Fable Legends may be free to play...

[Hedon]

They tried something different with the last Fable game and it didn't do well. I think a fair few people thought this title would be a return to previous Fable titles, minus the Molyneux lies.

Fable 4 is separate from this and in the works. We are not worried about that.

[HawkMan]

They tried something different with the last Fable game and it didn't do well. I think a fair few people thought this title would be a return to previous Fable titles, minus the Molyneux lies.

 

why would they think that ? it's been advertised as a multiplayer 4v1 game since it was announced...

[theyarecomingforyou]

So far the only thing behind the pay wall is cosmetic items.

No, we know that heroes are going to be rotated and that you'll have to pay for them if you want to play with them outside of rotation. Unless the characters are all cosmetic then that means there is a gameplay impact as a result of the F2P system.

 

People were up in arms because MS didn't support F2P last gen and now they do it and people moan. People hate IPs getting rehashed over and over so MS offers another type of first party game doing a style they haven't done before and people complain.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

There was no reason for Microsoft not to support F2P, hence the criticism. It was preventing innovative games, as just look at how Team Fortress 2 evolved. As for IPs getting rehashed, people just want a decent sequel that adds new features and content while remaining familiar. The problem with F2P games is that they're built around the monetisation system rather than the gameplay.

 

So no, it's damned if you do it wrong.

 

why would they think that ? it's been advertised as a multiplayer 4v1 game since it was announced...

Because it has Fable in the title. There is nothing in the title that implies it's a 4v1 game. I didn't know it was a 4v1 game until you mentioned it.

[nosense]

 

No, we know that heroes are going to be rotated and that you'll have to pay for them if you want to play with them outside of rotation. Unless the characters are all cosmetic then that means there is a gameplay impact as a result of the F2P system.

No, they stated you can buy them with in game currency similar to league of legends model.

 

"You can pay either with earned in-game money or real money"-OP

[trooper11]

Because it has Fable in the title. There is nothing in the title that implies it's a 4v1 game. I didn't know it was a 4v1 game until you mentioned it.

This game has always been demoed as that style. It had a Baldur's Gate vibe to it. It was never billed as Fable 4 or pushed as a sequel. Its a different kind of game to the main line series.

I really do want to see a proper Fable 4 game though, something that goes back to the rpg roots. Maybe something epic on the scale of Skyrim or Dragon Age.

[Hedon]

theyarecomingforyou, on 01 Mar 2015 - 17:03, said:

 

No, we know that heroes are going to be rotated and that you'll have to pay for them if you want to play with them outside of rotation. Unless the characters are all cosmetic then that means there is a gameplay impact as a result of the F2P system.

 

There was no reason for Microsoft not to support F2P, hence the criticism. It was preventing innovative games, as just look at how Team Fortress 2 evolved. As for IPs getting rehashed, people just want a decent sequel that adds new features and content while remaining familiar. The problem with F2P games is that they're built around the monetisation system rather than the gameplay.

 

So no, it's damned if you do it wrong.

 

Because it has Fable in the title. There is nothing in the title that implies it's a 4v1 game. I didn't know it was a 4v1 game until you mentioned it.

 

Ah no, it was and is as I said. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I already explained it.

[theyarecomingforyou]

No, they stated you can buy them with in game currency similar to league of legends model.

 

"You can pay either with earned in-game money or real money"-OP

Hearthstone uses the same model, where you can grind for an absurd number of hours to earn enough currency or buy immediately with cash. The business model is based around getting people to pay cash for in-game items, so obviously they're not going to make it easy to earn those items in-game. This is my issue with F2P - it ruins the gameplay, as everything is based around microtransactions and grind. I'd rather just pay for a game outright and have the game built around enjoyable gameplay.

 

This game has always been demoed as that style. It had a Baldur's Gate vibe to it. It was never billed as Fable 4 or pushed as a sequel. Its a different kind of game to the main line series.

I really do want to see a proper Fable 4 game though, something that goes back to the rpg roots. Maybe something epic on the scale of Skyrim or Dragon Age.

The point remains that it's a Fable game and that carries certain expectations. They could have gone with an original brand but instead chose to play off an existing brand.

 

Ah no, it was and is as I said. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I already explained it.

That's your opinion. As I said, I disagree.

[nosense]

Hearthstone uses the same model, where you can grind for an absurd number of hours to earn enough currency or buy immediately with cash. The business model is based around getting people to pay cash for in-game items, so obviously they're not going to make it easy to earn those items in-game. This is my issue with F2P - it ruins the gameplay, as everything is based around microtransactions and grind. I'd rather just pay for a game outright and have the game built around enjoyable gameplay.

 

The point remains that it's a Fable game and that carries certain expectations. They could have gone with an original brand but instead chose to play off an existing brand.

 

That's your opinion. As I said, I disagree.

Like i said before we don't know how in game currency going to work yet and this is not hearthstone model, its more like League of Legends f2p model. 

 

Again no item is behind a pay wall, just "cosmetic items" like how league of legends you can buy skins. It's clearly not using the same model as hearthstone, it's using the MOBA model..

 

 

"There will be no paywalls, no limited game time, no horrible "energy bars" or "gems" or whatever that take time to recharge. There will be 4 heroes available to play at any one time, and they will rotate every 2 weeks. Then, if you want to keep playing a character, you can either wait for them to come back into rotation (with all your XP and equipment intact), or pay to unlock them permanently. You can pay either with earned in-game money or real money, and you can also pay for cosmetic items; everything gameplay-related can only be earned through play. Same goes for villain players: different villain monsters will rotate every few weeks, and you can pay to unlock them permanently."

[HawkMan]

Hearthstone uses the same model, where you can grind for an absurd number of hours to earn enough currency or buy immediately with cash. The business model is based around getting people to pay cash for in-game items, so obviously they're not going to make it easy to earn those items in-game. This is my issue with F2P - it ruins the gameplay, as everything is based around microtransactions and grind. I'd rather just pay for a game outright and have the game built around enjoyable gameplay.

 

The point remains that it's a Fable game and that carries certain expectations. They could have gone with an original brand but instead chose to play off an existing brand.

 

That's your opinion. As I said, I disagree.

 

 

there was a time when playing a game to earn rewards and new stuff was the norm.

 

either way hearthstone is a bad example since it is a CCG. Heroes of the Storm is a more accurate example. and in the early beta when the prices where really high, I managed to earn the more expensive Nova character pretty fast by playing and enjoying the game, not feeling like a grind.

 

 

if earning credits feels like a grind, you're probably not enjoying the game anyway, and that won't change by earning a new character, so you'd be better of switching to a game you enjoy.

and why can't we have multiple types of games in the Fable universe. saying you can only have traditional RPGs in fable is short sighted. There are many game universes with multiple types of games set in them.

[theyarecomingforyou]

Like i said before we don't know how in game currency going to work yet and this is not hearthstone model, its more like League of Legends f2p model. 

 

Again no item is behind a pay wall, just "cosmetic items" like how league of legends you can buy skins. It's clearly not using the same model as hearthstone, it's using the MOBA model..

 

 

"There will be no paywalls, no limited game time, no horrible "energy bars" or "gems" or whatever that take time to recharge. There will be 4 heroes available to play at any one time, and they will rotate every 2 weeks. Then, if you want to keep playing a character, you can either wait for them to come back into rotation (with all your XP and equipment intact), or pay to unlock them permanently. You can pay either with earned in-game money or real money, and you can also pay for cosmetic items; everything gameplay-related can only be earned through play. Same goes for villain players: different villain monsters will rotate every few weeks, and you can pay to unlock them permanently."

The characters are behind a paywall. In order to play characters that aren't in the free rotation you have to pay for them or earn in-game currency. By necessity it will take a long time to earn them using the in-game currency, as that forces players towards making cash purchases and is what funds the game - that means grind.

 

there was a time when playing a game to earn rewards and new stuff was the norm.

 

either way hearthstone is a bad example since it is a CCG. Heroes of the Storm is a more accurate example. and in the early beta when the prices where really high, I managed to earn the more expensive Nova character pretty fast by playing and enjoying the game, not feeling like a grind.

Heroes Of The Storm isn't any better. By hiding characters behind a paywall it has a direct impact upon gameplay, something which Dota 2 doesn't do.

 

It's the same business model as Hearthstone, only with a rotating selection of free characters. They're designed to get you hooked and make cash payments to unlock. It's like drug dealers giving out free samples to get you hooked.

 

As I have said, I would rather just pay for a quality game than have it ruined by microtransactions. I want games based around compelling gameplay, not monetisation systems.

[nosense]

The characters are behind a paywall. In order to play characters that aren't in the free rotation you have to pay for them or earn in-game currency. By necessity it will take a long time to earn them using the in-game currency, as that forces players towards making cash purchases and is what funds the game - that means grind.

 

Heroes Of The Storm isn't any better. By hiding characters behind a paywall it has a direct impact upon gameplay, something which Dota 2 doesn't do.

 

It's the same business model as Hearthstone, only with a rotating selection of free characters. They're designed to get you hooked and make cash payments to unlock. It's like drug dealers giving out free samples to get you hooked.

 

As I have said, I would rather just pay for a quality game than have it ruined by microtransactions. I want games based around compelling gameplay, not monetisation systems.

Long time? Who know's like i said no info on how in game currency works. It might be be a long grind or not a long grind, but atleast its not pay to win.

 

This is basically the same model as league of legend, i've been playing that game for a year or two and havent spent a dime on that game. Just by regular play , I've unlock 90 percent of the summoners and ruins at zero cost.

[theyarecomingforyou]

Long time? Who know's like i said no info on how in game currency works. It might be be a long grind or not a long grind, but atleast its not pay to win.

For microtransactions to work the in-game currency has to take a long time to acquire. That's a necessity of the business model. It remains to be seen if the game is P2W, as if players that pay for characters have a distinct advantage over the free characters then that's P2W.

[Hedon]

 

 

That's your opinion. As I said, I disagree.

 

But it is not an opinion. It's a fact that I stated.

 

nosense, on 02 Mar 2015 - 06:50, said:

Like i said before we don't know how in game currency going to work yet and this is not hearthstone model, its more like League of Legends f2p model. 

 

Again no item is behind a pay wall, just "cosmetic items" like how league of legends you can buy skins. It's clearly not using the same model as hearthstone, it's using the MOBA model..

 

 

"There will be no paywalls, no limited game time, no horrible "energy bars" or "gems" or whatever that take time to recharge. There will be 4 heroes available to play at any one time, and they will rotate every 2 weeks. Then, if you want to keep playing a character, you can either wait for them to come back into rotation (with all your XP and equipment intact), or pay to unlock them permanently. You can pay either with earned in-game money or real money, and you can also pay for cosmetic items; everything gameplay-related can only be earned through play. Same goes for villain players: different villain monsters will rotate every few weeks, and you can pay to unlock them permanently."

 

Well stated.

 

theyarecomingforyou, on 02 Mar 2015 - 10:10, said:

The characters are behind a paywall. In order to play characters that aren't in the free rotation you have to pay for them or earn in-game currency. By necessity it will take a long time to earn them using the in-game currency, as that forces players towards making cash purchases and is what funds the game - that means grind.

 

Heroes Of The Storm isn't any better. By hiding characters behind a paywall it has a direct impact upon gameplay, something which Dota 2 doesn't do.

 

It's the same business model as Hearthstone, only with a rotating selection of free characters. They're designed to get you hooked and make cash payments to unlock. It's like drug dealers giving out free samples to get you hooked.

 

As I have said, I would rather just pay for a quality game than have it ruined by microtransactions. I want games based around compelling gameplay, not monetisation systems.

 

Do you have a link from Lionhead confirming it will take a long time?

[theyarecomingforyou]

But it is not an opinion. It's a fact that I stated.

No, it's an opinion and I disagree.

 

Do you have a link from Lionhead confirming it will take a long time?

It's the business model. In order to encourage users to make cash purchases they have to disincentivise the in-game currency, otherwise the game won't make money. To what degree it's an issue remains to be seen.

[nosense]

For microtransactions to work the in-game currency has to take a long time to acquire. That's a necessity of the business model. It remains to be seen if the game is P2W, as if players that pay for characters have a distinct advantage over the free characters then that's P2W.

That's a blance issue, not p2w issue regarding new characters being overpowered.

 

"For microtransactions to work the in-game currency has to take a long time to acquire." that's not true at all, games like league of legends make's a huge chunk of revenue from people purchasing cosmetic items like champion skins\ward skins\etc. if you want to fast track in getting the full roaster and pay. Thats fine, it doesn't hurt the blance of the overall game.

[George P Global Moderator]

Lot's of pre-determined conclusions here from some just because they hear "f2p". We'll know enough in time but so far, from what they have said it's nothing like what people say it'll be. 

[theyarecomingforyou]

That's a blance issue, not p2w issue regarding new characters being overpowered.

 

"For microtransactions to work the in-game currency has to take a long time to acquire." that's not true at all, games like league of legends make's a huge chunk of revenue from people purchasing cosmetic items like champion skins\ward skins\etc. if you want to fast track in getting the full roaster and pay. Thats fine, it doesn't hurt the blance of the overall game.

The point remains that Dota 2 has a F2P model that involves cosmetic items only, meaning there is ZERO impact on game balance. The situation is different with Heroes Of The Storm and Fable Legends, which hide characters behind a paywall.

 

I'm not saying this will be a bad game because of the F2P model, I'm just saying that I'd much rather pay for a game outright.

[nosense]

The point remains that Dota 2 has a F2P model that involves cosmetic items only, meaning there is ZERO impact on game balance. The situation is different with Heroes Of The Storm and Fable Legends, which hide characters behind a paywall.

 

I'm not saying this will be a bad game because of the F2P model, I'm just saying that I'd much rather pay for a game outright.

And again i keep on saying it's like the league of legend model, which you can grind in game currency to without paying a dime.

 

Locked behind a paywall means you have no access to it unless you pay real money. Which is not true. The only thing locked behind the paywall is cosmetic skins.

[theyarecomingforyou]

And again i keep on saying it's like the league of legend model, which you can grind in game currency to without paying a dime.

I'm well aware of that and acknowledged it numerous times.

 

Locked behind a paywall means you have no access to it unless you pay real money. Which is not true. The only thing locked behind the paywall is cosmetic skins.

The price is grind instead of cash. As I said, Hearthstone was ruined by the model.

[nosense]

I'm well aware of that and acknowledged it numerous times.

 

 

The price is grind instead of cash. As I said, Hearthstone was ruined by the model.

2 different genre and 2 different games. I never played hearthstone so I can't say if it was ruined or not by what ever model they implemented. The only thing i know about heathstone is that its an huge game with a huge player base. 

[HawkMan]

The point remains that Dota 2 has a F2P model that involves cosmetic items only, meaning there is ZERO impact on game balance. The situation is different with Heroes Of The Storm and Fable Legends, which hide characters behind a paywall.

 

I'm not saying this will be a bad game because of the F2P model, I'm just saying that I'd much rather pay for a game outright.

 

HotS system may be annoying sometimes, BUT it in no way affects game balance.

 

Anyway you completely ignored the majority of my last post.

I'm well aware of that and acknowledged it numerous times.

 

 

The price is grind instead of cash. As I said, Hearthstone was ruined by the model.

 

 

and again, it's not a grind if you enjoy the game, if you don't enjoy it, that's not going to change because yoga unlock Nova.

[theyarecomingforyou]

 

HotS system may be annoying sometimes, BUT it in no way affects game balance.

Of course it does, as people that pay get access to different characters that have inherent strengths and weaknesses. If one of the best characters to counter a free character is behind a paywall then that affects gameplay. That's something that Dota 2 doesn't do - it allows you to play all characters and only charges for cosmetic items.

 

and again, it's not a grind if you enjoy the game, if you don't enjoy it, that's not going to change because yoga unlock Nova.

Not true. I enjoyed Hearthstone but couldn't be bothered playing it because of the grind. As I've said repeatedly, the F2P model reduces my enjoyment of a game. I'd rather pay for a game outright that's designed to be fun that play one for free that's designed around the monetisation system.

 

Anyway, I think I've made my point and I don't want to just keep repeating myself as that doesn't achieve anything.

[HawkMan]

I'm not sure you've actually played HotS and understand how the balance system in the game works, but your scenario is a non issue as it won't happen.