Valve cancels paid mods for Skyrim


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Removing Payment Feature From Skyrim Workshop

We're going to remove the payment feature from the Skyrim workshop. For anyone who spent money on a mod, we'll be refunding you the complete amount. We talked to the team at Bethesda and they agree.

We've done this because it's clear we didn't understand exactly what we were doing. We've been shipping many features over the years aimed at allowing community creators to receive a share of the rewards, and in the past, they've been received well. It's obvious now that this case is different.

To help you understand why we thought this was a good idea, our main goals were to allow mod makers the opportunity to work on their mods full time if they wanted to, and to encourage developers to provide better support to their mod communities. We thought this would result in better mods for everyone, both free & paid. We wanted more great mods becoming great products, like Dota, Counter-strike, DayZ, and Killing Floor, and we wanted that to happen organically for any mod maker who wanted to take a shot at it.

But we underestimated the differences between our previously successful revenue sharing models, and the addition of paid mods to Skyrim's workshop. We understand our own game's communities pretty well, but stepping into an established, years old modding community in Skyrim was probably not the right place to start iterating. We think this made us miss the mark pretty badly, even though we believe there's a useful feature somewhere here.

Now that you've backed a dump truck of feedback onto our inboxes, we'll be chewing through that, but if you have any further thoughts let us know.

Source: Steam Community via Neogaf

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I have no doubt it'll return eventually, it's too profitable a business model for modders and game developers, the only people complaining were those who didn't want to have to spend money.

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Apparently we're supposed to be getting some news about Fallout 4 in May. Look for this whole mess to return when and if that game is ever released.

 

Valves heart was in the right place but the implementation was just absolutely awful. There was no quality control. No way to ensure the person selling a mod actually owns it, etc etc etc.

 

If Valve actually wants this to be a real thing they are going to have to address those issues. They can't take the same hands off approach with this that they have taken with early access and green light.

 

In the mean time they just need put a donate button on each mod page and give 100% of the donation (aside from taxes) to the mod author.

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Ah well props to them for admitting and refunding.  Sounds easier than it is with companies sometimes.  I think theres potential here but as trag3dy said if they want to take that approach would need to be more actively managed otherwise the donate button is likely the best approach.

 

...also fingers crossed for FO4 news in May!

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I have no doubt it'll return eventually, it's too profitable a business model for modders and game developers, the only people complaining were those who didn't want to have to spend money.

 

Yea they were the only ones complaining  :rolleyes:

People didn't sale mods that contained work by other people that was all made up.

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I have no doubt it'll return eventually, it's too profitable a business model for modders and game developers, the only people complaining were those who didn't want to have to spend money.

 

 

Ok suuure. That's why no one took the for paid mods side seriously and their weak arguments fell flat. Most would have no objection to tipping a nice donation to show their support and even more so now. That has very little to do with why there was such an outcry towards paid mods especially for a game with a modding community as large and mature as Skyrim. Those in favor of this can't see past their own eyelids to see the larger picture and the implications involved.

 

I've seen no meaningful discussion or arguments supporting why this was a good idea or how this benefits modders. I'm a fairly level headed and easy going person and even I could not find a reason to remotely give paid mods consideration and even more so for a game such as Skyrim. Paid mods might seem like a good idea on paper and only for those that have to gain from it to further their agendas. The reality of it and larger picture would paint a different picture for those willing to open their eyes AND mind. It's a corporations wet dream. It's about profits and control, putting the nail in the coffin of the modding scene as we knew it. See it for what it is and not the wool Valve/Bethesda was trying to pull over everyone's eyes. Read around, there are several well rounded and solid arguments against paid mods and why it's a terrible idea as presented.

 

Modding should remain a separate entity, free and open. Scrap the idea as is and reimplement for a game without an established modding scene and release as paid content (DLC) and I doubt there would be nearly as much outcry. This was a very bad precedence and the fact mods are what drastically improved Skyrim and pushed sales. It's not like Bethesda will suddenly develop and release more patches with the cut they received and the fact SKSE, SKyUI and USKP were going the paid route was very bad for everyone. Some have hundreds of mods installed. It would be a very expensive headache for everyone. Copyrights and DMCA would infect the modding scene and modders would have their own headaches to deal with.

 

For anyone that isn't a lawyer it's easy to take legal speak out of context. Claiming it was previously illegal to charge for mods may or may not be true but without knowing specifics that claim is sketchy. I doubt donations were strictly illegal nor was charging subscriptions as a service for modders wishing to go the paid route. Without clarification and proper interpretation from a legal representative we can only sit back and assume it was illegal up to and including donations and subscriptions.

 

Everyone had an issue with the pittance of a cut Valve was giving modders versus the cut themselves and Bethesda were going to take. It's like throwing peanuts at someone after they've worked so hard. It's insulting and I'm baffled anyone was going to accept this and jump on board. I was surprised modders and reputable modders behind quality mods - those I least expected to jump aboard.

 

G'day.

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I have nothing against paying for mods but I find the publisher and Valve getting 75% of the profits absurd.  That's like...hey you can pay for this thing, but we developed it and we get NOTHING!  I'd be extremely offended even considering it.

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Yea they were the only ones complaining  :rolleyes:

People didn't sale mods that contained work by other people that was all made up.

Sure they did, the right response in that situation is to send a takedown request (Like you would in any other situation), not boycott the whole idea.

Edit: It was only a few months ago that Valve quite publicly took down a community created CS:GO item (That you had to pay for, the horror!) because it included material created by somebody other than the people who submitted it. People actually got upset at Valve over that for taking it down so quickly.

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Sure they did, the right response in that situation is to send a takedown request (Like you would in any other situation), not boycott the whole idea.

Edit: It was only a few months ago that Valve quite publicly took down a community created CS:GO item (That you had to pay for, the horror!) because it included material created by somebody other than the people who submitted it. People actually got upset at Valve over that for taking it down so quickly.

 

Is the mod scene for CS:GO comparable to the mod scene for Skyrim? Or any bethsoft game for that matter? CS:GO might have a few hundred to a thousand or so mods while skyrim has tens of thousands of mods with just as many degrees of complexity and quality.

 

And to say that only people who did like this was the people people who didn't want to pay for mods is being dishonest at best. Many modders on the skyrim nexus were against it. The ones who would have benefited from it the most.

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They should just have a Donate button IMO.

This. Simple solution that is win-win for pretty much everyone (provided they also changed the 25% payout)

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Sure they did, the right response in that situation is to send a takedown request (Like you would in any other situation), not boycott the whole idea.

Edit: It was only a few months ago that Valve quite publicly took down a community created CS:GO item (That you had to pay for, the horror!) because it included material created by somebody other than the people who submitted it. People actually got upset at Valve over that for taking it down so quickly.

 

But Valve response was "its ok". A guy who took down his mod posted the messages between him and Valve and they didnt have a problem if it contained parts of someone else's mod. Valve just half-assed paid mods on their workshop.

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Is the mod scene for CS:GO comparable to the mod scene for Skyrim? Or any bethsoft game for that matter? CS:GO might have a few hundred to a thousand or so mods while skyrim has tens of thousands of mods with just as many degrees of complexity and quality.

 

And to say that only people who did like this was the people people who didn't want to pay for mods is being dishonest at best. Many modders on the skyrim nexus were against it. The ones who would have benefited from it the most.

The CS:GO mod scene is much smaller, which of course means nothing when it comes to DMCA compliance.

Lets use an example, SkyUI. One of the biggest Skyrim mods, and one of the biggest mods on the Nexus, downloaded nearly 4 and a half million times. They decided selling the mod on Steam would earn them more money than the donations they were receiving from the Nexus (Because I doubt those 4 and a half million downloaders all donated $1 or so) The response from the Nexus users was fairly consistently "Why should I have to pay for this?", and soon after the mod started getting pirated. That really doesn't sound like people wanting to support modders to me, exact opposite really.

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Good thing they removed it. The paid system was so stupidly done. Hiding Valve's mods ratings in order to get more purchases and swarming the workshop with hundreds of junks mods. Most of them looked like some sort of a joke but still required some cents to play. I was shocked at how low has Valve's service fallen.

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The CS:GO mod scene is much smaller, which of course means nothing when it comes to DMCA compliance.

Lets use an example, SkyUI. One of the biggest Skyrim mods, and one of the biggest mods on the Nexus, downloaded nearly 4 and a half million times. They decided selling the mod on Steam would earn them more money than the donations they were receiving from the Nexus (Because I doubt those 4 and a half million downloaders all donated $1 or so) The response from the Nexus users was fairly consistently "Why should I have to pay for this?", and soon after the mod started getting pirated. That really doesn't sound like people wanting to support modders to me, exact opposite really.

 

It makes a difference because of how the mod scene for Skyrim works and how many mods there are for it.

 

 

Ah well props to them for admitting and refunding.  Sounds easier than it is with companies sometimes.  I think theres potential here but as trag3dy said if they want to take that approach would need to be more actively managed otherwise the donate button is likely the best approach.

 

...also fingers crossed for FO4 news in May!

 

 

I was mistaken about that. I thought it E3 was in May but it's in June. That's my bad.

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I have no doubt it'll return eventually, it's too profitable a business model for modders and game developers, the only people complaining were those who didn't want to have to spend money.

 

Nah, the whole model was a mess. Trying to monetise something like this is always going to be a mess because it's has run for so long without.

 

Donate buttons all the way, then everyone has a choice.

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Another thing is that while developers deserve support for their hard work, mods can be messy (to put it nicely!). It's not rare for a mod to be hard to install (getting better with Steam, but still not as easy as it should), stuff not working, updates breaking things or never coming, etc etc. 

People raise hell when a game seems unfinished, or has a patch or DLC coming on launch day... will mods get the same treatment? If you're buying something you should expect it to more or less work and be complete.

 

I think the donate button is the way to go.

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Wow, this could have revolutionized the gaming industry, but a bunch people who are afraid of change ruined it for everyone else.

 

That's hardly what happened and you clearly aren't paying attention to all the flaws it had if you think what you said is actually true.

 

The flaws in the system far out weighed any positives it might have had.

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Wow, this could have revolutionized the gaming industry, but a bunch people who are afraid of change ruined it for everyone else.

How so? I've only rarely used mods in a game, and that was a number of years ago...however I can see that the modding community has been strong, and still is, without the need of commercialising it. I believe that introducing costs would only shrink the amount of mods that are created. People would stop making them for fun and do it purely for the cash (which I think would bring less care/affection to the mods and more problems).

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Good! I was most disgusted by the prospect of SkyUI becoming payware. Since many mods depend on it. Thank you Gabe for realizing what a horrible idea this was.

 

Authors of mods are more likely to get money by asking for donations. Perhaps offering an incentive like if you donate above $XX you get to name an NPC or get your name put in the credits, etc. 

 

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