes and a cold attitude.

 Julie Larson-Greene had nothing to do with this. Where are you pulling her from? And why do they need to give choice here? It would make a total abomination out of any application that would have that. You need to move on. It's 2014. The Ribbon UI is 7+ years old at this point.

 

It's frustrating beyond all Hell attempting to troubleshoot Office 2003, thank God the company I worked for has it all but phased out. There were so many toolbars and menus scattered to Hell and back, I actually had to ask the user where to find everything. That's embarrassing to do. With the Ribbon in Office 2010 and 2013, I no longer have to do that. I implore you to go read the PDF linked in the OP before you make such awful demands like that. Nadella doesn't need to fire anyone. The fact that you use that amount of addons to "restore" deprecated functionality tells me that's a PEBKAC issue, rather than a Microsoft one. They're moving forward with new application development standards, I fail to see how that's a fireable offense.   

 

 

That would make for an interesting discussion. Are there any other applications you would like to use the Ribbon, Dot?

I'd love to see the various management consoles in Windows get streamlined into one, and feature a Ribbon. The Windows 95 look on these are quite awful to deal with anymore.

[Studio384]

I love the ribbon - by the way, Paint does have undo and redo in the ribbon, it's part of the quick settings bar - and I'm glad Microsoft ignored all critique they got on Office 2007, otherwise, it would have been back to the old, messy, menus.

[LimeMaster]

I really like it in FTP Voyager. The program even allows you to change the appearance of the Ribbon with styles such as Office 2007 Blue, Silver, Black; Windows 2000, etc.

Cool, I always ended up using the black style as it was easy on the eyes. Shame they changed it to dark grey in Office 2013.

[Rudy]

Have you even tried to embrace it, use it for a year? Or did you get stuck on Office 2003.

No, I was forced to use it and tried to make it work but I found it slower and harder to use overall 

[Ian W]

I love the ribbon - by the way, Paint does have undo and redo in the ribbon, it's part of the quick settings bar - and I'm glad Microsoft ignored all critique they got on Office 2007, otherwise, it would have been back to the old, messy, menus.

I had forgotten about the settings on the Quick Access Toolbar when I made that remark about Paint. Thank you!

 

Cool, I always ended up using the black style as it was easy on the eyes. Shame they changed it to dark grey in Office 2013.

I also prefer the black color . . . it matches the black titlebar, Start menu, and taskbar in Windows Vista.

[Dot Matrix]

I forgot I made a quick mockup of Wireshark with the Ribbon a while back:

 

[PGHammer]

 Julie Larson-Greene had nothing to do with this. Where are you pulling her from? And why do they need to give choice here? It would make a total abomination out of any application that would have that. You need to move on. It's 2014. The Ribbon UI is 7+ years old at this point.

 

It's frustrating beyond all Hell attempting to troubleshoot Office 2003, thank God the company I worked for has it all but phased out. There were so many toolbars and menus scattered to Hell and back, I actually had to ask the user where to find everything. That's embarrassing to do. With the Ribbon in Office 2010 and 2013, I no longer have to do that. I implore you to go read the PDF linked in the OP before you make such awful demands like that. Nadella doesn't need to fire anyone. The fact that you use that amount of addons to "restore" deprecated functionality tells me that's a PEBKAC issue, rather than a Microsoft one. They're moving forward with new application development standards, I fail to see how that's a fireable offense.   

 

 

I'd love to see the various management consoles in Windows get streamlined into one, and feature a Ribbon. The Windows 95 look on these are quite awful to deal with anymore.

The biggest reason that folks - and especially enterprises - hung on to Office 2003 has nothing to do with the Ribbon UI.  It has to do with the new formats that were introduced with Office 2007, and the (utterly mistaken) belief that the older Office formats were going to be killed.

 

Balderdash - absolute balderdash.

 

Absolutely NONE of the older Office file formats have been killed.  Saving in them has remained an option - including in the x64 iterations of those same applications that launched with Office 2010.  A darn SENSIBLE thing for Microsoft to do - considering two rather horrible blunders made by their biggest competition in the word-processing space - WordPerfect Corporation.  (Yes - this was at the time that Word Perfect was an utterly independent company; in fact, I was STILL using - and teaching - WordPerfect for DOS.  It's why I don't - and refuse to - blame Novell for the blunders, as Novell had not come close to sealing the deal to acquire WordPerfect.)

 

WordPerfect blunder #1 - Word Perfect for Windows 6.0 was, to put it bluntly a buggy ugly MESS; in fact, it was SO buggy that WordPerfect had to ship Word Perfect 6.0a - both to existing users and the retail channel; in fact, if you were licensed to use 6.0, WordPerfect would send you a FULL - not upgrade - copy of 6.0a free - at its expense.

 

WordPerfect blunder #2 - One thing that WordPerfect users could count on in the past was backward-compatibility - that was broken quite badly in both 6.0 AND 6.0a; in fact, it was broken so badly that Word 6.0 for Windows (and the in-beta Word for Windows 95/NT) had better backward-compatibility with WordPerfect than WordPerfect for Windows did.  Quite embarrassing!  (That tore it for me - I switched entirely to Word, and recommended to everyone that I had taught WordPerfect that ran Windows to follow suit.  WordPerfect had gone from my word-processing software of choice to - put it bluntly - an embarrassment not merely to WordPerfect, but to those that taught it, and had been recommending it - such as me.)

[Guest]

 I'd love to see the various management consoles in Windows get streamlined into one, and feature a Ribbon. The Windows 95 look on these are quite awful to deal with anymore.

 

This! They already have the Microsoft Management Console as the base for everything. Now just to slap everything together in a cohesive way and make management easier.

 

There really is no need for a separate Device Manager, Disk Management, and GUIs when the same things are accessible through the Computer Management GUI which itself is an extension to the MMC. Even the Hyper-V management GUI is again an extension to the MMC. Surely these things can be unified in a good way into a single GUI?

 

EDIT: Another step that should be taken in the future, unify the exposed configurations in the old Control Panel and the new one. Everything that is accessible in the first should be accessible in the second, and vice versa. While they're at it, they should fix the old Control Panel to have a consistent feature exposure, as some things are not available in all view modes.

[blerk]

I forgot I made a quick mockup of Wireshark with the Ribbon a while back:

 

I like it. Well, I would like it if it had any functionality at all :D

[Dot Matrix]

I like it. Well, I would like it if it had any functionality at all :D

Maybe I'll have to try a new mockup. :)

[LaP]

I got used to it. But i don't think it works better than what we had before. I'm not more productive with it at all. It looks better though specially when you have enough vertical pixels to not fold it.

[gohpep]

I love the ribbon. May be a bit bigger at its default state, but it is quicker.

[Ian W]

This! They already have the Microsoft Management Console as the base for everything. Now just to slap everything together in a cohesive way and make management easier.

 

There really is no need for a separate Device Manager, Disk Management, and GUIs when the same things are accessible through the Computer Management GUI which itself is an extension to the MMC. Even the Hyper-V management GUI is again an extension to the MMC. Surely these things can be unified in a good way into a single GUI?

 

EDIT: Another step that should be taken in the future, unify the exposed configurations in the old Control Panel and the new one. Everything that is accessible in the first should be accessible in the second, and vice versa. While they're at it, they should fix the old Control Panel to have a consistent feature exposure, as some things are not available in all view modes.

Those are great ideas, particularly the one about making the Control Panel and PC Settings consistent.

 

Maybe I'll have to try a new mockup. :)

Please do!