DVD Forum approves Triple Layer HD DVD Version 2.0

The DVD Forum, the international organization that oversees standardization of DVD and HD DVD optical disc formats, has finally approved version 2.0 of triple-layer HD DVD discs, meaning manufacturers can now begin production of HD DVD read-only discs that can hold up to 51GB (3 x 17) of data. As well, content producers may now start to think about how to use additional capacity. Back in September, the DVD Forum approved version 1.9 specification of 51GB HD DVD media as well as revision 1.0 of triple-layer twin format discs, which can hold up to 30GB of data on its HD DVD side and up to 4.7GB of data on its DVD side. Toshiba confirmed the triple-layer disc structure and its successful operation earlier this year.

More importantly however, neither Toshiba nor the DVD Forum have confirmed that triple-layer HD DVDs will play on existing HD DVD hardware. Fortunately users on dedicated high-definition related forums report that improved 17GB layers actually gained in readability (compared to 15GB layers) and that even first-generation HD DVD players can read three layers. Therefore, it is highly likely that movies distributed on triple-layer HD DVD 51GB discs will be playable even on the very first HD DVD players. It remains to be seen whether triple-layer HD DVDs are more cost-efficient compared to dual-layer Blu-ray discs both in terms of media costs as well as replications costs.

News source: Xbit Laboratories

Report a problem with article
Previous Story

Blizzard not thinking about World of Warcraft 2

Next Story

Samsung Electronics sheds 1,600 jobs

25 Comments

Commenting is disabled on this article.

This format war isn't going to end until something much better comes along and supersedes them both. We will look back 100 years from now at this technological err, a mere blip on the radar of humanity!

I hope blu-ray wins because the technology is better. I can't believe there is even a competition. I mean, where's the logic is choosing worse technology?

I hope blu-ray wins because the technology is better.

As my good friends across the pond say...********. Explain how it's better. Please enlighten us.

Anyway, I'd like to clarify one point this article makes. There is no "DVD side" in the new twin format. The existing problematic combo discs are that now. No, the new twin format will have 2 HD DVD layers and 1 DVD layer. From everything I've seen coming out of prototyping and testing it's a far better and more stable and reliable format. Now users won't have to be confused as to which side of the disc goes up for DVD and HD. Just put the disc in and it'll play on your machine. Granted, the DVD layer is only 4.7GB right now, so there are limitations. But, this should be solvable as well.

from what i hear HD-DVD is better from a technical standpoint and they got stuff more organized etc etc

and i been hearing a decent amount of articles lately that HD-DVD is in good shape to win.

p.s. i think only real advanatage blu-ray has over hd-dvd is capacity. which is the ONLY reason i want it over hd-dvd. other than that i think hd-dvd is straight up better.... not to mention sony is a shady company lol

but for me personally, the bottom line is i aint going to bother with either format anytime soon until "price" is similar to dvd prices nowadays. so in other words 100 dollars tops for the reader that can read hd-dvd movies (plus not to mention i still gotta get a hdtv) and a burner than can burn them affordably (like 50-75ish for the burners) and maybe 1 dollar TOPS for the recordable discs. until this happends ill stick with current dvd with a smile on my face

If these discs and their burnable versions, and drives, can be produced cheaper than corresponding double layer Blu-ray ones, then they've caught up with Blu-ray's greatest advantage. It's the one advantage I see with Blu-ray, but one that I do believe is a strong one, especially for the usage in data storage.

I couldn't give a damn which "side" wins out here personally out of company preferences. Sony and MS are just two sides of evil in many cases, for example. I'm only looking at the technology and pricing. So if by the time this disc comes out and the Blu-ray camp will have a competitively priced disc at a higher capacity to preserve the current situation, then I think that format still looks interesting. Otherwise, of course, much less so.

As of right now, Blu-ray burners seem much more common than HD-DVD burners at least here in Sweden, and even getting down to "interesting" prices although still needing I think price cuts of up to 20-30% to be really interesting for a broader market than the enthusiasts.

Conversely, BD-R's are pretty much as cheap as HD-DVD-R's, so there's absolutely no benefit I can see to go for HD-DVD-R's rather than BD-R's at this point, today. You'll lose out a ton of space for barely any cheaper discs.

But this could change things, although they really need to start getting out some real cheap-ass HD-DVD burners here to start getting an edge. Today, using HD-DVD for data archival is a far worse choice than going Blu-ray.

Personally I'm starting to doubt either side will win, and that we'll have a succeeding format starting to get ready before this war is over.

I eagerly await Blu-Ray fanboys switching their arguments from "But Blu-Ray holds 50GBs & HD DVD only 30GB" to "But Blu-Ray has higher bandwidth than HD DVD & that's far more important than size".

The Blu-Ray group were testing 200GB discs, so capacity is still the biggest benefit of Blu-Ray. If the Blu-Ray group cannot get higher capacity discs to the public in a sensible timeframe then the HD-DVD format will start to become more popular, particularly with the exclusivity arrangement with Paramount (owners of Star Trek, amongst other things). No fanboy is going to use bandwidth as an arguement to support Blu-Ray and it's silly to suggest that, however much you adore HD-DVD.

theyarecomingforyou said,
The Blu-Ray group were testing 200GB discs, so capacity is still the biggest benefit of Blu-Ray. If the Blu-Ray group cannot get higher capacity discs to the public in a sensible timeframe then the HD-DVD format will start to become more popular, particularly with the exclusivity arrangement with Paramount (owners of Star Trek, amongst other things). No fanboy is going to use bandwidth as an arguement to support Blu-Ray and it's silly to suggest that, however much you adore HD-DVD.

Those discs are still in the prototyping stage however, and will require all new players.

HD-DVD is able to provide size updates with firmware upgrades with existing hardware.

theyarecomingforyou said,
The Blu-Ray group were testing 200GB discs, so capacity is still the biggest benefit of Blu-Ray.

Do you realize that it's the same technology, same laser. They both can do it lol.

Morpheus Phreak said,

Those discs are still in the prototyping stage however, and will require all new players.

HD-DVD is able to provide size updates with firmware upgrades with existing hardware.


On the other hand, if you can get your hands on 200 GB discs with a new player or recorder, that's a decent sales pitch. It would be such an improvement, that the size range would get into the territory of a new storage format.

Zhivago said,

Do you realize that it's the same technology, same laser. They both can do it lol.


Well... The numerical aparture is all different. That's where the extra space comes from. HD-DVD can't "do it" unless they change the specs entirely. What they can do is try to cram in more layers. Although Blu-ray discs can do this too, of course.

Zhivago said,
Do you realize that it's the same technology, same laser. They both can do it lol.

What nonsense. That's the whole reason the HD-DVD and Blu-Ray groups couldn't agree - because they had different storage capacities and required different technology to read the discs. You shouldn't post statements like that if you don't know about the subject matter.

theyarecomingforyou said,
No fanboy is going to use bandwidth as an arguement to support Blu-Ray and it's silly to suggest that, however much you adore HD-DVD.
Course they will; "Higher bandwidth = higher bitrates. Higher bitrates = even better video / sound". Wait & see...

theyarecomingforyou said,
If the Blu-Ray group cannot get higher capacity discs to the public in a sensible timeframe then the HD-DVD format will start to become more popular, particularly with the exclusivity arrangement with Paramount (owners of Star Trek, amongst other things)

Why would people choose a format based on capacity? I think people care more about what's on the discs themselves

theyarecomingforyou said,
The Blu-Ray group were testing 200GB discs, so capacity is still the biggest benefit of Blu-Ray. If the Blu-Ray group cannot get higher capacity discs to the public in a sensible timeframe then the HD-DVD format will start to become more popular, particularly with the exclusivity arrangement with Paramount (owners of Star Trek, amongst other things). No fanboy is going to use bandwidth as an arguement to support Blu-Ray and it's silly to suggest that, however much you adore HD-DVD.

200GB is nice and all... but think about it...most 42-50" tvs can only display a certain ammount of data, and I doubt movies are EVER going to be long enough to suck up that much data. Maybe if you had a 200" TV, and the movie was encoded in like some ultra high def size 4000x4000? lol then maybe..but if current 30 and 50GB disks can hold all the content they currently hold...who cares about a 200GB disk unless you're using it to backup your data. useless.

The point of extra capacity is NOT for extra resolution - it is for holding more content. Instead of needing four 50GB discs you'd only need one 200GB disc, meaning you're not switching out discs as often. It makes little difference for typical movies (except that all the extras can fit on a single disc) but it makes a huge different with series. With DVDs consumers got used to more discs being better but now we should be getting back to having as few discs as possible but with the same amount of content.

theyarecomingforyou said,
The point of extra capacity is NOT for extra resolution - it is for holding more content. Instead of needing four 50GB discs you'd only need one 200GB disc, meaning you're not switching out discs as often. It makes little difference for typical movies (except that all the extras can fit on a single disc) but it makes a huge different with series. With DVDs consumers got used to more discs being better but now we should be getting back to having as few discs as possible but with the same amount of content.

The video quality isn't going to change much but sound on the other hand takes up a ton of room especially uncompressed. And that's what I want. Totally uncompressed 7.1. As far as I know, only BluRay can do that at the moment.

it is highly likely that movies distributed on triple-layer HD DVD 51GB discs will be playable even on the very first HD DVD players.

This is the key sentence in the article =)