Neowin.net - Will judge put Java in Windows?

Will judge put Java in Windows?

Posted by Daniel Fleshbourne on 05 December 2002 - 12:00 · 33 comments & 911 views

Sun Microsystems told a federal judge on Tuesday that its Java programming language had been so harmed by Microsoft that it must be included with every copy of Windows XP. During the first day of an antitrust hearing that likely will last all week, U.S. District Judge Frederick Motz gave mixed signals about what he was thinking, saying that Sun's suggestion was "attractive" but could be unduly self-serving.

Bundling a Java interpreter with Windows XP, Motz said, would be a "wonderfully elegant and simple, although dramatic" remedy that could be better than turning the solution over to a clutch of economists from each side.

But Motz also said "it does give Sun the benefit over others," a reference to recent court decisions saying that U.S. antitrust law must help consumers, not competitors. "If you've got (Java) widespread and you've got the better product, why do you need parity?" Motz asked Sun's attorneys.

During opening arguments, Sun attorney Rusty Day of Day, Casebeer, Madrid and Batchelder said Microsoft had tried to kneecap Java because it poses a threat to Windows and, now, to the company's .Net strategy.

"The order Sun seeks merely affects a portion of the competitive advantage illegally seized by Microsoft," Day said.

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News source: ZDNet

Spano testified he sent several E-mails to Elcomsoft and its American Internet service providers trying to force them to stop selling the software or to have the company's Web site blocked. He said after Elcomsoft received Adobe's complaint it added a paragraph to its site saying the eBook product should not be used for illegal purposes.

Spano was the fifth in a string of prosecution witnesses testifying in the case. The government's star witness, Dmitry Sklyarov, the 27-year-old programmer who developed Elcomsoft's eBook software, may be called as early as Thursday. Last year Sklyarov spent four months in jail before the government agreed to drop charges against him in exchange for his testimony.

Adobe apparently withdrew its support of the prosecution after Internet policy groups threatened to organize a boycott of the company's products. Civil libertarians say the digital copyright act stifles computer research and gives publishers, record companies, and movie studios too tight a grip on online content.

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(5 replies) #1 Posted by Spectre on 05 Dec 2002 - 12:30: wait ... wasn't MS sued [b]BECAUSE[/b] the java VM was included in XP?

(1 reply) #2 Posted by Tom Servo on 05 Dec 2002 - 12:49: What if MS had never adopted Java at all, even with their own VM?

(6 replies) #3 Posted by kairon on 05 Dec 2002 - 14:19: Microsoft's VM is better, Sun's is bloated and I hate the java interface it has. This is Microsoft's product, people shouldn't be forcing there products on Windows for there own personal gain.

#4 Posted by Eric Ferleman on 05 Dec 2002 - 18:29: Sun must be really down in the dumps to be doing this......lol. I hope they fail.

#5 Posted by g33kb0y on 05 Dec 2002 - 18:43: As far as I'm concerned, Sun needs to die. First they sue to remove Java VM from Windows, then they're suing to FORCE Microsoft to include THEIR Java. I don't care what company (Microsoft or not), you shouldn't sue because a company didn't want ur crap in the first place. However...if Java VM was an illegal copy of Sun's Java, then it makes sense to remove it...but that, in no way shape or form, makes Microsoft obligatory to include Sun's version. Period.

#6 Posted by DELTA75329 on 05 Dec 2002 - 20:43: Seriously.. Sun needs a clue bigtime. They've become what they claim to hate about Microsoft. This is nothing more than a strong-arm tactic designed to give Sun an unfair advantage. Only this time, they'll use the court system. How pathetic. Sun is so ****ing weak.

(1 reply) #7 Posted by ss1 on 05 Dec 2002 - 21:26: Some of you guys need to get a clue: 1. Sun sued MS becase MS tried to change java so that it would only work for Windows operating systems only. This brakes Java's Cross-Platform capability and was in breach of the orginal contract drawn between MS and Sun, hence why Sun won that case. 2. Because MS loss the case they removed java from WinXP, so that they can force .NET down our throats. Far as i'm concered MS wanted revenge and now Sun wants avenge that and entitled to do so. ss1.

(1 reply) #8 Posted by jkuy9 on 05 Dec 2002 - 22:16: If this happens Microsoft will make it optional. They will use the argument that has been used against them with IE and OE, etc. "Let the customer choose what they want to use". They could have Sun's Java Engine and there own Java VM installed but neither are active, then when the user needs to use JAVA they are prompted with the option to use either the MS one of the Sun one. This is the best solution I can think of, after all this is all to give the customer the choice is it not?

(2 replies) #9 Posted by Kombatant on 05 Dec 2002 - 23:00: So.. if the judge decides that Sun's right about this one, and force MS to bundle Java with Windows, I guess that if I created a calculator, I could sue Microsoft because that MS Calc thingie is monopolizing the Windows platform and force it to bundle my version with Windows. Cool

(7 replies) #10 Posted by Ravager on 06 Dec 2002 - 00:52: What about Metapad? Why aren't they sueing Microsoft because of Notepad?

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