Get out the bandages, Apple's stock is bleeding value


There was a lot of speculation around Apple’s stock over the past year about how high it could go. Analysts love to make wild predictions that they are not accountable for, with some saying that the share price would top $1000 or go as high as $1500 a share, but alas, it looks like those pipe-dreams may be over.

Over the past three months, Apple’s stock has been on collision course with the X axis as the price has plummeted from a high of over $700 to the current lows of $490; and the bleeding does not appear to be letting up as the stock is down another 2%, as of this posting.

The theories as to why the stock is sinking faster than the Costa Concordia range from Apple having lost its way after the death of Jobs, to iPhone 5 sales missing the mark. Another guess that has made its way around the Internet is that the iPad mini is undercutting iPad sales which is resulting in lower profits, per device, for Apple.

It’s quite interesting to see the stock fall this sharply as there must be unrest in the market regarding Apple’s future. With no significant changes to the company’s strategy in several years, it could be that Apple’s edge has finally been matched by its competitors. Whatever the reason, investors are dumping Apple stock at a significant pace which indicates that there is certainly an external factor at play.

We don’t have to wait much longer to see how Apple performed during Q4 of 2012; the company's earnings call is on January 23rd and at this point, we will find out off the massive sell-off was founded or unfounded.

Source: Yahoo

Report a problem with article
Previous Story

Microsoft: Yammer is the company's "golden egg"

Next Story

Microsoft adds new support for its "Cloud OS" enterprise services

154 Comments

Commenting is disabled on this article.

The stock is bleeding because of 6 years of making the same phone. For 3 years of making the same tablet. No innovation, no real new features and nothing to look forwarded too. And the fact Apple's most hated competitors namely Google and Samsung kicking their arse. They expect a whopping 50M+ sales. Apple ordered a whopping 65M components from varying companies. Last week they asked for production to be cut by nearly 60%.

Iphone 5 sales are bad. REAL bad. Badder than they are telling you. Need proof? We already saw leaks of the iPhone 5. After the iPhone was officially annouced by Apple, the iPhone 4S continued to have huge sales even AFTER the iPhone was avail for pre-order and even after it was avail at retail stores. The sales of the Galaxy S III also increased. Verizon report that sales of the Motorola Razr which at the time was $299.99 on contract was selling faster than the 4S and the 5 combined. Where the iPhones were $199.99 starting. The Galaxy Note which starts at $299.99 at VZW, Sprint and ATT and were also selling like crazy.

I China, Windows Phone has gained major marketshare while Apple share has stood completely still. In fact when Windows Phone 7 had reached 7% market in China.

Google now has 70% of the smartphone market. In Q3 of 2012, Samsung sold 90M phones. Numbers which only Nokia and RIM use to see. 45M were smartphones where Apple only sold 23M. Samsung devices represent 40% of all Android phones sold and the hottest sellers are all bigger than the iPhone. The Galaxy line has proven to kill Apple single handedly as a single model with different country/carrier variants. But it is just one device.

Sorry Steve Jobs, but one phone can't make a difference. The stall in innovation by APple, with products that are appearing damaged when removed from the packaging, the child labor and fights at factories, the constant speaking against Samsung and others, the suing for non-innovative lements to stall competition is now backfiring.

They deserve every bit of it. I hope they gpo totally broke and just die along with theor hated leader.

I loved Apple in the past. My first computer was an original Apple II. I also had a IIc, IIe and IIGS. Those products got me interested in the IT Field which I remain in today. But the Apple since 1997 is not that same company I use to love. I hated when Microsoft didn't pulled the plug which ultimately would have killed them off.

The iPhone is a great device, the iPad was a great device when they both were first introduced. They certainly helped push other device makers into getting with the game and playing it to win and those who played the best game are now beating Apple at its game.

Apple stock never being split because of the company's greed has shown. AT least Microsoft split its stock 9 times to help more people invest. If you unsplit the stock it would be worth over $1000 per share.

All this litigation which APple started, getting patents for stuff like slide-to-lock which existed since the days of Pharoah, who stole company names for their own products and more are now dying a slow death just like Jobs did.
The company losing its founder, really isnt the issue, Steve left them a path to follow. The problem is that path lead to non-innovative products, that have the same designa nd style, offer no major bnefeit and people have simply wised up. The iPad is really the best thing they ahve now and that wont be after Windows 8 Pro devices with full touch capability is released.

While all the Microsoft haters are bashing Microsoft for taking Windows to the next level in providing a Touch UI...Look, Macs cost much more and you cant use touch at all. You have to start somewhere. Apple was willing to start with the iPhone and iPad to talk about in 2000.

Apple sat on their laurels for 6 years on iPhone. RIM did this too and Microsoft did this too. Look what happened to them. RIM is less than half what they use to be. Nokia is no longer the device production king, and wow Apple is no longer the great innovator; or as I say thief.

Unless the NEXT iPhone or iPad is a killer innovative device, ITS OVER FOR THEM VERY QUICKLY.

Now that their stock price is taking a hit, I hope that Apple finally chooses to bring out the big guns and put out products that are actually exciting, instead of milking the same stuff just because they could.

So, simply slapping a bigger screen on an existing model causes less demand? How shocking. Suing companies like Samsung because they are beating you causes those companies to increase sales? Whodathunkit?

Good riddance.

When the Apple stock was rising there was so many smirk comments from the Apple fanboys. They wanted to smear it into your face, like you if you where a representative from Microsoft to be held accountable, event though we are just a normal consumers.

I meet this a lot. Apple fanboys thinks that I know Microsofts strategy or is part of the decision making and accuse you for all sort of stuff, as if they are part of the Apples management. Really weird.

The top of that graph strangely coincides with the release of Win 8. And MS stock dive strangely coincided with Gates departure. Just Omens I'm sure. I mean who's afraid of Windows 8.

Oh god, again. Article number 6,987 of Apple stock sliding, company not doing well. People need to realize that these Wall St manipulations happen all the time. It's all that's done to make money. Nothing new.

All I hear is the word innovation I think most people just like to hear themselves say it. What has droid done in the world of innovation the last 4 years other larger screens ?

TurboShrimp said,
..What has droid done in the world of innovation the last 4 years...

The same thing Windows did for the desktop pc through the 90-2010 range, drove hardware to accelerate at a rapid pace.

The long and short of it is the company operates in a very competitive and dynamic market.. This is how there share price rose to an un sustainable number in 2011. There app delivery revenue and music sales are reliant on apple inovaiting products. As yet the form factors have changed but ios itself reminds me of comparing windows 3.11 to windows 7 or 8 when comparing to other mobile os's on/coming to market. When stacked side by side with competing products in hardware it all stacks up. It the ios platform that is letting the apple team down. I am very interested in how apples focus changes with ios 7 and how much innovation, attention to detail and ability to provide a rock solid platform unlike ios 6

I'm shopping for options now - I'm looking to buy a contract or two with a total cost $500/share. I expect the share price closer to $600 than $500 going into the spring. If I'm wrong I'll be out a couple hundred dollars. If I'm right I'll be up a couple thousand.

Just looking at contract+strike price for February contracts and it looks like $525 is pretty much what everybody else is thinking. If you think this is a long term trend (and you're right) then you can make a lot of money off of people like me who think that after the earnings report things will pick up.

These sorts of stories are a lot more fun when you put a small amount of money on them. If you can't or won't do options you might try intrade. There's nothing up right now but you could easily start one.

One theory is that the stockprice is always the most accurate estimate of a company's future value because it is determined by people who have read all the other estimates (and bought stock accordingly).

I strongly disagree with this because strong rise in stockprice means everyone will jump on it which leads to the price being too high. The opposite is also true. So while Nokia was underrated, Apple was overrated.

Die Apple! Die!

This news is out of date, we are at $485 right now, what's -3%. Yay!

Anyway, you know what they say: how higher you go, how lower you fall.

Studio384 said,
Die Apple! Die!

This news is out of date, we are at $485 right now, what's -3%. Yay!

Anyway, you know what they say: how higher you go, how lower you fall.


Wow the irony of American Capitalism.

rippleman said,
watch by 2014 it will be higher then before

This is the part where you provide proof that you just funnelled all your available money into Apple stock today.

Oh, you didn't? I see.

It is Good News for all of us, Apple invented the iPhone and changed the world, then everyone had to follow and provide us even better products, the Apple stuck!

The stocks going down is their wakeup call, change the world again if you want to stay number 1, or you are welcome in the books of history.

The smartphone revolution, yes. Cant remember which it was exactly, think it was an HTC, with a nice lil stylus. slideable keyboard and what not.
Oh and a start menu.

Also this was in 2003-2004 period. maybe 2005.

And in that time period, you either had a Nokia phone, or a WM phone. There where no real alternatives.

I think I read somewhere that Apple just canceled a massive amount of iPhone5 displays?

Users simply get tired of the same old overpriced tech...

For some reason if Apple will be in a similar position. This time MS will just buy Apple.
Cause for some reason I think Apple was saved partially cause MS needed a competitor. And outside Apple, there was none in that time.
No competitor and MS would be in so much more antitrust sh*t

This is just apple's stock coming back to reality.... during their climb they were always overvalued and it is just normalizing now.

I don't want them to fail, but getting a little reality check might be a good thing, especially for the fans who might get a little more inventions released to products in return.

Apple is great as underdog, they suck when they are king. End of story.
(just like a lot of companies and people would begin to slack. Clearly if you remove pressure, you try less hard)

GS:mac

Don't they have hundred billion cash? Surely with that amount, they can easily release another killer product even if it takes five years of research.

I think apple do both Hardware and Software and so far hardware they innovate cost way up there such as Firewire, Thunderbolt. They still don't have NFC on iPhone 5. iPad still have no USB. iPad 7 no Retina because it will cost way way up. Simply said their product cost too much to hardly innovate anything.

yowanvista said,
Nice.. People are finally getting off the iSheep bandwagon..
lmao only because it's crashing, not because they saw the light and realized there were other/better options!

yowanvista said,
Nice.. People are finally getting off the iSheep bandwagon..

If only it wasn't just to jump onto the phablet fad bandwagon...

My only wish for 2013 is that some manufacturer finally sees the light and cuts back to having a high-end phone in a non-phablet form factor. One can only hope...

Or it could just be that $700 per share represents a significant amount of actual real money, and people are simply selling while it's high. The value of shares goes up and down all the time. I don't see anything unusual here.

I dunno, not convinced that would save them. Apple used to be 'cool' because it was so expensive it was almost exclusive. Now almost everyone has one. Lower the prices more, and they'll see more sales, but it will no longer be the cool thing to have.
They're a victim of their own success. They could have prevented it by actually pushing the limits and releasing products that are a step above the competition, but they didn't and now I think they're in a flat stall, no chance of recovery (at least to their previous high) in the near future.

You are aware that Apple is limited by IP's aswell right?
That Apple was very, very late to the phone world, where Samsung was already playing in. Nokia is an old King of the market, even HTC been playing the phone market before Apple.
They all have IP's Apple lacks which also lack phone functionality.
And MS does not have enough IP's for Apple to use to keep endlessly improving their iPhone. And their patent sharing agreement stops Apple from copying anything that was/is in WM/WP aswel.

Apple can stop the bleeding if it lowers prices to sane levels across the board, eg a mac-book is $1300 but should actually cost $800. the beginning of the end is near if they don't start lowering prices and stop inflating their self worth.

I've been saying this for months, that Apple was no good. They are releasing last-gen products and nothing about their products are new and exciting. People will realize this.
I was recently on vacation outside of the USA. Most of my friends had iPhones but the locals were more interested in my Lumia 920 because they knew it was the better phone and wanted to buy it from me lol.

Last-gen products? Tell that to Windows Phone then. Aside from the HD screen, processors are those to be found on 2012 on most Android Phones, including RAM.

The problem with Apple is iOS. Android has evolved to a point in which everything the iOS has, Android has it (if not better).

Umm aren't the MS phones also using legacy hardware to try to capture sales? They just recently updated to have dual core phones and that's it,only dual core with same specs as most middle android phones. Nothing about Iphone and Windows Phone screams next gen.

Why does Lumia 920 have faster sunspider scores than iPhone 5 and Android 4.2 devices if is so slow or old? It's getting speeds that are almost double Android.

iPhone is outdated because the screen is small and not HD, the OS hasn't changed much in 6 years, there's no modern wireless features like NFC or charging, it uses proprietary connectors which nobody has, it doesn't have OIS like the Lumia camera, and the physical design is now 3 years old. On top of that it has terrible maps and needs a case because it is too fragile. All in all it is a boring mid-range phone and demand has dropped worldwide. The US was one of the last regions to realize the iPhone was obsolete. Looking at Kantar Worldpanel numbers most of the world already had abandoned iPhone and things were trending down everywhere except US and UK.

Jose_49 said,
Last-gen products? Tell that to Windows Phone then. Aside from the HD screen, processors are those to be found on 2012 on most Android Phones, including RAM.

Wouldn't that make them current generation?

S7R1K3R said,
Umm aren't the MS phones also using legacy hardware to try to capture sales? They just recently updated to have dual core phones and that's it,only dual core with same specs as most middle android phones. Nothing about Iphone and Windows Phone screams next gen.

nerds, stop slurping about dual core, and who gives a rats about the driving hardware. if it feels snappy with a single or dual core for the next 20 years, what difference does that make. it's the software that needs the most attn. we've gotten to the point that hardware on a little device has plateaued and doesn't need to move forward, for now at least there's no need for a quad core chip in a phone as of now. companies are just doing it to put a stat in their sheets for people to goo and gaa about.

I understand what you are trying to say but look at this, would you use win7 or win8 on a pentium 3? or would you use win98 on an i7 cus I am sure it will be blisteringly fast. My point is that software improvements go hand in hand with hardware, and we can't just stop developing hardware just so software can catch up. 3 years ago having a quad core would be unheard of and now it's pretty much the norm. Also people are using their phones for alot more than just calling people and the occasional email. If you haven't gotten the point im trying to make by now, you never will and that's ok. It won't make a bit of difference.

Jose_49 said,
Last-gen products? Tell that to Windows Phone then. Aside from the HD screen, processors are those to be found on 2012 on most Android Phones, including RAM.

The problem with Apple is iOS. Android has evolved to a point in which everything the iOS has, Android has it (if not better).

You were doing so badly in the first sentence but then redeemed yourself by noticing the issue isn't with the looks or specs but with the operating system - the bit of the phone you actually interact with the most.

iOS is just looking more and more staid.
Android might be a bit of a mess when it comes to updates but at least you can nerd around and modify it to your own needs if you are inclined.
WP8 is fresh and new and a bit different.
Even Canada's own is looking like they're trying to up the ante a bit with BB10.

If I was a shareholder and Apple hasn't radically overhauled their operations by the end of the year I'd be very worried. I get the impression they've spent too much time and money on lawsuits rather than actually doing work.

Jose_49 said,
Last-gen products? Tell that to Windows Phone then. Aside from the HD screen, processors are those to be found on 2012 on most Android Phones, including RAM.

The problem with Apple is iOS. Android has evolved to a point in which everything the iOS has, Android has it (if not better).


Yes. They just got LTE. Still don't have NFC. Their commercials are advertising noise cancelling microphones and ear buds, lol. Seriously?
Lumia has amazing touch screen, wireless charging, innovative camera, etc.

S7R1K3R said,
Umm aren't the MS phones also using legacy hardware to try to capture sales? They just recently updated to have dual core phones and that's it,only dual core with same specs as most middle android phones. Nothing about Iphone and Windows Phone screams next gen.

I have a Lumia 920 and most friends have the SG3, a few the iPhone 5 (really a few, just people who dont give a damn just upgrade their phone with a new contract and stick with what they know)
But they are all, all enormly suprised on how smooth the Lumia is, how fast it gets things done.
While its quite the weak phone when you compare raw specs.

Have u ran iOS6 on an iPhone 4? Its laggy...just like how iOS4.x was on the iPhone 3GS. The reason the iPhone 5 has an a6x is because the os would be laggy with anything lesser. The 4S is barely running it with lag which means iOS 7 is going to be laggy on the 4S. Watch!

How can iOS be so laggy when Apple added any features? YEs my Galaxy Note needs quadcore...look what it can do. I can run 2 apps on the screen at the same time along with full multi-tasking. U dont even have full multi-tasking on the iPhone. So what is using all that CPU power? It can be features bec it doesnt have any.

Now please try to explain that away?

Why would any Americans want a huge American company to fail? I know that most people here are not apple fans, but jesus, really?
/rant

They should have done a better job with the iPhone 5.. People are getting smarter and catching on..

Also, I believe the stock was way over valued..

Edited by fusi0n, Jan 15 2013, 5:55pm :

Fus10n said,
Why would any Americans want a huge American company to fail? I know that most people here are not apple fans, but jesus, really?
/rant

Most people's ego (here) is tied-up in their own smartphone's "mindshare."

Fus10n said,
Why would any Americans want a huge American company to fail? I know that most people here are not apple fans, but jesus, really?
/rant

They should have done a better job with the iPhone 5.. People are getting smarter and catching on..

Also, I believe the stock was way over valued..

Implying it's american in anything other than name.

Most of it's sales are outside America. Nearly all of it's manufacturing is done outside America. Any growth would be fuelled outside America.

Fus10n said,
That was a very intelligent reply. Thank you for taking the time to explain in great detail.

It's true. It's evil to abuse naive customers and suck money out of them. It's also evil to purposely prevent products from being updated to the latest software version to force people to buy new hardware.

PmRd said,

It's true. It's evil to abuse naive customers and suck money out of them. It's also evil to purposely prevent products from being updated to the latest software version to force people to buy new hardware.

I know! Instead of releasing updates that exclude a feature or two from older device, they should take notes from the competition and *not* release ANY updates! Great idea. Very forward thinking.

Truth of the matter is, consumers got a choice. If they feel like Apple was evil to them, they don't have to keep buying into Apple. The notion that the consumer has no choice (the premise of your argument) is absolutely absurd. The notion that anyone is forced to do anything is absurd. We are talking about tech gizmos not necessities to survive.

Shadrack said,

I know! Instead of releasing updates that exclude a feature or two from older device, they should take notes from the competition and *not* release ANY updates! Great idea. Very forward thinking.

Truth of the matter is, consumers got a choice. If they feel like Apple was evil to them, they don't have to keep buying into Apple. The notion that the consumer has no choice (the premise of your argument) is absolutely absurd. The notion that anyone is forced to do anything is absurd. We are talking about tech gizmos not necessities to survive.

Did you even bother to read what I posted. You're talking about stuff I never said.

PmRd said,

Did you even bother to read what I posted. You're talking about stuff I never said.

It's also evil to purposely prevent products from being updated to the latest software version to force people to buy new hardware.

O rly?

Fus10n said,
Why would any Americans want a huge American company to fail? I know that most people here are not apple fans, but jesus, really?
/rant

They should have done a better job with the iPhone 5.. People are getting smarter and catching on..

Also, I believe the stock was way over valued..

I Dont want Apple to fail, i want them to die. For the crap they did to our patent system and suing other OEM's for crap they didnt invent but claimed they did. They should die for all the lies.

Yeah, it shot up and "overshot" the value in anticipation of the iPad Mini announcement. High demand for a stock will do that. The stock is still up from last year, though it did lose much of the growth it saw last year in the past couple of days.

It could be that $700 was just artificially high. Stock prices sometimes has more to do with demand than with the pulse of the company.

Apple is facing a lot more competition though these days. Used to be that Android was beating iOS as a whole but there were no single handhelds that stood out. Now there are phones like the GS3 which are no doubt being seen as equally popular phones. Also a lot more competition in the tablet space last year. The Nexus 7 and the Kindle Fire HD made a significant splash against Apple's iPad.

Competition is a good thing. Apple can still be OK as a company while competition exists. This is good for the consumer. But it seems like a lot of folks on this board and others want nothing more than an Android monopoly which is sad.

Julius Caro said,
The costa concordia didnt *actually* sink now, did it? it just flipped over and laid there

Sounds like what the iOS interface does. It's just laid there for 5 years now.

Julius Caro said,
The costa concordia didnt *actually* sink now, did it? it just flipped over and laid there
Only because a reaf held it up...if it wasnt there, everyone would have died because the boat would have flip completely over...like Poseidon.

Apple fell into that same hole Microsoft did with Windows Mobile, RIM, and Nokia. They this thing where once they reach the top and people just buy whatever they give them, they dpont need to innovate and no one can touch them.

We on the outside of those distortion fields warned Microsoft Windows Mobile was losing and MS basically laughed and than RIM came out of nowhere. Then we did the same for RIM, and Apple showed up. We warned Apple and Google showed up. As long as Google and Samsung giving us more bang for the buck, no one can touch them.

Apple has no real competition bec no device runs iOS but theirs. If another devic ehad iOS...lets say a Galaxy S III runnign iOS with all its cool features, Apple would cease to exist as a hardware maker because youd have to be a fool to want an iPhone when you can get a better phone with the same OS. Android is iOS for the masses...even though the quality isnt as high and that is where Apple shines, it more than makes up based on cost and what you get for the cost.

Quality however will only get you so far. Ask Porsche, Benz and BMW. They all make quality cars, but GM still kicks their buts in sales even with all 3 combined. The fact is those guys like Apple dont really give you anything with all that cost.

It's because it's same old same old. Nothing to see here. They need to revamp iOS a bit to keep consumers interested. Change the icons (How is a flower related to photos? Always bugged me), unify the interface (ditch cheesy real world UI), change the dock to match mountain lion's, revamp multitasking, unify the default apps (why is there no calculator app on the ipad mini?) , the list goes on. It's not rocket science.

I also think they should make the iPhone's screen longer horizontally to have 5 icons a row and on the dock.

Edit: Where's my widgets, too?

Well, in all honesty, that's what happens when a company is so incredibly overvalued... I mean, let's be serious here... There was no justification whatsoever for the market cap they had.

Uplift said,
Waits for "our strongest quarter yet" on 23rd Jan.

Very well written article though.


It's all about spin. Apple executives are phenomenal at finding that perfect slice of their numbers that make them come out on top. The best part is when they take that narrowly defined slice, give it a name, and establish it as a 'market' they're leading.

Apple's competitors have long appealed to a wider market than Apple themselves, and Apple's response has always been taking their niche and treating it, not as a subset of a larger market, but as a market all by itself.

No, it is not good. No point in taking glee over the stumbling of one company. And it is not good to sink to the level of those who were happy when Microsoft's stock doesn't do well. We should want all companies to do well, to advance tech for everyone.

nohone said,

Oh boo freaking hoo, if there's one company that isn't bringing something new and innovative it's cleary Apple

It is good for investors who haven't bought AAPL yet... it is sort of bad (but not really) for investors who already invested in AAPL.
The price will go back up, as long as AAPL keeps innovating the way that it does

ThunderRiver said,

The price will go back up, as long as AAPL keeps innovating the way that it did a long time ago

I fixed that for you

Apple revolutionized smartphone industry back in 2007, tablet devices in 2009 and from then they reinvented tablet. 2 innovative product in 5 years. They revolutionized Music industry by ipod back in 1999. Then name something Samsung invented? The only thing google did was their search engine and that's it. I Love Microsoft but they did few as well. I guess the only thing they really invented was MS-DOS, MS-Office and Kinect to XBOX, well windows at some extent. ( I am talking about revolutionizing products)

Nayos said,
*sigh*
Wish people would change the record

Are you complaining about supposed Apple "haters?" Because there is no shortage of people on the other side who are more than happy to say the same things about Microsoft and their products - people who are overjoyed about every misstep Microsoft makes, people happy every product Microsoft makes that does not sell in the millions (see comments - http://www.neowin.net/news/ubs...llion-surfaces-last-quarter), happy when Microsoft does not meet analyst expectations for a quarter (remember when they reported financials that were down and announced layoffs, and the glee over those layoffs - http://www.neowin.net/news/mai...rosoft-set-to-cut-5000-jobs).

The difference is, Apple fans cannot stand any criticism. When there is valid criticism then you are a hater that needs to shut up because it makes Apple look bad. But when Microsoft is criticized, then it is a valid opinion and how dare you try to stifle opinion? Anybody who disagrees makes you a shill and therefore even worse. Don't believe for a second that Apple and their fanboys are just innocents that are unjustly treated poorly, because they do the same, and even worse.

PmRd said,

Oh boo freaking hoo, if there's one company that isn't bringing something new and innovative it's cleary Apple

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Astra.Xtreme said,

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

What about Samsung and the flexible/bendable displays.

Astra.Xtreme said,

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Have you been living under a rock for the past couple years?

Astra.Xtreme said,
A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Qualcomm for sponsoring the latest X-Prize for a working medical Tricorder?
Nokia for researching superhydrophobic coatings and doing phenominal things with camera optics.
Lytro

Astra.Xtreme said,

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Just because other companies are not producing things that are innovative to you, does not mean they are not innovative. There are companies producing many new form factors of computers that take advantage of Win8, of course Apple creates a new iPad with a screen half way between the old iPad and iTouch, and they call that innovative. Microsoft creates Kinect enabling new, different types of gaming, communicating through voice with consoles and computers, enables interaction with computers to allow advances in medicine, astronomy, physical therapy, and more - but there are rumors of an Apple branded TV that will copy many of those interactions and that is revolutionary and "magical." Cloud services are released by other companies, and now integrated into the OS that allows new storage and connected systems - but Apple releases yet another email service (what their 6th or 7th) and they are changing the industry?

Edit: This is a perfect example of the Apple fanboy attitude that I wrote about.

Edited by nohone, Jan 15 2013, 7:05pm :

S3P€hR said,
Apple revolutionized smartphone industry back in 2007, tablet devices in 2009 and from then they reinvented tablet. 2 innovative product in 5 years. They revolutionized Music industry by ipod back in 1999. Then name something Samsung invented? The only thing google did was their search engine and that's it. I Love Microsoft but they did few as well. I guess the only thing they really invented was MS-DOS, MS-Office and Kinect to XBOX, well windows at some extent. ( I am talking about revolutionizing products)

Microsoft bought DOS and Kinect. Not that they didn't put a ton of work into them (thousands of times more work was done after being acquired by Microsoft than before for both), but no 'invention' took place in Redmond for them.

Just being fair, though I look forward to anyone who might decide I'm a Microsoft hater suddenly.

S3P€hR said,
Apple revolutionized smartphone industry back in 2007, tablet devices in 2009 and from then they reinvented tablet. 2 innovative product in 5 years. They revolutionized Music industry by ipod back in 1999. Then name something Samsung invented? The only thing google did was their search engine and that's it. I Love Microsoft but they did few as well. I guess the only thing they really invented was MS-DOS, MS-Office and Kinect to XBOX, well windows at some extent. ( I am talking about revolutionizing products)

Tons of technology and chips that are behind the scenes that even Apple uses a ton of. Not as glamorous but they're important.

Astra.Xtreme said,

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Perhaps it is you that is blind.

Toysoldier said,

Perhaps it is you that is blind.


I...what? What is this, crappy script-writing day? "Perhaps it is you that is blind"? Who the hell actually says something like that? Real people can't possibly talk like that. Hang on, I'm going to invent time travel, go back to the 13th century, kill whoever invented the word 'contrived', and invent it myself just to express how completely, horrifically over-the-top, bullet to the brain, Brian Griffin you are of a communicator.

nohone said,
The difference is, Apple fans cannot stand any criticism. When there is valid criticism then you are a hater that needs to shut up because it makes Apple look bad. But when Microsoft is criticized, then it is a valid opinion and how dare you try to stifle opinion? Anybody who disagrees makes you a shill and therefore even worse. Don't believe for a second that Apple and their fanboys are just innocents that are unjustly treated poorly, because they do the same, and even worse.

I've been a fan of Apple since the '80s.

But when Apple screws up, I actually criticize them myself. I won't fool myself into thinking there isn't plenty they could be doing better.

nohone said,

Just because other companies are not producing things that are innovative to you, does not mean they are not innovative. There are companies producing many new form factors of computers that take advantage of Win8, of course Apple creates a new iPad with a screen half way between the old iPad and iTouch, and they call that innovative. Microsoft creates Kinect enabling new, different types of gaming, communicating through voice with consoles and computers, enables interaction with computers to allow advances in medicine, astronomy, physical therapy, and more - but there are rumors of an Apple branded TV that will copy many of those interactions and that is revolutionary and "magical." Cloud services are released by other companies, and now integrated into the OS that allows new storage and connected systems - but Apple releases yet another email service (what their 6th or 7th) and they are changing the industry?

Edit: This is a perfect example of the Apple fanboy attitude that I wrote about.

The problem with you Apple haters is that you are all so convinced that Apple thinks every little feature of their products is innovative. That's nothing but comical because Apple hasn't said things like that for years. What you clearly don't understand is the difference between expanding the technology and innovating. Microsoft releasing the Kinect is not innovating. It's taking what the Wii already had and designing it with modern sensor technologies. If Apple releases some sort of TV, it WON'T be innovating. It will be furthering the smart TV technology. Probably with Siri or something. Apple won't say it's innovative, but I know you sure will.

So I'll say it again, what other competitors are being so innovative in their products? Huge screens, wireless charging, and capacitive technologies is not innovative. Nobody is innovating right now. We've had basically the same PC and phone tech for the past 5 years. But nothing has revamped the entire market. And that is a very good thing. You need to have growth before you branch and start over. The sooner you get that through your head, the sooner we can stop laughing at you...

The especially sad part is that you constantly talk down to me like I'm Apple's #1 fan, but very rarely do I ever say they Apple do things better than anybody else. I didn't say it here either, but yet you jump all over it like you're insecure out of your mind... Another swing and a miss, I guess...

lunarworks said,

I've been a fan of Apple since the '80s.

But when Apple screws up, I actually criticize them myself. I won't fool myself into thinking there isn't plenty they could be doing better.

In that first sentence I should have written "Apple fanboys cannot..." not fans. There is a difference, there are many Apple fans that are reasonable. I differentiate between fans and fanboys.

S3P€hR said,
Apple revolutionized smartphone industry back in 2007, tablet devices in 2009 and from then they reinvented tablet. 2 innovative product in 5 years. They revolutionized Music industry by ipod back in 1999. Then name something Samsung invented? The only thing google did was their search engine and that's it. I Love Microsoft but they did few as well. I guess the only thing they really invented was MS-DOS, MS-Office and Kinect to XBOX, well windows at some extent. ( I am talking about revolutionizing products)
There is nothing revolutionary about improving something that already excist, the tablet is a Microsoft thing, and the smartphone isn't an Apple-thing eather. What they did is put some new and over-prised hardware in the concept and sell it as being innovative, but it's just a logic evolution, not more. You know what I call innovative/revolutionary? The Modern UI, the world has never seen an interface on different kinds of devices that worked the same, something you need to learn ones so you can use your knowledge of one device on another one, that's innovative/revolutionary!

Astra.Xtreme said,
Microsoft releasing the Kinect is not innovating. It's taking what the Wii already had and designing it with modern sensor technologies.

What? Are you out of your ****ing mind? Did you even know how the Wii and the Kinect work to say something idiotic like that?

PmRd said,

What? Are you out of your ****ing mind? Did you even know how the Wii and the Kinect work to say something idiotic like that?

Calm down... Yes they both use infrared sensors. The Wii version is very simple and basic. The Kinect integrates depth and uses a matrix to do its calculations. The Wii was innovative. The Kinect was furthering the technology. And more questions, or did you not even read what I said?...

Astra.Xtreme said,

The problem with you Apple haters ...

And there is the proof of my entire point, and the rest of your comment reinforces it.

Here I am, actually telling people not to treat Apple the way people some treat Microsoft, and I am still labeled a hater. An Apple hater and a whiner of theirs in the same thread!

Joshie said,

I...what? What is this, crappy script-writing day? "Perhaps it is you that is blind"? Who the hell actually says something like that? Real people can't possibly talk like that. Hang on, I'm going to invent time travel, go back to the 13th century, kill whoever invented the word 'contrived', and invent it myself just to express how completely, horrifically over-the-top, bullet to the brain, Brian Griffin you are of a communicator.

Hello pot, meet kettle.

nohone said,

And there is the proof of my entire point, and the rest of your comment reinforces it.

Here I am, actually telling people not to treat Apple the way people some treat Microsoft, and I am still labeled a hater. An Apple hater and a whiner of theirs in the same thread!

Well that sure went over your head... You labeled yourself as a hater in an earlier comment, and then you said what every other hater says in that you are convinced Apple thinks everything they make is innovative. Not to mention you see somebody contradict your hatred of Apple and they are automatically a fanboy. I haven't even gone that far and you still labeled me a fanboy. At least I can back up what I say... It's rather sad the insecurity some of you Anti-Apple people portray. If you don't like their crap, don't buy it. But at least learn what the hell "innovate" means...

Astra.Xtreme said,

Well that sure went over your head... You labeled yourself as a hater in an earlier comment, and then you said what every other hater says in that you are convinced Apple thinks everything they make is innovative. Not to mention you see somebody contradict your hatred of Apple and they are automatically a fanboy. I haven't even gone that far and you still labeled me a fanboy. At least I can back up what I say... It's rather sad the insecurity some of you Anti-Apple people portray. If you don't like their crap, don't buy it. But at least learn what the hell "innovate" means...

I labeled you a fanboy based upon my history in talking with you. Here I am, defending Apple, pointing out the good and bad of them, and admonishing people for attacking Apple but since I am not 100% the Apple fan, you are attacking me, trying to insult me. That is what makes you a fanboy. I did not label myself a hater, you did. I wrote that others, such as yourself, cannot stand anybody that may "think different" and need to go on the attack with insults, personal attacks, and childish name calling.

And you cannot backup one damn thing, you are claiming that nothing anybody else does is innovative, claiming that the Kinect is not innovative because it is copied from the Wii, when people are doing things with it that a Wii could possibly not do.

And I do buy Apple products, I have written a number of times about my iPads, iTouches, and Macs. When I find something good about them, I write about it. And when I find a problem with them, I will write about it. And if you cannot take the good with the bad, well, then you will need to deal with it because I am not going to change what I write so that I don't damage your ego.

nohone said,

I labeled you a fanboy based upon my history in talking with you. Here I am, defending Apple, pointing out the good and bad of them, and admonishing people for attacking Apple but since I am not 100% the Apple fan, you are attacking me, trying to insult me. That is what makes you a fanboy. I did not label myself a hater, you did. I wrote that others, such as yourself, cannot stand anybody that may "think different" and need to go on the attack with insults, personal attacks, and childish name calling.

And you cannot backup one damn thing, you are claiming that nothing anybody else does is innovative, claiming that the Kinect is not innovative because it is copied from the Wii, when people are doing things with it that a Wii could possibly not do.

And I do buy Apple products, I have written a number of times about my iPads, iTouches, and Macs. When I find something good about them, I write about it. And when I find a problem with them, I will write about it. And if you cannot take the good with the bad, well, then you will need to deal with it because I am not going to change what I write so that I don't damage your ego.

Wow, you are really lost here... I suggest you reread the above comments and refresh your memory. You are the one that attacked me first and labeled me a fanboy. You opened your mouth first. I won't bother replying to the rest of your comment until you get back on track...

Joshie said,

Microsoft bought DOS and Kinect. Not that they didn't put a ton of work into them (thousands of times more work was done after being acquired by Microsoft than before for both), but no 'invention' took place in Redmond for them.

Just being fair, though I look forward to anyone who might decide I'm a Microsoft hater suddenly.

Microsoft didn't buy Kinect at all. They bought the camera sensor technology - Kinect is much much more than that. There are around 200 patents in 1st edition of Kinect. For example to build enough cameras even to send out to 1st tier game game developers was going to take years due to the length of time it took to calibrate the cameras. MSR Cambridge worked on how to reduce this calibration time to a matter of minutes that reduced the prototype production cycle to a few weeks. Kinect had to work out people's faces, voices, different lighting, textiles, how limbs were connected and then emulate that in a game - you don't buy in this kind of thing.

The cameras themselves were from an Israeli military spin-off being hawked around as a golf coaching tool.

There is a fundamental misunderstanding if you believe that Microsoft bought "Kinect".

TogoP said,

Microsoft didn't buy Kinect at all. They bought the camera sensor technology - Kinect is much much more than that. There are around 200 patents in 1st edition of Kinect. For example to build enough cameras even to send out to 1st tier game game developers was going to take years due to the length of time it took to calibrate the cameras. MSR Cambridge worked on how to reduce this calibration time to a matter of minutes that reduced the prototype production cycle to a few weeks. Kinect had to work out people's faces, voices, different lighting, textiles, how limbs were connected and then emulate that in a game - you don't buy in this kind of thing.

The cameras themselves were from an Israeli military spin-off being hawked around as a golf coaching tool.

There is a fundamental misunderstanding if you believe that Microsoft bought "Kinect".


Man, it's almost like you stopped reading my post after the word "Kinect", otherwise you would've caught the qualifiers I tossed into the very next sentence.

Yes, the hardware developed by PrimeSense was incredibly primitive compared to the hardware the Kinect became--hence the "thousands of times more work" bit.

But you probably wanted to say "fundamental misunderstanding" so badly that you ignored everything after word five.

S3P€hR said,
Apple revolutionized smartphone industry back in 2007, tablet devices in 2009 and from then they reinvented tablet. 2 innovative product in 5 years. They revolutionized Music industry by ipod back in 1999. Then name something Samsung invented? The only thing google did was their search engine and that's it. I Love Microsoft but they did few as well. I guess the only thing they really invented was MS-DOS, MS-Office and Kinect to XBOX, well windows at some extent. ( I am talking about revolutionizing products)

FYI, Apple did not invent the smartphone or a tablet or the iPod. They innovated by creating products that were easy to use and appealed to the mainstream. Big difference.

so true. MSFT made the tab in 2001, smartphone by Sony Ericcson, iPod category by Sony. Sony also made the ultrabook category before AAPL and they made some other stuff.

"MSFT made the computer industry? Bill Gates wrote the code for the first Mac OS? Windows 8 was pretty revolutionary?"

Just to point out that when Apple were building the first Mac they couldn't get it to boot from those crazy old "Twiggy" discs. A young programmer named Neil Konzen wrote a Twiggy boot loader that actually worked and gave it to Apple. Konzen was a Microsoft employee and part of the MS-DOS team.

Also the first thing it said on the screen when you started an Apple II was "Copyright Microsoft, 1976" in case you don't remember.

How did the ipod revolutionize music?
I still wonder because there where already devices like the Sony Walkman around that do/did the same (i had one for half the price).

Astra.Xtreme said,

The problem with you Apple haters is that you are all so convinced that Apple thinks every little feature of their products is innovative. That's nothing but comical because Apple hasn't said things like that for years. What you clearly don't understand is the difference between expanding the technology and innovating. Microsoft releasing the Kinect is not innovating. It's taking what the Wii already had and designing it with modern sensor technologies. If Apple releases some sort of TV, it WON'T be innovating. It will be furthering the smart TV technology. Probably with Siri or something. Apple won't say it's innovative, but I know you sure will.

So I'll say it again, what other competitors are being so innovative in their products? Huge screens, wireless charging, and capacitive technologies is not innovative. Nobody is innovating right now. We've had basically the same PC and phone tech for the past 5 years. But nothing has revamped the entire market. And that is a very good thing. You need to have growth before you branch and start over. The sooner you get that through your head, the sooner we can stop laughing at you...

The especially sad part is that you constantly talk down to me like I'm Apple's #1 fan, but very rarely do I ever say they Apple do things better than anybody else. I didn't say it here either, but yet you jump all over it like you're insecure out of your mind... Another swing and a miss, I guess...

siri on a tv? wtf apple didnt invent siri they bought it

DKAngel said,

siri on a tv? wtf apple didnt invent siri they bought it

Who's saying Apple invented Siri? We all know they didn't.
If they make a TV, they might as well integrate it. Otherwise it will be simply an overpriced smart TV that blends in with the crowd.

PmRd said,

In other words: an Apple product

Their laptops and desktops, yes. But everything else is basically the same price as competitors. It's not just about price though.

Astra.Xtreme said,

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Look at the Galaxy S III and the Note 2 and tell me you wouldnt want such innovation on phone. Many of those features have been pc oriented or tablet. Two apps on the screen at the same time...nothing new. On a smartphone possible...yes many thought so. Now it is real. And you guys don't have it yet or ever. The iPhone screen is too small so until its at least 4.8" i wouldn't even look right.

Files transfer over a wireless connection...nothign new. Bumping phones to do it. Priceless. Not avail on iPhone. Great feature? Nahhhh..its gimmicky. But it is useful at time...like Siri.

Smartphons have pretty much reach a pennacle. They are just little computers. But they are more capable and many PC tasks are possible on phones. Apple however will shy away from most of it while Google will embrace it and that is where Appel s being killed. We live in a world where people want a mobile device to be able to do almost everything they can at a PC. Googel and Android is doing it and Apple isnt. They think a 4" phone is to big while in the same slanderous tongue they say the iPad is perfect. HAH!

What's innovative about the S3 and Note? Being big isn't an innovation. On both those phones, the big screen is nice and Android runs incredibly well, but the build quality is utter trash compared to everybody else on the high-end market. I guess they were innovative in learning that a lot of people don't care about physical quality, but rather having something big. Interesting concept though.

I don't want or need a huge phone, so my next one in July will be ~4" whether it be Windows, Android, or iOS. When I had an S3, I felt it was too big and very uncomfortable to carry in my pocket. And I do think NFC is gimmicky. If my phone had it, I wouldn't use it. I only use Siri for getting directions, and I feel it too is gimmicky for so little function. When Siri and NFC mature, I'm sure they'll be great.

The iPhone is meant to be a clean and professional phone. It's not meant to have a million features that disguise and bog down the core function of it, which is making calls and having internet access. Apple doesn't want to be like Google, and Google doesn't want to be like Apple. That's what creates the choices we have in the market. Choose what most fits your needs. Saying one software is better than the other doesn't make sense anymore now that Android is beyond the lag issues. The sales numbers prove that point.

Astra.Xtreme said,
What's innovative about the S3 and Note?

Innovation is a strong word. If being innovative means taking existing ideas and using them in new, potentially useful ways, then yeah, Samsung was innovative. I've never seen an Android handset take motion detection as far as the latest Galaxy devices. Motion gestures are all over the place for all kinds of functions.

I don't know if other vendors offer something similar, but I'm also impressed by scheduling a split-second power-up of the front camera right before the screen goes to sleep to see if a face is detected. If so, the sleep timer is reset. Surprisingly thoughtful feature.

Ezekiel Carsella said,
your point is????

Hint: the Neowin comment tree only has one level of depth. If you're just going to reply to someone without quoting them or using their screen name, or any context at all, nobody is going to have any idea what you're talking about.

Astra.Xtreme said,

A little blind to reality, are we? Care to share what other companies are doing that's incredibly innovative?...

Though I do agree with your points on some level, evolution is a form of innovation. It's not absolute innovation because the mechanics behind today's evolutions have a solid foundation for their existance. There is no need to start from scratch just yet until you evolve an idea to its absolute pennacle...then innovation is required next.

Example...people think Apple's lightning connecting is no innovative. It isn't. The fact is, it is SCSI evolutionized for todays technology. It uses the same concept, only faster and more compact. Lightning like SCSI required a dedicated controller to handle the task. This made it faster than USB which uses the speed of the system bus to transfer data. If your bus is already busy, USB usually slows your system even more. SCSI doesnt because it doesnt use the onboard BUS to transfer. It has its own bus on the controller dedicated to its connector to the drive on the other end...JUST LIKE LIGHTNING does. That's innovation by way of evolution. Evolving a older product into something more up to date.

But that doesnt mean no one is innovating. I guess it how you see it.

TechieXP said,
Though I do agree with your points on some level, evolution is a form of innovation. It's not absolute innovation because the mechanics behind today's evolutions have a solid foundation for their existance. There is no need to start from scratch just yet until you evolve an idea to its absolute pennacle...then innovation is required next.

Example...people think Apple's lightning connecting is no innovative. It isn't. The fact is, it is SCSI evolutionized for todays technology. It uses the same concept, only faster and more compact. Lightning like SCSI required a dedicated controller to handle the task. This made it faster than USB which uses the speed of the system bus to transfer data. If your bus is already busy, USB usually slows your system even more. SCSI doesnt because it doesnt use the onboard BUS to transfer. It has its own bus on the controller dedicated to its connector to the drive on the other end...JUST LIKE LIGHTNING does. That's innovation by way of evolution. Evolving a older product into something more up to date.

But that doesnt mean no one is innovating. I guess it how you see it.

I think the problem I had here is that people get all up in arms about Apple being a failure when they release a product that doesn't change the world. They are convinced, for some reason, that Apple should be releasing ground-breaking products every cycle, and then when it obviously doesn't happen, they play it off like Apple is going down the drain and everybody is beating up on them.

The reality is that nobody has been actually innovating since the beginning of the smart phone, tablet, or whatever. Apple releases normal updates like everybody else, and the trolls/haters keep running their mouths when Apple doesn't change the world. I appreciate the quality of products they release, but in no way do I think any of it is innovate. Apple doesn't think so either. I'm just confused why the trolls are convinced otherwise. It's quite sad actually.

Astra.Xtreme said,

Lol! Apple themselves were saying that the iPhone 5 was the best thing to happen since the iPhone (which at the time was quite revolutionary) itself. If that's not being ****ing delusional I don't know what the **** it is.

Astra.Xtreme said,

I think the problem I had here is that people get all up in arms about Apple being a failure when they release a product that doesn't change the world. They are convinced, for some reason, that Apple should be releasing ground-breaking products every cycle, and then when it obviously doesn't happen, they play it off like Apple is going down the drain and everybody is beating up on them.

The reality is that nobody has been actually innovating since the beginning of the smart phone, tablet, or whatever. Apple releases normal updates like everybody else, and the trolls/haters keep running their mouths when Apple doesn't change the world. I appreciate the quality of products they release, but in no way do I think any of it is innovate. Apple doesn't think so either. I'm just confused why the trolls are convinced otherwise. It's quite sad actually.

When Apple releases something that is not revolutionary, they quietly get rid of it and disavow any knowledge of it. Remember the Apple HiFi? Jobs got up on stage and claimed the sound was second only to being there live. It was personally designed by Jobs himself to be as beautiful looking as it sounded. It did poorly, it disappeared from the Apple store, and then the fanboys started the coverup - nobody thought it was great, it was just to get the other companies to produce better docks, and I heard some actually claim that it never existed.

Same with the Bluetooth device - it would revolutionize Bluetooth headsets, sounded great, looked beautiful, nobody would want anything else. Now it doesn't exist.

The only thing that Apple never really trumped up as a revolutionary device is the AppleTV, that they claim is just a hobby. But if it ever starts selling well, then it will be revolutionary, change the world, and the greatest thing ever - until it starts selling poorly and then it will be forgotten and disavowed.

PmRd said,

Lol! Apple themselves were saying that the iPhone 5 was the best thing to happen since the iPhone (which at the time was quite revolutionary) itself. If that's not being ****ing delusional I don't know what the **** it is.

Wow calm down... You clearly don't understand what Apple was saying there. All they said was that the 5 was the best iPhone so far. What's wrong with that? It's true... Nowhere do they claim they are revolutionizing the world, which plenty of people in here are convinced of... Every company says the same sort of things when they release a new product. It's called marketing... So what's your point?

nohone said,

When Apple releases something that is not revolutionary, they quietly get rid of it and disavow any knowledge of it. Remember the Apple HiFi? Jobs got up on stage and claimed the sound was second only to being there live. It was personally designed by Jobs himself to be as beautiful looking as it sounded. It did poorly, it disappeared from the Apple store, and then the fanboys started the coverup - nobody thought it was great, it was just to get the other companies to produce better docks, and I heard some actually claim that it never existed.

Same with the Bluetooth device - it would revolutionize Bluetooth headsets, sounded great, looked beautiful, nobody would want anything else. Now it doesn't exist.

The only thing that Apple never really trumped up as a revolutionary device is the AppleTV, that they claim is just a hobby. But if it ever starts selling well, then it will be revolutionary, change the world, and the greatest thing ever - until it starts selling poorly and then it will be forgotten and disavowed.

And when was the last time Jobs or Cook got up on stage and claiming that "insert product here" is revolutionary and innovating the world? Probably when the first iPhone came out. So why are you and so many others convinced that Apple is feeding us every single product as if it's the holy grail. It's stupid and not even remotely true...

Astra.Xtreme said,

And when was the last time Jobs or Cook got up on stage and claiming that "insert product here" is revolutionary and innovating the world? Probably when the first iPhone came out. So why are you and so many others convinced that Apple is feeding us every single product as if it's the holy grail. It's stupid and not even remotely true...

Earpods. They talked about how it took 3 years to design them, how they are formed to fit your ears while others are not, they have "ports" that others do not. Watch this commercial and you think that Apple invented audio:

http://youtu.be/PD6ATDEiT5g

From their own web site thy write about earpods: "But they're not just designed for the perfect fit. They're designed for the perfect sound, too"

During the iPhone 5 reveal, Tim said about the Mac

a radically new design.

Of course, you want the exact words "innovation" and "revolutionary", so here are a couple.

At the iPhone 5 keynote, talking about the new iTouches and iPhone:

Now when you look at each of these, they are incredible industry leading innovation by themselves.

Apple's own web site says about the iPhone 5:

We've packed an amazing amount of innovation and advanced technology into a thin and light, jewel-like device with a stunning 4-inch Retina display, blazing fast A6 chip, ultrafast wireless, even longer battery life; and we think customers are going to love it.

http://www.apple.com/pr/librar...le-Introduces-iPhone-5.html


About the MacBook Air, Tim Cook said in the 2012 WWDC Keynote:

First, let's start with the MacBook Air. As you know, the MacBook Air has revolutionized the very idea of the modern notebook

And:

It's revolutionized the notebook. It's a breakthrough. Everyone is trying to copy it. They find it's not so easy.

And:

We want to deliver more innovations so you can take your ideas even further. Today we're announcing new changes in our notebook lineup, and new versions of our OS and iOS.

He also said:

And the teams at Apple have been hard at work to deliver even more innovations, so you can take your ideas even further. Today, we are announcing exciting new changes in our notebook line up and major release of OS X and iOS

At the iPad Mini reveal:

Yes it has been an incredible year with all of these new products and all of the applications and cloud services. This has been a truly prolific year for innovation for Apple.


Would you like for me to find some more examples?

Astra.Xtreme said,
What's innovative about the S3 and Note? Being big isn't an innovation. On both those phones, the big screen is nice and Android runs incredibly well, but the build quality is utter trash compared to everybody else on the high-end market. I guess they were innovative in learning that a lot of people don't care about physical quality, but rather having something big. Interesting concept though.

I don't want or need a huge phone, so my next one in July will be ~4" whether it be Windows, Android, or iOS. When I had an S3, I felt it was too big and very uncomfortable to carry in my pocket. And I do think NFC is gimmicky. If my phone had it, I wouldn't use it. I only use Siri for getting directions, and I feel it too is gimmicky for so little function. When Siri and NFC mature, I'm sure they'll be great.

The iPhone is meant to be a clean and professional phone. It's not meant to have a million features that disguise and bog down the core function of it, which is making calls and having internet access. Apple doesn't want to be like Google, and Google doesn't want to be like Apple. That's what creates the choices we have in the market. Choose what most fits your needs. Saying one software is better than the other doesn't make sense anymore now that Android is beyond the lag issues. The sales numbers prove that point.

Haha! Let's Dance! Your OPINION that glass/metal is somehow better than plastic is so old and so used. Poly-Carbonate is what the shell on the Galaxy devices. Its the same shell on the Nokia Lumia 900/920 and the others. The Motorola Razr flip which was also metal/glass was certainly better than those cheap plastic flips avail at the time. That was then, this is now. Poly-Carbonate is a more resilent better grade of yes...PLASTIC. However, I find it great to taje an expensive pretty phone and making it ugly buy paying an additional $30 to $100 to put one of those ugly big cases on it and make the phone look worse than mine? First off I dont buy a phone just for looks, I buy for substance. Just because it looks good on the outside, doesnt mean it is inside. I buy for purpose not for style. Pretty much how I like my women. I like pretty things too, but I learned some hard lessons getting wrapped up in superficial things. One of those lessons was the iPhone.

A device that costs $800 retail should not break is dropped from less than 3 feet. I dropped my iPhone 4 from my pocket which is 34" from the floor and it shattered. I dropped my Galaxy S 3 several times and all that was damaged was the silver rim. I've dropped my Galaxy Note 2 a few times of a short table that stands about 28" and it doesnt have a scratch or dent.

I could care less what people think about how my phone looks. Like you, when I had my iPhone 4 and 4S, I looked down on people with other devices to a point. I also at first felt low when I had my other Android phones like my Droid Incredible and Thunderbolt and when I saw an iphone I felt low. So I got the iPhone twice. Then I got an ipad and saw I know longer needed an iPhone. Once i got the Galaxy S3 I felt redeemed. I dont even miss having an iPhone at all. And now that I have a Note 2 and gave my GS3 to the wife, I feel even more superior to those iPhone toting zombies. You know why? Because I paid the same cist on contract as a 32GB iPhone. Tho I have less internal storage, I added 64GB and I have an adapter which I have a 16GB flash attached too and will get a 128GB once the cost drops a bit more. I dont care about games much, bec I have iPad for that.

What I love so much about my device is the fact for about the for the same amount of money, I can do so much more. I have more power, I have more features, I have more screen, I have more substance. I have value for what I paid and all you have is...well nothing really.

Think of it this way. Because Android has several OEM's fighting for top, they are grasping ta new tech to stay ahead. Apple has no reason to rush bec no device runs iOS but theirs. Sad really, because iOS can be so much more. While APple is milking you for every dollar they can every year, I can have next years tech today and just update as the device matures.

If I get tired of my device I have 100's to choose and most of my stuff can be moved with it. With APple you MUST CHOOSE Another APple device that may be better or maybe not. The iPhone 5 is not better than the 4S. Its the same device with a slightly faster CPU/GPU anda .5" bigger screen.

Maybe size doesnt matter to you. I hate holding an iPhone now. When i help people at work with theirs, it feels like a little toy. They like seeing my GS3 when I had it always asking questions about what makes it better. Several people wanted one but were locked into a contract. Now I have the Note and they think the stylus is cool for what I said I use it for and they like the screen because you can read everything. Sure for some it may be to big...thats fine. I have fairly longer fingers and I can operate the device with one hand for most tasks.

Both the GS3 and Note 2 look simple. The iPhone looks simple. Glass/Metal isnt better than plastic in all usages. For a device that you will handled 200+ times per day, where it is likely to be dropped, plastic never shows any wear, its harder to scratch,

For a device that will be in my pocket, what's it made of isnt relevent. Even when I pull it out, I could care less what people think. When you whip out an iPhone someone who doesnt have one isnt going to care or ask whats its made of. All they will see is you are using an iPhone.

Cosmestic details are always preference. They are not based on any facts. Soda tastes the same whether you drink it from a glass or a plastic cup. Apple repair so many phones that broke, they went back to using a metal backing. Whatever idiot at Apple said used a glass back should have been fired. But it was probably Jobs, and well he got fired per se.

TechieXP said,

ramble

Wow, you really just wasted a whole lot of your time on that ramble. Where did I say that glass/aluminum is better than plastic? I said the plastic on the Galaxy phones makes them crap quality (along with the crappy screen). Two different words... If a company makes a car out of plastic and a car out of metal, the metal one is higher quality. Obviously the plastic one won't dent, but the overall quality isn't as good as metal. It's really not that hard of a principle... What's the one thing people complain about in regards to the Galaxy phones? That it's made of cheap plastic and the quality looks like junk compared to other high-end phones. And news flash, there have been numerous drop tests that show that the iPhone 5 withstands drops much better than the S3. So your claim has no substance...

That's great that your phone works for your needs. It doesn't work for mine, so again, your stance has little to no substance. What you want isn't what everybody wants...

LOL @ your "claim" that the 5 isn't better than the 4S. You yourself even listed enough reasons to prove that it is better. I'm not even going to bother replying to the rest of your ramble because clearly your delusions are taking over... Thanks for the essay though...

Astra.Xtreme said,

Wow, you really just wasted a whole lot of your time on that ramble. Where did I say that glass/aluminum is better than plastic? I said the plastic on the Galaxy phones makes them crap quality (along with the crappy screen). Two different words... If a company makes a car out of plastic and a car out of metal, the metal one is higher quality. Obviously the plastic one won't dent, but the overall quality isn't as good as metal. It's really not that hard of a principle... What's the one thing people complain about in regards to the Galaxy phones? That it's made of cheap plastic and the quality looks like junk compared to other high-end phones. And news flash, there have been numerous drop tests that show that the iPhone 5 withstands drops much better than the S3. So your claim has no substance...

That's great that your phone works for your needs. It doesn't work for mine, so again, your stance has little to no substance. What you want isn't what everybody wants...

LOL @ your "claim" that the 5 isn't better than the 4S. You yourself even listed enough reasons to prove that it is better. I'm not even going to bother replying to the rest of your ramble because clearly your delusions are taking over... Thanks for the essay though...

I like how you completely ignore what I wrote, and then go on to attack others for rambling and being delusional.

Oh, and BTW, most premium auto makers, from BMW and Mercedes to Porsche, Ferrari and Lamborghini, are moving to carbon fiber. Carbon fiber is made from epoxy, nylon, polyester, or vinyl - which are just different forms of, you guessed it, plastics (more technically, thermoset plastic). But you know better than BMW, Mercedes, Porsche, Ferrari, and Lambo, plastics are poor materials for making cars. You want quality, metal cars like Yugo.

nohone said,

I like how you completely ignore what I wrote, and then go on to attack others for rambling and being delusional.

Oh, and BTW, most premium auto makers, from BMW and Mercedes to Porsche, Ferrari and Lamborghini, are moving to carbon fiber. Carbon fiber is made from epoxy, nylon, polyester, or vinyl - which are just different forms of, you guessed it, plastics (more technically, thermoset plastic). But you know better than BMW, Mercedes, Porsche, Ferrari, and Lambo, plastics are poor materials for making cars. You want quality, metal cars like Yugo.

Once again, that point flew right over your head... I guess you couldn't figure out that we were talking about whatever plastic from the S3/Note 2 vs. glass/metal on other phones. I don't care about carbon fiber, kevlar, gold, platinum, etc. Completely off topic, so try again...

These are reasons why I shouldn't bother replying to your strays away from the point. But to make you happy, I'll give you one response to your previous comment. Good finds on the use of the word "innovate" and "revolutionize", BUT half your response is about the Macbook Air, which if I'm remembering correctly, did in fact revolutionize the thin notebook market and lead to the creation of Ultrabooks. So in that regard, none of what you said makes any sense, because those quotes weren't wrong. You have one, maybe two, items listed that I could give you credit on, but the rest lacks in proving anything. Happy?

Astra.Xtreme said,

Once again, that point flew right over your head... I guess you couldn't figure out that we were talking about whatever plastic from the S3/Note 2 vs. glass/metal on other phones. I don't care about carbon fiber, kevlar, gold, platinum, etc. Completely off topic, so try again...

These are reasons why I shouldn't bother replying to your strays away from the point. But to make you happy, I'll give you one response to your previous comment. Good finds on the use of the word "innovate" and "revolutionize", BUT half your response is about the Macbook Air, which if I'm remembering correctly, did in fact revolutionize the thin notebook market and lead to the creation of Ultrabooks. So in that regard, none of what you said makes any sense, because those quotes weren't wrong. You have one, maybe two, items listed that I could give you credit on, but the rest lacks in proving anything. Happy?

Your exact words from your comment:

If a company makes a car out of plastic and a car out of metal, the metal one is higher quality. Obviously the plastic one won't dent, but the overall quality isn't as good as metal.

You need to divert to start talking about cars, show you know nothing about what you are talking about, and then start blaming others for your failures.

As for the "innovate" and "revolutionize" thing, you said that Cook and Jobs never said such things in their speeches. Showing once again that you will just say whatever you want because it glorifies Apple, and then when you are shown to be wrong you find excuse after excuse, and contradict your own words.

Oh, and the MacBook Air was not revolutionary or new. The Air was in response to Netbooks, and second, if making something thin is revolutionary, and that is all Apple has, then they are in worse shape than I thought when I started off this thread by defending Apple, which you called me a hater for.

Guys. Guys.

Guys.

Just stop. You're caught in a loop and neither of you is going to actually accomplish anything here. All you're doing is punishing everyone else in this thread with new post alerts they don't care about.

So please.

Just stop.

Astra.Xtreme said,
Macbook Air, which if I'm remembering correctly, did in fact revolutionize the thin notebook market and lead to the creation of Ultrabooks.

Lol that's the biggest load of crap I ever heard

PmRd said,

Lol that's the biggest load of crap I ever heard

Okay professor, then enlighten us...
Or if you have nothing to add to the conversation, you might as well remain on the sidelines...

Astra.Xtreme said,

Okay professor, then enlighten us...
Or if you have nothing to add to the conversation, you might as well remain on the sidelines...

In other words, you don't like what PmRd has to say, so you demand he shuts up because it doesn't fit into your narrow world view.

nohone said,

In other words, you don't like what PmRd has to say, so you demand he shuts up because it doesn't fit into your narrow world view.

No, try again... If you say something and don't explain why, then what's the point of saying it in the first place? An opinion is absolutely worthless if you don't even attempt to back it up. If I were to say everything you are saying is wrong without bothering to say why, I would expect you would laugh at me and throw it in my face.

Perhaps you should read my whole comment before missing the point yet again. I explained it pretty clearly in that first sentence...

Astra.Xtreme said,

No, try again... If you say something and don't explain why, then what's the point of saying it in the first place? An opinion is absolutely worthless if you don't even attempt to back it up. Perhaps you should read my whole comment before missing the point yet again. I explained it pretty clearly in that first sentence...

So first you complain about someone writing too much, now you are complaining about someone not writing enough. Of course, your standards for everyone else do not apply to you - your comments are simply personal attacks on others, offer up no substantial information of your own, and then you complain about the supposed limited information in the comments of others.

You seem quite vocal for someone who twice in this thread said that they were going to stop talking to me.

nohone said,

So first you complain about someone writing too much, now you are complaining about someone not writing enough. Of course, your standards for everyone else do not apply to you - your comments are simply personal attacks on others, offer up no substantial information of your own, and then you complain about the supposed limited information in the comments of others.

You seem quite vocal for someone who twice in this thread said that they were going to stop talking to me.

Wow, how many times are you going to twist the story? Seriously, reading comprehension goes a long ways... It's getting rather sad. Nowhere did I complain about writing too much. Just that it wasn't relevant to the topic. And yes I will complain when somebody is too lazy to explain themselves. That's called Trolling 101.

And let's not forget that you were the one who attacked first. Perhaps you need to once again refresh your memory and scroll up a bit...

Let's tally up another "wrong" for good measure... Nowhere did I say I was going to stop talking... My oh my... Good lulz on this Friday... Thank you.