Saints Row Writer Accepts Anita Sarkeesian's Critique of His Games

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Saints Row Writer Accepts Anita Sarkeesian's Critique of His Games

 

Steve Jaros from Volition said he thinks Saints Row has gotten better in representing women over the course of the series.

 

There is a lot of talk these days about how women are portrayed in video games. The video series Tropes Vs. Women in Video Games by Anita Sarkeesian has shown through many examples how patterns exist in today's games which continue the cycle of portraying women as objects to be gained or, perhaps worse, as sexy, gritty background. The latest episode Sarkeesian's series sparked support from gaming leaders such as Tim Schafer from Double Fine. In discussing the latest Saints Row announcements with Steve Jaros, Creative Director at Volition, I asked him how he thought his games portrayed female characters considering that the original Saints Row was one of the games used as an example in Sarkeesian's latest episode about women used as background objects in games. Jaros said that he thinks they've been doing a better job with each sequel, but admitted there may have been some missteps earlier in the series.

 

"I actually tweeted out the link to the video yesterday about women as background objects and said that every game developer should watch this and sometimes is guilty of it," he said. "I think that [sarkeesian's] right in that case."

 

He affirmed that the way women are portrayed in the medium could be improved. "I think that it is a problem in the games industry. I think that we shouldn't be portraying senseless abused women and I think that if I could go back and hop in a time machine I would have done things differently. But there's also some things I didn't any control over and also I think that people's consciousness grew." Jaros mentioned that the first Saints Row came out in 2006, and the awareness of these kinds of issues has grown remarkably in the last 8 years.

 

In the games he could influence at his studio, Jaros said that he believes Volition has done a decent job at being aware of how women are shown in their games. "I think that there's some things Saints Row does better than other games, and I think that there are other things that we could have done better," Jaros continued. "I think that every time that we've done a Saints Row game we've gotten better at it. I think that we always wanted to make sure we do things with fairness, but we've gotten better at it as time goes on."

 

He pointed to a few recent examples of small ways he has tried to portray women in a more positive light. "It's very minor but it means something to me. We never call a woman a 'ho' in Saints Row 4, we call them sex workers. We respect that that's their position and we don't take a cheap shot at them for that. It's a minor thing, but it's something ... It's the right thing to do."

 

Jaros also believes that the way major speaking characters are dressed is important, and that the team struggled with how best to represent them. "There's a reason that none of the Saints Row characters ever get naked, it's a conscious choice," he said. "Viola and Kiki are sex workers in Saints Row 3, but they are the most covered up characters. They're wearing turtlenecks, leggings and a skirt over leggings. They don't show an inch of skin, and it was by design, because we didn't want to sexually objectify them."

 

Even in the more sci-fi Saints Row IV, Jaros debated how best to show Kinzie Kensington's powerful self in the virtual reality simulation of the game. "A great debate that happened in the studio," he said. "In Saints Row 4 she gets her superhero Matrix-ey outfit, [and we argued] about whether that was too provocative for Kinzie. 'Is this the right expression of the character? Is this fair? Do we think this is right?'"

 

Jaros does not dodge that earlier Saints Row games definitely showed a large amount of violence against women - the Brotherhood storyline in Saints Row 2 is a particularly memorable example. He accepts the criticism with aplomb that many of Sarkeesian's detractors could emulate.

 

"I think it's fair to be called out on your ######," he said. "I think that it's a sad man that can never be self-reflective. I think that we tried to go and carry ourselves with respect, and try to respect sexuality and respect gender as much as we can, and sometimes we fail but hopefully we'll do better and continue to get better."

I think that's all anyone can ask.

 

For more insight in how Saints Row has developed and changed over the course over the series, not to mention the weird wacky stuff in store in the newly announced standalone expansion Gat Out of Hell, check out the full interview with Steve Jaros here.

 

Source: The Escapist

[Torolol]

so the new saint row will be more 'feminist friendly' ?

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

so the new saint row will be more 'feminist friendly' ?

Here's hoping (Y)

[taim]

So desexualise men too, no showing ripped abs, tight butts, huge muscles, and don't have them do anything for reasons that have to do with the opposite sex because you know why they're doing it.

 

They are asking for equality but without sacrificing the mancandy.

[Praetor]

So desexualise men too, no showing ripped abs, tight butts, huge muscles, and don't have them do anything for reasons that have to do with the opposite sex because you know why they're doing it.

 

They are asking for equality but without sacrificing the mancandy.

 

this, even that not every woman asks for mancandy.

[taim]

this, even that not every woman asks for mancandy.

Enough do that makes a difference in other media, I wonder how Magic Mike or Twilight got so popular??

[blank]

Enough do that makes a difference in other media, I wonder how Magic Mike or Twilight got so popular??

 

i've seen neither of those movies, but seen the main actor of the latter.. Pale, scrawny, petite, soft skinned dude doesnt really fit your previous description.

[Lovell]

Saints Row is over the top in everything it does including it's portrayal of both men and women, however it also has strong female characters who aren't just big boobed bimbos who need to be saved by the men..

[eddman]

i've seen neither of those movies, but seen the main actor of the latter.. Pale, scrawny, petite, soft skinned dude doesnt really fit your previous description.

I haven't seen either too, but...

 

Magic mike:

 

 

Twilight:

 

 

[taim]

Ya I was going to bring up Jacob he pretty much always has his shirt off in Twilight, and Magic Mike I think you can tell by Eddman's pic.

[Memphis]

So let me get this straight, we can have video games about gang wars and massive amounts of violence drugs, and bloodshed, but god forbid we stereotype women in a game involving such other horrible things.

[siah1214]

Because the portrayal of men in Saints Row series isn't totally sexualized and over the top, just like the entire game is......

[Memphis]

I support the concept of strong woman in video games 100%, but they are going about it the wrong way. My girlfriend who is quite the pc gamer going back to Diablo etc told me that these women should make video games with these kind of characters instead of complaining about them if they want the concept to catch on. I thought she was spot on. Men have their own archetype in video games. If your not buff, violent, and quick with your words, (basically about none of us). your probably cowering in the corner. Strong females in the world of gaming are accepted and play a pivotal role in game development and community management. Anyone remember how Tiggs handled the SWG community after the Combat Update and how she calmed the whole communities rage against SOE? She moved to Lord of the Rings online and held an extremely respected position. If you want to be respected in video games and how they portray woman go into video game design and marketing and make it happen. As it stands, no one at my college that I met who was female and a single bit of interest in perusing these fields.

[Athernar]

Using the views of a 3rd-wave sex-negative feminist to "improve" your game's representation of women?

 

That's like hiring a paedophile babysitter.

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

So let me get this straight, we can have video games about gang wars and massive amounts of violence drugs, and bloodshed, but god forbid we stereotype women in a game involving such other horrible things.

You can cover topics like gang wars and drugs/violence and still have good portrayals of men and women, they're not mutually exclusive.

[Memphis]

You can cover topics like gang wars and drugs/violence and still have good portrayals of men and women, they're not mutually exclusive.

Absolutely correct, but saints row isn't just covering these topics, your an active participant in them (virtually of course) and that's why this argument against it is insane

[blerk]

Not that I have been paying much attention to this whole thing (I still have no idea who Anita Sarkeesian is and why this she is big news in the videogame world), but is the primary complaint the fact that female characters are overly sexualized in many video games, or the fact that women specifically being referred to in derogatory ways?

 

Thinking about both points - I have not really seen any examples of either of the above things in the games I play. FPS and strategy games don't tend to feature women that much I guess. 

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

That doesn't make any sense, why does it being interactive man that you need weak characters that rely on stereotypes?

[Praetor]

Not that I have been paying much attention to this whole thing (I still have no idea who Anita Sarkeesian is and why this she is big news in the videogame world), but is the primary complaint the fact that female characters are overly sexualized in many video games, or the fact that women specifically being referred to in derogatory ways?

 

Thinking about both points - I have not really seen any examples of either of the above things in the games I play. FPS and strategy games don't tend to feature women that much I guess. 

 

it's the over sexualization of woman: over the top bodies, skin showing without any objective meaning (just for sales), verbal and / or physical abuse and much more.

 

And while we do see more strong female characters in videogames, there is still a long path to walk.

[blerk]

That doesn't make any sense, why does it being interactive man that you need weak characters that rely on stereotypes?

uhhh...what?

edit: I saw the timestamp - you probably were replyingto sidroc :P

 

it's the over sexualization of woman: over the top bodies, skin showing without any objective meaning (just for sales), verbal and / or physical abuse and much more.

 

And while we do see more strong female characters in videogames, there is still a long path to walk.

Oh I see. 

[Memphis]

That doesn't make any sense, why does it being interactive man that you need weak characters that rely on stereotypes?

 

 

Because the gangbanger types in the game are walking stereotypes in every aspect. What your doing is picking and choosing what stereotypes that are negative we should display. How about every game have the main character never kill a civilian and always play a non corrupted cop? Or is that too much? Or is this only about one negative stereotype and not all.

[+E.Worm Jimmy Subscriber¹]

Using the views of a 3rd-wave sex-negative feminist to "improve" your game's representation of women?

 

That's like hiring a paedophile babysitter.

 

:rofl:

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

Because the gangbanger types in the game are walking stereotypes in every aspect. What your doing is picking and choosing what stereotypes that are negative we should display. How about every game have the main character never kill a civilian and always play a non corrupted cop? Or is that too much? Or is this only about one negative stereotype and not all.

You're missing the point here, you can portray people negatively and not rely on stereotypes, racist, sexist, etc. The characters should be well written so that their motivations make sense and fit the story, not just rely on stereotypes.

[HawkMan]

They can do whatever they want, but don't pander to Sarkeesian.

 

She's not even a gamer, she's a extremist feminist who couldn't get an audience amid the crowded market of feminist bloggers, so she decided to be a feminist gamer which was unique and allowed her to attack video games which she knows nothing of, which is popular. 

 

Sarkeesian needs to be ignored and forgotten. give room to actual female gamers, not ignorant hypocrite liers like sarkeesian. 

[Memphis]

You're missing the point here, you can portray people negatively and not rely on stereotypes, racist, sexist, etc. The characters should be well written so that their motivations make sense and fit the story, not just rely on stereotypes.

 

I 100% agree, but why focus on one of the many many stereotypes in just this game? I realize we have to start somewhere, but we will get nowhere focusing on only one of the stereotypes. How about make it where we have allot more whites in games about gangbangers for example. I realize this has been done, but a majority of them still seem to be black carrying on negative stereotypes of black men. Either we attack the problem as a whole, or let it be as one persons expression.