Jimquisition: EA Access ... Denied

[Showan]

The game and demo came out 3 months before the new consoles. There's a good chance if you wanted the game you bought it at the start of the season, played it on 360/ps3 and then upgraded with the $10 program.

 

Either way, not having demos != locking demos behind subscriptions.

 

 

 

First I would like to say, this looks very bad on EA's part.  Perception/Context is everything.  

 

EA has stated that, these will be full parts of the game, and not demo builds.

 

But my mindset (and others) is, "If your only getting a slice of the pie, then it's a demo" although in context it's the actual full game, in which you can even save your progress.

 

And with EA's track record, I think they may want to very much EMPHASIZE this.  

 

Instead of fine print, they may want to Boldly state that it's actual real game play and any progress can be saved and resumed if the actual game is purchase.  And make sure that it's stamped into people's minds.

 

 

 

Edit:  I don't care for EA at all.  But I have no choice but to put up with them in order to get to BioWare

[vcfan]

The game and demo came out 3 months before the new consoles. There's a good chance if you wanted the game you bought it at the start of the season, played it on 360/ps3 and then upgraded with the $10 program.

 

We can imagine hypothetical situations all day, it doesnt change the fact that there was never any Madden demo for next gen consoles last year,and nobody cared.

Either way, not having demos != locking demos behind subscriptions.

where was the outrage for destiny beta. you had to preorder to sample the game before launch. again, nobody cared. this whole thing screams hypocrisy.

[spacer]

Jesus this moron gives me a head ache.

 

I'm not EA's biggest fan (do they have any?) but frankly if you look at what's available and even one game in there is something you want, then you've already got your monies worth.

 

So what if other publishers start doing it? Where's the down side in that?

You didn't watch the video did you? He clearly states that, as it is now, Access is a great value. What he doesn't like about it, and what is already happening, is that this could be (is) a prelude to publishers gating off content only for subscribers in an effort to extort even more money from consumers.

 

We can imagine hypothetical situations all day, it doesnt change the fact that there was never any Madden demo for next gen consoles last year,and nobody cared.

where was the outrage for destiny beta. you had to preorder to sample the game before launch. again, nobody cared. this whole thing screams hypocrisy.

Beta != demo. Preordering != spending money. I'm confused how you think this is a similar situation. And Madden has had demos every year for the past 10 years, hasn't it?

[MikeChipshop Member]

You didn't watch the video did you?

 

No of course not, i just guessed it'd give me a headache. /s

[Showan]

You didn't watch the video did you? He clearly states that, as it is now, Access is a great value. What he doesn't like about it, and what is already happening, is that this could be (is) a prelude to publishers gating off content only for subscribers in an effort to extort even more money from consumers.

Beta != demo. Preordering != spending money. I'm confused how you think this is a similar situation. And Madden has had demos every year for the past 10 years, hasn't it?

 

 

Once again, everything is Context/Perception.

 

I do not like EA one bit.  But they have mentioned that it's portions of the full game.  Meaning you can save your progress.  

 

You cannot save any progress in demos.

 

Like I said, EA needs to very much clarify this... Before it's too late...

 

And from the looks of it, it's too late   :rofl:  :/

[vcfan]

Beta != demo.

my point is if he's lumping playing a game earlier means its "a demo", then you should be consistent with your opinion. ea access trials are not traditional demos either.

Preordering != spending money.

but you're committing to giving them your money to have that access. you're giving something up, even if its promissory.

And Madden has had demos every year for the past 10 years, hasn't it?

not last year it didn't on next gen consoles.

[spacer]

my point is if he's lumping playing a game earlier means its "a demo", then you should be consistent with your opinion. ea access trials are not traditional demos either.

but you're committing to giving them your money to have that access. you're giving something up, even if its promissory.

not last year it didn't on next gen consoles.

A beta is a non-complete version of a game that you're given access to in order to help test. Anything and everything you play or see during that time is subject to change and should not be taken on set-in-stone features. A demo is a trial version of the final game meant to provide a day-one play experience in order to inform potential buyers. There is absolutely a difference.

 

Amazon and other companies allow you to pre-order games for free and still send you pre-order access codes. Specially for Destiny, you could pre-order, get your code, register it on Bungie,net, then cancel your pre-order, and still take part in the beta. Therefore, you're giving up nothing.

 

The demo may not have been on the new consoles, but there was still a demo.

[vcfan]

A beta is a non-complete version of a game that you're given access to in order to help test. Anything and everything you play or see during that time is subject to change and should not be taken on set-in-stone features. A demo is a trial version of the final game meant to provide a day-one play experience in order to inform potential buyers. There is absolutely a difference.

not true at all. I play the NHL demos before release all the time,and the game always changes. ea trials are supposed to let you sample the whole full game. traditional demos are games that are crippled with restricted content, which ea trials are not.

 

Amazon and other companies allow you to pre-order games for free and still send you pre-order access codes. Specially for Destiny, you could pre-order, get your code, register it on Bungie,net, then cancel your pre-order, and still take part in the beta. Therefore, you're giving up nothing.

so basically you have to pull off scams to not have to pay?

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

not true at all. I play the NHL demos before release all the time,and the game always changes. ea trials are supposed to let you sample the whole full game. traditional demos are games that are crippled with restricted content, which ea trials are not.

 

so basically you have to pull off scams to not have to pay?

 

Anything that isn't the retail product is crippled by nature. I really don't know why people are going gung-ho over semantics as if saying a longer or more feature filled demo is somehow 

 

a) Not a demo

b) Something that could be argued as being worthy to pay for

 

When you got a large demo on a demo disc back in the day that was just chalked up to a generous dev, and it probably aided you in spending $50/60 on their game by enticing you with a decent showing. Nowadays we have to be oh so grateful to our corporate overlords to the point of accepting it's okay to pay for what is still just a meaty demo?

[vcfan]

Anything that isn't the retail product is crippled by nature. I really don't know why people are going gung-ho over semantics as if saying a longer or more feature filled demo is somehow 

 

a) Not a demo

b) Something that could be argued as being worthy to pay for

 

When you got a large demo on a demo disc back in the day that was just chalked up to a generous dev, and it probably aided you in spending $50/60 on their game by enticing you with a decent showing. Nowadays we have to be oh so grateful to our corporate overlords to the point of accepting it's okay to pay for what is still just a meaty demo?

if ea invited you to their offices 5 days before the release of madden,and let you play a few full games of madden 15,with any of your favorite teams and options. would you say

1. hey I just played the madden demo 5 days before release.

or

2. hey I just played the full madden game 5 days before release. COOL

[trooper11]

Except you have no control over the games included nor is it access to the whole catalogue.

 

You can play what they offer and have to spend more to get content that isn't included.

 

 

Which is basically the same formula used by competing services. You don't get access to every game, but instead to a curated list that rotates every month. The value becomes clear if you like the games they are offering and you know your a fan of many games that are likely to be added (EA games in this case).

 

$30 a year for that kind of access could be very compelling to many gamers

 

 

 

Anything that isn't the retail product is crippled by nature. I really don't know why people are going gung-ho over semantics as if saying a longer or more feature filled demo is somehow 

 

a) Not a demo

b) Something that could be argued as being worthy to pay for

 

When you got a large demo on a demo disc back in the day that was just chalked up to a generous dev, and it probably aided you in spending $50/60 on their game by enticing you with a decent showing. Nowadays we have to be oh so grateful to our corporate overlords to the point of accepting it's okay to pay for what is still just a meaty demo?

 

Its not just the evil corporate overlords, programs like Steam early access clearly show gamers are willing to pay for demos, betas, etc.

 

I mean think how crazy it sounds to pay to play an incomplete game and yet, its happening.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Which is basically the same formula used by competing services. You don't get access to every game, but instead to a curated list that rotates every month. The value becomes clear if you like the games they are offering and you know your a fan of many games that are likely to be added (EA games in this case).

 

$30 a year for that kind of access could be very compelling to many gamers

 

 

 

 

Its not just the evil corporate overlords, programs like Steam early access clearly show gamers are willing to pay for demos, betas, etc.

 

I mean think how crazy it sounds to pay to play an incomplete game and yet, its happening.

 

Steam Early access is a crock of ######, and Steam have been getting a ton of flak for it - There is absolutely zero quality control. Jim Sterling has railed on Steam quite a few times. No one gets a pass for shoddy paywalls/messing with gamers money.

[Showan]

Anything that isn't the retail product is crippled by nature. I really don't know why people are going gung-ho over semantics as if saying a longer or more feature filled demo is somehow 

 

a) Not a demo

b) Something that could be argued as being worthy to pay for

 

When you got a large demo on a demo disc back in the day that was just chalked up to a generous dev, and it probably aided you in spending $50/60 on their game by enticing you with a decent showing. Nowadays we have to be oh so grateful to our corporate overlords to the point of accepting it's okay to pay for what is still just a meaty demo?

 

 

I don't like EA nor do I trust them.  

 

But demos you dont get to save your progress.  Whatever you do in the "preview access" of games is carried over if you decide you want to purchase the game.  And continue where you left off during the early access.

[trooper11]

Steam Early access is a crock of ######, and Steam have been getting a ton of flak for it - There is absolutely zero quality control. Jim Sterling has railed on Steam quite a few times. No one gets a pass for shoddy paywalls/messing with gamers money.

 

Oh I agree it is very bad, but gamers still jump into it.

[Ironman273]

Which is basically the same formula used by competing services. You don't get access to every game, but instead to a curated list that rotates every month. The value becomes clear if you like the games they are offering and you know your a fan of many games that are likely to be added (EA games in this case).

 

$30 a year for that kind of access could be very compelling to many gamers

 

Don't forget that in EA Access the games don't rotate.  They stay in the Vault.  The big question is how often games will be added.  Without a definite "2 games a month" or something they are free to screw the users to whenever they feel like it.

[Knife Party]

zero chance ever again i'll trust EA. I've been burned too many times. And this subscription looks like your typical PR paymodel bonanza. Once they hook the users they start ramping up the rape machine. No thanks.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

Which is basically the same formula used by competing services. You don't get access to every game, but instead to a curated list that rotates every month. The value becomes clear if you like the games they are offering and you know your a fan of many games that are likely to be added (EA games in this case).

 

$30 a year for that kind of access could be very compelling to many gamers

 

 

 

 

Its not just the evil corporate overlords, programs like Steam early access clearly show gamers are willing to pay for demos, betas, etc.

 

I mean think how crazy it sounds to pay to play an incomplete game and yet, its happening.

 

I'm sorry but Steam Early Access is not demos, in any sense of the word. It's more an evolution of pre-ordering by letting gamers alpha/beta test the game ahead of final release. It's designed with Minecraft's model in mind. It is not a demo. Further, you're buying a game while it's cheaper and being involved in the direction they develop.

 

When did people stop understanding the difference between the two suddenly? :huh:

 

 

 We can imagine hypothetical situations all day, it doesnt change the fact that there was never any Madden demo for next gen consoles last year,and nobody cared.

where was the outrage for destiny beta. you had to preorder to sample the game before launch. again, nobody cared. this whole thing screams hypocrisy.

 

There is nothing hypothetical about it. Madden was the first game to be announced as part of the upgrade program IIRC. If you wanted to play the game, you had the demo and launch in August. You could then trade in for the next-gen release. Not having a console out in retail to demo something that released 3 months earlier is apples and oranges compared to NFL 15.

 

And again, beta != demo, so no need to repeat the same points above for Destiny.

[vcfan]

There is nothing hypothetical about it. Madden was the first game to be announced as part of the upgrade program IIRC. If you wanted to play the game, you had the demo and launch in August. You could then trade in for the next-gen release. Not having a console out in retail to demo something that released 3 months earlier is apples and oranges compared to NFL 15.

maybe you missed one of my earlier posts,could have been in the other thread, but fifa released a month later than madden 25, yet it had a demo on next gen. this argument doesn't fly.

 

And again, beta != demo, so no need to repeat the same points above for Destiny.

it was to point out 2 things.

1. just because you can play it before launch,doesnt mean its a demo,just like the ea trials are not demos

2.you still had to commit to giving the company money to play the game early ,just like the ea trials

it would be hypocritical to criticize one and be ok with the other.

[Torolol]

The DLCs themselves cost more than the game itself.  How sweet would have been if they had an editor for skins?

as a gamer myself, i certainly favors user editor over any other types of DLC, regardless user-unfriendly-ness and no dev-support of that editors be,

and of course the industry know this as well, they see editor available to end-users as serious threat to DLC's money milking potential.

 

Thats also explain that user-editors hardly ever available since the dawn of DLC,

and only generous game-dev/publisher that release the user-editors as DLC and usually only doing that at very end of the games' life.

[trooper11]

I'm sorry but Steam Early Access is not demos, in any sense of the word. It's more an evolution of pre-ordering by letting gamers alpha/beta test the game ahead of final release. It's designed with Minecraft's model in mind. It is not a demo. Further, you're buying a game while it's cheaper and being involved in the direction they develop.

 

When did people stop understanding the difference between the two suddenly? :huh:

I think you missed my post. Audioboxer and I were not talking about demos and Steam Early access as being equal. We do know the difference thank you.

I brought it up to show that gamers are willing to pay for a part of a game. I listed demos, betas, etc as part of that list. Early access is basically paying for beta access. In the old days, a beta would have never required payment, but now developers have found a way to convince at least some gamers that its worth paying for.

 

 

zero chance ever again i'll trust EA. I've been burned too many times. And this subscription looks like your typical PR paymodel bonanza. Once they hook the users they start ramping up the rape machine. No thanks.

That doesn't make much sense considering they can't really hook anyone for long. As soon as EA tries to do anything terrible, you just drop the subscription. The power is in your hands.

[Mathachew Veteran]

Since when is competition a bad thing? Competition breeds innovation, and the math can heavily favor subscriptions like this. The biggest factor is timing of releases to the service. What would I rather, paying $300 for 5 brand new games or $150 for 5 gaming subscriptions that could net me 20-30 games after a year or two? I know I'm making some assumptions, but it's a no brainer if there are no underlying issues or hidden limitations. By all appearances, EA Access seems like a steal.

[Juguard]

Since when is competition a bad thing? Competition breeds innovation, and the math can heavily favor subscriptions like this. The biggest factor is timing of releases to the service. What would I rather, paying $300 for 5 brand new games or $150 for 5 gaming subscriptions that could net me 20-30 games after a year or two? I know I'm making some assumptions, but it's a no brainer if there are no underlying issues or hidden limitations. By all appearances, EA Access seems like a steal.

While competition is good, its also bad.  EA are only subscribing base game for instance.  If you want to play the DLCs,  you have pay for them.(As I understand).  Competition might improve things, but the prices sore.  And the value of games goes down.  They sell them into pieces instead of a full game.  And also, they make you believe that Pre-order is a must, or you will miss out on some special skin that nobody cares about.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

maybe you missed one of my earlier posts,could have been in the other thread, but fifa released a month later than madden 25, yet it had a demo on next gen. this argument doesn't fly.

 

it was to point out 2 things.

1. just because you can play it before launch,doesnt mean its a demo,just like the ea trials are not demos

2.you still had to commit to giving the company money to play the game early ,just like the ea trials

it would be hypocritical to criticize one and be ok with the other.

 

No you didn't, not even in US where money down on pre-orders is common. You can pre-order anything on Amazon and get codes. In EU our pre-orders are free to make 24/7/365. I paid the grand total of ?0 to take part in both versions of the beta.

[vcfan]

No you didn't, not even in US where money down on pre-orders is common. You can pre-order anything on Amazon and get codes. In EU our pre-orders are free to make 24/7/365. I paid the grand total of ?0 to take part in both versions of the beta.

 

preordering is committing to the company that you will give them money on the release of the game. its sort of a lock -in on that purchase. they give you a code because you gave them something. peace of mind that they will have your money on release of the game. sure you can preorder and cancel to get codes, but that's unethical and scammy.

[DrunknMunky Veteran]

preordering is committing to the company that you will give them money on the release of the game. its sort of a lock -in on that purchase. they give you a code because you gave them something. peace of mind that they will have your money on release of the game. sure you can preorder and cancel to get codes, but that's unethical and scammy.

 

But like I said, in the UK we don't put any money down on pre-orders. I can make as many of them as I like for the consoles (which I did), or for multiple retailers on the same game to secure the best price.

 

Aka the way it should be worldwide :yes: