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Microsoft Accused of Destroying E-Mails

WishX   on 18 November 2004 - 08:11 · 30 comments & 2654 views

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Microsoft Corp. developed policies stressing the systematic destruction of internal e-mails and other documents crucial to lawsuits it has faced in recent years, a California software company alleges.

Burst.com, in court papers unsealed this week, also accuses Microsoft of destroying e-mails crucial to Burst's lawsuit against the software giant even after the trial judge ordered it to retain the documents. Burst had previously claimed that Microsoft deleted e-mails it needed for evidence. But the unsealed 50-page motion, filed Oct. 29, provides new details, Burst says, of "institutional policies" by Microsoft "to make sure that incriminating documents disappeared."

Burst is suing Microsoft for alleged anticompetitive behavior, saying Microsoft misappropriated the intellectual property behind its multimedia software after breaking off talks with Burst on a joint project.

Burst, according to the motion, wants the jury in the case to be told that Microsoft failed to retain important documents, so jurors should infer that the company did so because those documents were damaging. "Critical e-mails have been destroyed and will never be recovered. We've tried; they're gone forever," said Burst's lead attorney, Spencer Hosie. "This is the only remedy that's left open to us."

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News source: Associated Press


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#1 Poof on 18 Nov 2004 - 08:16
Wow...

They were shot with a .45 ... The defendant had a .45 which went missing so lets assume that that .45 was the one that shot them.

O.o.o.kay...
(1 reply) #2 pato_inbox on 18 Nov 2004 - 08:23
oohh, looks like Microsoft is going down finally
#2.1 EduardValencia on 18 Nov 2004 - 15:23
-duh-
#3 bladerunner81 on 18 Nov 2004 - 10:57
you know "1984" by orwell? you put that email into a "memory hole" and it ceases to exist in knowledge of men... or re-send the email with altered content every time a new history is necessary... nice one, ms
#4 frogworm on 18 Nov 2004 - 11:00
i wonder how they know Microsoft deleted certain emails. are they a little bit guilty also. i don't see why companies don't use some kind of communication system within their business that leaves no trail. email and messenger leaves trail, maybe they can do internal VoIP, who knows.
#5 noyb on 18 Nov 2004 - 11:29
Is this a follow up on the Chris Phillips case http://www.neowin.net/comments.php?id=24743&category=main

Its a shame that the documents are no longer linked need i say they made for an interesting read if anyone knows of a mirror for them please post it as i lost them a while back.

Edit: I have found them and if anyone wants to provide me a place to upload them let me know total size for both = 1.3mb
(15 replies) #6 slapnuts_ox on 18 Nov 2004 - 11:39
is anyone honestly that surprised? MS has proven that they do not pratice good business ethics in the past (anti-trust suite).
#6.1 JaggedFlame on 18 Nov 2004 - 12:29
Surprised that they've been accused? No, there have been plenty of dumbasses who've tried suing Microsoft for a quick buck.

You, on the other hand, have already assumed they did it. Great job.
#6.2 noyb on 18 Nov 2004 - 12:39
How about you read the documents in question before you make up your mind rather than taking the typical fan boy line, i have read them and let me just say in this case they have not practiced good business ethics.
#6.3 slapnuts_ox on 18 Nov 2004 - 13:10
JaggedFlame.....i agree with noyb so all i have to say is Great job Fan Boy!


remember just because you like a companies product doesn't mean you have to like the company. personally I don't like either but that is my preference.
#6.4 8-n-1 on 18 Nov 2004 - 14:03

It's not like this is the first time Microsoft has done this.

News Clips from September 15, 1998

#6.5 JaggedFlame on 18 Nov 2004 - 19:15
QUOTE
How about you read the documents in question before you make up your mind rather than taking the typical fan boy line, i have read them and let me just say in this case they have not practiced good business ethics.


I haven't made up my mind. In fact, all I said was that there are plenty of dumbasses who have sued Microsoft for a quick buck. True enough.

The fact of the matter is that I don't have enough evidence to state whether or not Microsoft is guilty. And neither do you.

QUOTE
JaggedFlame.....i agree with noyb so all i have to say is Great job Fan Boy!


I'm a fanboy because I told you not to jump to conclusions? You're a freaking idiot.
#6.6 noyb on 18 Nov 2004 - 20:40
Jagged i have the actual documents that are in question and in those documents is pretty strong evidence against MS and its not just destroying emails its also about how in the deal in question MS lied to the court about who they had representing their intrests so he could not be subpoenaed.
#6.7 JaggedFlame on 18 Nov 2004 - 21:36
Alright then, as long as you have the evidence.
#6.8 noyb on 18 Nov 2004 - 21:52
The evidence i have was available to all about a month ago when it was posted here on Neowin, since then the site hosting the documents is no longer doing so but i still have them and will by all means upload them either to here or another site. They really are a good read trust me.
#6.9 SquareSoft0 on 18 Nov 2004 - 22:55
You're funnnnneh
#6.10 noyb on 18 Nov 2004 - 23:33
huh?
#6.11 SquareSoft0 on 19 Nov 2004 - 00:01
I wouldn't be mentioning this 'proof' unless you actually have it on hand, because I have this evidence that proves that using Sony TVs makes you gay, but the webhost died.
#6.12 noyb on 19 Nov 2004 - 00:05
http://www.neowin.net/comments.php?id=24743&category=main

"You will find the two relevant unsealed documents in their entirety in this week's list of links."

Anything else to add? like i said if anyone wants them ill upload them to anywhere you please.
#6.13 noyb on 19 Nov 2004 - 00:16
Don't worry Squaresoft0 i have found them for you http://www.pbs.org/cringely/links/links20041007.html enjoy the read.
#6.14 SquareSoft0 on 19 Nov 2004 - 12:31
My problem wasn't with the validity in your statements, it's the fact that you based your argument with no support whatsoever.
#6.15 noyb on 19 Nov 2004 - 15:27
You did question the validity of my statements by assuming that i was lying about actually having the documents in question, i have proven i did have access to them as does everyone else.

The support i have is contained within the documents, i assume you have read them by now. For example Chris Phillips was omitted from the list of employees that MS had involved in the negotiations in question when he was in fact the key figure involved. As regards to emails Jim Allchin did make MS employees purge e-mails every 30 days and i quote

"This is not something you get to decide. This is company policy. ... Do not archive your mail. Do not be foolish. 30 days."

Further more convincing evidence is given by Candy Stark excluding emails from back-up procedures because and i quote "due to legal reasons".

I see the evidence contained within these court documents as pretty strong evidence against MS of not only withholding (Phillips) but also destroying evidence (Allchin, Stark), as did the Judge being that he actually unsealed them so that others could view them. I suggest if you actually want to challenge the case or me you should read the documents for yourself rather than resorting to childish comments and questioning the validity of my statements.
#7 EduardValencia on 18 Nov 2004 - 15:24
maybe it's a false statement
(2 replies) #8 Magallanes on 18 Nov 2004 - 15:32
i wonder why a simple e-mail can be a valious proof of somethings.

Ok, there are "fingerprint" in each email but they can be altered-faked or some no-authorized users can send a email using a pc of a comrades.
#8.1 8-n-1 on 18 Nov 2004 - 15:49

So you think that a good defense for Microsoft is for them to claim that they don't secure their executives' computers well enough to prevent anybody from sending mail from their computers?
#8.2 markjensen on 18 Nov 2004 - 15:59
Plus, if Microsoft supplied these incriminating emails, they would be vouching for their authenticity. Microsoft would NOT want to admit to unethical or illegal business practices, so any emails they provided along these lines are likely legitimate (as any "altering" they might do would be in their own favor, not to provide fake evidence that incriminates them).
(1 reply) #9 TaylorTAP on 18 Nov 2004 - 16:37
QUOTE
So you think that a good defense for Microsoft is for them to claim that they don't secure their executives' computers well enough to prevent anybody from sending mail from their computers?


@ 8-n-1 You honestly think that Microsoft saying they failed to secure their executives computers would really help their immage? I mean if they can't secure their machines how are we (the consumer) supposed to rely on them to keep our own stuff secure? I know I'd sleep a little less uneasier at night knowing Microsoft can't even secure their own stuff.
#9.1 noyb on 18 Nov 2004 - 16:48
@TaylorTAP

Billy G did report a couple of months ago that he was a victim of spyware, sweet dreams.
#10 kitchenutensils on 18 Nov 2004 - 20:46
although there is alot of rubbish lawsuits just intended to win a little off the earnings off sucesses that don't deserve to live in this world; i think this one sounds more substantial than most
#11 Adamb10 on 18 Nov 2004 - 21:15
Another day, another 100 lawsuits filed againest MS.

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