Difference between these cat5e cables?

[Technique]

I was looking at 10mtr & 20mtr cables. 10mtr would be ample where i currently want everything, 20mtr should cover the event of moving something in the future.

 

Question1: Would speeds be any worse over a 20mtr cable than a 10mtr cable or would you not notice?

 

Question2: What is the difference between these cables...

 

10mtr Scan Grey Cat 5e Snagless Moulded Patch Lead

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/10m-scan-grey-cat-5e-snagless-moulded-patch-lead

 

10m Cross Over (X-Over) CAT-5e RJ45 Cable Snagless 10/100/GbE

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/10m-cross-over-%28x-over%29-cat-5e-rj45-cable-snagless-10-100-gbe

 

Scan Cables 10m CAT 5e RJ45 UTP Patch Cable

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/10m-cat-5e-urt-610-rj45-utp-moulded-patch-cable-10-100-gbe

 

All 10mtr cat5e cables, all made by the same company, but different prices. I emailed the company but no response & i'm running out of time as i really need to be ordering them tonight.

[+Mud W1ggle Subscriber²]

Ignore the X-Over cable, you dont want that, other than that, I cant see any difference, perhaps just different brands?

 

I was looking at 10mtr & 20mtr cables. 10mtr would be ample where i currently want everything, 20mtr should cover the event of moving something in the future.

 

Question1: Would speeds be any worse over a 20mtr cable than a 10mtr cable or would you not notice?

 

Question2: What is the difference between these cables...

 

10mtr Scan Grey Cat 5e Snagless Moulded Patch Lead

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/10m-scan-grey-cat-5e-snagless-moulded-patch-lead

 

10m Cross Over (X-Over) CAT-5e RJ45 Cable Snagless 10/100/GbE

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/10m-cross-over-%28x-over%29-cat-5e-rj45-cable-snagless-10-100-gbe

 

Scan Cables 10m CAT 5e RJ45 UTP Patch Cable

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/10m-cat-5e-urt-610-rj45-utp-moulded-patch-cable-10-100-gbe

 

All 10mtr cat5e cables, all made by the same company, but different prices. I emailed the company but no response & i'm running out of time as i really need to be ordering them tonight.

[Technique]

Except they're made by the same manufacturer. Strange one. I'll just pick the cheap one then since they'll do the same thing.

 

 

But yeah, any idea on question #1?

[GavCity]

Difficult to say any difference between the top and the bottom. Top one does say 26AWG (American Wire Gauge) but the other does not specify any better such as 24AWG. The middle link is as it says a crossover cable and would not normally be used to connect a PC to a switch.

 

I'd be wanting a decent cable over 10 metres long, should be 24AWG at 20m and a decent build altogether.

Also we use CAT6 by default now.

[Technique]

Know of any UK website that guarantees 24AWG?

 

Also what benefits would cat6 give me over cat53 that i NEED? From what i've read - nothing.

 

And again, would you notice any significant difference between 10mtr & 20mtr cables in terms of connection performance?

[+BudMan MVC]

Looks like the first one is snagless, while other one is not.. See the things on the side of the boot, while other one does not have this. this is suppose to help it from getting snagged on other wires if pulling in through a rats nest of wires ;)

What is funny is that one is cheaper ;) I would go with the cheaper one myself.

edit: If the cable is rated 5E, then its good for 100meters, or 328 feet :) There is no performance difference between cables that have same rating.. 10 or 20 does not matter. As to cat6 over 5e.. For a patch cable no real reason to do it, if you were going to run it perm, etc. Then might want to go with 6 or even 6a -- at some point your going to want to run 10Ge, etc.

If you can find 6 for a few pennies more, then go 6.. I buy 6 if thinking about it, just because they are only a few cents more per foot normally.

[GavCity]

I have had plenty of problems with cheaper cables even though they are rated 5E and 20m is a decent stretch. An electromagnetic signal will dissipate over length hence why there is a specified limit. The specified limit of 100m isn't for a cable like that anyway. It incorporates mainly solid core cabling with up to 10m of patch cabling.

[GavCity]

Know of any UK website that guarantees 24AWG?

 

Also what benefits would cat6 give me over cat53 that i NEED? From what i've read - nothing.

 

And again, would you notice any significant difference between 10mtr & 20mtr cables in terms of connection performance?

 

Just search the site for 24AWG and you will find cable specified as such

 

It is a better specified cable therefore I would expect it to operate better, maybe you won't notice the difference but it is a better specification and they improved it for a reason or several I'm sure. As I said CAT 6 should really be default unless you are very pressed for money.

 

Yes signal deteriorates over length but will do less over thicker cable such as 24AWG.

[Technique]

I did search the site & found a million miles worth of cable for a lot of money.

 

I struggle to find any sort of branded cabling that is UK based. It's either cheap or a bit dear, with no naming or reason as to the price difference.

 

Though i got some cheap stuff for my PC which i think is 0.5mtr length. Seems to have worked fine so far

[+BudMan MVC]

"The specified limit of 100m isn't for a cable like that anyway. It incorporates mainly solid core cabling with up to 10m of patch cabling."

Well your normally not going to buy a UTP at 100m :) But you can, and I am sure they would work.. Why would they make/sell them if they don't work ;)

http://www.deepsurplus.com/Network-Structured-Wiring/Ethernet-CAT5e-Patch-Cables-300ft/300ft-Blue-Cat-5E-Patch-Cable

My point was that 20m is not going to be an issue, even with unshielded UTP.. Unless your running that across or next to something that causes interference.. I have a 100 foot unshielded that runs up into my attic from my computer room, and then into the living room and don't have any problems with it. And it was just some cheap cable I got off monoprice or deepsurplus. 100 feet is what 30 meters.

If your worried or its a run in the walls, then buy shielded, But 20m or 65ft should not be an issue for a prefabbed cat5e cable.

So that above 300ft is $40, for $50 can get cat6 - so your talking 3 cents more a foot.. Get the cat 6 ;)

[GavCity]

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Neet%C2%AE-Ethernet-Performance-Terminated-extenders/dp/B00HZJNIN0

 

https://www.euronetwork.co.uk/20-metre-grey-cat6-network-cable-utp-24awg-moulded-boots

 

Quite a bit more expensive but it depends how important it is to you really. A lot of network cables are actually 24AWG but they aren't specified on the description as such. A 5m cable in my kitchen actually states 24AWG on it and maybe the more expensive 10m cable you linked above is, maybe that is why the pointed out 26AWG on the cheaper one. Many times you will be happy with the cheapest option but personally I like to make sure of a decent quality connection.

[GavCity]

 Why would they make/sell them if they don't work ;)

 

Have you never had a faulty cable? I've had a fair few - mainly cheap crap ones. And some were a lot shorter than 10m.

 

The speed through cables is often very variable too. The guy was asking about signal loss over distance so it seems to me he is interested in making sure there is none. It is not true to say that any cable will have the same performance. A better grade cable should have better performance, especially over a long distance.

[+BudMan MVC]

Hmmm I thought 22-24 was per the standard... If they are saying 26 on it, then sure it meets standards?

edit: as to performance.. different over 10 meters? BS.. And no I can not say in all the years I have been working with network cables have I ever bought a cable and out of the box/bag was it faulty..

But then again I am not buying my cables off ebay, from some guy that made them up in his garage ;)

So your saying the packet is going to get their in a measurable difference between brand X that meets spec, and brand Y that meets spec? You do understand your talking less than milisecond here over that distance..

So your saying that brand X will give me say .5 ms ping to my router.. But Brand y will give me 1 or even .6? Nonsense I say Nonsense!!

edit2: Ok so just pinged a box over that 100ft unshielded cable I was talking about.. This includes 2 switches in the path and patch cables on both sides and your looking at an average of .5 ms

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.99:

Packets: Sent = 28, Received = 28, Lost = 0 (0% loss)

Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:

Minimum = 0.4 ms, Maximum = 0.7 ms, Average = 0.5 ms

So your telling me that your Brand Y cable is going to me to say .4 ms just by changing the cable? And then in the big picture of things if you do the math for actual bandwidth over that distance using .4 vs .5 do you really thing its going to make any difference?? Come on really?? We are not talking about microsecond stock trades here ;)

edit3: Ok just pinged that same box over that same wire, same switches from my linux box that reports higher resolution in the ping numbers.

--- 192.168.1.99 ping statistics ---

30 packets transmitted, 30 received, 0% packet loss, time 28998ms

rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 0.330/0.461/0.653/0.070 ms

So my average here was .461 ms.. Keep in mind the 2 switches involved.. What do you think adds more latency to the total RTT the switches.. Or the time it took that packet to go across the 100ft wire.. And you think this is going to change in a noticeable amount between brand X and brand Y?

If I run a cable along the floor from my switch 1 to switch 2.. I might have a 50 foot cable vs the 100.. So after the distance, and even that would not make a difference in anything worth mentioning and for sure not paying anything for.. Your talking lan speeds.. Your talking sub milliseconds ;)

examples of .1 difference in the RTT

Theoretical network limit

rough estimation: rate < (MSS/RTT)*(C/sqrt(Loss)) [ C=1 ] (based on the Mathis et.al. formula)

network limit (MSS 1460 byte, RTT: 0.5 ms, Loss: 10-08 (10-06%)) : 222778.32 Mbit/sec.

Theoretical network limit

rough estimation: rate < (MSS/RTT)*(C/sqrt(Loss)) [ C=1 ] (based on the Mathis et.al. formula)

network limit (MSS 1460 byte, RTT: 0.6 ms, Loss: 10-08 (10-06%)) : 185648.60 Mbit/sec.

So where there is a big difference in the max number.. You are so far over the max your nic/cable could do anyway it doesn't matter.. And even if we talk differences like 2 vs 1 ms.. your still talking numbers way over the Gig mark, etc. Like 100,000 Mbps vs 55,000Mbps - so never going to come into play. And sorry if your getting seeing over 1 ms in your lan, you got something else causing the delay - not the cable ;)

[GavCity]

Yes, I think most decent network cable is 24AWG but unfortunately it doesn't specify AWG on the other links.

[Technique]

With the cable i'm going to have to cut the end. I don't want a hole any bigger than it needs to be in my ceiling.

 

Once up through the ceiling i'm going to connect it to a junction box.cat5e socket (oh actually thinking about it, would i need to buy a cat6 socket? are they different?)

 

Then do you just pair off the wires exactly the same when connecting?

 

This is what i bought last night:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/371010167803?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271132853308?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[GavCity]

Sockets are compatible but again cheaper isn't always the best way to go. If you're going to be running it like that you dont want to run it twice so get something half decent, not the very cheapest at least.

[GavCity]

So your saying that brand X will give me say .5 ms ping to my router.. But Brand y will give me 1 or even .6? Nonsense I say Nonsense!!

 

No, I'm saying that there will be a difference between cables in throughput Mbps.

[sc302 Veteran]

Uh no, not exactly. The cat 5e standard means that it will at least support 1Gb/s up to 100m, that is why there is a standard. What is the point of a standard if the cable can't live up to it? Might as well just call it a network cable if that were the case.

[GavCity]

Most cat5e cables will not give you 1gbps throughput over 100m. It is not a perfect world. No media is perfect. Cable is more reliable than wireless but still there is loss.

[Technique]

So basically there is zero difference between these then...

 

cat5e faceplate: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Single-Socket-Network-FacePlate-Ethernet/dp/B00ESDRG2A/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1417475124&sr=8-1&keywords=cat5e+faceplate

cat6 faceplate: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Plate-Sockets-Single-Keystones-Jacks/dp/B003OSYWWM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1417475288&sr=8-1&keywords=cat6+faceplate

 

& it's just marketing nonsense? The 5e faceplate i bought will work when terminating a 6 cable on it?

 

While i did find cheap & expensive cable, i didn't really find the same for faceplates :)

[sc302 Veteran]

No cable will give you successful transmission over 100m. Signal tends to fall off at that point, too much signal loss.

As far as the plate goes there is a standard that the ebbs have as well, though not as critical as the cable. You try to match the Jack to the cable, it is false advertising other wise.

[Technique]

Just to bring it back on topic here a little guys, i know it can go for 100mtr, but i'm only looking at 20mtr tops :) I just want to network my house, not the street ;)

[GavCity]

Nor will you get 1gbps throughput at 20 metres most of the time.

[sc302 Veteran]

Nor will you get 1gbps throughput at 20 metres most of the time.

I could use my network as an example, but I won't hold that to open speculation so I will ask where is your proof of this?

 

Here is some of mine:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabit_Ethernet

1000BASE?T Twisted-pair cabling (Cat-5, Cat-5e, Cat-6, Cat?7) 100 meters

 

1000BASE-T (also known as IEEE 802.3ab) is a standard for gigabit Ethernet over copper wiring.

Each 1000BASE-T network segment can be a maximum length of 100 meters (330 feet), and must use Category 5 cable or better (including Cat 5e and Cat 6).

 

Others stating speeds over 20m (60ft if you can't do the conversion from meters to feet)

http://forums.techguy.org/networking/602385-will-cat-5e-run-gigabyte.html

[GavCity]

The standard goes to a speed. It doesn't say you get that speed every time guaranteed through every cable up to 100m. The cables can run a frequency at 100m under specified conditions in a low interference environment. It does not say every cable guarantees 1 gig. It would be ridiculous if it did. It runs up to 1 Gbps up to 100m. You simply won't get that with a cheap stranded cable at 100m.