Music biz loses Net royalties fight in Canada

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The music industry's efforts to recoup money lost from Internet piracy were thwarted yet again Wednesday.

The Supreme Court of Canada ruled that Internet service providers don't have to pay royalties to composers and performers for music downloaded or heard via online radio by web customers.

In a 9-0 judgment Wednesday, the court said companies providing wide access to the web are merely "intermediaries" who are not bound by federal copyright legislation.

At issue was an effort by the Society of Composers, Authors and Music Publishers of Canada (SOCAN) to force Internet service providers to pay a tariff -- known as Tariff 22 -- for music accessed in the online world whether downloaded or streamed for online radio.

The case dates back to 1995, a few years before Napster revolutionized the way fans get their hands on tunes.

The judges noted, however, that Canadian copyright law is archaic and invited Parliament to update it to meet the needs of the modern information age.

View: Read more at Canoe

News source: Canoe.ca

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(1 reply) #1 MetaLRasaM on 02 Jul 2004 - 06:12

Go Canada! im starting to like this place!

#1.1 chacho on 02 Jul 2004 - 15:15

just starting?? i live in US and have liked it for a loong time

#2 session™ on 02 Jul 2004 - 06:44

Canada is awesome but is this still news? lol

#3 altermind on 02 Jul 2004 - 06:50

canada ownz!

(7 replies) #4 ZeroBS on 02 Jul 2004 - 07:07

Where do you want to live?

Canada – No military, Citizens have freedoms, Politicians and courts work for the people, and good health care

United States of Embarrassment – Military that attacks countries on false intelligences, Politicians and courts work for the big corporations and the richest 1%, heath care what is that?

Yes, I live in thee good old USE. I think we could learn a thing or two from our neighbor to the north!

#4.1 Mattimeo on 02 Jul 2004 - 07:50

wow dude....way off topic...and most of the stuff you said can be argued differently...but that is for some other fourm.

#4.2 JVillanueva on 02 Jul 2004 - 07:51

QUOTE

Yes, I live in thee good old USE.

Apperently our education system isn't that great either.

But seriously, Canda has always had what best for their citizens in their minds, wish I could say the same the US...

The United States should take in concideration what the RIAA is doing is hurting average citizens, when have you ever heard of the RIAA sueing government officials for downloading?

#4.3 wildk on 02 Jul 2004 - 08:09

Is what the RIAA doing REALLY hurting average citizens, or are people just sore becuase they can no longer get their music for free? What is the difference between downloading a album from the web or just walking into your local HMV or whatever and picking up the same album and just walking out of the store with it, Oh wait you would get lifted for shoplifting wouldn't you. Why should people expect to get it for free from the net with no repercussions and bitch about the RIAA (who act on behalf of the record labels, if anyone actually looked at their site) and go after the people who download it. IT IS STILL THEFT WHICHEVER WAY YOU WANT TO LOOK AT IT.
I don't live in either countries and do not like the way the RIAA goes about things, but that still does not change the fact that downloading music/films/software form the net via Kazza, Bittorrent, etc is still theft. How would you like it if you were a musician and people downloaded YOUR music but you recieved no payment for it? You'd be pretty p*ssed off wouldn't you!

The judges noted, however, that Canadian copyright law is archaic and invited Parliament to update it to meet the needs of the modern information age.

Looks like Canada may not be the free for all everyone thinks it is, the trough is about to close, ladies and gentlemen please remove your snouts!

Last edited by 16997 on 02 Jul 2004 - 11:28

#4.4 Joel on 02 Jul 2004 - 12:48

QUOTE (#4.3)

I don't live in either countries and do not like the way the RIAA goes about things, but that still does not change the fact that downloading music/films/software form the net via Kazza, Bittorrent, etc is still theft. How would you like it if you were a musician and people downloaded YOUR music but you recieved no payment for it? You'd be pretty p*ssed off wouldn't you!

We pay a levy on media to recoup the "lost" revenue. So we're already paying them for the material.

#4.5 wildk on 02 Jul 2004 - 14:27

so $0.21c covers it does it, especially when you look at how it is divided
Canadian Leveys on media
5. CPCC shall distribute the amounts it collects, less its operating
costs, as follows:
1. 66 per cent, to be shared between the Society of Composers,
Authors and Music Publishers of Canada (SOCAN), the
Canadian Mechanical Reproduction Rights Agency (CMRRA)
and the Society for Reproduction Rights of Authors, Composers
and Publishers in Canada (SODRAC), on account of eligible
authors; $0.139c
2. 18.9 per cent, to be shared between the Neighbouring
Rights Collective of Canada (NRCC) and the Société de gestion
des droits des artistes-musiciens (SOGEDAM) on account
of eligible performers; $0.0397c
3. 15.1 per cent to the Neighbouring Rights Collective of Canada
(NRCC) on account of eligible makers. $0.0317c

If anyone thinks that that levy entitiles people to rip off music/movies whatever then they are sorely deluded

Last edited by 16997 on 02 Jul 2004 - 14:33

#4.6 dl0711 on 02 Jul 2004 - 15:13

Yes i do think that the Leveys Covers the artist and songwriting. when you buy an album from a store the Artist only gets here look

Where does the money go when I buy a CD?

Of course, it all depends on the cost of the CD, but the Canadian Recording Industry Association compiled figures this summer. Out of 100 per cent of the cost:
4% is retailer profit
7% is label profit
9% is manufacturing costs
12% is artist and songwriting payments
12% is record company distribution, sales & overhead costs
13% is promotion and marketing costs
19% is recording, video and production costs
24% is retail store costs

so the 0.21c I think would come up to the 12% and PLUS half of the Albums out there only have like mabe 2 to 3 Good songs and the rest are S-H-I-T. I want to ask PPL who are reading this - do you guys Play the whole album or skip the songs that you dont like to get to the ones you do like ????

______________________________

I can say that This was a SWEET Birthday Gift To Canada LOL a day b4 canada day and this came out to be A-OK

Last edited by 50582 on 02 Jul 2004 - 15:20

#4.7 wildk on 05 Jul 2004 - 09:05

Sorry, but no even a $10.00 CD the 12% equates to $1.20 so 0.21c is no where near 12% and when i buy a CD i buy it because i like the artist and listen to the whole CD.
Besides which if you had looked and the sources the levy detailed applies to blank media not commercial CD's as per the info you have provided!

(1 reply) #5 valent2191 on 02 Jul 2004 - 08:56

Canada is so grate just to remind you that it's not a democratic country it's ruled by monarchs

;-)

Last edited by 43497 on 02 Jul 2004 - 09:02

#5.1 ghostwind on 02 Jul 2004 - 23:25

Wow man, you obviously got it going on when it comes to your knowledge of Canada. Canada's government is set up in a constitutional monarchy. This means that she has no true power other than for purposes of ceremony. Her representative, the govenor general, signs documents into law. Even if she refused to sign any legislation, the prime minister still has the power to sign anything he wants into law. By the way a grate is a kind of box, which isn't that great, now is it?

Last edited by 34912 on 03 Jul 2004 - 20:18

#6 valent2191 on 02 Jul 2004 - 08:58

oh yeah canada is actually the only country that has "real" freedom in North america.
**** talking like this makes me think im in the wrong country

#7 neo_joel on 02 Jul 2004 - 13:31

Cheers, Canada Rules.

#8 Grappa on 02 Jul 2004 - 14:18

IN YOUR FACE, RIAA!! Nice one Canada!

Now if only the US would wake the fark up and do the same.

#9 un0 on 02 Jul 2004 - 18:31

Heh, im starting to like canada more and more each day. F' RIAA!
Good goin' Cana...

(1 reply) #10 Sydd on 02 Jul 2004 - 20:01

*Proud to be Canadian*

IN YOUR FACE CRIAA! HA.

Im really starting to favour that judge....

#10.1 ghostwind on 03 Jul 2004 - 20:20

I think the canadian recording industry should CRIAA me a river

Man, my humor is bad

(1 reply) #11 Andareed on 02 Jul 2004 - 22:28

I'm a Canadian too

I was shocked it was a 9-0 decision. I would have expected at least 1 judge to be in favour of the recording industry. Also, with a liberal minority and apparent liberal-ndp coallition, it is clear that "legal" p2p in Canada is here to stay.

#11.1 allfive6 on 03 Jul 2004 - 06:42

QUOTE (#11.0)

Also, with a liberal minority and apparent liberal-ndp coallition, it is clear that "legal" p2p in Canada is here to stay.

God i love Canada. Liberal minority mean nothing get done that is even alittle bit disaproved of

#12 zivan56 on 03 Jul 2004 - 04:53

The court also put in a strong suggestion that the privacy of an individual is more imporant that copyright. This mean that it is close to impossible for anybody to identify what you are sharing and who you are.

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