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Why Vista Will Not Be The Last OS Microsoft Makes

Mr magoo   on 22 April 2006 - 00:48 · 142 comments & 61606 views

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A site boasting to offer irreverent Apple news boasted some frankly irrelevant news yesterday. An opinion piece titled " Will Vista Be the Last Operating System Microsoft Produces?" suggested that after Vista, that's it in the OS game for Microsoft. We urge you to read it.

The article argues that if they do put out another OS, it won't be until 2015. How, I hear you cry, could this be so? Quite simple, according to Apple Matters (we'd pun the name, but hey, you can over do it). First, Vista is just too big! Secondly, that web based Google OS is coming. Thirdly, that Microsoft have lost some employees to Google.

Leaving asides the 63,000+ people still working at Microsoft, the article is seriously flawed on a number of counts. A new OS every eight years?! Drive letters are an antiquated 'idea'? A web based Google OS? There's too much code in Vista?! Come on. A drastic re-write is what Microsoft claims to have done with Vista, and is one of the reasons why it has taken so long to deliver. The Google OS rumour has hopped from blog to blog with little attributable information to verify such a claim. One might claim with more credibility that Microsoft had done a far better job at building a 'web OS' with Live.com. Further, if reports are to be believed, Microsoft will soon be launching online storage too, well before the GDrive is launched. As Mr Cringley is so found of writing, we probably will see serious virutalisation of Windows on Mac in the near future - yet the scale is important.

Apple is very deft at getting journalists (and bloggers) to write very favourable articles about the company. However, this skill masks excellently the company's size in comparison to the competition. Apple's share of the PC market in 2005 was just 2.5%. That's correct. Whilst it might be coasting at 50+% in portable media player markets, if not a lot more, in the PC market, it is slim. Steve Jobs, mac god, has engineered a recovery in the company's financial fortunes but has seen a decline in the market share (4.6% in 1996, 2.2% 2005). We think you can probably do the maths here - hint - Linux isn't taking up more than a few percent. That's right - Windows has between 80 and 90% of the PC market.

Here is the reality. Vista development is plodding along. It's not going to be the re-birth of Christ, but it is going to be an improvement on Windows XP. It is exciting, and whilst it's very popular to say otherwise, it does come with new features. We're mid year, and Microsoft does not have any major product announcements at the moment. This is why it's gone a bit quiet; not because something has gone seriously wrong and they're hushing it up. Microsoft have a long list of items they've, well, dropped from Vista, and it doesn't seem plausible that they would simply waste that development. Expect a service pack with a number of features (WinFS, for example) after Vista has been launched.

Perhaps it is unfair to single out this article for attention, for it is but one in a series of articles doing a dis-service to bloggers online. A previous example is the 60% of Vista getting a re-write story which bounced around the web in March. We'll admit - true to name, we at Neowin are about as un-professional as it gets. However, we're not in the business of what can best be described as 'trashy think pieces', designed for the single aim of courting 'controversy' - and traffic. Writers might think that the short term gain from getting syndicated around the web is worth it - but we think not. We're here for our users, and think that running mis-leading articles is at best unhelpful, and at worst, down right mischievous. If online publications, bloggers included, want to be taken seriously as 'news' outlets, they need to be serious about their news.

As this affects you, dear reader, we'd like to hear your thoughts - so leave us a comment.

View: Apple Matters Article




Post a comment · Send to friend Comments · There are 142 additional comments
#1 Chicane-UK on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:25
Microsoft are treading a little close to the wire IMHO.. they can't afford for Vista to be yet another "in-between" OS whilst they promise the earth of the next version they release. Consumers will get fed up of the mediocrity.

I think people are far more vocal about what Microsoft are putting out these days now that reliable, fast, cheap and attractive alternatives exist - people used to bemoan the state of Windows back in the 95/98 days but then it was just accepted that was how OS's behaved. Competition from the Linux and Apple people have proved otherwise since!
(6 replies) #2 AppleBelly on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:32
I miss the old unprofessional neowin. Stop putting editorials on the front page, create a new section for them or something.
#2.1 vetLOC on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:40
Uh, Neowin is still run by us you know. If we want to post an editorial on the front page, then that's where it goes.

What is it with you people that have to complain because a staff member voiced his opinion about something? Does that make Neowin worthless to you or something? I just don't understand it.
#2.2 Grandaevus on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:36
I like the editorials, keep em coming. And for the "Editorial" in front, how is it possible to miss the




#2.3 LyKwId on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:43
i'm acutally quite a fan of the new editorials. quite insightful! keep them coming!
#2.4 theyarecomingforyou on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:02
I don't think the new editorials are quite there yet but I definitely like seeing them. I think the problem is that Neowin has always been about news snippets and editorials are generally a bit long to fit comfortably on the main page.
#2.5 markjensen on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:51
I miss the old unprofessional neowin.
Ummm... You do realize, don't you, that the "old" Neowin for which you lament used to post a lot of editorials on the front page?

Or maybe you just wanted to be cool and complain...
#2.6 sphbecker on 24 Apr 2006 - 14:43
No, this is so funny that its worth a spot of front page! Newing does a good job at keeping the front page relevant. As long as the total posts to the front page stay less then about 10 a day I'm happy. It doesn't take long to scroll past something you don't care about.

As for the article, the writer is completely missing the reasons for Microsoft's delays. One, they put Windows development on hold for about 18-24 months to get SP2 and other security fixes out the door (that is not likely to happen again), and two, Vista is a massive over-hall of the Windows platform. I don't expect even the next Major release of Windows (after the point release) to be as big as Vista.
(5 replies) #3 The_Decryptor on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:32
"Apple's share of the PC market in 2005 was just 2.5%"

And Acer's was around 2.7%, yet both companies are raking in the money.
#3.1 Smigit on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:35
"Steve Jobs, mac god, has engineered a recovery in the company's financial fortunes"

Nothing the article didnt say
#3.2 Dashel on 22 Apr 2006 - 18:47
...yet Acers still run Windows. OS X continues to provide no competition for MS's OS.
#3.3 The_Decryptor on 23 Apr 2006 - 09:03
"yet Acers still run Windows."

and the current Mac's can as well.

Really, OS X has around 100% market share of the computers it can run on, the only market segment where Windows and OS X are competing together, is the Mac segment (ignoring warez copies of OS X running on generic PC's), and in that segment OS X is beating Windows.
#3.4 LTD on 23 Apr 2006 - 15:37
Keep in mind the market share phenomenon. It's all about sales and brand recognition. If Microsoft loses a bit of the market to Apple, no real harm done. But it can mean a great deal to Apple's bottom line. Remember that Apple's goal is not to target everyone and their dog, but to appeal to a certain segment of the tech-user market that is willing to pay more for higher-end goods. It's a very lucrative market that is just as much about style and design as it is about the available technologies.

Apple does not target the average $399 Dell user, because a.) that user cannot afford to do pay say, $1,700 CDN for a decent mac, or b.) will not pay say, $1,700 CDN for a decently-equipped mac because they see it as simply a tool, and not a lifestlye marker.

Same reason Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, Gucci, Versace, all sell the way they do in North America. And yes, there are midrange Fords and GM autos that have larger and faster engines than say, their BMW counterparts. But they're still *not* Beemers. ;-)


#3.5 Neomac v6 on 24 Apr 2006 - 01:05
The market share figures are a little misleading. Apple is actually on the way back up after bottoming out at 1.8% of global share.
Don't blame Steve for the Mac's "decrease" in market share. The Mac was in decline before he returned to Apple. Mac OS X didn't come out till 2001 and wasn't really ready for prime time till 2003. Market share has been steadily rising again since then.
Incidentally, Safari's share of the browser market is over 3%, so the Mac's installed base must be bigger than its market share. Its share of the home market is probably bigger again, as Mac users who have to use PCs at work effectively cancel out their "vote" for the Mac.
(1 reply) #4 icat on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:40
Well, even IF MS doesn't manage to release Vista still it will have a bright future developing new OS. Why?
When it comes to chosing the OS for your home PC will you ever choose Mac (that has a really number of programs you can run on it) or Linux (that has almost the same problems)?
#4.1 Daffy_Duck on 22 Apr 2006 - 15:16
"that has almost the same problems"

Just curious why linux has almost the same problems? You make it sound like more software is available on linux than OS X when the opposite is true.

http://darwinports.opendarwin.org/

"The DarwinPorts Project's main goal is to provide an easy way to install various open-source software products on the Darwin OS family (OpenDarwin, Mac OS X and Darwin)

There are currently about 3252 completed and usable ports, with more being added on a regular basis."

#5 Digix on 22 Apr 2006 - 10:44
i dont care about pc market just singley narrow minded people about OS's are very lame and google already has an OS its just not formal and not public and even if it was its nothing special but a recompilzation of linux.
(8 replies) #6 scandal on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:10
well, IMHO, in 2015 every PC will run Linux. To many reasons for it.
#6.1 Timmah on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:22
Maybe we'll all be driving round in hover cars and taking meals in pill form too?
#6.2 Daedalus on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:30
Don't forget we'll all be living on the moon too!
#6.3 rIaHc3 on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:38
well, IMHO, in 2015 every PC will run Linux. To many reasons for it.
Altho its your opinion, it has to be one of the most stupid and troll sentences ive read...
#6.4 Hurmoth on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:52
@scandal: Maybe one or two of my PCs will be running Linux--as they already do, but unless game developers start rolling out games for the Linux platform, this isn't going to happen with my main rig. I have a feeling this is true for a lot of Windows users, especially here at Neowin.
#6.5 Croquant on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:10
Aparantly I'll be living in my flying house eating my formerly-flying bacon, watching my robot maid (running Linux: RoboMaid's Edition) clean my robotic house in 2015. Hopefully, the HD-DVD/BNlu-Ray format war will be over by then.
#6.6 PureLegend on 22 Apr 2006 - 16:57
People must have a bloody good reason to change to Linux. I mean, what does the average user see out of it (other than a slimmed-down freebie)?
#6.7 excalpius on 22 Apr 2006 - 18:27
as long as it's a shareware OS, you won't see businesses moving to it on the front end and consumers moving to it on the desktop. period.
#6.8 osirisX on 23 Apr 2006 - 00:06
And we were supposed to be living in Space by 2001.
#7 cork1958 on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:11
Very simple as to why it won't be their last OS, it's to much of a cash cow, even if it isn't their main source of income.
(3 replies) #8 AppleBelly on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:27
Its the fact that you're mixing (what should be) unbiased news with biased articles on the same page.

I am not saying don't post them, it can be fun and interesting to read someones opinion on a topic, but in the current structure it seems like you are trying to make it appear as news, just give more general awareness to users, put "Editorial:" in front of the title or something.

If a lot of people are voicing their opinion against your editorials isn't that a sign that they aren't being implemented correctly? Or is our opinions to you worthless?
#8.1 Smigit on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:05
Quote - AppleBelly said @ #2.2
Its the fact that you're mixing (what should be) unbiased news with biased articles on the same page.
half the news here is biased but. How many of the news items are based on articles or blog entries or are reviews of a product. I mean read the post two days ago from Paul thorott. I dont see how having an article on his oppinion onn Vista is any better than having a similar article by a staff member.

Actually I like the editorials and would ask that more be posted. Original content is good. It's not like it was expressed as factual knowledge, it was no doubt a single mans oppinion and it was a great read if you ask me.

edit: quoting really stuffs up the formatting of this site..the above post was originally 2.2 or something before I quoted it and it got moved to 8 and my reply to 8.1....ahh well. If it's going to mess up page formatting perhaps the quote button should be disabled for now (using the new swift theme here)

Last edited by Smigit on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:11
#8.2 M2Ys4U on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:49
How can you miss the big editorial logo?
#8.3 shanepitman on 22 Apr 2006 - 16:49
Quote -
AppleBelly on 22 Apr 2006 - 07:27
Its the fact that you're mixing (what should be) unbiased news with biased articles on the same page.

I am not saying don't post them, it can be fun and interesting to read someones opinion on a topic, but in the current structure it seems like you are trying to make it appear as news, just give more general awareness to users, put "Editorial:" in front of the title or something.

If a lot of people are voicing their opinion against your editorials isn't that a sign that they aren't being implemented correctly? Or is our opinions to you worthless?


Uh, hello... BIG red dot that says E D I T O R I A L.
(5 replies) #9 shark1 on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:41
Vista is a third of what was announced by Microsoft couple of years ago...I've read the last article/review of Paul, and well it aint inspiring...
#9.1 vcv on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:19
A third? Did you just pull that number of of your arse? Please provide some sort of reference for that number or shut up.
#9.2 werejag on 23 Apr 2006 - 02:44
yea i wouldnt go as high as a third. maybe 1/12th or 1/25th. provide some proof its that high
#9.3 PCyr on 23 Apr 2006 - 17:47
"yea i wouldnt go as high as a third. maybe 1/12th or 1/25th. provide some proof its that high"

Trolling again?
#9.4 werejag on 23 Apr 2006 - 19:59
"Trolling again?"

PCyr Increasing your post count again?


if you have nothing important to contribute. why post?
#9.5 PCyr on 24 Apr 2006 - 14:07
"if you have nothing important to contribute. why post?"

I believe I asked you a question first or are you just trying to evade my point? Way to fit the troll criteria even more.
#10 Christian on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:43
Good editorial. I like it! Well done!
(2 replies) #11 angrybrit on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:45
All this FUD... I just like before during the Chicago launch... Microsoft will fail... It's a not a real 32-bit OS... This and that... Nothing like free publicity for MS! Three cheers!

Vista will trounce MacOS X. Over emotional OSS fundies users will still be hating MS. Then we, PC users, will get a new OS. Woot!
#11.1 unkle stu on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:11
you are right on that my friend. in fact, every major windows release brings the prophets of doom out..

the other thing is that most everyone has been watching vista gradually change, and it's hard to see the big picture. for joe user knowing only win xp, vista will be awesome.
#11.2 Ideas Man on 23 Apr 2006 - 23:28
Exactly. The problem with vista really only emerges if you've monitored the progress right from the beginning (PDC 2003) where we were shown CONCEPTs of Vista (Which were bloody awesome) and what came of it. Most people no nothing of those concepts and so for a user from XP->Vista, it's gonna look very nice. If you forget all the beginning stuff, it's still a good release.

Having played with the latest build, I can say it's shaping up to be a very nice release. UAP still needs some work, but it's coming along nicely, and IE7 in that build is bloody fast, never seen it so fast TBH. Plus the visuals and the like, it's coming along and it should still impress.
(2 replies) #12 Matt T on 22 Apr 2006 - 11:46
Frankly I think this seems a bit childish on Neowin's behalf. If you read the "Apple Matters" article, you'll see the very first thing the composer says is "I don’t think Microsoft will ship another Operating System after Vista launches" - clearly, he is simply expressing his opinion. What, are we all going to start attacking harmless bloggers because they express a different opinion?

I don't agree with this guy and I'm not trying to defend anyone here, but come on, let's all consider the basic right to freedom of speech before we post a several-paragraph editorial on the front page.

Of course this is all my opinion - am I going to be attacked because of it?

Last edited by Matt T on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:02
#12.1 Emphatic on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:06
I think you can be questioned as to the reasoning of that opinion - you've the right to say something but somebody else doesn't have the right to reply?
#12.2 Smigit on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:09
and the neowin article is also an oppinion of which you have now attacked. Go figure.
#13 xpclient on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:01
For some people, some common tasks they do constitute an OS! They seem to know nothing about computers other than home computing.

Nothing's gonna change, there's still plenty of innovation left to be done in OSes and the underlying platform.
(2 replies) #14 ccuk on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:15
It won't be the last OS Microsoft make, but I fear its going to be to 2007 what Windows ME became to the world since 2000.

Microsoft made a big mistake with not getting its team and production of vista running to its set deadline. Features that were impressive are now old hat, after we have seen vista pushed back and back.

We need to be seeing more promised features like WinFS in order for vista to not flop, or for there to be any major reason to fork out for the top end "Ultimate" windows OS, where previous editions quite frankly have indeed been over priced for too long. For non gamers and those working in an office environment using their boxes for word processing and spreadsheets, for those who merely surf the internet, they will see vista as a luxury expense which in reality isn't necessary. It (Vista) offers to them (joe average user) nothing more than XP, a glass interface maybe... is it really worth £200+? There are other features, the search, the DX10, the new security measures etc but joe average doesn't see these as important. If thy bought a pc this year, and it works, goes on the internet, they can use browsers such as FF and opera, no pop ups with good av protection... then their reason to upgrade is pretty minimal.

" if it aint broke don't fix it "

Its a shame, I had such high hopes for vista for so long... but my eager anitcipation has diminished into... well i guess I might upgrade... to damn I have to upgrade in order to play DX10 games...



I will still upgrade as I game and I want DX 10, I am really disheartened by Microsoft's inability to keep to deadlines. But the fact ramains i know many who will not be upgrading... and to be honest rightly so.

ccuk
#14.1 Luppy on 23 Apr 2006 - 02:12
If thats true why arn't you still running windows 95.
Sure current OSs are fine for now, but thats until you taste whats better.
#14.2 ccuk on 23 Apr 2006 - 17:56
@ Luppy you obviously didn't read what I wrote...

If DX10 was coming to XP I wouldn't waste my £ stirling on it. Problem is in order to Continue gaming we are FORCED to upgrade to Vista.


#15 djepi on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:21
I'm moreover impressed with the amount of passion that Vista has generated recently. From Paul Thurrott's strong words to now Neowin's somewhat strong yet justified rant. It just goes to show how much people care about Windows. Crazy eh?
(2 replies) #16 azz0r_wugg on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:45
I dont mind editorials...but when they're this stupid its pathetic.

As if MS would drop out the OS market, suicide.
#16.1 Hurmoth on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:55
What is stupid; Apple Matters' original article or Neowin's response? I don't see how our response is stupid. Care to go into a little more detail?
#16.2 kazzama on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:26
I think azz0r_wugg means the Apple Matters article is stupid as (s)he said "As if MS would drop out the OS market, suicide. " soo im assuming (s)he does mean that the Apple Matters article is "stupid" Hurmoth.
#17 LTD on 22 Apr 2006 - 12:57
Another opinion piece:

1.) In defense of Vista

2.) while taking a shot at Apple

3.) that is based on a wild assumption.

Microsoft will miss two of the most lucrative moneymaking opportunities: the back-to-school shopping season, and the Christmas shopping season. All thanks to a lumbering, delayed Vista.

Meanwhile Macs are running on Intel, and Apple Stores are literally *jammed* with people. I mean *jammed.* Wait until Christmas.

MS will hold on to their 90+% for the time being, but the competition seems to be galactically underrated and more capable and viable than ever.

So far, Vista has been a disappointment. Prove otherwise and I'll buy you dinner. THAT is why it is being shat on all over the web. If something does not inspire confidence, at least aknowledge it. You can cheer for it when it is released and actually lives up to expectations.

Right now here is the REALITY for all of you that have such a love for pointing it out:

We do not have Vista, but missing features from Betas and broken promises. What we do have is an aging XP that should have had a more meaningful update cycle but never did.

Cheers.
#18 Smigit on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:02
I like the editorial and all but one thing...if you are going to cite that the certain articles are "trashy think pieces" and "misleading", why are those articles making the frontpage news as opposed to being left in the forums. Heres an example that you referenced in the editorial which you then used as a frontpage story here. http://www.neowin.net/index.php?act=view&id=32576

I dont mind but if you wholely believe this news to be trash why not leave it in the backpage news?

edit: whats more when that news was posted no hint was made as to it being false. I never believed it nor did many but it seemed several people did think that they were going to be rewriting all that code.

Just an oppinion, not having a go at the news team or anything.
(1 reply) #19 !_chr1s_! on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:20
ROFL Windows fan is getting hot under the collar.............. :p
#19.1 Dr.Jones on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:35
.......... while other Fanbois are still trolling
(4 replies) #20 Ely on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:34
God I can't wait for MS to release Vista; Once this new OS is out the door all the apple's fan boys noise will fade away; everyone will start using Vista and will be happy with it, then the hype for Microsoft new OS will start to bloom; live and learn; the same old story repeats itself!
#20.1 Daffy_Duck on 22 Apr 2006 - 15:52
Don't forget that some of us Apple fanboys are forced to use Windows at work. So I will still be complaining about Vista even after it is released. I just hope that it won't be the hunk of junk it is now or that my company will not switch to it anytime soon. Thankfully, that is unlikely.
#20.2 Neomac v6 on 23 Apr 2006 - 12:52
Vista will only reinforce for Mac fans (like Daffy) why they use OS X. Those who've never used a Mac will once again believe Windows has "caught up".
#20.3 LTD on 23 Apr 2006 - 15:24
Neomac ;-)
#20.4 PCyr on 23 Apr 2006 - 17:57
"So I will still be complaining about Vista even after it is released."

A true fanboy. Makes up his mind before a product is even finished.

"Those who've never used a Mac will once again believe Windows has "caught up"."

Windows will never be "caught up" to OS X, and OS X will never be "caught up" to Windows. I don't see people can summarize an entire, elaborate OS as being "better" or "caught up". Aside the different development practises, MS and Apple have different priorities about what is important in an OS release. Windows will always (well, very likely) have edges over OS X, and OS X will always have edges over Windows. In the end, it depends what you want in an OS that will make the decision.
#21 Krad on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:44
The lamest article on neowin i have ever seen. Boo to you
(4 replies) #22 philburt on 22 Apr 2006 - 13:48
YES! Why not wait until the OS is finished to make judgement?? It's a tough decision to release betas/pre-release information to the public, but shutting the public out would probably drive everyone insane.
#22.1 mattrobs on 23 Apr 2006 - 01:00
How come I don't hear this much fuss about public Mac betas (is there even such a thing)?
#22.2 Luppy on 23 Apr 2006 - 02:29
@mattrobs Because only 2.5% of people care
#22.3 LTD on 23 Apr 2006 - 15:22
Public mac betas are a rarity. Apple's development process is usually a closed one. Lots of secrecy and hush-hush. ;-)

Besides, no one's really worried, anyway. Mac users know that they can expect nothing but quality from Apple, and Apple usually delivers that in spades.

Mind you, OS 7.5 and 8 were rather uninspiring, but that's way in the past.
#22.4 Neomac v6 on 24 Apr 2006 - 00:52
Quote -
How come I don't hear this much fuss about public Mac betas (is there even such a thing)?


Apple's latest public beta is Boot Camp. And yes, there's been a fuss about it!
#23 RangerLG on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:00
Editorials are fine, but isn't this why Neowin added a Blog section? Usually, editorials are reserved for their own section. Maybe you guys need to add an opinion section and link to it from the main page.
#24 Croquant on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:11
That editorial was like watching someone take a shotgun an idiot apple fanboy. Well done. I applaud your editorial skils, sir.
(2 replies) #25 vcv on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:22
Who took a shot at apple? A few FACTS were stated about Apple, but no "shots" were taken at it.

And what is the wild assumption anyway?
#25.1 Garry on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:45
Quote - vcv said @ #17.1
Who took a shot at apple? A few FACTS were stated about Apple, but no "shots" were taken at it.

And what is the wild assumption anyway?


It was rather taking a shot at Apple.

I'd like to know who's ass the "2.2% market share" statistic was pulled out of.

I know the Neowin tagline is "Where unprofessional journalism looks better." but Jesus, if they don't fix the bugs in Shift on IE soon, it'll just be "Unprofressional Journalism."
#25.2 Smigit on 23 Apr 2006 - 04:53
I agree with VCV, the 2.2% to me seemed more as a way of showing how dominant MS market share is and used it as a reason for MS to continuwe releasing its OS. I dont believe there was any underhanded jabs being made by it.
#26 chconline on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:38
Virtually every topic (Front page or not) If it's the starters opinion or things about the starter, they get flamed. NW staff gets flamed less often, but unfortunately it's a practice of 'some' members (I am not pointing fingers at anyone, honestly) to go in every thread, flame the starter, etc etc

Back on topic, I am a MS Beta tester, Vista seems pretty promising. They did do a lot of work on it, I can tell. On build 5342, its already pretty stable, and runs pretty fast (I'd expect it to go faster after some final code optimizing).
(1 reply) #27 M2Ys4U on 22 Apr 2006 - 14:56
garry:
Firstly, that number is actually 2.5 not 2.2, if you're going to quote somebody quote them properly.
Secondly, Shift is in BETA - the developers are constantly working on it and they know that it's not working exactly as planned in IE, which is why they have brought a member or two on board to help fix this cross-compatability problem. If it's so much of an issue for you, do back to Swift.

Quote -
Mac market share of worldwide PC shipments rests at around 2.5%

http://www.forbes.com/markets/currencies/2...0markets04.html
#27.1 Garry on 22 Apr 2006 - 15:47
Quote -
Steve Jobs, mac god, has engineered a recovery in the company's financial fortunes but has seen a decline in the market share (4.6% in 1996, 2.2% 2005).


Unprofessional at best. Quotes two different figures for the same statistic in the same article. And like the author of the article, I'm using selective quotations to suit my devious ends. The article doesn't mention the massively predicted growth in Apple's markets this year nor does it use one of the more optimistic statistics. Depending on where you look you'll find Apple's market share figures are between 2% and 5%.

I realise Shift is in Beta. I was being facetious, it's not an issue for me at all. What is an issue is your attitude. It's plainly obvious you can't tell when somebody is playing devil's advocate. Personally I couldn't care less if the stats are right, if MS releases another OS or whether the author is backhandedly swiping at Apple - I just disagree with the main page of, what is primarily a news and rumour site, being used to promote one person's opinion.
#28 Sn4k36 on 22 Apr 2006 - 15:00
But isn't microsoft still making blackcomb for some time around 2010 to later? that's going to be a 64bit client/server OS only...


But i do hope that windows vista become a big of failer... Then maybe microsoft will start to listen to the people...
(6 replies) #29 Mathiasdm on 22 Apr 2006 - 15:15
Good points in the article:
-the registry is antiquated
-get rid of drive letters (mounting would be so much better, imho)
-Windows XP was released in 2001. If Microsoft continues at the same pace, there won't be another OS until 2013 (six years per release). Comparing this to most Linux distributions (2 releases per year) or Apple (one release every 18 months – not sure on this one), that's pretty damn slow!
On the other hand, I think MS will speed up their OS development (I at least hope so).

The rest of the article smells like... bull****:
-Google web-based OS: Oh, come on! Bandwidth constraints don't permit this. Data loss would be a huge risk as well.
-Virtualisation, allowing Apple to run Windows apps on OS X: what does this have to do with virtualisation? Wouldn't it be an implementation of the API instead?
-There won't be a market for MS OS'es: Oh, come on! Over 90% of the OS market is Microsoft (talking home computers here). It'll take decades before the market share erodes by a decent amount (and I doubt it'll be to Apple).
-Every modern OS contains HUGE amounts of code. I'm sure Windows code won't be perfect, but I doubt it's not workable.
-Management: management might not have been so good, but I think they'll learn from their mistakes.

My estimates: Windows will remain the major OS for a long time. OS X might gain a bit of market share, but not much. (They're too expensive... if you take a look here, you'll see the cost of iBooks (yes, those old G4 thingies). I have an Acer I'm using right now. It costs less than the iBook on the right, has a 64-bit processor, a larger hard drive, more RAM...
I know it's a cliché, but Macs are still expensive.)
Linux will gain some market share, and will be pre-installed on more computers. Its market share will still remain rather small, but I suspect that will slowly change.
In 2015, not that much will have changed.
In 2030, I'd say about 20-30 percent of computers will run Linux, 5-10% will run Macs, and the rest will be Linux.